Time Warner Cable: Caps 'Make Your Internet Experience Better'When marketing measures your connection by e-mails sent, you're in trouble... ( old news - 10:41AM Thursday Jul 03 2008) tags: prices · business · bandwidth · cable · caps · RoadRunner CableI'm generally amused when a broadband provider employs low caps in the age of FiOS and HD web delivery, but I'm far more entertained when their marketing departments try and convince customers how reasonable those caps are. For instance when Rogers recently began charging overages, they sent out an e-mail informing customers, with pictures, that their new caps allowed 6,291,456 e-mails and 1,572,864 page views. Time Warner Cable has started marketing their capped trial in Beumont, Texas, and the website uses similar measurements for caps as low as 5GB: So you can better understand what level you should choose, 1GB gets you about 70,000 e-mails, 34 hours of gaming or 1,344 hours of Web browsing; or, it’s the approximate equivalent of downloading 569 photos, 277 music files, 7 hours of low-resolution video (YouTube), 3 hours of standard definition streaming video or 45 minutes of high-definition streaming video. So should you pay up to $35 for their lowest 5GB plan, you just might be able to actually watch two HD films. Of course you can go over your limit if you're willing to pay $1 per additional gigabyte, a markup over cost of only 1,000 to 1,500% by Time Warner Cable. That's a bad deal however you slice it -- unless you work in marketing. "Our new usage-based billing makes your Internet experience even better," claims the website. Much in the same way Charter's decision to sell your private data for a profit without reducing your monthly bill created an " enhanced online experience." How much more "enhanced" can the American broadband experience get? Stay tuned.
Related:- Time Warner Cable Will Increase Caps
- Cogeco Drops Metered Billing On Users
- Time Warner Cable 'Delays' Texas Metered Billing
- Time Warner Cable: Let's Not Talk About Net Neutrality
- Time Warner Cable Protests Planned
- Time Warner Caps Go from Ugly To Invisible
- Customer Battles Time Warner Overages
- Time Warner Cable GETS MORE EXTREME!!!
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Pizz
Hi
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY | Maybe They're hoping their HSI service only has elderly and light users. It wouldn't be surprising if thats their plan from the beginning. | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Re: Maybe 5GB can give me... 1 ISO download for Fedora Core.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
 ·RoadRunner Cable
 ·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Maybe Personally... I think they need to scale by a factor of 10.
50GB/100GB/200GB/400GB
Lets make at least an assumption or 2 here to show the use/cap ratio:
Road Runner Basic
Speed: 1.5M x 384K
Basic Tier – 10GB 1.5Mbps = 192kB/second = 474GB/month (30 day). 10:474 = ~ 2.1% usage, not including upload
Road Runner Standard
Speed: 6M x512K
Standard Tier – 20GB = 768KB/second = 1898GB/month (30 day). 20:1898 = 1% usage
Road Runner Turbo
Speed: 10M x 1M*
Turbo Tier – 40GB = 1280 KB/second = 3164GB/month (30 day) 40:3164 = 1.2% usage.
Personally.. I'd expect no less than at 10% usage cap, and would 'push' for 33%.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Re: Maybe If they give me less bandwidth... I might just be inclined to not use the Internet at all, and not have to pay for their service. 
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
| bamabrad
join:2006-01-27
Port Orange, FL | Instead of hoarding band width they should try to stretch usage as a learning experience to better understand how to economically enhance their ability to give the consumer what they desire(and how do they know what they want?) and to make a FAIR profit. | |
| mjgould
join:2006-04-30
Bowling Green, OH
·Verizon Online DSL
| Try it in a college town I would like to see what happens if Time Warner tries to deploy caps in a college town. I know here in my town it is nothing to have 5 or 6 college students living in one house all using the same connection. My neighbors for example have 4 people in the house and it is not uncommon for all of them to be watching ABC or some other high quality TV online while downloading torrents among other things. It would be easy for them to download 40GB in a week or so. | |
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amigo_boy
join:2005-07-22
Tempe, AZ
·Cox HSI
 ·magicjack.com
| Re: Try it in a college town said by mjgould  :I would like to see what happens if Time Warner tries to deploy caps in a college town. I'd like to see what happens if they don't. Your own example is of activities that weren't common two years ago. The infrastructure doesn't have infinite capacity. I'm ok with it being upgraded to provide for the kinds of uses you described. But, it seems reasonable for those who need it the most to pay for it.
Mark | |
| | | mjgould
join:2006-04-30
Bowling Green, OH
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Try it in a college town The problem for us is that TW has not been spending the money for upgrades. Right now I am getting the advertised speeds which for me is 7mbps, but come August when 75% of the students come back I will be lucky to get 3mbps from my 7mbps connection from about 5PM until 4AM the next morning. | |
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amigo_boy
join:2005-07-22
Tempe, AZ
·Cox HSI
·magicjack.com
| Re: Try it in a college town said by mjgould :The problem for us is that TW has not been spending the money for upgrades. Right now I am getting the advertised speeds which for me is 7mbps, but come August when 75% of the students come back I will be lucky to get 3mbps from my 7mbps connection from about 5PM until 4AM the next morning. Is it reasonable to believe an ISP can deliver constant bandwidth, even if it goes unused 80% of the day? It seems like there's two ways to look at this.
1. Guarantee they can provide 7mbps any time you need it (even if that capacity sits idle 80% of the time.
2. Estimate average capacity based upon historic usage patterns.
The first choice seems like it would be very expensive. The second choice seems to correspond to what we expect with our traditional telephone service. The phone company doesn't guarantee everyone in the country can pick up their handset at the same moment and get a dial tone. Just that you will get a dial tone if the historic use holds true.
I guess there's a third choice. They just tell you "up to" speeds without any indication of how average that speed will be. I agree that's wrong.
Mark | |
| | | | | mjgould
join:2006-04-30
Bowling Green, OH
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Try it in a college town Well, I had Verizon DSL for 3 years and they never had any issues providing me with the 3mbps that they claimed, regardless of whether school was in session or not. I just wish TW would not claim 7mbps, because most of the time they can't provide it. Some basic honesty on what they can provide would be great. | |
| | | | | qworster
join:2001-11-25
Los Angeles, CA
·DSL EXTREME
·Brand X Internet
·RoadRunner Cable
·Vonage
3 edits | said by amigo_boy :said by mjgould : Is it reasonable to believe an ISP can deliver constant bandwidth, even if it goes unused 80% of the day? It seems like there's two ways to look at this. 1. Guarantee they can provide 7mbps any time you need it (even if that capacity sits idle 80% of the time. 2. Estimate average capacity based upon historic usage patterns. The first choice seems like it would be very expensive. The second choice seems to correspond to what we expect with our traditional telephone service. The phone company doesn't guarantee everyone in the country can pick up their handset at the same moment and get a dial tone. Just that you will get a dial tone if the historic use holds true. I guess there's a third choice. They just tell you "up to" speeds without any indication of how average that speed will be. I agree that's wrong. Mark YES IT IS REASONABLE! It's JUST as reasonable as:
Building roads that can handle 100,000 cars an hour, when they only actually handle these loads six hours a day.
