 |
 | dcurrey
join:2004-06-29
 ·ViaTalk
| Re: Locked in yearly plans.... On new accounts they have two choices. Eat the cost or bill the customer.
Now on accounts they are already prepaid can the government collect the USF fund? The service was already bought and paid for and the voip company will not be getting any more revenue from the user until the next renewal date. Hence no revenue to base the 7% on. | |
|
| 
Toadman
How do you like these Apples
join:2001-11-28
Medina, OH
 ·Armstrong Zoom In..
| We should not be billed for it. Since our agreement and subsequent bill was generated prior to this happening, there should be no "retroactive" USF. Now the new ViaTalk rate will be higher because it would have to include 12 or 24 months of the USF. | |
|
| |
| 
ftodd
join:2001-04-11
Pittsburgh, PA | Before you know it, we'll be paying as much as copper customers!!
Best wishes. | |
|
| | 
Phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Jacksonville, FL
 ·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: Locked in yearly plans.... Well, ironically enough, if you use Vonage, or any major VoIP company, you'll notice you already ARE paying more, you just have no tax on VoIP, and no tax means lesser bill. For example, standard phone service might cost $21, but you have 911 tax, USF, State and Local tax, Long Distance carrier charges, and then the features, turns into $46 real easily. Soon VoIP will be no exception, but I have my own VoIP switch, so all my phones features were made by me. I have no problem paying a tad bit more, considering I have unlimited inbound termination (meaning I have MORE than call waiting, I have que's, lol, $35 paid for the WHOLE YEAR!). I could care less, as long as it remains resonable, then I'll switch to cellphone.
--
SIPPhone/Gizmo # 17476200648 / Ran by Asterisk & Slackware 10.1. | |
|
| | | 
cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Locked in yearly plans.... My average phone bill was around $85 which included local calling package, long distance, and DSL. Take out the ~32 for DSL and associated fees and I'm down to around $53/month. I just renewed my VT subscription for a year for $99, or 8.25 a month. Even if they start tossing a few fees like a $1.75 USF, I'm still 1/5th my old bill.
--
Quis custodiet custodes ipsos? | |
|
| | | briartech
join:2005-12-23
Stamping Ground, KY
·RoadRunner Cable
| $21???!! I'm moving to Florida if that's true! Here in Kentucky, $21.00 won't even get you dialtone from BellSouth. Much less, 3 way calling, voicemail, caller ID, unlimited long distance, unlimited in state calling, etc. I'll keep my Vonage thank you very much. | |
|
| | 
dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by ftodd  :Before you know it, we'll be paying as much as copper customers!! And thats why we went voip originally [to escape all these bullshit fees]
--
You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
|
| 
rwhubert
Bipolar Athlon
Premium
join:2002-07-26
Atlanta, GA
 ·CYBERONIC INTERNET..
| The USF is the biggest rip-off since King George decided to arbitrarily impose a tax stamp on all printed matter, thus goading the colonists into a rebellion! I mean, where does this USF crapola stop, anyway?
It's a legal excuse for information highway robbery. It's arbitrary, exhorbitant and unfair. It should be rescinded, but of course we know our esteemed congresspeople and senators well enough that we're pretty sure that will not happen ... not in this liftime.
Robert in Atlanta | |
|
Zoder
join:2002-04-16
Miami, FL | Cut the fraud first How about they crack down on the hundreds of millions of dollars in USF fraud. Then they won't need to make up a shortfall. | |
|
| 
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Re: Cut the fraud first said by Zoder :How about they crack down on the hundreds of millions of dollars in USF fraud. Then they won't need to make up a shortfall. Get rid of USF entirely and there won't be any more fraud.
--
Tancredo 2008! | |
|
| | Zoder
join:2002-04-16
Miami, FL | Re: Cut the fraud first True, but we both know that will never happen. | |
|
| | 
N3OGH
Will it all be Obama's fault now?
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
·Verizon Online DSL
| No kidding..
Quoted from the article...
