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story category Utah Residents Love $40 15Mbps Fiber
Though they still love Comcast more...
(old news - 03:14PM Friday Jan 26 2007)
tags: Fiber · competition · bandwidth · municipal
Utopia is the nation's largest muni-fiber network, connecting almost a dozen cities in Utah. It sells wholesale access to providers like AT&T, who then offer 15Mbps symmetrical fiber connections for $40 to residents of participating cities. One of those providers, MStar, is lauding the fact that locals have voted it one of the top three ISPs in the region. Of course, there's really not many broadband ISPs to begin with, with Comcast and Qwest gobbling up the lion's share of the Utah market (MStar ranked behind Comcast but above Qwest). While the price and speed may be nice, our users have complained that the service comes with a 100GB/month cap (better avoid those pirated HD-DVD flicks). The competition, however, has forced Comcast to compete on price, something the cable provider rarely does.

Related:
  1. Verizon: Offering FiOS In AT&T Turf 'Logical'
  2. 50Mbps, 20/20Mbps FiOS Tiers Hit All Markets
  3. Verizon Considers 'Fiber to the Node' FiOS
  4. Cox: DOCSIS 3.0 Upgrades By Third Quarter
  5. Fiber To The Home In Kutztown, PA
  6. Locals Try To Keep Utopia Afloat
  7. Was FiOS a Good Idea?
  8. Broadweave Completes iProvo Acquisition
Forums » Utah Residents Love $40 15Mbps Fiber
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thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY

768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

With a 100 GB cap why bother even offering it? It's ovvious they can't keep up with their own service.

The more I read about broadband here, the more I'm convinced Verizon is the only good ISP in the US.
dr2500

join:2005-09-09
Lancaster, PA

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

thank you

Shack

join:2002-01-17
Bloomington, IN
·Insight Communicat..

100 Gb is much more than the average user downloads in a month. For them the quick downloads will outwiegh the cap. 768 takes a damn long time to download anything large. For 40 dollars I could live with that. Hopefully it would be possible to purchase more download bandwidth for a fair price.
wev567

join:2006-02-25
Pittsburgh, PA

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by Shack See Profile :

100 Gb is much more than the average user downloads in a month.
So why have a cap, if most people won't exceed it?

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by wev567 See Profile :

said by Shack See Profile :

100 Gb is much more than the average user downloads in a month.
So why have a cap, if most people won't exceed it?
People will exceed it once they have a 15 mbps connection.

It's there for a simple reason - to tell people like me "our service sucks, use a real ISP like verizon"
--
The Problem With Music.


Our Rationale


Time to rewrite the DMCA.
lesopp

join:2001-06-27
Land O Lakes, FL
Saying Verizon is good ISP is like saying there are WMD in Iraq.

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by lesopp See Profile :

Saying Verizon is good ISP is like saying there are WMD in Iraq.
Saying 31/9.5 for $55/month with zero limitations is not good is like saying Iraq has always been a peaceful country.

said by travelguy See Profile :

said by thender See Profile :

With a 100 GB cap why bother even offering it?
That's more than 15 SD DVDs a month. You might not be able to run multiple HD streams with that kind of cap, but not many people would have an issue with it.
If you need a 15 mbps connection, you need to do more than 100 gigs a month.

You're moving backwards with this. It's like the early P4 vs the P3... 600 more MHz, but it performs on par, and in some cases worse. Why bother? I'd rather have an uncapped connection anyday, regardless of speed(so long as it's 768 minimum) than some stupid cap.

Saying you can do 100 gigs a month on a 15 mbps connection is retarded. They should worry about getting lower speeds to work before getting into caps.

Caps are for third world countries. I hear about this bullshit with ISPs in other countries, but we're America. When we ask for 15 mbps, we want useable 15 mbps.. I could use my monthly cap in 17 hours on that connection. This is a problem.
--
The Problem With Music.


Our Rationale


Time to rewrite the DMCA.

