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story category Major Artists May Sue RIAA
Who should get all that settlement money?
(old news - 02:59PM Saturday Mar 01 2008)
tags: legal · Fileswapping · business · trouble
There is certainly a lot of debate in the air about the way that the RIAA operates, punishing individuals with excessive fines for acts of illegal filesharing. However, they defend themselves with the argument that what they are doing is protecting the copyrighted work of the musicians who have worked so hard to create original works of art. If that’s the case, why are some major artists starting to get disgruntled about the fact that RIAA hasn't actually ever given most of them any of the money that they’ve gained through these fines? Reports indicate that the RIAA has garnered as much as $400 million in settlement fines that haven’t been passed along to the artists whose copyrights were violated. The recording industry says that the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up but some artists are starting to get antsy enough about the issue that they are threatening legal action.

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Forums » Major Artists May Sue RIAA
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punker
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lol

lol

woody7
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h mmm......

Starting to see the dissent, which shows that it really wasn't about the artist, after all.(which I actually knew anyway)Peace
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Re: h mmm......

said by woody7 See Profile :

Starting to see the dissent, which shows that it really wasn't about the artist, after all.(which I actually knew anyway)Peace
The RIAA doesn't care about the artists. The RIAA thinks of artists the same way Marilyn Manson sings about "Disposable Teens."

If established artists were smart, they'd form their own Music Label--just one so they get more than 10-20% of the money.

Michael Jackson's Thriller album made him $75 million. It made the studio about $300-400 million.

Of course, James Cameron got $0 for directing Titanic. After it broke the box office records, they paid him only on the backend.
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Re: h mmm......

actually James Cameron took a pay cut if i remeber for the movie on his own reconisense to finish it.

on another note its funny the RIAA scum bags can come of with a figure so quick when they sue someone but it takes forever for the artist to get there money. that's just a little to ironic.

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Re: h mmm......

said by joker5656 See Profile :

actually James Cameron took a pay cut if i remeber for the movie on his own reconisense to finish it.

on another note its funny the RIAA scum bags can come of with a figure so quick when they sue someone but it takes forever for the artist to get there money. that's just a little to ironic.
Yes, he returned his director's fee, $3.5 million, in exchange for finishing the movie the way he wanted. They still tried to screw him on the backend. He didn't see money on the movie till about 2 years later.
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rawgerz
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Nice guys

I guess those artists really don't care where that money came from. That makes you look as bad as the RIAA. Maybe they didn't realize that the RIAA is basically the same as any class action lawyer, by which the lawyer walks away with a nice fat percentage of the award and the people affected are lucky to get $50 each.

Squabbling over money that was probably set aside by those kid's parents for college, real nice.
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Re: Nice guys

said by rawgerz See Profile :

I guess those artists really don't care where that money came from. That makes you look as bad as the RIAA. Maybe they didn't realize that the RIAA is basically the same as any class action lawyer, by which the lawyer walks away with a nice fat percentage of the award and the people affected are lucky to get $50 each.

Squabbling over money that was probably set aside by those kid's parents for college, real nice.
so true
Gary Coleman

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GASP!

You mean the labels may NOT have the artists' best interests at heart!? And these artists are just learning this? Say it ain't so!

newview
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What we really meant . . .

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
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Re: What we really meant . . .

said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
No. they don't know how to divvy up the money. The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much? No matter how they split it, some artists are going to feel they deserved a bigger piece of the money than other artists. I'd bet money that that is what is holding everything up.
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major marco
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moderated:
March 1st, @05:26PM

Re: What we really meant . . .

said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
No. they don't know how to divvy up the money. The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much? No matter how they split it, some artists are going to feel they deserved a bigger piece of the money than other artists. I'd bet money that that is what is holding everything up.
Oh please - that argument is cliched and clueless.
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r81984
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Re: What we really meant . . .

I agree.

They are probably trying to hold out as long as possible to make money off the $400 million before they have to pay it out.
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MeKuN

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Re: What we really meant . . .

Exactly what i was thinking. Wonder what kind of interest you could get off 400 mill. Sorry we dont have all the 400 mill in one place we have it diversified in our RIAA portfolio.

