 jaorgeron
join:2003-11-13
Kenner, LA | Well do you blame them Look how everyone else is trying to do the something with other silly patents. Microsoft is just trying to save themselves money | |
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MikegotOOL
join:2001-01-21
East Setauket, NY
clubs: | Re: Well do you blame them Next they'll try to patent e-toilet paper. | |
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click_310
Eat my shorts
join:2002-12-06
Savannah, GA
| Re: Well do you blame them said by MikegotOOL  :Next they'll try to patent e-toilet paper. They'll have to patent the,"Virtual Ass" first. | |
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| | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH
edit:
July 23rd, @12:46PM
| Re: Well do you blame them Dont forget about the E-Toilet and iShit as well as the all-new Vista-Flush! | |
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| | | | | noogoo
join:2005-06-27 | Re: Well do you blame them who needs e-TP when you can have e-Bidet? | |
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hayabusa3303
Over 200 mph
Premium
join:2005-06-29
clubs: | what about the "Virtaul Crap" thats makes the mess. | |
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Smitedogg
Uzbekikitty
Premium
join:2000-11-11
Pueblo, CO
| said by MikegotOOL :Next they'll try to patent e-toilet paper. One-Pass Wiping | |
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| | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH | Re: Well do you blame them I preffer the triple pass. May be slower, but gets the job done better.
--
- "Techie" Jim | |
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David
Last man standing
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
clubs: | Re: Well do you blame them I preferr the multi-pass till it is clean... Like a clean bottom.. | |
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA | Re: Well do you blame them Will it accept dual sided quick ram.? Maybe it'll prove itself to be a splash in the can. 
--
Honk if you've never seen an uzi fired from a car window | |
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| DprssdIsntFn
Premium
join:2004-01-12
Pompton Lakes, NJ | Actually ... yes.
Stealing IP and then paying for it under court order is standard procedure for Microsoft. I've long since lost track of the number of cases they've lost and then settled.
They are the worst offenders. | |
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| | bth_lonewolf
join:2005-03-28
Redmond, WA | Re: Well do you blame them That's an absurd generalization, and just frankly not true. | |
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MS is piracy
@verizon.net
| Re: Well do you blame them Hmm.
BurstNet.
Opera Software.
Novell.
Need I go on? Those were just off of the top of my head, but I'm sure that I can dig up quite a few more with a little help from Google.
The parent post spoke the truth. MS is the biggest corporate intellectual-property pirate there is. The ARE a 1000lb Gorilla. (They've grown since they used to be an 800lb Gorilla.) | |
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| | | | bth_lonewolf
join:2005-03-28
Redmond, WA
| Re: Well do you blame them said by MS is piracy:
BurstNet.
Opera Software.
Novell.
Need I go on?
Novell: The Netware issue had nothing to do w/ IP theft (unless you're discussing something else).
Opera: Nope, not over IP theft. (Was about MSN not working correctly in Opera, and Opera claims it was intentional to maintain market dominance.)
Burstnet -- you mean Burst.com? (Streaming?) -- yeah, this one has some merit, certainly at least seems suspicious.
I'm not saying that IP Theft has never happened (in ANY company -- there's plenty of suits involving IBM and other large companies). I just can't stand generalizations -- 2/3 examples you posted had nothing to do with IP theft -- and you exactly proved my point. You make it sound like it's a corporate objective for employees to go out and steal. Unfortunately, a single employee doing something wrong can get the company into a LOT of hot water. For all the small companies doing it, most of it will go undetected.