"Companies offering long-distance and international telephone services as well as high-speed Internet service via digital subscriber lines (DSL) must currently contribute 10.9 percent of that revenue into the $7.3 billion fund."
WOW, an almost 11% tax. That's a lot of scratch...
I doubt my DSL bill will go down, they never do. | |
|
| | | Odie97
join:2006-04-19
Oak Creek, WI | Re: Cut the fraud first Yea and when you think about how much $$ they collect we could bring FTTH to all of rural America .... like that's going to happen  | |
|
Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Austin, TX
clubs:
·VoicePulse
| Dumbest thing yet This makes absolutely no sense.
VoIP can be run from anywhere with a broadband connection. There is no physical line drop needed to provide service to the boonies. What you DO need, is DSL or cable.
VoIP providers will be paying into the fund, but will in no way be able to use it, as their networks don't require anything different for a guy in NYC than a guy in B.F.E.
Not that the fund has ever been used for the purpose it is supposed to anyway.
--
AMD X2 4800+ @2700Mhz/ MSI K8N Neo 4 Platinum SLI/ 4x 1024Mb Corsair XMS PC4000/ WD 74Gb Raptor/ PNY 7800GTs SLI/ Antec 550 True Control/Custom water cooler | |
|
| Onemore
Premium
join:2006-05-12
Louisville, KY
| Re: Dumbest thing yet The new VoIP tax makes no sense to me but neither does $3.00 a gallon for gas but since someone has the power to call these kinds of shots, I will do what the average American has been doing for years, the only thing that we can really do...I will Play The MONEY Game. I will search and find a new VoIP provider with the lowest price(with the new tax included). I will search and find the gas station with the lowest price per gallon. I watch my grandfather herd cattle the same way, wherever you put the feed, the cattle will go....The rich know exactly what they are doing...they are herding cattle...and the game is, "You have to pay if you want to play". With every new tax, I am ready to play...if you cannot beat them....Mooo | |
|
ke4pym
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC | It'd be nice... To see one of these VoIP companies (or better yet, all of them) just say no or fight this in court. | |
|
| fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: It'd be nice... Why? It's easier to pass this on to the consumer since they all have to do it.
The tax is B.S. and they all know it. This is like saying cable TV has to pay a tax for rural telecom when cable has nothing to do with telephone.
Voip is voip - it's NOT telephone service. Why should Voip information services have to pay into a tax for the competition? The only way that I could see this happening is if the voip companies got some benefit out of the tax as well. This is mob tactics.. take from the little guys and give to the big. I say F*CK the telephone companies once and for all. If they are making so much damn profit, let them dig into their own coffers and pay their own bills for once.
They just can't compete on a level playing field. They are demonstrating that on an almost daily basis anymore. | |
|
| | RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission
| Re: It'd be nice... said by fiberguy :The tax is B.S. and they all know it. This is like saying cable TV has to pay a tax for rural telecom when cable has nothing to do with telephone. Voip is voip - it's NOT telephone service. Why should Voip information services have to pay into a tax for the competition? Then VoIP companies and their supporters need to stop selling VoIP as a telecom substitute. In the 90's VoIP was being sold as the telephone system of the future, all big companies would dump all other methods and be able to combine PBX and computers into one seamless system.
Also, if VoIP did NOT connect to Joe Six-pack's telephone, then there might be some logic behind not applying the extra taxes, but in the eyes of a politician - if it quacks at one end, the whole thing is a money making duck (gotta earn those bribescontributions somehow).
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
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| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: It'd be nice... I agree they need to stop calling it telephone service. But, if they are telecom service, then they need to get their fair share of the cut of that tax sub too!
Don't rob peter to pay paul. | |
|
| | | | RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs:
·XMission
| Re: It'd be nice... said by fiberguy :I agree they need to stop calling it telephone service. But, if they are telecom service, then they need to get their fair share of the cut of that tax sub too! Don't rob peter to pay paul. That would make too much sense, especially with little or no physical infrastructure, so to speak.
