 
telcolackey
The Truth? You can't handle the truth
join:2007-04-06
Death Valley, CA | First Post Greed, greed, greed
FiOS, FiOS, FiOS
Monopolies, monopolies, monopolies
Thought I would get that out of the way
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"Believe only half of what you see and nothing that you hear." - Dinah Craik | |
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Dogfather
Altitude is your friend
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: First Post Pretty much sums it up nicely. | |
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supergirl
join:2007-03-20
Pensacola, FL
 ·Cox VOIP
·Skype
 ·Cox HSI
 ·AT&T Southeast
·magicjack.com
| Hate to say it, but FIOS is started to test investors's nerves. Hey, Verizon, MAKE SOME GOOD COMMERCIALS! They suck! Market it right. Nobody understands that techo-sh@!# so price, price, price. Ivan, get off you butt and fire the marketing staff. Also, fix that mess of a billing system. If you can't make a profit by 2010, hope they shoot holes in your golden parachute.
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Saving the world keeps me busy. However, I find Earth very primitive from my home planet of Krypton.
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cypherstream
Build Fios, and I will come.
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
clubs:
 ·Cingular Wireless
| Re: First Post Hey I like the Fios commercials with the "awesome" guy and the multi room DVR, and all of that.
The telco's will keep loosing to Cable because Cable has one thing that the telco's don't. That's footprint. Cable is all over the place, where Fios or Uverse is only in select locations. Fix that problem and then maybe start to see a change.
If Fios was available to me I would subscribe. | |
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dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: Cable > DSL WTF? Neither you nor anyone else could power off the equipment and yank the USB and connect CAT5?
Yeah, too hard. 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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telcolackey
The Truth? You can't handle the truth
join:2007-04-06
Death Valley, CA
edit:
August 9th, @12:10PM
| Re: Cable > DSL If she only had USB I expect this was a very old computer. To say that Comcast sucks because the tech could not figure out how to hook up outdated equipment probably running a very old OS is a bit of a general statement based on a isolated issue.
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"Believe only half of what you see and nothing that you hear." - Dinah Craik | |
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dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
edit:
August 9th, @12:24PM
| Re: Cable > DSL You say lazy.
To connect USB, drivers have to be installed - more work.
To connect CAT5, plug it in - no installation of drivers.
For more than one computer to be used, sub either gets to pay for Home networking and all hw/installation/setup is handled and supported by Comcast
*OR*... user gets to connect their own router - themselves - no installation by Comcast and no support.
Story is full of holes here Mactron.
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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BillRoland
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL
clubs:
·Cox HSI
| Re: Cable > DSL said by dadkins  :Story is full of holes here Mactron. I have to agree. The believability of what he wrote is predicated on all of us being idiots and never having looked behind the cable modem.
The only lazy person is the person too lazy to unplug the USB, plug in the CAT5 and power cycle the modem.
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"Don't steal. The government hates competition." | |
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dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
edit:
August 9th, @12:44PM
| Re: Cable > DSL said by Mactron :said by dadkins :Story is full of holes here Mactron. As they say the truth hurts.  Deal with it. My guess, they couldn't figure out release, renew to pull a new IP address. So USB it was.  The original connect had to pull IP when modem powered up - with either connection.
There is no need for release renew when swapping connection type.
Resetting or powercycle of modem(at most) is all that is needed.
USB was used (most likely) at user request/approval as it would require running the install software to install USB drivers - but you already know this, right?
Getting way too deep in here for me. LOL!
We believe you Mactron, honestly! 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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| | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: Cable > DSL Maybe the moral to that story is that stupid people shouldn't own computers, especially these days. That story only isn't full of holes, it's not believable either. | |
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| | | | | | | | | Syncognition
join:2008-01-12
Winter Park, FL
| Re: Cable > DSL Embarq includes NIC installation in a full install scenario. Not all ISPs are created equally. Some do only what is necessary to get service working for a customer, while others do only what is necessary to make the customer satisfied with how their service works. | |
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| | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Not to mention, I'm sure that there are 90% of the people that would agree that no one wants a "lazy" tech, much less a smart one, installing anything on their computers.. | |
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jsz0
join:2008-01-23
Jewett City, CT | ^^ You can use a USB connection on a modem on any computer if you install a driver. Perhaps he tried CAT5 and it didn't work for some reason? So he used USB instead? | |
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CableTool
Poorly Representing MYSELF.
Premium
join:2004-11-12
| said by Mactron :said by Matt :T I only know one person who has DSL and that was because his cable service in Manhattan was awful. I know quite a few here. The local Comcast franchise just plain sucks here. I just helped a friend here setup Dry Loop DSL here. Comcast hooked her up with USB Internet so she couldn't use it on her other computers. After many calls and tech visits Comcase basically told her Tough Luck. "We only promised you one computer connectivity".  She dumped Comcast cable TV, HSI and is very happy with her new DISH DVR and DSL. She saves ~ $20 a month too. Moral... Not all Cable Companies are created equally. Get over it Cable Shills. Im not even sure what "USB INTERNET" is. If the tech had an issue with her NIC he resorts to USB. They are not there to figure out any issues your system might have. Its your system.