I also won't say antitrust cases have never happened, but frankly I find many cases BS. Whatever you think about Microsoft, how many hundreds of half-baked lawsuits are filed against Microsoft so companies could get a pile of cash? | |
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a
@qwest.net | mark, the only reason you are not pleased is because you didn't think of it yourself, give yourself a break, if you were a genious like bill gates then you would have thought of it. | |
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marketex
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Chicago, IL
edit:
July 23rd, @10:45PM
| Re: Well do you blame them Bill Gates is, perhaps, a genius at playing poker, requiring huge skills at bluffing. He did not think up the idea of emoticons any more than he thought up Drivespace or the browser or Disk Operating System (the original DOS) or the GUI or Java, each of which he attempted to appropriate as his own. Can you spell T-H-I-E-F? | |
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| | | dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Well do you blame them said by marketex :Bill Gates is, perhaps, a genius at playing poker, requiring huge skills at bluffing. He did not think up the idea of emoticons any more than he thought up Drivespace or the browser or Disk Operating System (the original DOS) or the GUI or Java, each of which he attempted to appropriate as his own. Can you spell T-H-I-E-F? Come to think of it, he didn't think up the idea of 'computer program' (probably John Von Neumann), or 'subroutine linkage' (David Wheeler), or 'operating system' (the Atlas team, under Tom Kilburn).
What a thief!
And that goes for anyone else who writes software, too! | |
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MS is piracy
@verizon.net
| Re: Well do you blame them dave, you do have to admit, MS had brass balls to: 1) pretty much outright "steal" Stacker's runtime disk-compression products' features (*), 2) integrated it into MS-DOS, including a new API that would allow pre-loading the driver, and 3) turn around and sue Stacker, for "theft of trade secrets", for developing an updated version of their product to work with that new API.
(*) Not just features - MS's actual compression implementation infringed on Stacker's LZS (Lempel-Ziv Stacker) patent, IIRC.
There is pretty much nothing new under the sun coming from MS. Every single thing that they "innovated", that I am aware of, was "stolen" from someone else.
MS, the playground bully, got rich by stealing the lunch money from the naive children of rich parent, not by earning the money themselves - to make an analogy. | |
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marketex
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Chicago, IL
edit:
July 26th, @04:00AM
| ! ! | |
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marketex
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Chicago, IL
| Re: Well do you blame them No, Dave, some of us "roll our own" subroutines which is why the concept of incorporation of each of the pilfered devices as claims within a patented and pirated program is tantamount to a particular writer one day deciding to patent all the vowels in the alphabet.
It is rather ironic that the least innovative producer of computer software does the most to limit creativity on the parts of other creators of software while protesting to the Attorney General that any fetters on its market position would impede market innovation.
But, then, Bill is a friend of yours, right? Schoolyard kind of buddy? Like "MS is Piracy" suggests?
Bill will eventually get your lunch-money. Check with his former employees for a reference on that point. | |
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john Qwest
join:2002-05-24
Fishkill, NY
| Microsoft Patents Custom Emoticons I recall that this is one that will fall due to "prior art", as I believe they have been use since T.T.Y. 
What about the good old yellow Smiled face of the 60's.
Have a Nice Day :P | |
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| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Microsoft Patents Custom Emoticons said by john Qwest :I recall that this is one that will fall due to "prior art", as I believe they have been use since T.T.Y. You didn't read the patent, did you?
They're not patenting 'emoticons', they're patenting a particular method for handling user-customized emoticons.
With such a system, I could define a new emoticon right now (say, something to say 'you completely missed the point'), and include it inline in this message. Thereafter, it would have been given a name such that I could refer to it by name in future, rather than having to respecify the image every time, and readers would simply see the image.
It may be that prior art exists for this, I'm not well-versed enough to know. But we weren't doing it on ASR33 teletypes, that's for sure.
(My opinion: allowing easily-customizable emoticons will knock a few more IQ points off an already-dangerously-illiterate public.) | |
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ET TU
Its' Only Temp
Premium
join:2005-05-21
Belvidere, NJ | Better hurry-up Better hurry-up patent our ass's | |
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| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio | Re: Pirate Someone else who didn't read the patent ... | |
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erbert Kornfeld
@208.145.x.x | ROFL! OMG funny poke! (I'm too afraid to use the emoticons for this post for fear of legal reprisals.) | |
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Steve
Security is inefficient
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Tustin, CA
| Re: They've GOT to be kidding! said by richk_1957 :And now @#$%^&* Microsoft wants to copyright them??? You not only didn't read the patent, but you also don't know the difference between patents and copyrights.