Nope, gotta keep the slush fund up so that the political process can keep working. (probably should have a sarcasm flag on this so that people do not think I really mean that it should be that way))
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
|
Timmn
join:2000-04-23
Tinley Park, IL | Rate Reduction? Will DSL customers see a rate reduction in August once DSL carriers are free of the USF?
Yeah, when pigs fly. | |
|
| |
| | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD | Re: Rate Reduction? that's much better! I was just going to go
hahahahahahahahahahahaha | |
|
yaplej
CCNA
Premium
join:2001-02-10
White City, OR
·Charter Pipeline
·Clearwire Wireless
| Funk at work here. It must really be nice to have the government in your back pocket. I swear every f*%#ing government official must be a telco investor.
1. Stop telco's from having to pay USF fees for DSL(even though they passed it onto the customer I bet the bill wont drop any so more $ in the bank for them).
2. Start billing wireless, and VoIP providers USF fees(to be passed on to the customers again).
3. Give those USF fees to the telco's for further phone, and DSL deployments.
Hell why don't we just pay for the entire telcom infrastructure then just give it away to some greedy company so they can charge us whatever the f#%^ they want. Oh wait we did! | |
|
| Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
| Re: Funk at work here. said by yaplej :Hell why don't we just pay for the entire telcom infrastructure then just give it away to some greedy company so they can charge us whatever the f#%^ they want. Oh wait we did! Yes we did, several times over. | |
|
neftv
join:2000-10-01
Broomall, PA
·Broadvox Direct
edit:
June 21st, @03:07PM
| This is ridiculous We call ourselves the land of the free and land of the brave. Nothing is free of course but we sure are not brave if there is a shortfall. IT's amazing how much government gets away with and the America people just sit there with the beer on the one hand and the remote in the other as the dollars flow out of the wallet at the same time. I guess this must be ok since to few talk to their congress person about the realities.
Every time the government has a shortfall yea blame us little folks by having legal pick pocketing. | |
|
jjoshua
Premium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ | Can the FCC do this? Pardon the ignorance but...
Where does the FCC get the authority to regulate VOIP?
VOIP companies are service providers connected to the internet. They don't provide the connections. Why, then, are they regulated by the FCC? | |
|
| 
celeritypc
For Lucky Best Wash, Use Mr. Sparkle
Premium
join:2004-05-15
Caldwell, NJ
| Re: Can the FCC do this? said by jjoshua :Pardon the ignorance but... Where does the FCC get the authority to regulate VOIP? VOIP companies are service providers connected to the internet. They don't provide the connections. Why, then, are they regulated by the FCC? I can smell the court challenge already. | |
|
| 
quetwo
That VoIP Guy
Premium
join:2004-09-04
East Lansing, MI | Because they are connected to the PSTN, which is regulated by the FCC.... | |
|
| | dcurrey
join:2004-06-29
·ViaTalk
| Re: Can the FCC do this? Along those lines given the fact that Voip are service providers that just happen to connect to POTS network should the USF be sent to companies that provide DIDs to voip companies.
Example Level 3 has to pay for revenue generated from the sell of voip service to say Vonage. Now given the fact that Vonage is probably only paying at most 2 or 3 dollars for the number this would seriously reduce the USF cost. Level3 passes the cost to Vonage. Vonage can then eat the cost since its such a small amount or pass it on. | |
|
| | |
jjoshua
Premium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ
edit:
June 21st, @03:48PM
| Re: Can the FCC do this? Exactly. Level3 should pay into the USF. VoIP companies are only end-users of the POTS lines and should not have to pay. | |
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| | | | neftv
join:2000-10-01
Broomall, PA | Re: Can the FCC do this? No that will start a domino effect. Making Level 3 pay fee will then in turn they add that on to what their customers pay then it ends up to you and I paying it anyway. This has to be stopped at the source not at the victim side. | |
|
| | | | | dcurrey
join:2004-06-29 | Re: Can the FCC do this? True but a least this way the fee is only being based on a couple bucks. Lesser of two evils. | |
|
| | | | | | neftv
join:2000-10-01
Broomall, PA | Re: Can the FCC do this? I can't accept that. Everyone must contact their representatives and complain. | |
|
TelecomJunky
Premium
join:2005-12-12
Kansas City, MO
| Voip USF You know what the independent VOIP providers will do? Nothing. Your rates will not go up. Instead, they will absorb the cost into their flat rate fees. Yes, they will take a little less profit, but don't expect them to follow in the footsteps of the Bells and Cable MSOs with their despeptive billing practices and hidden fees.