Building an electric system that can handle a 100 megawatt load, when that load is only used four hours a day during the hottest months of the year.
Building a cable TV systen that provides 200 channels, even though 80% of the viewers watch the same 10 channels during prime time.
Building a water system that can provide high pressure for fire hydrants, even though fires rarely occur.
Building an infrastructure of sanders and snow plows that may only be used a few days a year.
Building a drainage system that might only be used every 20 years (or less) during hurricanes (New Orleans?).
Building a telephone system that can provide for 10,000 calls an hour when 1/3 of the time it only has to do 1/10th of that.
Building a public transit system that can move 50,000 people an hour when it's only used to move that many people 6 hours a day.
Shall I continue? I can probably come up with another 50 or 75 if you want.
Whether Time Warner likes it or not, the Internet is now a public utility that's EVEN MORE IMPORTANT then their legacy product, cable TV. In many cases you can't apply for a job or order medicine or make reliable long distance phone calls without it. It's up to them to make the necessary upgrades as needed to serve their customers! One thing that they have going for them is that unlike electricity, roads or water systems, bandwidth costs PRACTICALLY NOTHING to produce! | |
| | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town "Whether Time Warner likes it or not, the Internet is now a public utility that's EVEN MORE IMPORTANT then their legacy product, cable TV. In many cases you can't apply for a job or order medicine or make reliable long distance phone calls without it."
Yes you can, yes you can, yes you can... geez. Can we can the drama for a moment? There isn't anything you NEED the internet for that you can still do in other ways or in person.
The internet is NOT a "public utility"... It may be important to YOU or to SOME, but still not to the masses.
You mentioned medicine, are you high? Who is the population group that orders the most medicine? And of that group, how many have the internet? Seniors.
In many cases you can't make a "reliable" long distance phone call with out it? WOW! Are you maad? I can't say for certain that any call placed over the internet is going to be more reliable than a traditional POTS line.
.. apply for a job? There is some gray area, however, you can always use the public library to do so. SOME employers who take internet only apps have kiosks in their buildings for people to use to apply. And, so what? Instead of walking a paper app in, you have to walk in and apply on a computer, or walk in to a library.
I won't even go into the other items you mention because they are simply too ridiculous to bother. Your ideas of reality are plain flat skewed and well over dramatized.
The internet is STILL hardly a public utility. Just because SOME businesses chose to do things so-called exclusive, which many still don't, on the internet, doesn't make it a utility. Just because there is a surcharge to book an airline ticket imposed by a company doesn't make the internet a utility. And, just because to SOME, they chose to utilize the internet 100% as much as possible - still does not make it a "utility"...
Personally, while I think the internet is a very very great thing, it's also making people lazy, thus making them "dependent" and, quite honestly, stupid and incapable of functioning in the real world. Just as with cell phones making people "more important" these days, when they aren't, people forgot how to simply live with out these things.
For SOME, things like the internet and cell phones are very important tool.. but still, remove them, and life can STILL go on easily. It's called planning. | |
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HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| Re: Try it in a college town said by fiberguy :The internet is NOT a "public utility"... It may be important to YOU or to SOME, but still not to the masses. I don't know what masses yer thinking of, but obviously you must have one in your head if you're thinking like that! Everything these days is driven via the internet. The whole backbone of the economy is, people bank ever day online, research things which are needed for school classes, college courses are taken online, people tele-commute for work. Business is done and billions of deals exchanged via net meeting, email, online account transfers, and VPN's. The times have changed, and this is how the country is run these days. One only needs to look at Google stock prices to see that. You say remove these things and life goes on...can it? Not for me in line of work. | |
| | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town The whole back bone of our economy is not the internet. Ever heard of housing? Sheesh.. come on now. Your entire message has done nothing to convince me that the internet is a "utility".. the very nature of "the internet" itself says it is not a utility. Any idea what the "internet" is?
People bank on line. Great! They check their balances to see if checks clear and maybe move money. You can't still pick up the phone and do it? (Again, convenience)
Research for school. Again, go to the library. They have computers there and the lines are most likely better than you will get at home. Not to mention, last time I checked, books still exist.
College courses are still offered in the classroom. Online courses are often offered for conveneince. Yes, I know only SOME courses are offered ONLY online - that's not enough to make the internet a utility. That was a stupid decision on the colleges part.
Some people tele-commute - you're right. I'm one of them. Still, it's not a requirement nor do enough people do it to consider it a "utility"...
"Business is done and billions of deals exchanged via net meeting, email, online account transfers, and VPN's." So, so, so and so. Those are businesses and are not enough to base the internet on a "utility".. There certainly is no issue on that end of the internet. Why? Those connections are FAR more stable and.. guess what? They PAY for their ACTUAL WORTH! .. not $16.99 a month.
You said it right. A lot has changed and "not for me in line of work". You are not THE actual top of the food chain. While it's important to you, and you have integrated it in almost everything you do, that's you. And yes, many people still don't use the internet as their primary source of everything.
What you want to do it protect the internet because you, rightfully so, have found ways to make your life easier and most likely cheaper. However, that still, in my opinion, is NOT enough to make the internet, today, a utility.
