 
knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
 ·AT&T DSL Service
2 edits | Phewww! I'm glad I saw this here first. I looked at the website and thought *scam*, so I tried a bunch of fake usernames to see if I could login with them. They didn't work, so I wasn't sure if it was a phishing site for passwords or something. Glad to know it's really "real", LOL. Guess I'll login now and see what info they have.  | |
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 | TAKUNDA
join:2005-06-09
Plano, TX | Re: Phewww! I am very excited about this. I think I'm already sold. I hesitated on Google and ended up with nothing. This time I'm going in head first and hopefully Vonage will deliver. | |
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knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: Phewww! I've just now signed up, the website actually does a lot of effort to make this as easy as possible for the average Joe Blow, so I was really impressed. I did my initial offer to buy 100 shares just to see what happens. I'm going to see if some family and friends want to pool some money together to raise that. It's all risky and it's possible to lose everything, but I expect this to be another google like stock race. It may not hit numbers as high as google, but I do expect us early investors to be able to turn an effortless profit from this.
And to keep on topic, my Vonage service (all 6 lines) have been great, never any problems | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by TAKUNDA  :I am very excited about this. I think I'm already sold. I hesitated on Google and ended up with nothing. This time I'm going in head first and hopefully Vonage will deliver. Google(GOOG) was by invitation only on their IPO. unless you were somebody who was somebody you didn't get in on the IPO.
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
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rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL | The lose as much as they "make." How is it a good investment? Hoping someone with competence will buy them?
Yahoo!'s voice is a better product and backed by a company with MONEY not hope! | |
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| | shashinka
join:2000-09-16
West Boylston, MA
1 edit | Re: Phewww! Let me see you get wire your house with a yahoo appliance. I was trying to use an Softphone through skype and had too many issues. Not many people like being tied to a PC anyway. I myself have been a vonage customer for several years and know a dozen friends/family on it. Especially now that they have given free calls to Europe, hope more coutnries coming soon, need Japan. I like how sunrocket bundles in their LD. I just signed up for 100 and was thinking of doing more. I myself had about $500 in ebay when it IPO'd but my wife and I were bringing in about $20 an hour combined so I said we need the money, damn i could have scraped by and had 10x that now i think. damnit.
Oh and don't forget how they are putting this into wireless phones, i think nokia is building into cellular handsets and eventually the PSP/Nintendo! | |
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knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
·AT&T DSL Service
| said by rachelsfx :The lose as much as they "make." How is it a good investment? Hoping someone with competence will buy them? Yahoo!'s voice is a better product and backed by a company with MONEY not hope! It's all about numbers and name really. Vonage is lumped into VoIP service, people just refer to their voip service as Vonage service instead of what is really is. That's a very powerful tool for a company to be synonymous with a service. When people want to “google” you, all they are referring to is doing a web search, but the culture and brand behind it has kind of meshed into one. In my opinion, that's the strong point of Vonage. It may not be the best or the cheapest, but even my mom who knows nothing about computers knows what vonage is and she knows she can save money over the local telco for phone service. Given that, not all heavy stock investors are tech heads like us, but do they do know the name Vonage and what it does and that's what gives it the same power that Google had when it starting selling stock. Everyone calls Google a fluke and it will never be repeated, but I think they are wrong. It's the same people that said Google stock would be worthless after everyone bought some after they starting selling. There is a lot of experience to consider in this and the opinions I read here are very valid and realistic. But we all have to remember that playing the stock game is never a win, win for all. It could turn to crap or it could turn to gold. I'm only going in with the minimum 100 shares just to gamble a little and hope for some gold alchemy returns later on.  | |
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MeanPeepsSuk
Premium
join:2004-11-21
Muddy Field
clubs:
| Re: Phewww! Hmmmm......
»video.google.com/videoplay?docid···05&q=snl
p.s. A large number of my friends and family use VoIP phones and none of them refer to the service as "vonage service" as you say. They all just say "VoIP phone". | |
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King P
Don't blame me. I voted for Ron Paul
Premium
join:2004-11-17
Inman, SC
·Windstream
 ·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Phewww! said by MeanPeepsSuk :Hmmmm...... »video.google.com/videoplay?docid···05&q=snlp.s. A large number of my friends and family use VoIP phones and none of them refer to the service as "vonage service" as you say. They all just say "VoIP phone". By contrast, a lot of my friends and family do refer to Voip service as "Vonage"...
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Forget 'em, Support the Indies.
