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story category Qwest Angry At Colorado Towns
Because they want to know who won't get service....
(old news - 11:58AM Friday Jun 22 2007)
tags: legal · prices · Video · competition · coverage · business · telco
In response to the FCC's new video franchise rules (currently under appeal), several towns in Colorado have banded together to pass an ordinance that demands Qwest divulge exactly where they won't be offering TV and broadband services. Qwest is greatly annoyed (see Denver Post, Rocky Mountain News) and calls the move a "cable monopoly protection ordinance," though nothing currently prevents Qwest from competing.

AT&T, Qwest and Verizon have all been working very hard to abolish the local video franchise system because they want to eliminate build-out requirements for telcoTV (though they insist it's to bring competition and lower prices to all consumers). The phone companies (and some cable providers) are also working very hard to avoid more accurate broadband penetration reporting, which would illuminate deployment shortcomings.

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Forums » Qwest Angry At Colorado Towns
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morbo
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this "demand to know" issue should spread

this would put quite the snag in telco video roll-out plans. seems only fair though. if telco isn't coming to town anytime soon, cities can start muni systems.

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Re: this "demand to know" issue should spread

said by morbo See Profile :

this would put quite the snag in telco video roll-out plans. seems only fair though. if telco isn't coming to town anytime soon, cities can start muni systems.
And quite the snag in providing competition to cable providers. They are cutting off their nose to spite their face.
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Re: this "demand to know" issue should spread

it wouldnt snag competition at all, if cable for exmaple saw qwest was really strong in one area and they had it neglected oddds are they would start to apply pressure to that area to take customers away from Qwest.
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morbo
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uh, no. if telco isn't coming to town and they have to disclose that information, then how is starting a muni system cutting off their nose? telco isn't coming! muni is a competition to cableco. competition is good, right?
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Re: this "demand to know" issue should spread

said by morbo See Profile :

uh, no. if telco isn't coming to town and they have to disclose that information, then how is starting a muni system cutting off their nose? telco isn't coming! muni is a competition to cableco. competition is good, right?
Except some people tend to think that once the government has given up something (like internet, telephone, etc), then they should not ever be allowed back in, no matter what the level or what the reason or what the majority of the tax payers (well, we all know that the 'majority' is 51% of the 10% who bother to vote) want. And they pay good money to 'law makers' to ensure that muni's can not carry out the will of the local people.
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jslik
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said by GOLFnSUN See Profile :

And quite the snag in providing competition to cable providers. They are cutting off their nose to spite their face.
Well, the telcos moaned and hollered for these changes, and now they have to live with the FCC order's ambiguities. This one-size-fits-all-not-really approach is one of the reasons the FCC (until now) has kept out of the local franchise arena.

I would think you of all people would hate unelected bureaucrats in D.C. telling folks how to run things in Hometown, USA. As the Wikipedia entry for the 10th Amendment says:
"The Amendment, which makes explicit the idea that the federal government is limited only to the powers it is granted in the Constitution, is generally recognized to be a truism."
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said by GOLFnSUN See Profile :

They are cutting off their nose to spite their face.
Not as far as they're concerned. They're simply choosing to discourage telcos from coming in, cherry-picking, and offering service to only a portion of their citizens. The towns decided that such a development would be worse than no telco TV at all. IMHO it's a reasonable position. As representatives of all their citizens, they have an obligation to look out for all of them, when granting certain permissions to private firms to utility the right-of-way and other public resources.
PeterCollins

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Or they could just enter the market on a level playing field to the cable cos and be required to do a full buildout (like the cable cos must do).

dvd536
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Its not about cable at all. its that they want to be able to cherrypick which areas they'll deploy in.
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longstreet

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Qworst

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marigolds
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What's really funny...

is that the cable providers are already required to supply buildout plans to cities, as well as providing subscriber numbers and households passed information.

batterup
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New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

Click for full size
What has that done for New Jersey?

Just keep it up. You all deserve what you will get.

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

Yea, and Massachusetts and Washington don't have statewide franchising and they're doing just fine on your chart.

Your point?
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :



Your point?
My point is New Jersey is number one because of FiOS. Do I really have to spell it out Mr. Comcast Rocks.

