 
Chris 313
Come get some
Premium
join:2004-07-18
Houma, LA
clubs: | Always Watch your bills Let that be a lesson. Always watch your bills. But one thing though, if you don't know about it, how can you stop it?
Being called stupid by a rep was uncalled for in my opinion. | |
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Jim Gurd
Premium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI | Re: Always Watch your bills How can you not notice the charge appearing on your bank statement each month?
I would say that is stupid. At the most she should have been refunded no more than 60 days of charges. | |
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| | pstation
Premium
join:2003-06-23
Indianapolis, IN | Re: Always Watch your bills I dunno, it's pretty simple.
I have between 300-400 transactions on my bank account every month, if something that small slipped through I probably wouldn't notice it either. | |
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| | | | ender7074
join:2006-11-21
Saint Louis, MO
 ·AT&T Southeast
 ·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Always Watch your bills said by exocet_cm  :said by pstation :On another note, I'd freak out if somebody called me stupid that worked for a company that provided me a service. One could argue that Vonage was not providing a service for them  Still no excuse to treat someone like that but it struck me as funny when I was thinking about it | |
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Uranus
@ameritech.net | How many people look at their bank or credit card statements? Many don't even keep receipts of their cc transaction or bank transaction | |
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devrandom
I got a pot, full of random stuff here
Premium
join:2003-06-28 | I wonder what they said to the rep to provoke him/her into saying that. Then again, over the phone support reps probably take a bat to their cubicle whenever they get certain customers. | |
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bjl
5 weeks to go
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Laguna Hills, CA
| Re: Always Watch your bills said by devrandom :Then again, over the phone support reps probably take a bat to their cubicle whenever they get certain customers. I can confirm that statement.  | |
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Fatal Vector
join:2005-11-26 | Re: Always Watch your bills
She and her husband WERE stupid and he is a police officer? no wonder he works for some BF small town. It took the 15 MONTHS to look at their bank records and then only because a check bounced? Idiots. | |
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jfhnfjfhgddfhg
@optonline.net
| Re: Always Watch your bills said by Fatal Vector :She and her husband WERE stupid and he is a police officer? no wonder he works for some BF small town. It took the 15 MONTHS to look at their bank records and then only because a check bounced? Idiots. He works for Temple University.I would hardly call Philly a "BF Town" | |
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Elcabong
Cuba SI, Castro NO
join:2000-03-09
Philadelphia, PA | Always watch, I got ripped off by broadvoice and it took some wrangling to get my money back. | |
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leXicon5
Pelosi, SHUT YOUR Fing Pie Hole
Premium
join:2000-12-27
Saint Louis, MO
·AT&T Southwest
| How can you watch your bill if the morons set up an e-mail account for you, dont tell you the name or password and send bills to it????
Watch your bills?
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iPod #2 on Amazon best sellers list, Zune not even in the top 100.... | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| Re: Always Watch your bills Vonage ONLY accepts recurring automatic credit card charge. Thus, the e-mail account is irrelevant as to whether or not she/they would notice. The charge would show up EVERY month on their credit card/bank statement.
IMO, to miss the charge 1 or 2 or 3 months, well, maybe you are really busy and have a lot of transactions on your statement. To miss the charge 15 months? Wouldn't you wonder where that ~$30 every month was going?
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"I invented it, Bill made it famous." --David Bradley, the inventor of Ctrl+Alt+Del. | |
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| MrBentor
join:2003-02-18
Seattle, WA | Call me old fashioned, but I'm sticking with my POTS. | |
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MrBradTX
join:2001-05-23
Carrollton, TX
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by Chris 313 :Being called stupid by a rep was uncalled for in my opinion. Here's how that call may have gone.
Cust: I just noticed you've been billing me for a service that I don't have.
Rep: Wow, that was pretty stupid, huh? (meaning his company, not her)
Cust: (hears the word Stupid and the conversation is officially over)
That's why most CSRs stick to scripted responses that are specifically designed to minimize misinterpretation by the customer.