»www.ind-music.com | |
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knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
·AT&T DSL Service
| said by MeanPeepsSuk :Hmmmm...... »video.google.com/videoplay?docid···05&q=snlp.s. A large number of my friends and family use VoIP phones and none of them refer to the service as "vonage service" as you say. They all just say "VoIP phone". Ah, got such a good laugh out of that one, great link. | |
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MeanPeepsSuk
Premium
join:2004-11-21
Muddy Field
clubs:
| Re: Phewww! said by knightmb :said by MeanPeepsSuk :Hmmmm...... »video.google.com/videoplay?docid···05&q=snlp.s. A large number of my friends and family use VoIP phones and none of them refer to the service as "vonage service" as you say. They all just say "VoIP phone". Ah, got such a good laugh out of that one, great link. Yeah, that one cracks me up too. (It puts my portfolio in perspective, lol). Glad you liked it. 
GL with your investments.
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"There are no victories against stupidity; only battles."
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rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL
| Well, because maybe they are the only ones stupid enough to buy it? ...and hold it?
This company spends about $250 per customer to acquire them. No wonder they lose double what they make.
Unlike Google, the IPO is desperation knowing they are facing bankruptcy unless they get a cash infusion.
I smell a "pump and dump" scheme on the "IPO"! | |
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Yearight
@mindspring.com | Re: Why selling to customers? "Pump and dump?" You are truly enlightened!  | |
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rileyjam514
There You Go Again...
join:2005-06-26
Kearny, NJ
| Citron's a crook... ... and the fool who hands him any money might as well be burning it in a trash pile.
Or do we all so easily forget the Datek incident?
Considering the lack of decent tech support and the ease with which the company blames all tech issues on the ISP, I'd be hesitant to throw my money away on this one.
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Abortion is murder, Reagan was a hero, Clinton was a sleazeball, Iraq is much better off without Saddam, and the telcos are not trustworthy with American tax dollars. There! I've managed to offend a significant portion of BBR! | |
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| compton
join:2002-02-08
Brooklyn, NY
| Re: Citron's a crook... said by rileyjam514 :... Considering the lack of decent tech support and the ease with which the company blames all tech issues on the ISP, I'd be hesitant to throw my money away on this one. That's a stupid reason to based an investment decision on. Potential investors should be focusing on future growth and returns. | |
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| | emptywig
Huh? What?
Premium
join:2002-08-05
Pasadena, TX
| Re: Citron's a crook... Future growth and returns depend on a customer base. If you lose your customers because your tech support annoys them, then you will not have any growth or returns.
The reason so many companies suck today is because selfish investors are not interested in having a good company with happy customers, that makes money for a long time. They just want a quick buck.
If your product sucks, your company will not succeed.
wig | |
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JSRoman
Premium
join:2005-03-10
Callahan, FL
| Run as fast as you can from this offer! You have to be absolutely crazy to invest any money in Vonage.
1- If doesn't control the pipe. NO QOS.
2- Have you noticed that vonage has yet to turn a profit.
3- Cable companies are just starting to gain steam selling voip and in short time Charter,TW and Comcast have all gained booku voip subs. Noticed the runup in Comcast stock the last couple of weeks and the praise it received for quarterly numbers.The big number was 211,000 voip subs. TW the 270,000. Get the picture.
IMO you investing in Vonage is like going back in time and buying a ticket on the Titanic.
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President Hillary Clinton! Are you scared yet?
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| dclee9
join:1999-10-17
Walnut, CA
1 edit | Re: Run as fast as you can from this offer! look at packet8
it's around $1 and it's not profitable as a company too! | |
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| | Freezone
join:2000-09-29
Southfield, MI | Re: Run as fast as you can from this offer! No this is a gamble buy it at ipo price and dmp it later. | |
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cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27
 ·Verizon FIOS
| True.
Co-worker told me of the IPO (I recall deleting the email as I'm a Vonage user). I laughed. I mean, Citron wanted to sell this puppy and now wants to get an IPO and get a jump then bail.
Comcast and other VoIPs are catching up if not already. Buying means you'll lose and then someone will buy Vonage after the stock drops to a buyout price. Citron will take his GoldenParachute and jump (unfortunately NOT into the props).
Google was a windfall and comparing it is not exactly a good choice. Google makes money off ad revenue, Vonage is just another VoIP. Once other's offer same service for under $20, Vonage will suffer. (remember they had to drop their price tier several times to compete).