Do you know what the secret limit is before Comcast sends THE letter.

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

My point is New Jersey is number one because of FiOS. Do I really have to spell it out Mr. Comcast Rocks.

Do you know what the secret limit is before Comcast sends THE letter.
Given a choice to be (barely) first in an average speed test vs. second (or fourth) and keeping local control, second would be fine.

Keep in mind the regulatory scheme you have (or lack thereof) you'll be stuck with for decades. I don't think that's worth ceding local control for a few months' faster deployment.
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :

Given a choice to be (barely) first in an average speed test vs. second (or fourth) and keeping local control, second would be fine.

Once the CATV is granted a franchise local control is down the crapper. Just keep going the way you are going. Keep an eye on New Jersey, New Jersey all action no B.S. speculation.

What a surprise, another post form Comcast. You can't fool all of the people all of the time. How many letters did you send out today?

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

Once the CATV is granted a franchise local control is down the crapper. Just keep going the way you are going. Keep an eye on New Jersey, New Jersey all action no B.S. speculation.

What a surprise, another post form Comcast. You can't fool all of the people all of the time. How many letters did you send out today?
First, just because your town can't manage its right-of-way is no reason to want to take any other towns' rights.

Second, just because I'm using Comcast means nothing. Comcast was the best value for me at this time, so I don't know why you keep bringing it up. FIOS is impressive, and if it were available (I'm not in a Verizon area) I'd probably get it.

If local franchising is so bad, why has Verizon said repeatedly that it's not a problem?
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :

First, just because your town can't manage its right-of-way is no reason to want to take any other towns' rights.

You don't really know what a CATV franchise is and yet you post.

A CATV franchise has nothing to do with a right-of-way. It has to do only with supplying CATV. Verizon can run FiOS without town permissions as it falls under maintaining and improving the telephone plant. The cable is in place telephone and internet can be carried without a town franchise. Only when CATV is carried over the same wire does the town have a say.

If you only read TeleTruth ignorance will be the rule of the day and the leeches will get fat on the blood of the gullible.

jslik
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3 edits

Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

You don't really know what a CATV franchise is and yet you post.
Excuse me, I know what a CATV franchise is. If you bothered to read federal law you'd clearly see that: "Any franchise shall be construed to authorize the construction of a cable system over public rights-of-way, and through easements, which is within the area to be served by the cable system and which have been dedicated for compatible uses..."

The law is the law. If Verizon (or any other provider) wants to run telecommunication services defined as cable under federal code, then they need a franchise.

What is your definition? You seem to have all the FreedomWorks supplied answers.

batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :



What is your definition? You seem to have all the FreedomWorks supplied answers.
FiOS is a fiber cable used to replace 100 year old copper telephone cable.

A CATV franchise is not needed to place FiOS. It has nothing to do with a right of way. FiOS is an improvement to the telephone plant and covered by a tariff not a franchise.

As of now Verizon can place FiOS and transmit data at 1490 nm and 1310 nm without having to slop the local hogs. In order for Verizon to transmit data at 1550 nm RF/CATV they must slop the local hogs. It has nothing to do with right of way; the cable is in the right of way.

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

I don't disagree with those comments. Franchising law covers the type of service, not the means of service. The ROW obligations depend on the type.

Call it a big deficiency in federal law, but until it is changes, we have to live with it.
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :

I don't disagree with those comments. Franchising law covers the type of service, not the means of service. The ROW obligations depend on the type.

Call it a big deficiency in federal law, but until it is changes, we have to live with it.
How can New Jersey law over ride Federal law? Post a link to the Federal law.

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

How can New Jersey law over ride Federal law? Post a link to the Federal law.
I believe the way states are doing franchising is re-defining the franchise area. Quite frankly, I don't know why cities aren't fighting their states over this.
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batterup
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said by jslik See Profile :

Excuse me, I know what a CATV franchise is. If you bothered to read federal law
P.S. excuse me, I did not know there was a Federal law concerning CATV franchises. Please post a link and throw more stumbling blocks in the way of those trying to build America's network. 18th and falling is not low enough for you?

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

excuse me, I did not know there was a Federal law concerning CATV franchises.
Well, enough said.