You do not need the internet to sustain life as you do the phone, power, and water. The internet has improved your life, but you do not need it to "sustain" life. | |
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HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| Re: Try it in a college town said by fiberguy :The whole back bone of our economy is not the internet. Ever heard of housing? Sheesh.. come on now. Your entire message has done nothing to convince me that the internet is a "utility".. the very nature of "the internet" itself says it is not a utility. Any idea what the "internet" is? People bank on line. Great! They check their balances to see if checks clear and maybe move money. You can't still pick up the phone and do it? (Again, convenience) Research for school. Again, go to the library. They have computers there and the lines are most likely better than you will get at home. Not to mention, last time I checked, books still exist. College courses are still offered in the classroom. Online courses are often offered for conveneince. Yes, I know only SOME courses are offered ONLY online - that's not enough to make the internet a utility. That was a stupid decision on the colleges part. Some people tele-commute - you're right. I'm one of them. Still, it's not a requirement nor do enough people do it to consider it a "utility"... "Business is done and billions of deals exchanged via net meeting, email, online account transfers, and VPN's." So, so, so and so. Those are businesses and are not enough to base the internet on a "utility".. There certainly is no issue on that end of the internet. Why? Those connections are FAR more stable and.. guess what? They PAY for their ACTUAL WORTH! .. not $16.99 a month. You said it right. A lot has changed and "not for me in line of work". You are not THE actual top of the food chain. While it's important to you, and you have integrated it in almost everything you do, that's you. And yes, many people still don't use the internet as their primary source of everything. What you want to do it protect the internet because you, rightfully so, have found ways to make your life easier and most likely cheaper. However, that still, in my opinion, is NOT enough to make the internet, today, a utility. You do not need the internet to sustain life as you do the phone, power, and water. The internet has improved your life, but you do not need it to "sustain" life. Ummmmm you can't pick up the phone and do it, at least not at my credit union...that was phased out a few years ago over security concerns. And I didn't say the whole backbone did I? However it is a BIG time integral player. My beef isn't if it is a utility or not but with your comment about about 'the masses'. Research, yes and what is that you mentioned?? Computers?!? Now where do you think those go to?? Sure they have books, but at the same time, one can't exactly access reports from MIT students can they at their local library. Why does something have to be a requirement? While you say most people don't use the internet for their primary source of everything, well what exactly classifies everything?? It is integral part of life these days, I will say that. And since when do you need a phone to sustain life?? Using your logic, you can easily walk next door and use the neighbors. Water? Sure! Power? Don't even really need that either. Does the internet sustain life?? Well it is embedded in how we do and conduct business these days, if it wasn't so important, things such as CERT wouldn't exist would it? So if the Gov't is protecting such a valuable infrastructure... »www.us-cert.gov/ and is something which is considered vital, I don't know what else ya want to have it be classified as a utility.
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Capturing the images of Colorado
»jdebordphoto.com | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town Yes, you did say "the whole backbone of.." - see your own post.
If your bank discontinues the use of phone banking, then they're in the minority. All the majors, and many small banks I know of still allow phone transactions either automated or live people.
You are right in that the internet is a big player, but, it's still not something that society MUST depend on especially in the private sector. The business side of the internet, as I said, is already using beefier and heavy duty internet services. Already running well on that end.
People have chosen to utilize the internet for a lot, yes, I agree. However, it's still not a necessity. If college students want to use the internet, the campuses have very good lines connecting them. Again, there's no need to have involvement at the campus level.
I still don't think "integral" includes chatting, gaming, email, etc. It's a convenience, yes, I agree, but you can still pick up a piece of paper and stamp and mail. You can pick up the phone and call people. You can play games with out a computer.. it's a nice thing to have and is a luxury. Many people still do not use the internet at all and live life just fine.
When do you need a phone to sustain life? Ever heard of 911? Maybe not. But, when people need medical help, the phone will save your life,.. not the internet. Even if you walk next door to use the phone, is it still the PHONE that is making a call? Please - you're really stretching here to save your side.
You ask if the internet sustains life.. you mention business. However, as I said before - business is business, and what you have in your house are two different things. People still live their lives and "conduct business" with out the internet. Bills can be paid through the mail or phone, doctors appts are set, medicine is ordered, money can be transferred, so can stock. You can order a pizza much easier over the phone than the internet. Anything that you can do in government on the internet can be done in person.
The internet REMAINS a LUXURY. You've provided nothing that can't be done outside of the internet. What you have done is stated that it makes your life easier. Does a car make it easier for you to get from point A to B? Sure.. people can still walk or take a bus, or ride a bike and do the same. Guess what, it takes more effort than the car. Cars are not utilities are they?
What it's going to take to be classified as a luxury, and I doubt it would for MANY years ahead, is where society MANDATES access to certain resources SOLELY to the internet. And even then, I think society/government is smart enough (I just thew up a little in my mouth) to determine that the internet is FAR FAR FAR away from being something to rely and trust certain vital information with as the only means of access.
Maybe down the road, but not now, and not tomorrow. This is my opinion. | |
| | | | | | | | | | lvlorpheus
join:2008-02-17
Eureka Springs, AR
3 edits | Re: Try it in a college town So let me understand your thinking here. Students that are trying to better their selves in this country that commute to college, community college or trade school should drive 30 to 50 miles to get a book or connect to the internet at their campus. Before you respond by saying they should take care of all of that before they leave the campus think a little. Where are there kids going to go. Just stay home alone. Let someone else take care of them. Load them in the car and take them from there school work for the drive.
Have you ever though about changing your name here to string-N-canGuy. fiberguy really seems to conflict with your opinions.
A lot of bill payment and things like that you have to pay a fee to call or go in person. The business side of the internet is changing traditional ways of doing things and forcing customers to use the internet or pay a fee. So people are going to be charged a fee, or use the internet, but the internet is not a necessity.
I am guessing you would say AC is a luxury?
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| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town Yes.. AC is a luxury, not everyone has it do they? I suppose that a few million in San Francisco alone haven't hear that, huh? And before you talk about how cool it is in SF, Mr. AR, San Francisco can and does get into the high 90's.. even breaks 100 there. Trust me, I've lived there.
Now, back to the topic. Where did I dismiss the importance of the internet? Please try to pull yourself out of emotions for a moment and look at reality.
The campus is a place of learning, right? YES. I believe that if they don't have internet, and some don't, they would do their research on the campus where they have the tools to find the information. Last time I checked, they have internet on campus in those book borrowing rooms.
Stop being a drama queen here for a moment. EVERYTHING you described in that thread, ONCE AGAIN, is to make life easier. It does not sustain life nor does having it in your home make it better for society at this time. Colleges, as your example, has often better than any internet you can get at home - maybe you didn't see me say that a few times already, maybe you were at one too many parties in college and should have paid attention?
And, I could care less if people get charged a fee to NOT use the internet to pay a bill. WHO CARES? That's a problem of the business and the end user. How do you know, with out the internet, that prices would have risen the amount of those fees absent of the internet? Keeping "fees" down is not a reason to make the internet a utility. It still doesn't make it a "necessity".. it means you still have the option to, oh my, MAIL your payment! Novel concept! Fees are not an excuse. Nice try.
Everything you just described has all been things that makes things more convenient. Look, I have Three connections to the internet in my home. I CHOOSE TO! However, I don't believe in subsidizing it, and I don't believe in mandating it. I still believe that if people want the internet and can't afford it, then they need to walk their happy butt to their local library and use it there.