I can buy alot more $2-4 stocks and gain more than this risk. | |
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nozzer
join:2004-06-25
Waltham, MA | US Citizen? Why does it require you to be a US Citizen? Surely Permanent Residents (who pay the same taxes everyone else does) aren't excluded? | |
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jgkolt
Premium
join:2004-02-21
Lakewood, OH
clubs: | investing If you are a short term buyer vonage is good. As long as you get in before the price can go yp and yuo dump the stock before it plummets(around a year). I dont like this gamble. it will not be in my portfolio | |
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phoneboy2
@shawcable.net
| It's a numbers game It's risky but I will probably go for it. It's not about profit for a high growth company in the early states. It's all about how many regularly paying customers and the rate of growth of customers. It's a fairly straight forward numbers game where you can predict when profitability will occur and how much profit after that. | |
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sailor
Merry Whatever ..R.I.P. dadkins
Premium
join:2003-10-21
Long Island
|  Think Before Investing !!!
The main reasons is most IPO's are a losing investment and even the most heavily promoted ones will rise quickly the first few hours of trading or for the day and then quickly fall back...best to leave it to the big time traders and those brokerage houses who are given access to the IPO's who will immediately buy and then dump for a quick profit...the average person can always come in later to buy after the big boys are done buying and quickly selling..
If you are sold on Vonage as an investment for your money, then my advice would be to just sit back and wait until the IPO is completed and then buy it...buy it using your own broker...
And finally, if you read the FAQ's from that website,(See Below) these few things set off red flags in my mind...again, this is just all my opinion of course but I strongly recommend that you think before investing.....You could even make a case in comparing a highly pumped/promoted upcoming IPO to a new operating system release, say Windows XP, to give an example ..Those who just have to rush out and be the very first on their block to get it the moment it becomes available are the ones usually stuck with all the initial flaws, glitches and security problems compared to those who patiently wait until the smoke clears..
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From The FAQ
You Must:
Use this website to open a limited purpose brokerage account at either Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank Alex.Brown, a division of Deutsche Bank Securities Inc. or UBS Financial Services Inc. More information about the terms of the accounts offered by each financial institution and the account-opening process is included elsewhere on this website.
Submit a conditional offer to purchase a number of shares of Vonage common stock by the time and date stated elsewhere on this website.
Check this website on a regular basis. Important notices about your participant account and the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program will be given to you through this website. If you fail to read these notices and take appropriate action, you may lose your ability to purchase shares of Vonage common stock through the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program. For example, if the initial public offering price is set above or below the expected range, or if the expected initial public offering price range is changed, your conditional offer will become invalid and you will need to enter a new conditional offer in order to continue to participate. Your conditional offer also may become invalid in certain other circumstances. If your conditional offer becomes invalid, you will be notified through information posted on this website.
A limited purpose brokerage account opened through this website cannot be used to purchase or hold any other shares of Vonage common stock or any other securities.
The terms and conditions of limited purpose brokerage accounts at Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank Alex.Brown, a division of Deutsche Bank Securities Inc. and UBS Financial Services Inc. may be different.
Details about the terms and conditions of limited purpose brokerage accounts at each institution are available on the Limited Purpose Brokerage Account Form page which can be accessed from the Main Menu of this website.
QUESTION:
I already have a brokerage account at Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank Alex.Brown, a division of Deutsche Bank Securities Inc. or UBS Financial Services Inc. Can I purchase Vonage common stock through that account?
No. You will not be permitted to use your existing brokerage accounts to purchase shares allocated to you through the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program. You will be permitted to purchase shares of Vonage common stock allocated to you in the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program only through a limited purpose brokerage account at one of those financial institutions. Even if you already have a brokerage account at one of those financial institutions, you must open a new limited purpose brokerage account through this website. | |
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KoolMoe
Aw Man
Premium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD
clubs:
·Verizon FIOS
·Speakeasy
| Re: Think Before Investing !!! said by sailor :The main reasons is most IPO's are a losing investment and even the most heavily promoted ones will rise quickly the first few hours of trading or for the day and then quickly fall back... True sometimes, not true others. Look at Google, for example. The only future Vonage has, IMO, is being bought. Much like Covad, with no owned 'last mile' access, it'll be a tough battle against the established players. IMO, buying IPO and flipping, assuming massive speculation/enthusiasm like Google, is less risky than holding it as a long-term investment.
That said, my portfolio is amateur and certainly not making me rich!
said by sailor :From The FAQ ... QUESTION: I already have a brokerage account at Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank Alex.Brown, a division of Deutsche Bank Securities Inc. or UBS Financial Services Inc. Can I purchase Vonage common stock through that account? No. You will not be permitted to use your existing brokerage accounts to purchase shares allocated to you through the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program. That's shady and lame as heck. What possible reason could their be to force another account in the same brokerage?