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said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
No. they don't know how to divvy up the money. The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much? No matter how they split it, some artists are going to feel they deserved a bigger piece of the money than other artists. I'd bet money that that is what is holding everything up.
Honestly I bet they don't care. They certainly have to know what songs were "Distributed"(I'll not use the word downloaded) otherwise they wouldn't be able to come up with a money value settlement to begin with. To begin with they can only attempt suits against song sharers who's artists were with RIAA which not all artists are. Thus some songs are off limits. I'll bet it has gotten to the point where they(RIAA) does not keep a database of who's songs where shared/settled thus negating the money split. The artists depend on the RIAA to help them but in actuality they are simply trying to line their own pockets. Many artists are already being screwed by the record labels as it is.
Skippy25

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Re: What we really meant . . .

They should because if they had to take you to court for it they would have to have specific songs that you were distributing. The court rarely works on broad terms and with this it would certainly require specifics.
SalesGOD
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Your argument holds no weight. For the RIAA to file suit against you, they need to know the title/artist of the song you had illegally on your hard drive. The have to provide that to the ISP and the court to process the suit. The RIAA has a complete list of which songs were downloaded. They know who the money belongs to. They are just being money-grubbing hounds. They are screwing over the artists that they say they are protecting.
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But they do know how to divvy that money up. Every one of these cases is filed with a specific list of songs that were discovered on the defendants computer. You can't sue someone for copyright infringement without naming exactly which work was infringed.

The RIAA and the artists know exactly where the money should go.

yock
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said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much?
They should have figured that out before collecting the fines.

bear73
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said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
No. they don't know how to divvy up the money. The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much? No matter how they split it, some artists are going to feel they deserved a bigger piece of the money than other artists. I'd bet money that that is what is holding everything up.
Sorry TK, but I think you are WAAYY off here. For each count that the RIAA took an individual to court for, they had to have a song/artist name. So for each settlement, they have a list of the infringements. Then its a simple percentage math.

The Fat-Cats are just stalling to either make money on intererst, or to swindle teh artists.
If the RIAA tries to say that most of teh money offsets the cost of litigation, then they are REALLY screwing around people. They said they were getting the money in the name of hte artists. The legal fees were just the cost of business. AT BEST all they can claim for themselves is the same percentage they take in direct sales of media (be it downloads, CD sales, or such)
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Ahrenl

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Re: What we really meant . . .

Almost all of this money was from private settlements through there telemarketing/direct mail centers though. There's only been one case to see court if I'm not mistaken. A few handfuls of those were reported to have severely incorrect information, so who knows how poorly the suit selection process actually was.
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said by TK Junk Mail See Profile :

said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We haven't figured out a legal way to screw the artists completely and keep all the money for ourselves.
No. they don't know how to divvy up the money. The fines collected were not tied to music downloaded on specific artists. So, how do they decide who gets how much? No matter how they split it, some artists are going to feel they deserved a bigger piece of the money than other artists. I'd bet money that that is what is holding everything up.
And I thought you were smarter than this.

All you have to do is look at the records and see what songs they accused people of downloading. If that song was part of the complaint, then that artist gets the money. Of course, if record keeping wasn't so good, then that could be another case.

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said by newview See Profile :

quote:
"the money has just been delayed due to the complexity of figuring out how to divvy it up"

Translation:
We pulled the numbers we used to sue people out of our A$$, and now we have no clue what we owe anyone, or even if we owe anyone at all. We were intending to keep all the money for ourselves.
I fixed it for you.
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edit:
March 1st, @03:50PM

"excessive"? bit of editorializing here ...

OK, KathrynV, you call this "news". So stay objective, and drop biased statements, like whether or not the "fines" are "excessive". Just report the amounts, and let the readership judge. In most cases, that's a more effective way to make the point, anyway.

That's what organizations that purport to report "news" strive to do.
Ahrenl

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Re: "excessive"? bit of editorializing here ...

Which organizations? Name one.

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" >www.inkycircus.com/photos/uncate···25.jpg">

should go back to playing VIDEOS.
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edit:
March 1st, @05:42PM

Actually...

