 
VerizonSuXass
@comcast.net | So Freakin What! ...Verizon has done an abysmal job deploying broadband to it's customers. This half assed deployment won't put a dent in Verizon's bottom line considering it's high deployment costs.
Verizon will die a flaming investor death! | |
|  | 
rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL | Re: So Freakin What! Comcast astroturfing is alive and well.  | |
| | srobmw
join:2005-10-01
New Windsor, NY | Your agenda is painfully clear. | |
| | ITALIAN926
join:2003-08-16
Stratford, CT
| Youre a 'tard. Verizon is doing a great job deploying FiOS. If they had the resources , theyd deply it even faster. Unfortunately, it takes money to make money. When the existing FiOS network starts to create profits, you will REALLY start to see some cool deployment.
The ONLY thing holding them back now is getting LFA's for Television. Hopefully, theyll get more states on board like CA and TX.
I remember 3-4 years ago, the majority of the people here thought Verizon would NEVER do FiOS at all. | |
| | pcnetworx1
join:2005-09-21
Bethel Park, PA | Wow, this IS CLEARLY an astroturfer. Pardon me but please, STFU! | |
| | | | | BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| What do they consider "broadband"? Is it like the FCC which considers 200Kbps broadband? Which is a joke. Ok so now the movie from cinemanow or movielink will only take a day and a half over your 200 Kbps "broadband" connection to download instead of a week. | |
| | | | 
Tsume
My little Toby.
join:2004-02-23
Winter Park, FL
 ·ViaTalk
 ·Cox HSI
| AFAIK only Verizon is doing this quote:
Now a number of network operators are starting to deploy robust technologies like fiber-to-the-home.
"A number?" That number is one, right?
--
"True warriors do not follow paths, they make them. It is not just their desire, it is their nature." (Battletech) | |
| | 
dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this said by Tsume  : quote:
Now a number of network operators are starting to deploy robust technologies like fiber-to-the-home.
"A number?" That number is one, right? No. There are a few ISPs that are FTTH.
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | |
Tsume
My little Toby.
join:2004-02-23
Winter Park, FL
·ViaTalk
·Cox HSI
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this Oh, what I meant was that out of the top 10 cablecos and top 10 telcos, only Verizon is doing this.
Smaller companies are probably doing this, but the impact is insignificant.
--
"True warriors do not follow paths, they make them. It is not just their desire, it is their nature." (Battletech) | |
| | | |
dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this *Most* of the "smaller guys" have fiber connections that blow Verizon out of the water.
I would rather have one of these smaller ISPs(or a Muni) service my house than Verizon. Asymmetrical is so last century! LOL!
SureWest has had 10/10 for a while now(years), and now has 20/20.
"Other" ISPs & Munis have even more on tap for their customers.
There is no real reason why Verizon is dishing out 15/2 or 30/5... 
If these "smaller guys" or Munis can push semi-reality, surely Verizon could too, no?
I'm not going to fawn over Verizon or any other ISP.
I have the fastest available to me.
Perhaps before I die, I will see a fast, symmetrical connection... maybe.
It surely won't be Verizon.
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | 
Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs: 
| No one should discount what might be a surprise contender for our future broadband business either in the form of our electric companies.
I can't recall where it was, perhaps here at bbr maybe..but I was reading a story the other day about one in particular and came away feeling that Wow..this could really be the biggest surprise of all to hit the industry.
While all eyes seem to be on the cable and telco wars, don't forget that it wasn't long ago that they themselves weren't really in this game either. They came along and literally took a whole industry away from the likes of many a dialup provider.
Could our electric companies now do the same thing?
This article outlined how this one particular company was going to be putting in fiber and how the main purpose for it was going to be to serve their electric customers with next generation technology.
They also detailed their plans on being an ISP as well, but the real focus of the rollout was electricity related, and come he** or high water, their plans WERE to continue with the FTTH.
While there's so much focus on triple play..how about QUADRUPLE play..in the form of our electric company offering it all..PLUS our electric service?
After all, if lines to our homes are being eliminated, why not truly make it all in one?
I can't help but to think that verizon really has seen all of this writing on the wall for the future and that has caused them to move ahead with their big plans now.
These electric companies could be major players in all this in the future, and the real wild card that's yet to be exposed.
Obviously, they're enormous companies with a lot of financial ability to move heavily into this if they want.
I am simply amazed and dumbfounded at this point that the likes of AT&T hasn't yet come to realize that they MUST do this now if they hope to be a contender for our business a few short years from now.
One thing I DO know is that if Ct.Light and power comes along and starts offering this..between them and the cable operators in this state like Comcast and OOL...there probably will be NO MORE AT&T to talk about.
I mean, lets face it folks. Who's really going to be taking this slow dsl they offer many of their customers in the face of fiber to the home competition?