"Stupid" has become a 4-letter word to a lot of folks. They hear it and immediately flip the Bozo Bit on the speaker, as though it was an F-bomb. For a CSR to use such a word in any context was foolish. | |
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mwf
join:2000-11-26
Granite Quarry, NC | Three questions How did Vonage get her address and how did Vonage get her credit card number and doesn't she ever balance her checkbook? | |
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DaSneaky1D
one wall to block them all
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
The Lou | Re: Three questions Read the story, not the summary. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
 ·Verizon FIOS
| said by mwf :How did Vonage get her address and how did Vonage get her credit card number and doesn't she ever balance her checkbook? She had given Vonage her address and bank account information prior to realizing that Vonage wasn't for her. She didn't even want to subscribe.
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Go Colts | |
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| | matrix3D
join:2006-09-27
Deep River, CT
| Re: Three questions If she didn't want to subscribe... then why the hell did she give them that info in the first place? She should have realized that they probably went through the process of setting up her account after she provided them with all of that information and called to cancel or prevent it accordingly. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Three questions said by matrix3D :If she didn't want to subscribe... then why the hell did she give them that info in the first place? I agree. However my guess is she was an older woman and for lack of a better excuse, didn't know better. The fact that she doesn't use her computer much and hasn't ever used email to me is a sign that she had no clue what VoIP was, how it worked, or what exactly she was signing up for. She probably just heard that it was cheaper/better then her existing phone service and just wanted to save some money.
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Go Colts | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Weird No company should ever call a customer stupid and there definitely something strange about this story. However the consumer has to carry some of the blame for not noticing a $28.75 charge on her account for 15 months.
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Go Colts | |
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| AquaBlaze
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Re: Weird said by cdru :However the consumer has to carry some of the blame for not noticing a $28.75 charge on her account for 15 months. I couldn't care how long the duration is. If someone charges you for a service you never agreed to subscribe to, then you should be entitled to your money back, period. Vonage had no right frauding her out of money in the first place. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Weird said by AquaBlaze :said by cdru :However the consumer has to carry some of the blame for not noticing a $28.75 charge on her account for 15 months. I couldn't care how long the duration is. If someone charges you for a service you never agreed to subscribe to, then you should be entitled to your money back, period. Vonage had no right frauding her out of money in the first place. I'm not arguing with you on that account. I fully agree and she should be entitled for a full refund if not extra. However what I am trying to say is that Vonage can't correct a problem that they don't know is a problem. Where was the customer at for 15 months that she didn't notice the $28.75 charge every month?
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Go Colts | |
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| | | AquaBlaze
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Re: Weird said by cdru :Where was the customer at for 15 months that she didn't notice the $28.75 charge every month? That's a question. However, should she still be within the legal limit of prosecuting for fraud, I don't think we need an answer. | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| Re: Weird said by AquaBlaze : However, should she still be within the legal limit of prosecuting for fraud, I don't think we need an answer. She DID get her money back, right? How is that fraud?
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"I invented it, Bill made it famous." --David Bradley, the inventor of Ctrl+Alt+Del. | |
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| | | | | AquaBlaze
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Re: Weird said by PolarBear :She DID get her money back, right? How is that fraud? If she didn't, the situation's next step would be coming to that. Billing someone for services that A) weren't rendered and B) weren't ordered is pretty fraudulent if you ask me. | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| Re: Weird From the summary:
While Vonage couldn't track down the source of the problem, they do cough up a $396.40 refund after being pressured by the journalist.
They paid her back when she FINALLY noticed the error. That's not fraud, that's simply a billing error, albeit a large, long term one. Should they have started the service in the first place? No. But maybe she didn't make it clear that she didn't want the service, especially since she gave credit card and shipping info first. Regardless, they DID refund the $$.