Shack

join:2002-01-17
Bloomington, IN

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

Not really. The need for Fast download and upload is not only about quantity of data that you move. It is also about how long ittakes to move data.

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by Shack See Profile :

Not really. The need for Fast download and upload is not only about quantity of data that you move. It is also about how long ittakes to move data.
And how long does it take to wait a month to move said data after you reach your cap?

Shack

join:2002-01-17
Bloomington, IN
·Insight Communicat..

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

You don't read well. The majority of users that will never be a problem. I understand for some it will, and I would hope the ISP would be willing to sell more bandwidth to them, or they may need to consider a busniess plan or go with a DSL plan like yo listed. That does nto make this service worthless like you try to portray it.

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS


moderated:
January 27th, @12:01AM

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by Shack See Profile :

You don't read well. The majority of users that will never be a problem. I understand for some it will, and I would hope the ISP would be willing to sell more bandwidth to them, or they may need to consider a busniess plan or go with a DSL plan like yo listed. That does nto make this service worthless like you try to portray it.
I read very well. I disagreed with what I read.
--
The Problem With Music.


Our Rationale


Time to rewrite the DMCA.

Shack

join:2002-01-17
Bloomington, IN
·Insight Communicat..


edit:
January 27th, @01:07AM

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

You are simply being difficult because the this service has a limitation for you. It would not be for the average user. Your comparison to 768 dsl is assinine.

So what do you disagree with?
The average user uses >100GB?
Faster connection are of value to people that do not download > 100 Gb?

Or are you just being arguementative.

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS


edit:
January 27th, @04:09AM

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by Shack See Profile :

You are simply being difficult because the this service has a limitation for you. It would not for the average user. Your comparison to 768 dsl is assinine.
What's asinine is that you can do more on the 768 kbps service than the 15 mbps one.

You want to talk about the average user? Fine. The average user doesn't need 15 mbps in this day and age. The average user, with a connection that has low latency, would be fine with 768/128 for web browsing, email, youtube, and other average things.

Most people don't need an 850 watt PSU, and this is fine. But it's still shady to say your PSU is 850 watts, than in fine print rate it to be 850 watts at 15c.

Same here.Most people don't need 15 mbps, and this is fine. But it's still shady to say your service is 15 mbps, advertise it as the fastest, then put the 100 gig restriction in fine print.

This isn't AT&T trying their best to give people a fast connection. This is so they can say "OMG COMCAST IS 8 MBPS BUT WE'RE 15 MBPS, WE ARE TEH FASTAR SERVICE CHOOSE US AS WE ARE THE FASTEST!!" in their commercials and general advertising. And they'll be technically correct, too, but it's still shady.

Real PSUs rate their output at 50c, and real ISPs rate their bandwidth without a cap that you can go over in less than one day.

This happens everywhere. 5.1 receivers in best buy boast 100 watts/channel but weigh 30 lbs, and you get disappointment because in the fine print, it says peak power, or as tested in some special alternate universe. People buy a speaker rated from 20 hz to 20 KHz but it has no -/+ 3 dB spec, so it could really do half that range. A Thermaltake 2000 RPM, 120mm fan that's rated to 22 dB, but they measure it in another room instead of to the ISO standard of right up in front of it. Yes, technically they are offering 15 mbps, but they're doing it the cheap dirty way - the bare minimum just so they can say that they offer 15 mbps, that's not something I think they should be commended for. This isn't progress, it's just a sidestep disguised as progress, and should be treated as such.

--
The Problem With Music.


Our Rationale


Time to rewrite the DMCA.
travelguy

join:1999-09-03
Albuquerque, NM

said by thender See Profile :

With a 100 GB cap why bother even offering it?
That's more than 15 SD DVDs a month. You might not be able to run multiple HD streams with that kind of cap, but not many people would have an issue with it.
jjcrandall

join:2004-01-01
Salt Lake City, UT

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

It would be a BIGGER ISP in the area IF UTOPIA would rollout to more cities than just 3!!! They currently only serve 50% of the biggest city in their footprint..
GhostDoggy

join:2005-05-11
Duluth, GA

If they are going to cap they need to come up with a better approach in the capping process. They should have adopted something like X-GB per 1-Mbps service sold. So, if you have 15Mbps sold service (vs 12 Mbps delviered service) then your cap is 15X.