Next you'll ask if I think a car is a luxury. Those with out cars use the bus don't they? Now, before you say that cities run buses, there are still cities that DON'T have bus service.
Fun.. | |
| | | | | | | | | | lvlorpheus
join:2008-02-17
Eureka Springs, AR
1 edit | Re: Try it in a college town said by fiberguy :Yes.. AC is a luxury, not everyone has it do they? I suppose that a few million in San Francisco alone haven't hear that, huh? And before you talk about how cool it is in SF, Mr. AR, San Francisco can and does get into the high 90's.. even breaks 100 there. Trust me, I've lived there. Now, back to the topic. Where did I dismiss the importance of the internet? Please try to pull yourself out of emotions for a moment and look at reality. The campus is a place of learning, right? YES. I believe that if they don't have internet, and some don't, they would do their research on the campus where they have the tools to find the information. Last time I checked, they have internet on campus in those book borrowing rooms. Stop being a drama queen here for a moment. EVERYTHING you described in that thread, ONCE AGAIN, is to make life easier. It does not sustain life nor does having it in your home make it better for society at this time. Colleges, as your example, has often better than any internet you can get at home - maybe you didn't see me say that a few times already, maybe you were at one too many parties in college and should have paid attention? And, I could care less if people get charged a fee to NOT use the internet to pay a bill. WHO CARES? That's a problem of the business and the end user. How do you know, with out the internet, that prices would have risen the amount of those fees absent of the internet? Keeping "fees" down is not a reason to make the internet a utility. It still doesn't make it a "necessity".. it means you still have the option to, oh my, MAIL your payment! Novel concept! Fees are not an excuse. Nice try. Everything you just described has all been things that makes things more convenient. Look, I have Three connections to the internet in my home. I CHOOSE TO! However, I don't believe in subsidizing it, and I don't believe in mandating it. I still believe that if people want the internet and can't afford it, then they need to walk their happy butt to their local library and use it there. Next you'll ask if I think a car is a luxury. Those with out cars use the bus don't they? Now, before you say that cities run buses, there are still cities that DON'T have bus service. Fun.. I guess with all the people that die in heat waves almost every year AC was not necessary.
"It does not sustain life nor does having it in your home make it better for society at this time." Well i have to disagree. Every gallon of gas that is used driving your car or riding a bus to campus is that much more damaging to our environment/society. Reducing our dependence on foreign oil and sending billions of dollars to a region that does not always hold America and Americans in the highest regard makes it a necessity. Every fraction of a cent paid for gas that does not go to terrorists who want to destroy or way of life/society and kill us all makes it a necessity.
How long is it OK to stay stagnant with regards to the internet. As a nation do we wait until it is glaring us in the face like our oil dependence now. From this moment forward how many students in high school are not going to want to have access to the internet. Do we wait until we can not compete on the global market and then try to solve the problem. You have got to see the internet is the future.
"However, I don't believe in subsidizing it, and I don't believe in mandating it." So you are just going to deny the inevitable future and wait until it is a problem, and keep facilitating money going to people who want to destroy our way of life.
"It still doesn't make it a "necessity".. it means you still have the option to, oh my, MAIL your payment! Novel concept! Fees are not an excuse. Nice try." Great even more gas and oil used to move a letter around instead of a few clicks of a mouse. Sometimes you have to adjust your beliefs and do things that improve you society as a whole.
Its a free country. I prefer to see my money go to improving our future. You have the right to see your money continue to go to gas and oil with portions of that money going to people that want to kill us.
I think its fair to say 90%+ of every future generation is going to want access to the internet. So we just sit in the dark with our blinders on and refuse to see the future or take any action. | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town Sorry, but half the population is out on the whole "global warming" thing, and guess which side I'm on? 
Your example on AC doesn't sway me. What you described is that for some people it's important. Can you survive with out it? Yes - you can. I've gone several summers with out it. The AC issue is over... it's going no where.
Look, you and others are missing the point. Where did I say the internet isn't important to some people in love? The fact remains that many people still don't have the internet and live their life just fine. In fact, you should ask some of your friends who don't have the internet and ask them how much better their life is with out it. Some people chose not to get it for a few reasons. You'd be surprised why.. for some, it's not money or lack of providers.
You don't need to make it a "utility" in order to make it important. I can tell you're not paying attention to this debate right now. It's not if the internet is important, it's should it be a utility. You're sounding like there is some kind of an internet crisis. I've got news for you and every single person her having this debate with me. NOTHING you have described is not perfectly able to be done now, AND with as little as a 256k line. Now, before you get your panties in a bundle, I am not saying the bill gates reasoning that we only need 256. I'm saying that for Banking, for school study, booking tickets, banking.. all these "life sustaining" things that everyone's thrown at me, none of that can't be done with something as little as a 256 line.
Why do you need a 50 meg line to do college research? Why do you need one to "save $10 booking an airline ticket".. why do you need 50 meg to check your bank account or to buy or sell stock? (Other than if the site is over bloated with extra crap it doesn't need in the first place) ... seriously. What you NEED ultra fast internet for is for what? Say it alllll together... to make your life more "fun"... so you can download movies in just a couple minutes, not 20. So you can serve your P2P software over a residential line, which you shouldn't be doing anyway..
You don't need to compete with a global market "at home"... you compete with a global market at work. Are you in competition with China to pirate those Star Wars movies faster? Are trying to compete with Japan on getting blizzard patches out faster?
I'm not denying ANYTHING, as you said. What I am saying is that the internet doesn't need to be rules a utility in order to give us all those things you stated. Just because phone was made a utility didn't make phone better - in fact, ask people in the US West territory.. I can guarantee you that 11 western states would tell you horror stories regarding their "public utility".. one benefit of a public utility is that it helps to regulate costs. And, to be honest, if $42 is too much for you to pay for something that is SOOOOOOOO important, then maybe you need to rethink your own personal finances. I, for one, am not willing to pay more taxes to sustain another bureaucracy so you can hope to have a cheaper internet service. (Which won't happen under regulation)
You are more than welcome to have your green world, but I'm sorry, I as many others don't buy, your hype that global warming is real. I, as do many scientists, write this up as mother nature going through another one of her cycles as she has in the past. Al Gore invented global warming, not the internet.
"The gas is going to kill us!! The gas is going to kill us!!" Sheesh.. be real.
Your arguments are so filled with drama it's unbelievable. People like you see things as black and white.. it's either one way or another. I'll help you correct your ways.. there are more than just two sides to issues and how to resolve them. Cutting out oil isn't the answer. I'm sure you forget that it takes power to run the internet.. where are you going to get it? Windmills?  | |
| | | | | | | | | | lvlorpheus
join:2008-02-17
Eureka Springs, AR
1 edit | Re: Try it in a college town fiberguy/string-N-canGuy statements.