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"I invented it, Bill made it famous." --David Bradley, the inventor of Ctrl+Alt+Del. | |
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| | | | | | | AquaBlaze
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Re: Weird said by PolarBear :Regardless, they DID refund the $$. Again, many companies will only pay up to 2-3 months for "billing oversights". The debate right now is moot, since she got her money back. However, if she had only been offered a partial refund, I'd label that fraud - if she was within statues of limitations. | |
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| | | chuckkk
join:2001-11-10
Warner Robins, GA | It's Vonages problem and error. She should be entitled to a refund and interest. If the bills were sent to an Email account that was not hers, who knows how she would have known about the problem in a timely fashion. | |
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| | trav155
join:2004-03-06
Fremont, NE | She had to agree to it to get charged!! | |
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| | | AquaBlaze
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Re: Weird said by trav155 :She had to agree to it to get charged!! Read the article. She was calling in to query about the service, found it wasn't for her, and said "no thanks". It was the Vonage employee who went ahead with her billing information and set her up an account without her consent.
You should have to agree to services in order to be charged for them. The problem here though, is she did not. | |
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Phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Jacksonville, FL
 ·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
edit:
February 26th, @10:52AM
| Vonage sucks.... I got accused of sending them an empty box when my adapter failed. They charged me $150, which I changed my CC# before they could post it. The ironic part is the label was their shipping label, which the UPS man posted the weight on the box. Oh well, they suck, their stock sucks, and their hold time sucks. I'm sticking to "no-name" VoIP's for my hobby, and Comcast for my home phone.
EDIT: By the way, I was a customer for 3 years before they "screwed" me. You would have thought 3 dispute calls, each made once a month, about $150 charge for the adapter, would have made some supervisor say "Hey, he waited on hold 45 minutes each time for this, perhaps he's telling the truth, perhaps we need insurance on our UPS packages". 
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SIPPhone/Gizmo # 17476200648 / PIMPNET Chatline / Ran by Asterisk & Slackware 10.1. | |
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See 16 replies to this post |
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brianiscool
join:2000-08-16
Miami, FL | Scam Sounds like they are trying to scam people. Almost like TigerDirect with their rebates. | |
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TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Scam said by brianiscool :Sounds like they are trying to scam people. Almost like TigerDirect with their rebates. Yes. An unscrupulous employee probably working from home looking for commissions probably did this.
commission for new accounts. That sounds like a financial incentive for a bad employee to cash in on a potential customer who has second thoughts.
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My BLOG
My Web Page | |
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yock
Eschew the False Dichotomy
Premium
join:2000-11-21
Fairfield, OH
| Re: Scam said by TK Junk Mail :said by brianiscool :Sounds like they are trying to scam people. Almost like TigerDirect with their rebates. Yes. An unscrupulous employee probably working from home looking for commissions probably did this. That was my thought. If you think about how much information the sales rep had, it was really an easy thing to register a free e-mail account and start billing to it. It seems prudent from all of this that Vonage should implement some sanity checking in their billing practices and software. Something so simple as to check whether or not the customer has logged into the system this month or whether or not they even have hardware registered to their home would go a long way in stopping fraud before it gets out of hand.
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Wiki Wiki
Laughter is the closest distance between two people. --Victor Borge | |
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cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27
Levittown, PA
| Again, where is accountability? "...Here's one theory: Some of Vonage's customer-service representatives are paid both an hourly rate and a commission for new accounts. That sounds like a financial incentive for a bad employee to cash in on a potential customer who has second thoughts..."
Even though (after it took law enforcement involvement) the customer was refunded her money, this is a bad policy to sales. And many companies use this (car-sales techniques). And a few bad reps will put the info in.
Ofcourse, how can call someone stupid (when actually, they are) when it's difficult to prove in a court of law that they aren't!  | |
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rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
·Charter Pipeline
| Sales Tactic is Common While it would be best for Vonage to work out customer complaints without using degrading statements, this kind of sales tactic has been used for years.
When I was about 19 and living at home, the local newspaper sales staff called. We already subscribed to the Sunday-only service and they initially claimed the call was to verify our subscription information. I provided all relevant information by verifying our address and telephone number. Right before they tried to end the call, they told me that our daily subscription will start within a few days. I asked them, "When did I agree to a subscription change?" They said that by providing the address and telephone number I was agreeing to the new subscription. I told them that they asked for this information to verify the current subscription. They disagreed and said the information was to verify the subscription change. I told them that I was not the head of the household and could not make these decisions. I finally managed to end the call but it was clear they were upset about the wasted time. Luckily I remembered to tell my dad about it and he made a call to the paper that evening. Sure enough, they changed our subscription even though I explicitly told them no.