If its hooked up via USB and the customer wants to unplug it and plug in another computer with Cat5 what is stopping them? There is nothing in the modem stating it needs a USB connection.
As far as customer service stating they only hook up one PC thats true. Unless its networking, the tech isnt going to have you line up every CP in the house and hook them up and install drivers on all of them.
They can of course.. and Im sure a charge will ensue.
In any event a tech using USB and installing drivers is actually the OPPOSITE of lazy. Its a last resort and for some reason the tech had to resort to it.
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CableTechs.org/"Horrible People with Integrity" | |
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Dogfather
Altitude is your friend
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | I know lots of people with DSL because they don't give a crap about 10Mb service. They are fixated on POTS and would rather have 1.5-3Mb service for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of cable. | |
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dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: Cable > DSL said by Dogfather :I know lots of people with DSL because they don't give a crap about 10Mb service. They are fixated on POTS and would rather have 1.5-3Mb service for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of cable. I know a few just like that... but I also get to hear about xxxMB taking forever to download too.
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: Cable > DSL said by Dogfather :said by dadkins :said by Dogfather :I know lots of people with DSL because they don't give a crap about 10Mb service. They are fixated on POTS and would rather have 1.5-3Mb service for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of cable. I know a few just like that... but I also get to hear about xxxMB taking forever to download too. I get the same complaints of cable users suffering from BT traffic shaping. Grass is always greener on the other side. Yep, from either side, huh? 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
·DSL EXTREME
·DSL EXTREME
| I've been on both, and typically will go for whatever deal works out best for 'me'.
1. I don't have HDTV sets, nor do I care for any of the hockey/football/sports packages. I can (and do ) get decent service on OTA digital.
2. I do care if the service is reliable (esp. Internet, as I telecommute) I don't need service higher than 3Mbps/512kbps, but it had better be up.
3. I do need voice, and I don't care if its voip (I use Skypeout for telecon calls).
4. I want a good price.
Eg. I have been on
DirecTv (went from $55 to $65/month for 3 sets on 'plus' package.
AT&T POTS/LD $40 + $4.99 for Canada + Tax/fees = $57 
DSL-Extreme: 3mbps/512kbps for $24.95 + taxes
TWC will be giving me: Digital (1 box) + analog + HSI + VoIP unlimited for $89/month + taxes/fees (probably $100 total).
In the long term, I may switch over to AT&T DSL for a better deal: AT&T DSL $30/month, Vonage/Call Vantage $25/month, and OTA digital TV.
Its next to impossible to move my phone number while on DSL-Extreme, so I'm taking this route.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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| | elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
·SONIC.NET
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
·MM INTERNET, INC.
| said by Dogfather :I know lots of people with DSL because they don't give a crap about 10Mb service. They are fixated on POTS and would rather have 1.5-3Mb service for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of cable. We're not fixated on POTS.
When, or should I say, IF cable-voip offers a service level equivalent to POTS, then we'll look at it.
Cable has had a decade of opportunity to make their service viable. In my neighborhood, they've re-cabled four times in 18 months, but it (cable modem) still craps out daily.
I expect my phone to ring when it is dialed.
Circuit-switched POTS ensures that. VOIP, in all of its flavors, does not, and often, doesn't route the failed call to a working voicemail box. POTS does. When I dial 911, I expect to reach a 911 operator, who knows who I am and where I am, every time. POTS does this. Everything else doesn't. | |
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DHRacer
Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10
Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Charter Pipeline
| TV more important I think the majority of people want to bundle their services and bills around TV, which helps Cable Companies.
Telco, which doesn't have much in the way of TV service to the masses (it's coming but not as widespread as Cable is now), is simply losing because people want TV, and they want bundles, and right now Telcos can't do as well as Cable in this department.
Though I would give the FIOS bundle a try if it came into my neighborhood. I'd even switch my wireless to VZ and go for the quadrulple play...
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texans20
Johama McBama 08
Premium
join:2002-09-28
Texas!
clubs:
| That's Business In the 90s when cable companies were dumping a lot of money into upgrading their network, the telcos did nothing, not a damn thing. Today we are seeing the results and the cable companies are seeing the rewards of their investment last decade.
AT&T still can not look beyond next quarter's earnings, that is why they refuse to begin doing a large scale upgrade to fiber. They are missing out on yet another chance as fiber would allow them to offer video and compete with cable companies. Their inability to look beyond next quarter's cash flow statement will be their downfall. They're proud of U-Verse which is nothing but a bandage.
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"I sincerely believe the banking institutions having the issuing power of money are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies." Thomas Jefferson | |
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a333
A hot cup of integrals please
join:2007-06-12
Corona, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: That's Business The telco's would go the FTTH route, and they knew that..