--
Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site | |
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richk_1957
If ..Then..Else
Premium
join:2001-04-11
Minas Tirith
| Re: They've GOT to be kidding! wrong
I did read the patent
They are patenting either using character sequences, such as a colon [:] and a right bracket [)] as a smiley face, or to have the same sequence replaced by a image, such as on the receiver of the text.
And yes, you are right, I did use the word copyright, instead of patent. That is my mistake | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
 ·WOW Internet and C..
·Comcast
| Re: They've GOT to be kidding! said by richk_1957 :wrong I did read the patent They are patenting either using character sequences, such as a colon [:] and a right bracket [)] as a smiley face, or to have the same sequence replaced by a image, such as on the receiver of the text. And yes, you are right, I did use the word copyright, instead of patent. That is my mistake It's not yet a patent. It's an application. Possibly a very big difference. | |
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Seandhi
Seeing From a New Level
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Humble, TX
| They are patenting a way to transfer custom emoticons to another user through IM. Right now, one must have the same database of emoticons to be displayed the same on both machines. This will allow a user to create a custom emoticon, and have it displayed as intended on the other machine despite disparities in the databases.
--
"Bah. Bush is no cowboy. He's an east coaster who came down to Texas, picked up the accent, and rode it into the White House." - AmeritecTech | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
·WOW Internet and C..
·Comcast
| Re: They've GOT to be kidding! said by Seandhi :They are patenting a way to transfer custom emoticons to another user through IM. Right now, one must have the same database of emoticons to be displayed the same on both machines. This will allow a user to create a custom emoticon, and have it displayed as intended on the other machine despite disparities in the databases. Finally . . . thank you. | |
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richk_1957
If ..Then..Else
Premium
join:2001-04-11
Minas Tirith
| said by Seandhi :They are patenting a way to transfer custom emoticons to another user through IM. Right now, one must have the same database of emoticons to be displayed the same on both machines. This will allow a user to create a custom emoticon, and have it displayed as intended on the other machine despite disparities in the databases. I just went through that patent application again slowly and got a headache. If that's what it means, I'll take your word for it.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like microsoft is concerned that when you send a emoticon as text, unless there is a local database to render the text as an icon, all the user will see is the text. Microsoft wants to set itself as the central database for this, so you will not have to worry about anything local. Like a couple years ago, there was an emoticon for a smiley face with a beard :]>. I don't think there ever was a icon for that. Microsoft wants to have the central database (control) of all the icons. If this is so, every time you time an emoticon, it will have to reference Microsoft's servers. This will increase the internet traffic enormously, while originally, emoticons were supposed to decrease it.
If this goes through, will there be a charge to use emoticons? | |
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| | dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
edit:
July 24th, @08:17PM
| Re: They've GOT to be kidding! Microsoft wants to set itself as the central database for this, so you will not have to worry about anything local. Microsoft may or may not want that, but you won't find a word about it one way or another in the patent application. Patents describe procedures, not business plans.
Your reply seems to be pure fantasy. | |
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richk_1957
If ..Then..Else
Premium
join:2001-04-11
Minas Tirith | Re: They've GOT to be kidding! Not really
After going through the application, this is what it sounds like to me. I could be wrong. | |
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dadkins
Land of Confusion
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
edit:
July 23rd, @10:58AM
| Patent This! LOL!
©Yo Mama | |
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storm64007
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Freeport, NY | Re: Patent This!  | |
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dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
| Microsoft is not the problem It needs to be said: the problem is not that Evil Microsoft wants to patent every idea in sight. The problem is how the patent system works with respect to software.
If you're playing a game where the rules are such that, if you buy property you land on, then it has the dual benefits of allowing you to collect money from other players while preventing them from using the property to collect rent from you, then you'd have to be pretty silly to try and win the game without buying a certain amount of property.