Try this link to US Code Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter V-A, Part III, Franchising and Regulation, Sections 541-549. Read Section 541.
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :

said by batterup See Profile :

excuse me, I did not know there was a Federal law concerning CATV franchises.
Well, enough said.

Try this link to US Code Title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter V-A, Part III, Franchising and Regulation, Sections 541-549. Read Section 541.
quote:
(c) Status of cable system as common carrier or utility

Any cable system shall not be subject to regulation as a common
carrier or utility by reason of providing any cable service.
So TPC can tell the great unwashed no POTS for you. I am no longer a common carrier, I am free to hustle a buck. Die universal service at a reasonable price, die. I like the way you think.

jslik
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by batterup See Profile :

So TPC can tell the great unwashed no POTS for you. I am no longer a common carrier, I am free to hustle a buck. Die universal service at a reasonable price, die. I like the way you think.
That's why I mentioned deficiency in the code.

FiOS, for example, can do pretty much anything; but depending what it is 'doing' any given second, it falls under a completely different area of law. That's why all the big concerns are pushing for all of their service to be classified as 'information', not cable or telephone. Then they'd be free of pretty much any regulation.
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batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by jslik See Profile :

That's why all the big concerns are pushing for all of their service to be classified as 'information', not cable or telephone. Then they'd be free of pretty much any regulation.
Verizon is TPC and could never be totally deregulated. Deregulation is what dropped US from 1st to 18th in 20 short years. A regulated national information common carrier is the way it worked. One System it Works gave US the best in the world for over 90 years.

At this point in time I don't have a dog in the fight. I will soon be connected to the best network in the world.

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1 edit
So? Doesn't mean its related so please quit posting that graph like its proof that statewide franchises bring broadband bliss.

We deserve what we get?

Where's Texas in that list? We were one of the first to pass a state franchise (not counting Connecticut's failed DPUC in 1996) but we're nowhere near the top. A lot of good its done for us so far.... so thanks a lot AT&T.

And New Jersey only signed their state franchise in mid 2006. You seriously think that in less than 12 months they've become the #1 broadband state because of that bill.

But hey... what does a state-wide franchise for video services have to do with internet speeds?

Government has nothing to do with it. The more they keep messing around the worst its going to get.

batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by kpfx See Profile :

good its done for us so far.... so thanks a lot AT&T.

And New Jersey only signed their state franchise in mid 2006. You seriously think that in less than 12 months they've become the #1 broadband state because of that bill.

Actually the state wide franchise has been in effect for only 5 months. In that time I have seen FiOS deployment increase 10 fold. I'm sorry if New Jersey in number. No I'm not we deserve it.

In about 1 and 1/2 years the world will stand slacked jawed in awe of New Jersey's network.

Thespis
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quote:
Where's Texas in that list? We were one of the first to pass a state franchise (not counting Connecticut's failed DPUC in 1996) but we're nowhere near the top.
In all fairness, building out New Jersey and building out Texas are two COMPLETELY different things...

batterup
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Re: New Jersey has a state wide franchise law.

said by Thespis See Profile :

quote:
Where's Texas in that list? We were one of the first to pass a state franchise (not counting Connecticut's failed DPUC in 1996) but we're nowhere near the top.
In all fairness, building out New Jersey and building out Texas are two COMPLETELY different things...
New Jersey doing better than Texas is natural selection and more then a CATV franchise.

Texas is mostly at&t.
Let us compare Texas and New Jersey.

Education, the percent of those that enter 9th grade that will graduate High School.
Number 1 New Jersey 89.8 %
Number 38 Texas 64.2%
»www.unitedhealthfoundation.org/s···rad.html

Family income.
Number 1 New Jersey $59,989
Number 36 Texas $41,959
Funny, Texas is a so called right-to-work state and New Jersey is heavily union. You can't bag groceries in NJ without belonging to a union.
»www.census.gov/hhes/www/income/h···08b.html

Do I hear banjo music in the background?
Gnarlodious

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Let's nationalize internet access...

Yeah, it's time. Call the internet part of "The Commons" and turn it over to hordes of open-source geeks working out of Wiki sites. Let's take a cue from Hugo Chavez and his Socialist Revolution, corporate controlled communications are antithetical to the needs of the consumer.
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