...instead of either side getting greedy about the money, donate it to some charities.

rob_in_chatt
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how to split it up

have you all seen a copy of one of those stupid ass letters from the RIAA? it clearly states that xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx ip downloaded copywrighted material, then proceeds to give a list of what was downloaded and when.

so they can do all that, but cant decide how to split it up between the artists? BULLSHIT!!!

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You know what that means.

I guess I should start suing people for illegal file sharing as well if the RIAA is. If the RIAA is doing this on behalf of the artists then they should have already started paying all of them they are suing for. Or maybe we should make an organization to sue the RIAA on behalf of the artists who are not getting any money, or better yet sue on behalf of the people who are getting harassed by the RIAA.
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The RIAA has Sheryl's Pennies!

Maybe the RIAA can bring R.A.P.E's Nutty McShithead out of retirement to explain things to the artists.

hebert131

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now we see what the RIAA is all about

RIAA it time to pay the piper now we see what your up to you are the ones that should be put on trial and fined and the musicians come up fine for you.
Where is all of that money for the artists in a bank ,in your pockets ? I knew your party would come to an end .
It is time for you guys to be shut down
for good .
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Legal fees

The reality is that much of the money was used to support a very expensive legal team. The artists that they were supposed to protect are not getting much if anything but I assure you that the legal fees have been paid. Has anyone inquired how much they paid to outside counsel?

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Re: Legal fees

the legal fees are the cost of doing business. The ONLY way the RIAA can keep a penny is if they use the same formulae they use on sales. legal fees are independant of ALL of that.

If you sue BillyBob for $10 but it costs you $9 to get it in legal fees, you dont get $19 from BillyBob (unless thats PART of the judgement). Now, if you are suing BillyBob in Amy's name, because BillyBob owes Amy $5, and you project $5 for your "operational" costs, and you win $10, but it costs you $9 in legal fees, then you STILL owe Amy $5. That $9 came out of your pocket...
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said by rmoonin See Profile :

The reality is that much of the money was used to support a very expensive legal team. The artists that they were supposed to protect are not getting much if anything but I assure you that the legal fees have been paid. Has anyone inquired how much they paid to outside counsel?
Considering they might not have had ANY counsel in the first place running an illegal court system that should get a lot of lawyers disbarred and thrown in the slammer, who knows?

I've seen an RIAA letter and no lawyer was listed. They are also suing in the wrong jurisdiction, if they are suing at all, but the ppl settling don't know it. Judges throw those out.

My advice on an RIAA letter: send it to your State's AG and ask them if real lawyers are involved and if it is a real case. Or, send it to your state bar, not association, with an unlicensed activity complaint.
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ross

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Maybe...

these artistes that support the R.I.A.A. should get what every other class action plaintiff gets: a coupon! In this case good for a discount on their next CD purchase...
qworster

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Always follow the money....

In this case, right into the labels' bank accounts, where it WILL stay!

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Great news

It's about time the lawsuits got turned back around on those bastards.

cork1958
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Re: Great news

said by winterforge See Profile :

It's about time the lawsuits got turned back around on those bastards.
No doubt, and these are just the people to do it to them.
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Re: Great news

The RIAA as we know it is in a downward spiral.
Becoming more and more irrelevant.
It is only struggling and hanging on from law suits, not from "representing artists."
Now that the news is out that artists are not even getting anything from the lawsuits, makes the RIAA even more irrelevant.
The artists need to find a company that envelopes new technology to distribute songs. Many artists have already broken rank from the "big guys" in favor of the little guys to get songs out.
The RIAA as we know them are done...... they just don't know it.
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edit:
March 2nd, @07:51AM

Pointless

Why should the artists expect any money from these settlements?

The artists (for the most part) no longer own the works in question that are being infringed. These works belong to the RIAA member companies and those companies are free to do with this money anything they wish.
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See 9 replies to this post

Link Logger
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Weasel Lawyers

One word, 'Lawyers'.

Even when they work for you, you can't trust them as a weasel just can't help but be a weasel.

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theblonde07
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Individuals.......probably not

I think one thing that everyone is missing here is that most of the millions that have been collected have not came from individuals. Doesn't anyone remember Napster or mp3.com paying out the nose to settle?
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jarthur31

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I wonder......

.....if these "artists" and their attempt to scare the RIAA is just Lars Ulrich? Wouldn't that be sweetly ironic?
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