If you don't like the way the game works, then it's kind of fruitless to point out that the other players are playing by the rules. You need to get the rules changed. | |
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See 10 replies to this post |
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pokesph
It Is Almost Fast
join:2001-06-25
Sacramento, CA
clubs: | Pirate heh.. i was just poking fun.. geeze get over it.. | |
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jmorlan
Crescit Eundo
join:2001-02-05
Pacifica, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| I can't view the patent The images in the patent don't show up for me. I see a QuickTime logo which immediately disappears. It's the same in both Firefox and IE. I have disabled all popup blockers. I tried uninstalling and re-installing QuickTime. Nothing works.
Any suggestions?
TIA. | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
edit:
July 23rd, @01:11PM
| Re: I can't view the patent You need to install a TIFF viewer. Only a couple of different ones work.
Here's the link:
»www.uspto.gov/patft/help/images.htm | |
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jmorlan
Crescit Eundo
join:2001-02-05
Pacifica, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: I can't view the patent Thank you. That worked in IE, but it still doesn't work right in Firefox. I guess I'll take it up in the Firefox forum. Thanks again. | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL | Re: I can't view the patent »www.alternatiff.com/
If you go there, they say they have a plugin that works with FF. | |
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jmorlan
Crescit Eundo
join:2001-02-05
Pacifica, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: I can't view the patent said by Goober :» www.alternatiff.com/If you go there, they say they have a plugin that works with FF. Thanks. I had tried that earlier, but this time I checked their troublshooting pages and found the fix. Thanks again. | |
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whogivesaratsass
@comcast.net | Patents and MicroSquash WTF, do i care! answer hell no go away with this crap of a news story. move on get a life, take a breath of fresh, non polluted microsquash air........
signed,
dontgivearatsass | |
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xirian
Premium
join:2003-01-26
Beacon, NY | The icon for this article... is pure awesomeness. | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
·WOW Internet and C..
·Comcast
| Does No One Read the Patent Application? It's amazing that people on DSLR consider themselves so much more intelligent than the non-techies. And yet, looking at all the comments, clearly there's only a few people here that understand what the patent is about.
Too many jerks moving their knees at the same time.
Of course, DSLR clearly likes to froth the waters with their yellow journalism when it comes to MS and patents. | |
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See 9 replies to this post |
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XknightHawkX
join:2003-02-13
Morton, IL
clubs:
| Can't patent something that is already out. I was pretty sure that in school they told us that you can't patent something that has already been let out into public. You have to file for a patent when you come up with the ideal/product/program. Now if I read the patent right, They are trying to patent something that was already out. This is out of the patent application.
((Emoticons have acquired immense popularity and hence importance in new email, chatroom, instant messaging, and even operating system applications. The variety of available emoticons has increased tremendously, from a few types of "happy faces" to a multitude of elaborate and colorful animations. In many cases, an increase in the number of available emoticons has been a selling feature for new releases of communications products. However, there are now so many emoticons available that some applications may be reaching a limit on the number of pre-established ("pre-packaged") emoticons that can be included with or managed by an application. There is an exhaustion point for trying to provide a pre-packaged emoticon for every human emotion. Still, users clamor for more emoticons, and especially for more nuanced emoticons that capture the subtleties of human emotions and situations.))
Now if I am reading this right they just said that emoticons are popular and they want to patent the ideal of emoticons. I better tell everyone I did not read the whole application so no need to flame what I said here. I may be wrong and just thinking of copyright laws but if I am wrong then the laws for patenting need changed. They just want thier hands on more money. Why is beyond me. I like money but I am sure they have plenty of money already. | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
edit:
July 24th, @03:44AM
| Re: Can't patent something that is already out. You're reading it wrong.