Of course, we don't expect intelligence in Utah.

thender
Glamour Profession
Premium
join:2004-05-16
Staten Island, NY
·Verizon FIOS

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

said by GhostDoggy See Profile :

If they are going to cap they need to come up with a better approach in the capping process. They should have adopted something like X-GB per 1-Mbps service sold. So, if you have 15Mbps sold service (vs 12 Mbps delviered service) then your cap is 15X.

Of course, we don't expect intelligence in Utah.
Makes more sense than this.

At this rate, we should see 200 mbps in ten years with a 200 gig cap.. so useless.
--
The Problem With Music.


Our Rationale


Time to rewrite the DMCA.
bohn

join:2006-05-30
Scarborough, ON
We would kill for a 100 Gb cap per month in Canada. You can lose your shirt or car or even house for just downloading more than 20 gigabytes in a month.
GhostDoggy

join:2005-05-11
Duluth, GA

Re: 768/128 DSL > 15 mbps snake oil

Sounds like living in Canada sucks.

Placebo
Premium
join:2005-12-14
Huntley, IL
·Comcast

I think it's funny that...

Comcast is trying to position itself as "premium" brand. Is there really such a thing as "premium" when talking about cable/HSI? No one ever wants to have to compete on price, but do the suits at Comcast really think price isn't the motivating factor for 75%+ of their customers??

I loved my Comcast HSI--until my promotional period ran out and I couldn't convince the nice CSR to hook me up with an extension. I'm now a not-so-proud customer of AT&T (and yes, I imagine it'd take a week for me to upload a Blu-Ray movie...)
jdir

join:2001-05-04
Santa Clara, CA

Meanwhile...back in silicon valley

We're still stuck with spotty crappy WIFI, slow DSL and high price cable.

And San Jose still think itself as a high tech (??) capital (?) of the world

johnny_t
Premium
join:2004-03-21
Palo Alto, CA

Re: Meanwhile...back in silicon valley

said by jdir See Profile :

We're still stuck with spotty crappy WIFI, slow DSL and high price cable.


Dagda1175

join:2001-06-17
Goleta, CA

Home biz?

Are home businesses allowed on it? If so, i wish i lived there.

shellenberg
Premium
join:2003-12-20
Salmo, BC

In Utah?

They don't pirate movies. They don't do porn. What do they need that kind of bandwidth for? Bring it to my house!
mortaldivine

join:2002-02-07
Bountiful, UT

MSTAR = Joke

Mstar is a joke. Get your Utopia through XMission.com.

Ryle
P2P 4EVA

join:2005-03-09
Bellevue, WA

edit:
January 26th, @04:46PM

symmetrical fiber in utah?

i live 5min from microsoft in redmond, WA and fastest i can get is comcast. and people way out in the boonies in utah get symmetrical fiber?? comon!

yeti34
RC Onroad racin

join:2001-04-12
Salt Lake City, UT

Re: symmetrical fiber in utah?

said by Ryle See Profile :

i live 5min from microsoft in redmond, WA and fastest i can get is comcast. and people way out in the boonies in utah get symmetrical fiber?? comon!
The cities mentioned having this service are by no means in the boonies. It is a pretty big valley with a lot of little cities in it and I am in one of the cities that will be getting this service. As soon as said service is available to me I am thru with Comcast LSI. Xmission does seem to be the better of the two providers here under this service, but Mstar can bundle TV and phone as well. Xmission does not provide the latter two services.

gatorkram
Spelling and Grammer impared
Premium
join:2002-07-22
Winterville, NC
clubs:
·Suddenlink
·Cirtex Hosting

Re: MSTAR = Joke

said by mortaldivine See Profile :

Mstar is a joke. Get your Utopia through XMission.com.
I wish we all had a choice like this. One provider isn't giving you what you want, make a phone call and switch to another.