1.) "Ever heard of 911?"
2.) "The internet REMAINS a LUXURY. You've provided nothing that can't be done outside of the internet."
3.) "Does a car make it easier for you to get from point A to B? Sure.. people can still walk or take a bus, or ride a bike and do the same."
4.) "And, I could care less if people get charged a fee to NOT use the internet to pay a bill. WHO CARES?"
5.) "Please, name ONE thing that can ONLY be done online that is an integral part of society."
6.) "NOTHING you have described is not perfectly able to be done now, AND with as little as a 256k line."
7.) "all these "life sustaining" things that everyone's thrown at me, none of that can't be done with something as little as a 256 line."
8.) Everything you just described has all been things that makes things more convenient.
9.) "It still doesn't make it a "necessity".. it means you still have the option to, oh my, MAIL your payment! Novel concept! Fees are not an excuse."
10.) "Cutting out oil isn't the answer."
Early on you ask for "ONE thing that can ONLY" be done on the internet as you insist it is not necessity or that will improve society. Then you are given a number of examples and you change your point of view and say "NOTHING you have described is not perfectly able to be done now, AND with as little as a 256k line." Until you are going to stand behind one point or the other it is a waist of my time to try to get you to come out of the dark and take your blinders off.
I don't recall anyone saying we should all have 50 meg connections, just that the internet has become a very important and ever more necessary tool. Although it would be nice if we could get a semblance of what companies in Japan are able to provide to their customers.
I never said cutting out oil was the answer. I said "Reducing our dependence on foreign oil and sending billions of dollars to a region that does not always hold America and Americans in the highest regard makes it a necessity. Every fraction of a cent paid for gas that does not go to terrorists who want to destroy or way of life/society and kill us all makes it a necessity."
"And, to be honest, if $42 is too much for you to pay for something that is SOOOOOOOO important, then maybe you need to rethink your own personal finances." I pay $120 a month for two "unlimited" EV-DO connections from Alltel and used less than 300 GB of data last year from the two connections combined. And the #5 cell provider not once complained, contacted me, or questioned any of that usage. So with Verizon buying Alltel their 5 GB caps worry me a great deal. That less than 300 GB of data would of cost me over $70,000 under the pricing plan Verizon had last week. Now with their new plans if I use 6+ gigs a month on each account it will cost me $8640 a year for 144+ GB of data. If the #5 cell provider can do it "with no complaints" then the #2 soon to be #1 cell provider should be able to at least come up with fair caps. You have the luxary of shooting your mouth off because you get to take the internet for granted. Trade those three $42 connections you have in for three $60 5 GB Verizon EV-DO connections and lets see if you are then ready to come in out of the dark and take the blinders off. | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town So.. now that you've gone to this length.. you still haven't addressed the very issue as to WHY it needs to be a "UTILITY"..
You've steered clear of everything, spun, and side stepped the issues. You sure quoted me a lot which was un necessary. I think the fact that my message is RIGHT ABOVE YOURS is pretty clear what I said. I stand behind my statements.
The one thing you did mention was the desire of Verizon to buy Altel Regulating it as a utility isn't going to change anything about you and your "2 EV-DO" connections. I happen to have a few of them myself. Regulations mean NOTHING in that regard. Even under regulation or utility, all a provider has to do is petition and show that they need to charge more for their service, and guess what?
The ultimate reason you want the service to be a utility is that you HOPE that it will lower your bill! My So-called blinders remain on, thank you, because I am realistic in my thinking. I TOLD you in my last message it was about your hopes to keep service "cheap"..
Mobile broadband isn't ready for high usage right now. THAT is reality! When there is a supply and demand issue, it's always going to make prices stay high. The mobile broadband service (or as you like to call it, EV-DO) is not ready for prime time and everyone to just throw the kitchen sink at it. I am GLAD it still expensive. I use it all the time for business when I travel. I NEED to stay connected. I know some people want to buy it as unlimited and then start pulling the same crap they do with a residential connection and download everything they can! The reality is, is not going to happen.. not now, not at this time!
Since I use my service for business, which it still is built and modeled for, I know that if I use more, I will pay more.. and I am ok with that. I've been an early adopter in MANY technologies INCLUDING DLS when a 256 line cost $120 a month with a $300 install, $120 modem fee, and 3 year contract. How about you? I had cell phone service back in the late 80's when you paid a $29 access fee and 30 cents peak and 15 cent off peak rate. Did you? I had expensive ISDN lines in my home costing upwards to $200 a month for 144k, did you? I'll take my so called blinders off when you take off your rose colored glasses.
Further, I could care less about oil - you brought it up and I think it's not appropriate in this conversation.
.. and, keep up with the name calling, it's very adult of you. | |
| | | | | | | | | | lvlorpheus
join:2008-02-17
Eureka Springs, AR
4 edits | Re: Try it in a college town At this point I am going to have to quote someone else from the conversation.
"are you that stupid?"
"Further, I could care less about oil - you brought it up and I think it's not appropriate in this conversation." You keep saying the internet is not necessary in society today or tomorrow ... Every tool that can be used to keep money out of the hands of people that want to destroy our way of life is a necessity.
"Further, I could care less about oil -..."
If you don't care about major impacts on our society why am I even wasting my time on you. | |
| | | | | | | | | |
HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| As said above, fees are charged now for when you have to mail in things. My Verizon bill is one of them, if I don't have it directly debited from my account, which HAD to be set up online, I pay an extra fee every month. (Incidentally I have a Business connection here at home and not a residential plan)Again you mention the phone, but 911 wasn't mandated til the 80s, and before that, say 30 years before that, not everyone even had phones. Life went along just dine didn't it? And as far as pizza goes, I do all my ordering online for that cuz it's easier. Now let's throw in a unique element here, how about those folks who are handicapped? Who can't exactly take a bus or drive a car? For them would it be a utility as it allows them to carry out life in a somewhat normal manner? Hmmm now there is an interesting concept.
The Physical Infrastructure itself--here in the US, gas pipes have provided an excellent an ideal place to put and use fiber for telecommunications...check out Wilson Communications who used to be a gigantic Gas company and is now, a telecommunications company. And what about if BPL does come about and we have the utility companies actually offering services?? Another one to think about!
--
Capturing the images of Colorado
»jdebordphoto.com | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: Try it in a college town The internet and the means of transport are two different things. Such as the DSL line and the carrier that takes the data to the internet.