KM
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War is a test of power, not a search for truth or justice. Can the violation of the primacy of love, destruction of life, and tearing of society truly be the will of God? | |
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sailor
Merry Whatever ..R.I.P. dadkins
Premium
join:2003-10-21
Long Island
| Re: Think Before Investing !!! Google is an exception but Google also had the one thing that eventually all good stocks must have...and that is earnings.
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Here is an article from March 30th that mentions both the Datek incident and also mentions the time from when Vonage first filed for a IPO....Good article in my opinion for anyone considering the Vonage IPO.
From the article of March 30th:
Vonage filed to go public nearly two months ago but it has yet to file any amended registration statements with the Securities and Exchange Commission. That's an unusually long time between filings and has led some telecom industry observers to speculate about whether Vonage might be looking to sell out instead.
Analysts said one other reason why Vonage might be better off selling out instead of going public is that investors may be wary of the firm due to the background of Jeffrey Citron, the company's founder and chairman.
Citron, prior to founding Vonage, was an executive with Datek Securities, a brokerage firm. According to Vonage's prospectus, the SEC alleged that while Citron was at Datek, he and other individuals "participated in an extensive fraudulent scheme involving improper use of the Nasdaq Stock Market's Small Order Execution System." Citron reached a settlement with the SEC in 2002 and 2003 by agreeing to pay fines. He is also banned from future association with securities brokers and dealers.
Vonage did hire Michael Snyder, formerly the president of Tyco's ADT Security Services, in February to take over the CEO role from Citron. Snyder will oversee the day-to-day management of Vonage. That may assuage some investor concerns about management. But Vonage noted in its prospectus that there is a risk that "some prospective investors will not purchase our securities... as a result of allegations against Mr. Citron."
So the longer that Vonage goes without filing another statement with the SEC, the less likely it is that the company will ever go public, Menlow said.
»money.cnn.com/2006/03/30/technol···ndex.htm | |
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| shashinka
join:2000-09-16
West Boylston, MA | Aren't these the usual terms anyway? When I bought ebay I had to do that too, they have to organize and alot this way to track everything. | |
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| | compton
join:2002-02-08
Brooklyn, NY
| Re: Think Before Investing !!! said by shashinka :Aren't these the usual terms anyway? When I bought ebay I had to do that too, they have to organize and alot this way to track everything. Yes, those are the usual terms. They have to segregate your regular account from this special account. One of the reasons they do that is to make it easier to prevent you from selling the stock before you are eligible to do so. When you buy these kinds of stock you have to hold it for a specified amount of time. That time can range from 90-120 days. If you sell before that you can be penalized. Take this example, let's say Smith Barney is part of the selling syndicate. If too many Smith Barney customers sell before the restricted date then the lead underwriters will penalize Smith Barney. Smith barney could lose 15% of their selling concession. So, to prevent early selling Smith Barney customers will have to buy these shares in a special account. Smith Barney will then freeze all selling in that account until the date set forth by the underwriting syndicate. | |
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| | | hurl03
join:2005-03-25
Congers, NY
| Re: Think Before Investing !!! When can I sell the shares I purchase through the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program?
You may place an order to sell the shares you purchase in the Vonage Customer Directed Share Program as soon as the trading of Vonage common stock begins on the New York Stock Exchange. Even if you place an order to sell your shares, you will remain obligated to pay in full for the shares you have been allocated through this program. No proceeds from your sale of those shares will be available to you until the financial institution at which you opened your limited purpose brokerage account has received your full payment for the shares and funds have settled.
Please contact your financial institution for more information. | |
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| | | | tfrank3
join:2003-02-19
Denver, CO
| Which is Best: Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank or UBS? It looks like there is a hefty fee to sell your shares from any of these three options. Also Smith Barney and Deutsche Bank will charge a hefty fee to transfer your shares to another brokerage.
My plan is to transfer these to another brokerage account, but with the hefty fee, I don't know.
If I read the terms right, it seems UBS doesn't have a transfer fee.
Any thoughts on a strategy to dump the shares? | |
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| | | | | gatzdon
join:2002-10-25
Lake Zurich, IL
| Re: Which is Best: Smith Barney, Deutsche Bank or UBS? said by tfrank3 :It looks like there is a hefty fee to sell your shares from any of these three options. Also Smith Barney and Deutsche Bank will charge a hefty fee to transfer your shares to another brokerage. My plan is to transfer these to another brokerage account, but with the hefty fee, I don't know. If I read the terms right, it seems UBS doesn't have a transfer fee. Any thoughts on a strategy to dump the shares? I believe UBS has a fee, they just don't specify it up front. You need to search for their fee schedule to find the fee.