Not too many.
Not many at all.
--
The life you help save just might be your own Team Discovery | |
| | | | karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
Nashua, NH
 ·Fairpoint Communic..
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this You are absolutely correct. My town (taunton, ma) has symettrical Fiber (10/10) for 35.00/month. It's WAY faster/better than comcrap or even Verizons offering. They even offer 100/100 connections for just 120.00/month (I only use the 10/10 though).
The best part about my town is that the electric company is OWNED by the town. They don't have to appease shareholders, hell, they don't even need to show a profit. The ratepayers are subsidizing the internet at the moment, and there's only about 5,000 customers at the moment, but the town has an OC-192 to Boston, and it only runs about 10,000.00/month. That's a GREAT bargain, and everyone who has fiber raves about it. Nothing like downloading a TV show at 1MB/sec (about 5 minutes) from bittorrent sites. And the fact that I can seed at 10mb/sec makes it all the sweeter.
The future is FTTH. And if Verizon doesn't lower it's prices, and increase it's speeds, it's going to be a 'has-been', as they really can't compete against a non-profit town. | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Merry Whatever
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA | Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this That's what I'm talking about!
I'm envious! | |
| | | | | | | | | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by karlmarx The ratepayers are subsidizing the internet at the moment, and there's only about 5,000 customers at the moment, but the town has an OC-192 to Boston, and it only runs about 10,000.00/month. That's a GREAT bargain, and everyone who has fiber raves about it.
[/BQUOTE :And how the hell did your town get such a cheap rate for transit? | |
| | | | | | karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
Nashua, NH
·Fairpoint Communic..
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this I live in one of those commie blue states. You know, those states where the government actually WORKS for the citizens. In the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts, we have state subsidies for ALL towns to get very cheap internet access. We don't roll over and give Verizon whatever it wants, we tell Verizon what we expect, and verizon provides it. It's a much better system than those right-wing christian nutcase states have, and ALL our citizens benefit. Luckily, we'll be taking back both the House and the Senate next month, so all those weirdo pedophile republican whacko christians will be 'put out to pasture'.. | |
| | | | | | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY | Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this So 10K is only what your town pays, but the state pays for the rest? | |
| | | | | | | charterbites
join:2005-11-19
Covington, LA | Look Commie boy...What MA wants to do is give it FREE to the ghetto kids at taxpayer's expense. | |
| | | | |
rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL
| VZ is holding back, letting the network settle in, and when it does, BANG!
Even in your city only 5,000 of how many (56,251 or less than 10% sign-up). Say 5,000 x $35 = $175,000 a month.
$10,000 a month for the line to the backbone (how much is that? $100,000 a month?). Sounds like a disaster so far. | |
| | | | 
91439306
15,000 Watts of Bass Power
join:2002-10-16
New Milford, CT
| You're describing BPL (Broadband over PowerLine), a technology that is both impractical and doomed, because it causes illegal interference to a broad range or radio services from 2-80MHz. Don't be fooled by BPL rollout tests. They are companies that are just soaking up green investors' money (ie, ignorant investors pumping money into this based on marketing informationt that is designed to make BPL look like the next savior of broadband--which it is not).
BPL is actually more expensive to roll out, because it needs more repeaters, and because the power lines are natural antennas, the BPL signal hash will radiate for miles and disrupt a broad portion of the radio communications spectrum. Therefore, it is doomed by its very nature. Don't expect anything beyond trials.
--
Take care,
Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
My Kurzweil Music at: '»www.dv-clips.com/theater.htm
'»www.basspig.com Bass Pig's Lair
'»www.mwcomms.com
'»www.adventuresinanimemusic.com Stereo Feed! | |
| | | | | hottboiinnc
Kyle
join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable
edit:
October 7th, @01:18PM
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this Not all BPL cities are doomed. Cincinnati, OH has a very large area that they have with BPL it is OUT of testing and fully operational. Its operated by Current Communications.
Edit: Also the new Equipment by Motorola's Canopy line does has eliminated all of the interference by using Wireless Internet to each transformer. The SM is connected to the transformer and then the low voltage line that is connected to the building is the one carrying the Internet Traffic then back to the wireless back haul.
NOT everything is doomed. There are companies making this work. | |
| | | | | | | | | | |
91439306
15,000 Watts of Bass Power
join:2002-10-16
New Milford, CT
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this As Kyle (hottboiinnc) has cited earlier in this thread, some are using wireless for the backhaul (gee, if it's wireless, then is it really BPL?), citing Cincinnati, OH as one example. Sure, this limits the range of interference to some degree, but low voltage power lines are just as good at acting as antennas as high voltage lines, so unless the power level is microscopic and the spectral mask is notched in important frequency ranges, there's going to be a considerable rise in the 'hash' on the communications bands when one of these systems goes online.