911 was an improvement to a system that was already in place. People, before 911, just dialed a number to their local fire, police, and ambulance.
And, I disagree with you on paying a fee to mail your bill to Verizon... good try. You may be lacking a discount for using bill pay, but NO ONE is charged to mail their payment in. | |
| | | | | | | 
BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| said by fiberguy : The internet is NOT a "public utility"... It may be important to YOU or to SOME, but still not to the masses. You know if it was 100 years ago the same arguments would be made about electricity, telephone and indoor plumbing. | |
| | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: Try it in a college town ... and? | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| Re: Try it in a college town said by fiberguy :... and? are you that stupid?
If people like you had their way and not spent money on getting "luxuries" like electricy, indoor plumbing and phones serivce to ALL Americans our country would be considered third world to this day.
The 3% excise tax that had been on phones for over 100 years was actually considered a LUXURY tax meant to get more money form the rich because only the rich had phones and used then to make long distance calls. Funny how things change. One day the internet wil be viewed in the same light as electricy, water and phone service. And since it will be viewed that way one day wait until that day and start accepting it NOW? | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
1 edit | Re: Try it in a college town Nope.. I'm not. However, I don't agree with you still.
The internet is not an important service to sustain life like phone, power, gas, or water is.
The same could have been said about Television. The internet, like television, is "information".. why isn't Cable TV a "utility"..? If you ask me, the information that comes across cable is just as important. News and information IS something that can sustain life. If the bomb is going to drop, I'd want/need to know. The internet, in my opinion, is on the same level as TV. You CAN live with out it.
The phone - a life line to emergency services.
Water - you need it to drink and be sanitary.
Electric/Gas - needed to heat and cool.
And, you keep saying "indoor plumbing".. the INDOOR plumbing is NOT the utility. The pipes in the street, however, are. And, not to mention, I still have a house that has no sewer or street pluming. I get water from my own well, and a septic tank in the back does the rest. Of course, in a city you need it.
Until and unless the government mandates certain public resources solely to the internet, which I doubt we'll see for quite some time yet, the internet still isn't a utility.
Please, name ONE thing that can ONLY be done online that is an integral part of society.
Also,.. a lot has changed in 100 years. If you really want to live in the past because it supports your view, then I'd be happy to pull many more things from 100 years ago, but I think many woman and ethnic groups would disagree. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | 
pspcrazy
Anime Freak
join:2008-02-06
San Diego, CA | Nice false analogy bro, if you noticed those are all PHYSICAL things. We're talking about bandwidth people something that can travel by light. It's structure can still be expanded WITHOUT physical limitations so all your analogies are hogwash. | |
| | | | | | 
watice
@rr.com
| just the WORST logic i've seen this year thus far.
Building roads that can handle 100,000 cars an hour, when they only actually handle these loads six hours a day.
During rush hour, at least here in nyc, all lanes slow down. Even though the highway was built to handle mass amounts of traffic, the amount of cars exceeds the available space because more people have cars today than when it was built. Sound familiar? Could the lanes be bandwidth, the nodes be highways, and the cars be.. you get the idea
Building an electric system that can handle a 100 megawatt load, when that load is only used four hours a day during the hottest months of the year.
On the hottest day in NYC in 2003, I'm sweating my balls off when I realize my UPS backup starts beeping. This was the start of a very long 2 day blackout.
Building a cable TV systen that provides 200 channels, even though 80% of the viewers watch the same 10 channels during prime time.
Guess what? IT DOESN'T WORK!!! We're switching to SDV!! We need more bandwidth!
Building a water system that can provide high pressure for fire hydrants, even though fires rarely occur.
You're right, we've built a reliable high pressure system. And fires do rarely occur. Just like bandwidth demands were lower 3 years ago. What would happen if the rate of fires shot up at the same ratio bandwidth demands did? What if every fire hydrant had to put out 2 fires @ the same time? Would we still have enough pressure?
Building an infrastructure of sanders and snow plows that may only be used a few days a year.
Tell you what, if you can get sanders and snow plows to be completly effective and clear all snow and provide a perfect road 24/7 during blizzards, I'll get you unlimited garanteed bandwidth 24/7 even with 300 other users on a node.
Building a drainage system that might only be used every 20 years (or less) during hurricanes (New Orleans?).
Drainage systems are used every day it rains, snows, etc. And they get backed up. You mentioned New Orleans, a perfect example of a not so perfect system.
Building a telephone system that can provide for 10,000 calls an hour when 1/3 of the time it only has to do 1/10th of that.
I'm assuming you're not familiar with the all too familiar "We're sorry, all circuits are busy now. Please try your call again later".
Building a public transit system that can move 50,000 people an hour when it's only used to move that many people 6 hours a day.
Public transportation system scales back during non peak hours. You ever try to get on a crowded train but you can't cause there's a bunch of people on the door, so you gotta wait for the next one? Kinda like a train CAP. Could get on the train with the sleeping smelly bum on it, but there's no QOS in that car. Luckily the train's TCP system will send another train in 3 mins. | |
| | Tommyastro
join:2004-01-18
Poughkeepsie, NY | I live in a town with 3 major colleges. 2 4 year and 1 community college. Can you say Vassar and Marist? There are other colleges within another 5 - 10 miles as well. Oh the PAIN.... | |
| 
Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs: 
| I doubt that TW will keep or institute caps that low.
Fios and even Uverse competition will see to that.
While I understand the rationale and need for caps of some sort, if they're really out to address the bandwidth hog issue they could go a lot higher than they are.
By comparison, Comcast's 250 gig caps are very generous. I think a number in between that and what TW is trying to do is a good starting point to make inclusive in ones service.
125 Gigs would seem appropriate for the price people pay and if someone wants more than that..let them pay more for it.
--
The Coyote captured the RR! Roadrunner Rick is now Comcastic! | |
| |
See 23 replies to this post | |
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See 9 replies to this post | |
NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN | Screw the subject, I don't want to use one. So with increasing threat of easier competition, they give their customers even lower morale. Marketing genius. | |
| jester121
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL | Ouch If they're going to offer a budget package, they're not likely to have success pricing it at $35. Maybe $20/mo for people that actually only do e-mail and web browsing would get some takers. | |
| 
yuutomo
The Wonder Kitter
Premium
join:2001-08-27
Missoula, MT |  sound of drums..
| |
| 
scoopy03
join:2003-05-06
00000
 ·Verizon FIOS
| i am glad i dont have to pay for caps like time warner that is ridiculous i easy can view up to thousands on top of thousands of pictures with fios. sure i dont have time warner but it just stating this is purely ridiculous. and when i had only 768k dsl i was still going through 1gb a day without any kind of downloads. i am glad fios has yet to cap their service as long as you pay them they dont care.