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$100 placed at 7 percent interest compounded quarterlyfor 200 years will increase to more than $100,000,000 --by which time it will be worth nothing.- Lazarus Long | |
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scared1
@rr.com | Re: Think Before Investing !!! What does this mean? I am worried that if i bought, i would have to hold them and I dont want to. | |
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odreian615
join:2006-01-18
Chicago, IL | Comcast is waiting to gobble them up I give it 2 years max | |
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| mierwins
join:2004-03-18
Montgomery, IL | Vonage IPO SPAM!! Yesterday when I saw the email from Vonage I thought, how nice of them. Today, when I got a voicemail from them saying the same thing I thought to myself. These guys are really desparate! I feel like I'm a victim of Vonage IPO spam. | |
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Parafly9
@eline-wireless.com |  Need more advice, not much on the web right now!
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techPK
@mindspring.com
| Re: Need more advice, not much on the web right now! I am buying Vonage IPO stock...but only with money I can afford lose.
With all the facts surrounding the Vonage IPO that reveals why buying Vonage is not a rational decision, I think that the naysayers forget that buying any stock is always a gamble.
Six month from now, we will all know the main reason why this Vonage IPO succeed or failed. And, to be honest, those who participate in the offering won't care what that reason was. Every one else will either take the side of “we were wise, Vonage stock buyers were stupid” or “we were stupid, Vonage stock buyers were wise”.
I'm amazed that every time I hear VOIP is challenging traditional phone companies, Vonage is mentioned as a leader in the attack. I think their brand name now has power that is underestimated by the naysayers.
I am not convinced that "price" is the top concern of VOIP service customers. Customer generally seek an affordable price (which Vonage does offer) and not necessarily the lowest price.
I am not convinced that Vonage will never be profitable. Their biggest expense is marketing which is a controllable expense.
I am not convinced that any of their competitors have advantages that are “Vonage killers”. All companies related to VOIP are at risk of being wiped out from their many competitors and from rapid introductions of new technology.
I think of myself as a cautious investor who is willing to gamble that the Vonage will survive this year and the next and the next. And I like actions that Vonage is taking to fortify itself as a business for the long term such as making a brand name for itself and focusing on having income from their entire customer base.
I can not imagine investing in a Skype IPO or in any other VOIP provider that has a business model where “FREE” is the main attraction for all customers.
I can not imagine investing in a cable company or telephone company which provides VOIP service directly to their customers. New IP-TV services will soon threaten the cable companies. And WiMax/WiBro Internet service will soon come to threaten cable and telephone companies alike. I think new technical challenges will not be handled well by cable and phones companies due to the lost of their proprietary technology edge.
So I plan to buy Vonage IPO stock because...
-I believe Vonage will survive the next few years better than their competition.
-I believe Vonage is positioning it self as a business offering service for a fee and not for free.
-I believe Vonage will limit its marketing expense when it needs to.
-I believe upcoming Internet and VOIP technology changes will favor pure-play VOIP companies like Vonage over those companies only offering VOIP over their own proprietary networks (like the cable and phone companies).
Buying stock still is a gamble, so I'll only buy what I can afford to lose! | |
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tjreid2
join:2006-05-23
Rockwall, TX |  Vonage Stock
Thanks | |
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N9MD
Premium
join:2005-10-08
Wayne, NJ
 ·VOIPo
·ViaTalk
·PHONE POWER
·Callcentric
| Vonage Foolishness Well, it's now the beginning of August. And I've read through this thread from last May. Those of you who were considering purchasing or actually did purchase VG IPO shares now must face the folly of your reasoning.
Even before the IPO came out, experts and pundits were warning against this IPO. Vonage has spent millions on advertising which it will NEVER recoup. One pundit on Bloomberg Financial News stated: "Vonage has no moat to protect them." His meaning was that Vonage does not offer a unique product. Competition from the more established and financially stable companies such as Verizon, SBC, CableVision, etc. will ultimately bury Vonage. These other companies have more and more marketing clout with the potential customer pool, as they begin to lower their prices bit by bit to attract more of the common folk.
The "52-week High" was $17.25. The last trade today was $6.70! This is not Monday morning quarterbacking. The cooler heads realized that this was not a "great opportunity." Rather, it was a very, very risky (same as Las Vegas roulette odds on the "00") investment. And, unfortunately for those who got sucked in, "RED & ODD" came up, not "00".
Check out this item:
»pr.vonage.com/releasedetail.cfm?···D=205853 | |
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Vonage Offers Users IPO-Priced Stock