I think that the political approach of notching out the portions of spectrum belonging to the most vocal opposition groups will silence many opponents, but that doesn't mean that the problem is objectively solved.
Investors are a fickle bunch. A good company PR job can lead investors to "follow through and not abandon what they already invested considerably in". Some saavy investors may cut their losses, but others will want to believe that a solution is around the corner, and are already in too deep to drop out. I think that's why BPL has lasted far longer than it's technical merits suggest.
--
Take care,
Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
My Kurzweil Music at: '»www.dv-clips.com/theater.htm
'»www.basspig.com Bass Pig's Lair
'»www.mwcomms.com
'»www.adventuresinanimemusic.com Stereo Feed! | |
| | | | | | | hottboiinnc
Kyle
join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this MOT has worked with several people to develop this standard so it does not cause interference. And as far as Cicni being a small scale launch its actually almost city wide. Cinci is one of the top 30 Metro Cities in the United States. Also low voltage lines have less radiation going through them since the Transformers are the ones cutting the power down its not a BIG antenna like you think it is. It can kill like any amount of power in large amounts but this equipment is doing its job. But its not wireless. Its actually BPL. It services many homes on 1 low voltage line. Everyone connecting to a single transformer can receive BPL over that transformer if its enabled.
MOT's equipment is one of the few break through to actually make this work; even in the country areas. | |
| | | | | | | |
91439306
15,000 Watts of Bass Power
join:2002-10-16
New Milford, CT
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this Let's see, at 80MHz, anything over 4' is big, so a hundred feet of wire running from pole to house is a 'big' radiator.
Since powerlines are not shielded (as in coax), they radiate.
Like I said before, the BPL provider can mitigate but not eliminate the problem, by notching (filtering) portions of spectrum used by politically-important groups. That is really the only way they are getting away with this, if there isn't massive outcry about interference.
--
Take care,
Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
My Kurzweil Music at: '»www.dv-clips.com/theater.htm
'»www.basspig.com Bass Pig's Lair
'»www.mwcomms.com
'»www.adventuresinanimemusic.com Stereo Feed! | |
| | | | | | | | | hottboiinnc
Kyle
join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH | Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this so you're saying the power companies are lining the pockets of the Hams? | |
| | | |
Yet Anon
@verizon.net
| While there's so much focus on triple play..how about QUADRUPLE play..in the form of our electric company offering it all..PLUS our electric service?
After all, if lines to our homes are being eliminated, why not truly make it all in one? Uh, maybe because you can't transmit power over fiber? It's a completely different product from telephone, Internet and cable service, all three of which amount to moving information in one or both directions. That's why the cable / Internet / phone companies won't get into the utility business in a big way and why the utility companies are unlikely to try a similar crossover on a large scale.
I can't help but to think that verizon really has seen all of this writing on the wall for the future and that has caused them to move ahead with their big plans now It's extremely unlikely that Verizon is concerned with utility companies. It's vastly more likely that they simply want to reduce and eventually eliminate the burden of maintaining copper and they want to cut in on the cable companies' action by offering television service. Not to mention that their profit margins for Internet service are likely to go up over time since they don't have to share their fiber connections with CLECs.
These electric companies could be major players in all this in the future, and the real wild card that's yet to be exposed.
Obviously, they're enormous companies with a lot of financial ability to move heavily into this if they want. Actually, no. In most states the utility companies are extremely heavily regulated in terms of the rates they can charge and the products they can offer. While it's certainly not impossible for them to offer products other than electricity, the likelihood of that occurring on a large scale is slim to put it mildly. To do so would require a truly massive investment that could only be funded through a huge increase in electric rates. Do you seriously believe that any politician would support doubling the electric bill of some little old lady just so that the power company could compete with Verizon by offering you a fiber connection to the Internet? I think not. | |
| | | | |
Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs:
| Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this Quadruple play is exactly what this appears to be.
Here's another story of an electric company now getting into the business.
»www.jconline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a···152/NEWS
--
The life you help save just might be your own Team Discovery | |
| | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA | 1 million total subscribers from various providers, including municipalities and utilities.
Includes muni's, like Utopia. Of course it'd be even more without all the corporate lawsuits.. | |
| | |
rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL | Re: AFAIK only Verizon is doing this Taxpayers shouldn't be funding Munis. The poor subsidizing the rich too cheap to pay for it? | |
| markopoleo
join:2003-04-02
Bonne Terre, MO
·Charter Pipeline
| yawn, not very impressive Very small number considering how long they have been "deploying" fiber now. Fiber to the home needs a huge backing to get it to more people.
Nothing short of a national push for fiber endorsed by the government would make it feasible.