--
Member of FIOS tech forum. | |
| | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
1 edit | Re: i am glad i dont have to pay for caps like time warner Caps are a way to force user to pay more if they use certain amount of data
Caps are a way to generate more revenue without any investment
Caps let the company run to the bank a lot more frequent then they normally do
Caps allows the company to make more money while the employee doesn't get a raise.
With caps in place, they will be able to oversubsribe and not cost them a penny...
All it takes is that more people subscribe to this lousy service and everyone use a lot less bandwidth so that their network is rarely used.
Capitalism - wealth centralised into the few hands, everyone work for money and are poorly paid, in debt and are broke for life. Poverty is as a bad as communism
Communism - wealth centralised into the few hands, everyone works for free and are not compensated for their hardwork. Everyone gets their meager share and are living in poverty.
It doesn't matter what system. be it socialism... when the few controls everything we are all screwed.
Amen. | |
| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: i am glad i dont have to pay for caps like time warner With caps in place, it will allow them to manage their networks from those that go above and beyond their rights to abuse the resources.
With caps in place, it will allow them to grow at a reasonable pace while demands on the internet outpace their ability to rebuild and reinvest.
You have no idea of what being "poorly paid" is until you go to ares of the world where people are poorly paid.
This is the only country where the average home has 2 or more televisions. This is the only country where more people live in actual houses. While you bash capitalism, you fail to see how you benefit from it.
You do two things wrong:
1) You bash capitalism, yet you offer no solution. You apparently love to bash things and bitch but you offer no solution.
2) You failed to say WHICH system WOULD be fair and better suited for you... (hint: just about every one system out there takes more from people to give people who don't want to contribute their money.
When was the last time you voted correctly? When was the last time you voted for a candidate that would best represent the country and not a niche issue? Truth is most people vote for dem or pub. This system can work right if the right people are put in place to manage it. | |
| | | | 
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| Re: i am glad i dont have to pay for caps like time warner said by fiberguy :With caps in place, it will allow them to manage their networks from those that go above and beyond their rights to abuse the resources. Just how did we get from 250 hosts to over 500 MILLION before Deep Packet Inspection and Usage Caps came along?
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
| |
| | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: i am glad i dont have to pay for caps like time warner Really??
How did we get from a few people using cell phones and no cell phone related accidents back in the late 80s / early 90s to cell phone legislation banning the use of them in cars?
Ever heard of what the idiots of the masses do to something good? Remember Mr YouTube whiner who tried to come here and tell his story of how comcast booted him claiming he didn't over use the internet, and then told us how he did?
It's always that the few end up spoiling it for the max. Sadly, some of those few are right here on BBR. | |
| Monolith
join:2007-07-25
united state
| 'Make Your Internet Experience Better' I doubt it will Make my Internet Experience Better...
I don’t consider myself a heavy internet user, or my family. We download from iTunes, surf the web, email, and security patches, download some games for the wii, and play some games with it. Also the kids play WoW and several other online games a fair amount; we average about 50 GB a month, this is for 4 computers. We don’t watch movies or use P2P software. If Time Warner does this for all areas I will be upgrading my DSL to faster speed and getting rid of Time Warner. Right now I use the DSL mostly for my VPN for work; I wonder how much more I would use if I use VPN over Cable, as I work from home about 2 days a week for 12 hours a day. | |
| | |
See 8 replies to this post | |
Doctor Four
My other vehicle is a TARDIS
Premium
join:2000-09-05
Dallas, TX
·AT&T U-Verse
1 edit | Seems TW's Marketing division hired this guy "Caps make your Internet experience better!" | |
| moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD | That must be some good stuff.... ....that Time Warner is drinking.
Funny how many companies say they love their customers (as long as they send in their money) but treat them like complete idiots. | |
| 
mb
join:2000-07-23
Washington, NJ | Nothing New Cable companies just can't over the thought of selling by the piece, whether that be the outlet, channel, or gigabyte. | |
|
RR User
@rr.com
| Multi-User/computer Households? This isn't going to go over very well with multi-user/multi-computer households.
20-40GB for standard/Turbo may be enough for *just* 1 person, but what happens when you have 4-10 user households, are we suppose to expect $100+ increases in our bill in overage charges just because TW wants to artificially inflate the price of a gigabyte?
I'm in a 4 user household, and together have a total of 10+ computers. Everyone has at least a desktop and a laptop. I even have P2P *blocked* at the head router, so there is no file sharing or torrents whatsoever under this roof. And, even with that, consuming 100GB or more per month is pretty regular for us. Our monthly TWC bill ($185-$200) is already more expensive than our Electric ($125), and our Natural Gas ($82), and our water/Sewer ($70-$80). It's more expensive than our Cell phone plan. The only thing our TWC bill is not more than, is our food bill and our Mortgage. And by going with the numbers of 20-40GB and $1 per gig over, we could soon expect our cable bill to top $300 a month? That's ridiculous!
We're using on average of 100-150GB a month between 4 people... I really don't consider that to be very high or even excessive in this day in age when there is so much available over the internet. It's nothing like the stories you hear of a person downloading 600GB-2TB of Data just for the hell of it.
I really will cancel all my services with TWC if this hits NC. It makes absolutely no sense to place such strict data caps on a broadband service when each year, year after year, the cost of a gigabyte continues to fall. Why else do you think sites like youtube exist. And why do you think a number of the major networks can now offer HD streaming of their content online? because, the price per gigabyte of transfer is so cheap now, they can make money streaming HD content on the web. They don't provide it out of the kindness of their hearts... The advertising more than pays the bandwidth bill, so its just a profit for everyone.
A gigabyte only costs a couple cents... Charging $1 a gigabyte is so backwards, that this is the reason why American broadband will *never* match that of any country that leads us significantly in broadband. It will *never* happen when you have such greedy companies that control nearly all broadband access in the US. We pay more money, for an inferior product, and there is nothing we can do about it. Verizon is the only ISP that is 'half there' with the idea of delivering a superior next gen network. Even though they brag and boast that their network can easily handle 400Mbps or more, it's unlikely we will ever see that anytime soon. It will only take a few individuals maxing out their Fios lines 24/7 to make Verizon decide to also implement data caps to take care of bandwidth hogs... or being a greedy US company they are, watching TWC rape users for bandwidth usage, they may just join the game to increase profits as well.