While cable co's got a margin over the telcos based on their superior last-mile networks, they're reaching the limit of the technology. The telco's have been in the data business for a LONG time, hence their core networks were much superior to anything that MSO's could get in their dizziest daydreams. AT&T will go the FTTH route soon enough, as the step from FTTn to FTTH isn't that big of a step. As to FiOS, GPON is only the beginning of things. Right now, Verizon is posed to provide symmetric 100 Mbit internet over the EXISTING FiOS infrastructure, and in a few years, EPON or even WDM-PON will come into play. And there's nothing the cable MSO's can do about it. DOCSIS 3.0 can't save them. Throttling/traffic shaping won't save them. As I've said, Cable's last-mile was great for the last decade, but the telcos are now beginning to actually use the full potential of their backbone networks (such as Verizon lighting up 40 Gbit links), while cable starts to feel the limitations of coax, and their rather limited core network. | |
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NetAdmin
join:2008-05-22
| Re: That's Business said by a333 :TThe telco's have been in the data business for a LONG time, hence their core networks were much superior to anything that MSO's could get in their dizziest daydreams. You base this statement about the MSOs core networks on what exactly? I know of at least two MSOs that are carrying their full channel lineups via IP from their "super-headends" to the local market headends. That includes the SD and fully uncompressed HD feeds.
As I've said, Cable's last-mile was great for the last decade, but the telcos are now beginning to actually use the full potential of their backbone networks (such as Verizon lighting up 40 Gbit links), while cable starts to feel the limitations of coax, and their rather limited core network. Despite what you believe, MSOs actually have an upgrade path from their coax networks. Some of the MSOs have node densities as low as 200 homes per node, which after round of splits, can allow fibre to be run directly to the home. Unlike most telcos, the MSOs actually have fibre much deeper in the last mile and will be able to extend that fibre for much less, if needed. With some of the newer 3ghz overlay technologies, they might not need to and still remain competitive with FTTH.
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Eleven years of carrying The Clue Bat... | |
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a333
A hot cup of integrals please
join:2007-06-12
Corona, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
edit:
August 9th, @10:42PM
| Re: That's Business I never said telcos have fiber deeper into the last mile. By 'core networks', I meant the telcos' IP backbones that've been around for a looong time, compared to MSO fiber. Sure, MSO's have their fiber, but a lot of that serves as the closed network that delivers their TV content. When it comes to IP, cableco's most of the time must dump that data onto another datacenter (cogent/Level3/Verizon), incurring peering charges. Telco's on the other hand, have Tier 1 networks, giving them essentially free peering with other Tier 1 backbones.
BTW, I never said telco's have more last-mile fiber than cable. I said they've improved their core network to the extent where they are poised to offer next-gen services if needed, over whatever medium needed. FiOS, where deployed, is starting to make noticeable dents in cable's subscriber base in the area. As to Re-Verse, they'll get their head back out their a$$ and get that final leg of fiber pushed out to their millions of existing subs. | |
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rdmiller
join:2005-09-23
Richmond, VA | Qwest?? I haven't seen any specifics about Qwest. They seem to be the telco in the most danger of going out of business. Perhaps some clever hedge fund (you know the one!) could bundle Qwest with Sprint and sell the package to the Koreans. | |
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Dogfather
Altitude is your friend
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
·Cox HSI
 ·Verizon FIOS
·MegaPath
·Cox VOIP
·Verizon west (ex G..
·ViaTalk
·Time Warner VOIP
·RoadRunner Cable
edit:
August 9th, @11:59AM
| And the telco response will certainly be... More dollar-ing to death of customers with endless junk fees.
It seems these pencil pushing corporate dumbasses don't see the obvious coorelation between endless price increases and losing to competitors.
What else should a telco expect when they double the price of intro DSL deals? What else should a telco expect when they charge $7.50 or more for Caller ID alone? What else should a telco expect when they have such bullshit fees like Verizons "you didn't use enough long distance" fee and $1.50 "how dare you not want to be in the phonebook" fee.
Above all else, people shop price. Drop the price, get the customers. It's that simple. You dollar the piss out of them and they'll eventually bail. And a customer, once lost, is very difficult to get back.
And even if they return to the $10-$15 DSL deals, it stops being a deal when the POTS side is $20-$40, laiden with junk fees and overpriced services.
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"Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders...All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger." -Hermann Goering 4/18/46 | |
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supergirl
join:2007-03-20
Pensacola, FL | Re: And the telco response will certainly be... Add VZ's billing system sucks. | |
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fcb2868
@mindspring.com
| Interesting that you should bring up the $7.50 monthly charge for caller ID. It was when the phone company took that charge from $6.17 to $7.50 that I was motivated to investigate service from my cable provider. Within hours the divorce from the phone company was complete. TV, phone and internet via cable are working fine for me. | |
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Duramax08
Oy, Pass It on.
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX | Dang crazy. | |
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Telcos Lost Both Voice and Broadband To Cable in Q2
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Cable > DSL