The 30/30 plan starting @ 125 sure sounds nice.

Please excuse me while I go, um... drool, yeah drool...
--
Give me bandwidth or give me death!
alfnoid
Premium,MVM
join:2002-02-18
·Comcast

From »www.xmission.com/utopia/faq/index.html

"Note that bandwidth usage limits will be handled similar to how XMission handles DSL, with a 100 gigabytes of included usage each month."

So, why are they better again?
raye
Premium
join:2000-08-14
Orange, CA

Selling wholesale fiber access to AT&T

while AT&T is busy offering 6 Mbps copper (insert letter here)DSL in their territories. What a dichotomy...

houstontarge
Target

join:2005-01-08
Houston, TX

Re: Selling wholesale fiber access to AT&T

After seeing how AT&T has sued to keep other muni-fiber projects from being deployed, I frankly don't think they should be allowed anywhere near the Utopia network, much less actually sell it!!! Talk about two faced
massysett

join:2006-01-04
Silver Spring, MD

Complained?

At least they are making the cap explicit, unlike the other providers who have some unstated cap that they don't tell you about, and then send you menacing letters about when you violate it, only to then tell you that they still won't tell you what the cap actually is.
bbscript

join:2004-11-09
Fairfield, PA

Re: Complained?

*cough* comcast invisible cap*cough* 500gb gets u a warning.
did it just to be a smartass to see if comcast would say anything.
fenix_jn

join:2006-12-28
Miami, FL

Re: Complained?

True. Most providers have a cap, they just don't tell you.
Pete_64

join:2001-12-20
KingstonON

Re: Complained?

my cap is 60gig combined on a 10/768 connection which is standard for 39.95CDN, I got a warning for 150gig this month, I usually go over about 20gigs a month but never hear anything until you get about double the limit
fenix_jn

join:2006-12-28
Miami, FL

Re: Complained?

Well so far I DL a lot (almost 70 GB/month), bellsouth has not sent me anything (yet).. so anyone knows if BS has a cap??

fonzbear2000
Premium
join:2005-08-09
Saint Paul, MN
·Comcast

how do you figure?

said by lesopp See Profile :

Saying Verizon is good ISP is like saying there are WMD in Iraq.
in the "recent reviews" section on the main page, verizon FIOS has only ONCE had a review under "unhappy campers", NEVER under "mixed", and ALL other reviews have been under "smooth ride"-meanwhile, ALL other residential ISP's have had MANY reviews under "unhappy campers"
--
»never pay full price for high speed again!!!
madrhino

join:2004-07-03
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast

More computers per household

said by shellenberg See Profile :

They don't pirate movies. They don't do porn. What do they need that kind of bandwidth for?
Each wife has her own computer?

--
Get Verizon FIOS,The Anti-DIOS

ndt06

@comcast.net

They're not THAT lucky right now...

The only speeds gained on a system like that are minimal due the fact that once the data leaves the fiber network, it hits the slowdown...

It'd be pretty cool to make the fiber users part of a LAN for the towns or counties getting service, all of the providers could be part of it so it wouldn't get downright nasty competitive...

Like a mini myspace yet cooler and more functional because it would be homebrewed and localized... and undoubtedly file-sharing would run rampant...

Governator

@grandenetworks.net

great price for the service, but...

Don't forget that the cities involved had the fairly large cost of installing the fiber network. And since cities can't print money, they get it from their taxpayers. So the cost to each customer is really greater than $40/month.

That's a favorite method for government - taking your money, using it to do something for you less-efficiently than you or a private company could do it, hiding (or just not mentioning) a large part of the cost, then telling you what a great "deal" you're getting.
Forums » Utah Residents Love $40 15Mbps Fiber


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