 
AbBaZaBbA
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Wildomar, CA | ha blame canada | |
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technick
Premium
join:2000-12-16
Loganville, GA
| Re: ha I can understand this perfectly. Look at the schools for antivirus students, and other virus creators, and network security engineers. They teach you how to hack the hell out of different routers, switches, systems, everything. So that you know how to stop them in the future.
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"Our greatest glory consists not in never falling, but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius - - - - - - - - - - - Streamfire.net- - AIM - CoNFuCiUsNiCk | |
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Nightshade
sic semper tyrannis
Premium
join:2002-05-26
Salem, OR | Re: ha I dunno. I have a bad feeling nothing good will come of it.
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Just say "no" to bad code | |
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| | audiog
join:2004-08-09
Detroit, MI
| Yes
I took one way back in college. A course on how to hack OS kernels and network security it included a large this is illegal and these are the penalties. We had video guess lecturers from people who were caught and it was illegal for them to be with in 20ft of a computer or for some set foot on a college campus. Also, while I was in college a student at MIT let a virus he was working on lose by accident and it almost brought down most of the east coast internet and Michigan were the backbone control was located. The guy lost all of his gad credits and was blackballed for being so stupid. | |
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Nerdtalker
Working Hard, Or Hardly Working?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-02-18
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
| said by technick  :I can understand this perfectly. Look at the schools for antivirus students, and other virus creators, and network security engineers. They teach you how to hack the hell out of different routers, switches, systems, everything. So that you know how to stop them in the future. I agree.
Know your enemy.
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Touch a thistle timidly, and it pricks you; grasp it boldly, and its spines crumble. -William S. Halsey
iPod Shuffle=iPos
I'm testing Gmail's spam filters: Broadbandreports1@gmail.com
Spam: 2785 | |
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ColdFiltered
join:2005-01-25
Atlanta, GA | Another reason to invade Canada? Malicious. Why not offer a class to commit to terrorism activities, too? | |
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Alki-lime
@golden.net | Re: Another reason to invade Canada? There ARE classes on how to commit terrist activities. However, police officers, soldiers, body guards, and such aren't usually considered terrorists -- at least until the Bush administration needs to do some fundraising. | |
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LaserjetXX
join:2004-03-13
Waterford, MI | lolerskates Why don't we offer a class on how to make explosives? Or a class on pickpocketing? If we better understand how these work we'll be able to stop them! | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
1 edit | Re: lolerskates Bomb making is illegal. Spam isn't. And you don't think in law enforcement circles they don't teach how bombs are made, how they work so that bomb squad personnel understand what they're looking at even if that particular bomb configuration has never been seen or come across bomb making materials? You can't diffuse a bomb unless you know how it works. And you can't understand how one works unless you can make one if given the parts.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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| | kdhamann
join:2003-11-08
Medina, OH | Re: lolerskates Some "Bomb" making is legal. Otherwise dynamite and fireworks would not be available and mining would be impossible. I've been in at least one mine, and they still blow up ore bodies. Have to get the explosives from somewhere. | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
1 edit | Re: lolerskates You're right...my bad. Certainly if we want to get specific, some bomb making has to be legal since our military get their weapons from somewhere. What I meant was that it's not legal for just anyone (like a college student) to make a bomb. My understanding is explosives manufacturers (in the U.S.) have to be licensed by the ATF to make and/or distribute those explosives. I would assume that something similar is required in Canada.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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| vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD
| said by LaserjetXX :Why don't we offer a class on how to make explosives? Or a class on pickpocketing? If we better understand how these work we'll be able to stop them! So a person that has a job as a bomb diffuser with policeor FBI doesnt know how to make them?
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I tie a rope around my penis and jump from a tree, don't you wanna grow up to be just like me!!!! | |
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Black Box
join:2002-12-21
 ·Execulink
| Re: lolerskates said by vic102482 : So a person that has a job as a bomb diffuser with policeor FBI doesnt know how to make them? Correct. They are taught in bomb making and terrorism classes. But you won't be admitted to one unless you're police, army or CIA. --
Keep It Safe, Stupid!
Yes, I CanChat. Can You? | |
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davoice
join:2000-08-12
Saxapahaw, NC
·Comporium
| said by LaserjetXX :Why don't we offer a class on how to make explosives? They already do, it's called Chemistry 101 and 102. Any student who pays attention in Chemistry class can make a moderately effective bomb w/o much hassle.
said by LaserjetXX :Or a class on pickpocketing? They already have that too... it's called Law School.
- Davoice | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| The police only teach bomb-making to those with a need to know, those with jobs in the field, and those who have just been hired to take on jobs in the field.
Traffic officers don't learn it. Homicide detectives don't learn it.
And the police certainly do not teach bomb making when they deliver lectures at high schools and colleges.
As for chemistry courses, there is making an explosive, and there is making a bomb. There is a difference.
If you'd studied engineering you would be aware of that difference. But you'd also (hopefully) have been immersed in the concepts of ethics first.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| Re: Police Don't Teach Unemployed People Bomb Making Of course they teach it to people are aren't employed in the bomb-squads...there would be little point in teaching it to someone already in the bomb-squad.
Traffic officers certainly do learn it as they're part of the pool of officers are are chosen as candidates.
As a degreed engineer (M.E. & mathematics) I'm well aware that even the G.E. requirements for my M.E. major required not only more than enough chemistry to make explosives, but also enough E.E. to build a charge and trigger and of course enough M.E. to design the casing of a such a device so that it would have rather nasty effects if detonated.