Bottom line... It's all about money/profit *cough* rape *cough* | |
| |
vapor2314
@lexis-nexis.com | Re: Multi-User/computer Households? everyone in that test market should just cancel their supscriptions. This i know is not a thing that would ever happen, but if enough people just said nope we are done with you it just might get someones attention. | |
| | 
odreian615
join:2006-01-18
Chicago, IL | Not just multiply computers, but now Video game systems, Apple Tv and Netflix eat up bandwidth | |
| neufuse
join:2006-12-06
Indiana, PA
·Comcast
·Verizon Online DSL
| caps... 5GB is just BS for a broadband connection.. sure it makes sense on cell phones... but on a cable connection where you can pull potentially 30MB a day just having the modem sit online taking ICMP and Routing packets... thats 900MB right there out of your 5GB cap... (I let my Comcast modem sit idle with just a router connected for 2 days and it pulled almost 55MB of just routing packets! ARP, ICMP, etc...) 250GB is a good cap that way you can still download your windows updates, watch some streaming videos, download some apps, download some demos on PSN or XBOX live... get a few Wii VC games.. I mean people DO use the internet for more then browsing... heck even just browsing in a a browser with 4 people in a family actively using the internet here we get about a gig a day of web usage... now days websites are complex with tons of images and multimedia... its not the day of 5K website pages anymore | |
| | neufuse
join:2006-12-06
Indiana, PA
·Comcast
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: caps... Heck I just checked our usage logs for the last two months... we've never survive on a 5GB plan... and this is just a 4 person family doing standard web browsing every day, some streaming videos, some RDP from work to home (remote desktop connection) and VoIP
Jun 2008 Down 44.14 GB Up 3.48 GB Total 47.62 GB
May 2008 Down 42.99 GB Up 3.92 GB Total 46.91 GB
and most of that "up" bandwidth according to the logs is ARP packets, ACK's and ICMP data... not sure why comcast sends so much ARP data out but its a constant never ending 1 to 3KB stream of it, from what I can tell | |
| 
viperpa33s
Why Me?
Premium
join:2002-12-20
Bradenton, FL
·Bright House
| Being flexible is key We can't say that TWC will not institute low caps after the test trials are complete. If they thought a 5gig cap was going to be a problem, they would of instituted a more generous cap for there test trials. TWC says that 95% of there users use only use on average up to 40 gigs a month but no hard data has been presented. I find it hard to be believe that is true.
I love when people say, this said amount is generous. That because I only use the web to surf a few sites and get a few emails, that's all the next person should be doing. To me a statement like that says we all need to conform with each other and do the same thing. That a person making $60,000 a year is to much, that making $40,000 is generous and we just take the other $20,000 from you.
Granted there are a few people who download 24/7 and those people could be handled accordingly. If a company feels those people are going overboard, you just cancel there internet access and be done with it. If TWC wants to get rid of those customers anyways, then what is the difference?
Right now the internet is flexible for me, I can download 10 gigs one month, 100 gigs the next, 50 gig the next month and so on. I don't have to keep looking over my shoulder and wonder, have I gone over my gigs for this month? That is one of the reasons why I switched cell phone providers. I can talk as much as I want and I don't have to worry about if I went over my minutes and getting this HUGEEEEEE bill that month.
As I said before, I use Brighthouse which is a reseller of Road Runner. If TWC implements these caps, then I will either switch to 3mb Verizon service or use my cell. I maybe going down in speed by switching to Verizon but at least I can still be flexible. I won't have to pay outrageous money just so I can download the webpage faster. Waiting a few seconds longer for the page to load won't make no difference to me.
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benc
Premium
join:2007-06-17
Glen Carbon, IL
·Charter Pipeline
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Callcentric
·AT&T Midwest
| Re: How will subscribers predict usage. said by Mr Matt :I have a better solution, and that is to require websites sending streaming data streams to pay the ISP's for carrying their traffic. Oh. My. God.
Are you F-ing kidding me?!?! Do you realize what you just said, what you just suggested?
If this is implemented, what this means is the end of blogs, small websites (especially to cater to fringe tastes), P2P of course (since in P2P everyone is a server), and the end of just about anything provided over the Internet that doesn't come from a big corporation with a lot of money.
It would mean the end of my E-mail server, my Asterisk PBX, and anything else I may wish to provide on a very small scale from my own server at home. No, I don't violate the TOS. I bought a "business" connection to avoid restrictions and B.S., and to get a static IP (keeps things simpler). So, my TOS allows servers. | |
| | | | bgraham
join:2001-03-15
Smithtown, NY
·Verizon FIOS
| I think all ISP's will end up thinking the same way. I believe we have seen just the beginning with caps plus additional charges.
The mindset of all ISP's is to get everyone hooked, then raise prices either through caps plus additional per gigabyte charges or just plain price increases.
As broadband becomes a household necessity people will keep paying more because they cannot live without it.
In areas where there is a monopoly it's so easy for providers to raise prices. Where there is a duopoly there is some limitation as to what a ISP can do regarding price increases (thankfully). With FIOS and cable here locally it seems the competition is not so much with price but with bandwidth offerings. (Verizon started really low but already has a couple of price increases) One ISP can offer 20/50 meg for the same price as the competition's 10/20 and that is a selling advantage. Who the hell really needs a 20/50 connection anyway, but the ISP's marketing department evidently think it is a big selling point. | |
| | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
| Re: I think all ISP's will end up thinking the same way. This makes obsoletely no sense.
That's like having a buffet all the time and switching right in the middle of us when wanting to grab more stuff we like to eat...
Oh wait transferring data on the computer that uses our electricity is actually being billed like metered utility
insane
absurd
Their slowly crawling into our living room, please stop those thieves before they own everything.
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Definition of HD?
One thing the ISP's like Time Warner do not mention is that a subscriber cannot predict how many bytes of data will be downloaded when visiting a website. Many websites send advertising slide shows, streaming audio and/or streaming video while a person visits a web page. Furthermore there is the usage created by many software programs automatically log into the software creators server for updates. For example: Windows Activation, Anti Virus programs and other software products. Imagine if your cellular phone usage was billed like the message rate service in New York City. You would not know how many units of usage you would be charged when you placed a call. Land line Subscribers were charged message units based on distance. Calls placed within the central office were charged a flat rate of one message unit. Calls placed to a central office at the edge of the message rate area were charged Seven Message Units for the first minute and one message unit for each additional minute. Broadband Subscribers will be faced with the same problem if companies like Time Warner set usage limits. I have a better solution, and that is to require websites sending streaming data streams to pay the ISP's for carrying their traffic. If the ISP's want to limit P2P traffic they can take a lesson from Japan where the ISP's are limiting upstream traffic to 30GB per day.
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