Currently to much political bickering and finger pointing to get stuff done. Sometimes I wish a democracy could sometimes take the communist idea about sweeping changes overnight :P The only time this country does sweeping changes is when it wants to take over another country now-a-days.:D | |
| tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| FIOS 20/5 speakeasy speed tests:
seattle: 5066/632
san francisco: 6606/732
los angeles: 5782/732
dallas: 10630/1226
chicago: 16497/1724
atlanta: 19081/2067
NEW YORK: 20158/4040
washingtondc: 20165/2889
these are fios speed tests from NY metro.. why do the TX,WA and CA speed tests hit the toilet compared to the others?
Is it that FIOS skimps on the backbone service outside the metro loop or does speakeasy not have a wide pipe for cross country service? | |
| | 
Tzale
Ron Paul - I Didn't Vote For Either
Premium
join:2004-01-06
NJ, USA
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Optimum Online
| Re: FIOS 20/5 said by tmc8080 :speakeasy speed tests: seattle: 5066/632 san francisco: 6606/732 los angeles: 5782/732 dallas: 10630/1226 chicago: 16497/1724 atlanta: 19081/2067 NEW YORK: 20158/4040 washingtondc: 20165/2889 these are fios speed tests from NY metro.. why do the TX,WA and CA speed tests hit the toilet compared to the others? Is it that FIOS skimps on the backbone service outside the metro loop or does speakeasy not have a wide pipe for cross country service? Net congestion. It is out of their hands outside of the local area. Everyone knows that a 20mbit connection isn't going to give you 20mbit ALL around the world. The more routers you need to pass through, the more congested it will get.
Verizon ain't skimping on anything, they are one of the best ISP's in terms of latency on FIOS and bandwidth.
-Tzale
--
»www.stop-us-military-aid-to-israel.net/
FACTS NOT PROPAGANDA | |
| | | tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| Re: FIOS 20/5 it's just that i'm wondering, is this REALLY what geograpahically happens with my routes during data transfer?
going back and forth across different routes that seem to route un-intelligently?
Now I'm not expecting the data have QOS as good as a POTS voice telephone call circa 2000. There probably is room for improvement with intelligent routing or opening up more dark fiber in places of peak use. What will consumers be getting with higher broadband caps while throughput falloff 10-90% up/downstream speeds..?
We're talking about falloff that gets as bad as 1/3rd to 1/10th caps on a cross country route, granted-- not all the time and to all places like speedtests. Microsoft Update throughput seems rather good, most times. | |
| |
Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs:
| It could be RWIN related.
What RWIN are you using?
Over those longer distances you're more likely to encounter higher latency. Your rwin should be set based on not only your speeds, but latency as well.
The trick here is to have your RWIN set high enough for you to realize your full speed potential, but low enough for it to do the job it was intended to do.
The formula for computing your rwin is this..
Your maximum rated download speeds x latency divided by 8 = ???
In this case, your rated download speeds is 20,000k.
That's the number you'll use.
The variable here is what latency figure to use?
Here's how I see it.
I think that if you use a figure over approx 110ms, you're starting to run the risk that the reason for that is due to unfavorable line conditions along whatever route you're on. In THAT case, you'd want a lower rwin to actually help your connection be faster than it normally would.
If you use a figure lower than that however, you're probably unnecessarily reducing your speeds when you don't have to.
And so, I'd go with this formula for your connection.
20,000 x 110 divided by 8...
the result is 275,000, which is what I'd be using for an RWIN if I were you with that connection.
Any lower than that..and you're probably hurting your speeds.
Higher than that..and you're pretty much wiping out the benefits of even having an RWIN to begin with.
I'd try that number and see if it improves your results on longer distance speed tests.
Note, that this MIGHT not be the reason. Anytime you're traveling at these longer distances, you might be encountering higher latency. Do a tracert to anywhere far away and you'll see that for yourself.
BUT..you don't want such a high rwin to offset that because you might wind up with actually a slower connection if you encounter packet loss.
--
The life you help save just might be your own Team Discovery | |
| 
owenhome
keeper of the magic blue smoke
Premium
join:2002-07-13
Wichita Falls, TX |  Please....
| |
| 
dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ | 6 Million what about the other 344 million that AREN'T passed? | |
| |
See 7 replies to this post | |
writeitdown
@verizon.net
| tax rebates there is such a thing of write-downs and tax breaks for writing off antiquated dsl equipment, in favor of Fiber equipment.. and writng off BPONS in favor of GPONS, 
Hint #2: verizon mostly deployed their service among communities that ALREADY have a cable-tv provider who deploys broadband/tv service via coax. while some tv customers come from satellite, more likely than not, broadband customers come from the cable provider or.. themselves with dsl to fiber installs. | |
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FTTH Hits One Million Subscriptions
Some interesting charts about FTTH deployment