Now I'm not out running around blowing crap up nor have the slightest urge to. And that isn't because I took ethics which at my school was a joke class in itself. The only ethics I was forced to take was a propaganda class on how being an engineer will lead me to destroying the fragile planet we live on and how we should all move back into caves. The same for these students. Just because they're taught the skills doesn't mean that there is going to be a wave of new spammers graduated from it.
With your logic we could also scrap chemistry, biology, programming, C.E., M.E., archery or any other class that teaches skills that could be used to do harm in one way or another.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| Re: Plenty SPAM examples; should just teach stop SPAM It's not about stopping yesterdays spamming methods. It's about stopping tomorrows. Only when someone is profecient on doing it themselves do they start to think out of the box so that proactive measures can be created to stop new types of spamming before it even starts.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| It is about creating new spam engines That is the thing, he will be teaching how to create new spamming engines, not how to stop ones that already exist.
I don't think it is a good approach, unless ethics are taught first.
And I doubt this professor is qualified to teach ethics.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA | Re: It is about creating new spam engines University ethics courses are a complete joke. | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| What's the big deal... Besides, you will never be able to control spamming unless you understand completely how it works so that anti-spam programmers are in the mindset of 'if I were a spammer'. The key is to foresee future spam techniques BEFORE actual spammers do. Without such classes and stuff anti-spam will always be a corrective action rather than a preventive action.
Someone made the comment about terrorism. Think about it...CT analysts at the FBI and CIA are constantly drilled to think like terrorists so they can understand their mindset and thus think of ways to kill Americans as terrorists do, hopefully before the terrorists themselves think of it. Of course not with the purpose of doing so, but with the purpose of stopping it or blocking it.
On the other hand, it's also legal to spam. It's not a bombmaking class. I'm wondering if 1/2 the people complaining about the spam class put up an equal protest to brewing classes. It's certainly no secret that alcohol breaks up families and is responsible for countless deaths on the highways. Certainly a worse effect than spam.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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LaserjetXX
join:2004-03-13
Waterford, MI
| ... You don't have to analyze every little thing that someone compares it to. Spam itself may be legal, but in it's unsolicited form, the form you see it in most of the time it is. How many people do you know jump at the chance to get on a mailing list for enlarging your penis, refinancing your house, etc? | |
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Persona
Premium
join:2004-07-07
Gravenhurst, ON
| the media I laughed out loud at the media feeling the need, at the end of the article, to explain the great security lengths the university will be going to - to protect the people.
You'd swear they were talking about a Level 4 BioHazard Lab.
Perhaps it should be listed as a business course? | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| spam directed at our neighbours to the south Canadians like to think of themselves as a civilized people.
Generally Canadians take exception when their universities are used to teach how to disrupt the lives and businesses of others -- including foreigners.
And this is the case even though most of the spam some of these students will go on to generate will be directed at our neighbours to the south.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) | |
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rshoch
Premium
join:2003-09-01
Santa Ana, CA | Top Gun This class reminds me of the elite training given to the best of the best. | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| Flying For The Soviets Following your analogy, these guys will be flying for the Soviets in no time.
They don't have jobs, they aren't likely to get AV, AT and ASW jobs, and they are not a part of any elite, they pass Programming 101 and 201, and they can get into this course.
They'll be working for the otherside just to pay off their student loans.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) | |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
1 edit | Re: Flying For The Soviets Looks like someone got an A in Conjecture 101.
Any evidence to support these assumptions?
Following your logic we should ban racing schools too since they have little chance of ever getting a sponsored ride and will end up just doing 150MPH on city streets.
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Don't get it, demand it! The Anime Network www.theanimenetwork.com | |
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
·Qwest.net
| I for one..... would find this fascinating, just like learning how to write viruses. When the forums here devoted to malware discuss and even post the codes it is so interesting for me to read their critique of how the code is written, Learned bunches
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Real Men use Vacuum tubes, 25 pound filament transformers, and plate voltages no less then 2400 volts...BPL I'm coming to get you | |
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bokamba
Chengdu Rocks
Premium
join:2002-04-05
Falls Church, VA
·Verizon Online DSL
| Good idea, but not the best place to teach it It's kinda risky to teach college students to do this stuff, because right now there's more money in creating and distributing spam and spyware than there is in preventing it. If these guys were guaranteed an internship at Symantec or Webroot after completing the course, the risks would be reduced. | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB
| Re: Good idea, but not the best place to teach it That is one of the things. These students are in Alberta. A Canadian province with no major AV, AT, or ASW labs.
There is enough unemployment in IT in Canada that they may turn to crime just to feed themselves and pay off their student loans.
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(Virus&Hijacking FAQ + Submit suspected malware + Backups FAQ + Security FAQ TOC) | |
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keith2468
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-03
Winnipeg, MB | Becoming The Enemy There is knowing the enemy, studying what the enemy does.
And there is becoming the enemy, doing what the enemy does.
They are becoming the enemy. | |
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adamofwales
join:2004-08-24
Englewood, CO
1 edit | SpamU Well,
I know that University are hurting for students these days.
Problem is that no major reputable company uses spam. There's too much negative connotation with the word.
They'd rather advertise legitimately. | |
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| JimmySask
join:2004-06-24
Regina, SK
| Re: SpamU There is not a single Canadian University "hurting for students." As a matter of fact, many of them are starting to be far more stringent with admission criteria to thin the herd so to speak. I see this as them trying to offer something new and innovative, to stand out amongst a fairly large crowd of other canadian universities. | |
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Spam School
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Plenty SPAM examples; should just teach stop SPAM