Even though the Vonage sales person was dishonest, the lady should have been balancing her bank statement to know that Vonage was billing her every month. How many other charges on her statement have gone unnoticed? I wonder if she and her husband will now balance their account each month?
I'm also surprised Vonage customer support did not verify that the account made no calls. Common sense tells me that this could have eliminated the need to involve the local media and Vonage upper management. | |
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| unoriginal
join:2000-07-12
San Diego, CA
·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Sales Tactic is Common I wonder if they were recording the call and looking for some way to get you to say "Yes." That way if anyone called to dispute the change they could playback a 2 second snippet (after cutting and deleting everything else) of you being asked "Do you agree to these changes?" "Yes." I know it sounds underhanded but I wouldn't put it past the telemarketers trying to make a buck by upgrading everyone's subscription to something more lucrative. | |
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| | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | Re: Sales Tactic is Common Sounds like they don't care whether or not you agree. They subscribe you anyway, get their commission and let you and the company they are representing work out whether or not you really want the subscription! | |
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Chuckles
Premium
join:2006-03-04
Saint Paul, MN | Stupid x2 Stupid for giving bank information before deciding to sign up.
Stupid for not checking bank statement each month.
Buyer beware! | |
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See 9 replies to this post |
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HardwareGeek
join:2003-11-15
Brooklyn, NY
| Vonage sent me to collection agency I returned my ATA to Vonage paid my last months bill but a Collection Agency for Vonage wants 29 dollars from me. When I called the Agency and asked why they basically said I didn't return the "THINGY" (what the lady called it) to Vonage. When I had returned it atleast a year prior to getting the notice from the Collections agency.
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Email/MSN: Michael at hardwaregeeks.comAIM: MikeR35292 | |
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Trinijoy
Premium
join:2005-09-12
Brick, NJ | Oh no.. How dare that rep make a mistake! this is an outrage | |
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thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
| She is stupid and the rep was right to say it. a) The rep is probably paid little.
b) The rep probably gets bitched at constantly for issues he or she had no responsibility for causing.
c) How the fuck do you not notice $25/month extra on your bill over and over? I mean, come on. How can people bitch about being in credit card debt and not being able to afford rent without loans when they are this retarded? Do you just throw money away, philly woman?
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The Problem With Music.
Our Rationale
Time to rewrite the DMCA. | |
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Trinijoy
Premium
join:2005-09-12
Brick, NJ | Re: She is stupid and the rep was right to say it. Obviously I was being sarcastic in my post.  | |
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thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY | Re: She is stupid and the rep was right to say it. Obviously since I hit new topic and not reply to I wasn't replying to you.. | |
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Trinijoy
Premium
join:2005-09-12
Brick, NJ | Re: She is stupid and the rep was right to say it. woops didn't mean to reply to you :P | |
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RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission
| Takes publicity to get action out of the telecom screwups AT&T several years ago billed my credit card twice for cell phone service in the same month. One was the office in either Missouri or Mississippi and the other was the office in Oregon or Washington.
I called both places up (the phone numbers were on my statement) but they would not reverse the charges. They also would not tell me what my account numbers or phone numbers were. The credit card people issued me a new card and said that it was a bad debt and they removed them from my bill.
Maybe I should have called up a newspaper but since the CC people were more honest than the telecom folks, I just went on with life. Oh, and in the two or three weeks that those faked charges were out in the wild, I had *NO* other disputed charges!
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I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
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rob_in_chatt
Premium
join:2004-09-17
Chattanooga, TN | voip i looked at one of those services a few months ago. i was just curious about the price vs my landline, and before i could get to the page that told me a breakdown of the charges, they were hounding me for my debit card or cc number. | |
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Vonage Bills 'Stupid' Non-Customer For Years
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