Copyright laws??? | |
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| XknightHawkX
join:2003-02-13
Morton, IL
clubs:
| Copyright laws might be what I'm thinking of. But I just don't see how they can get a patent on something they said in the application. Emoticons have acquired immense popularity. How can you patent someone elses product? And I'm not saying it wasn't thier product first. But they have no proof it is thier product. They point out that emoticons have acquired immense popularity. If they wanted the patent they should have filed for it before they became popular. I am not trolling on this subject and do not want flamed for what I have to say. I am hoping someone can explain how they would get a patent to something they have to proof to prove that it belongs to them. | |
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| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
edit:
July 24th, @11:06AM
| said by XknightHawkX :Now if I am reading this right they just said that emoticons are popular and they want to patent the ideal of emoticons. I better tell everyone I did not read the whole application so no need to flame what I said here. You're not even close.
There isn't a single claim in the text you quoted. It's simply background for describing the problem (which is why it's in a section headed 'background').
You should have read the 'abstract', which is a single paragraph saying what is being claimed. | |
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Goober
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
·WOW Internet and C..
·Comcast
| Re: Can't patent something that is already out. said by dave :said by XknightHawkX :Now if I am reading this right they just said that emoticons are popular and they want to patent the ideal of emoticons. I better tell everyone I did not read the whole application so no need to flame what I said here. You're not even close. There isn't a single claim in the text you quoted. It's simply background for describing the problem (which is why it's in a section headed 'background'). You should have read the 'abstract', which is a single paragraph saying what is being claimed. And even then, sometimes the abstracts aren't updated as claim amendments are made during prosecution.
What happens is that the patent office requires that an abstract be submitted as part of the original application filing. If a patent attorney is diligent, they will update the abstract after the claims are allowed. But, I rarely ever do and most other practitioners that I know rarely ever do either.
So, as a general rule, I would consider the abstract likely broader than the actual patent. I think reading the claims along with the abstract probably gives a generally good, quick idea as to what is going on. | |
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gukid
join:2005-05-17
| maybe it's someone with the same name as microsoft As stated in the "background" of the patent:
"Emoticons have acquired immense popularity and hence importance in new email, chatroom, instant messaging, and even operating system applications."
Doesn't that in itself state prior invention? That they are trying to patent something that has "aquired immense popularity"? This may honestly be the last straw microsoft... | |
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| gukid
join:2005-05-17
| hey wait! let's patent the method of patenting something. the whole submission and reviewing method, as obviously it's possible to patent things that other people have been using for years.
that way, any time a big corporation patents stuff, we'll sue them for breaking out patent, or charge them a giant blanket licensing fee! | |
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| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: maybe it's someone with the same name as micro said by gukid :As stated in the "background" of the patent: "Emoticons have acquired immense popularity and hence importance in new email, chatroom, instant messaging, and even operating system applications." Doesn't that in itself state prior invention? That they are trying to patent something that has "aquired immense popularity"? This may honestly be the last straw microsoft... Let us imagine a hypothetical patent application for 'the wheel'.
The background would say 'inasmuch as moving around the place has acquired immense popularity ...' and then would mention some problems that had been impeding moving around.
The claim would then go on to describe the marvellous new invention for solving those problem: the wheel.
The Microsoft patent application follows exactly the same model: there are certain problems with using emoticons (which are either a fixed repertoire and/or excessive overhead), and the patent application descibes a supposedly novel solution for the problems.
So, no, the fact that you're solving an existing problem does not make the solution 'prior art'.
(FWIW, I'd guess that not many patents claim that they solve problems that haven't so far been seen to exist.)
I suspect that you failed to understand what you were reading. I can't see any other reason for confusing the background and the invention.
P.S. I'm well aware that there is, in fact, a patent for the wheel held by someone down under. I am not talking about that one. | |
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Microsoft Patents Custom Emoticons
© 2005 Microsoft so now every time we use a emoticon 
© 2005 Microsoft we're ripping off M$
© 2005 Microsoft
© 2005 Microsoft sad world we live in...
and 
Ptooey