However, I do hope they put a nice big disclaimer informing their users that the FCC is forcing them to pay $1.75 per month to subsidize SBC and Verizons fraudulent infrastructure upgrades.
--
-----»hotcarl.diaryland.com | |
|
| emptywig
Huh? What?
Premium
join:2002-08-05
Pasadena, TX
edit:
June 21st, @03:33PM
| Re: Voip USF What fantasyland are you living in? They're not about to take a cut in their profits, since they don't make enough profit to be a real business in the first place. They will definately pass that tax on to us.
You must be dreaming.
wig | |
|
| |
cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Voip USF I actually suspect it will be in the middle of the two posts. The flat rate companies will remain flat rates, but rates will go up at some point in the future but not immediately. The companies can't afford to just let every fee or expense to continue to erode away their profits. However they also have to show a sing of stability and not have constantly fluctuating pricing. People like the flat fee what-you-see-is-what-you-pay pricing where a $21 phone line doesn't cost $46 after taxes.
--
Quis custodiet custodes ipsos? | |
|
| | | applegatebb
join:2005-12-12
Jacksonville, OR
| Re: Voip USF It seems that an elephant is in the room, but nobody's mentioning it. Services like Skype do VOIP (actually much better than POTs)--I wonder if trying to layer all these POTs legacy taxes onto VOIP (which a bridging technology) will just bring on Skype/pure VOIP use faster. After all, VOIP is just another service running on top of TCP/IP, just like HTTP and email, etc. If the FCC proposed a USF charge for email, for instance, it would be tea time for sure. Why VOIP should be singled out to be taxed separately is...well, the sort of asine thing dreamt up by those trained as lawyers... | |
|
IanR
join:2001-03-22
Madison, NJ
| I already pay this fee thru POTS Why should I pay this fee twice?
I have a basic POTS connection and pay the Fee to them already.
I don't have DSL, I use a Cable Broadband connection and use VoIP thru this channel. But why should the FCC make me make pay again to my VoIP service for onward transmission to them.
I think the FCC are a bunch of non tech clueless people who are dangerous. | |
|
|
cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: I already pay this fee thru POTS I understand where you are coming from, but I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a minute. If you had two POTS lines, you would expect to pay the USF at approximately twice the rate of a single line.
This isn't a whole lot different. The FCC is saying VoIP is like a regular POTS line, and such the VoIP providers have to chip in the 7% for the phone line. It's not double dipping because you are paying the fee on two different services that are not related (other then in similar functionality).
--
Quis custodiet custodes ipsos? | |
|
| GhostDoggy
join:2005-05-11
Duluth, GA | You have a second ankle, though, don't you? Grab it, too!  | |
|
amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
·Cox HSI
| yep Well I wonder what'll happen to net2phone......
Still have money in the acct. but I hardly use the thing. More of a novelty and a nice convenience for calling every once in a great while.
It's amazing how much government gets away with and the America people just sit there with the beer on the one hand and the remote in the other as the dollars flow out of the wallet at the same time. ...yep, that's what I like to call the "cold beer mentality" so firmly and staunchly embraced by so many people who could care less about anything other than themselves and their little world. "..what, you don't like cold beer??? what's wrong with you???" ..of course I do, but that's not the point. | |
|
|
See 6 replies to this post |
|
avatarx
join:2000-05-17
Fairfax, VA | FCC I'm going to send a hate mail to FCC. everyone should do the same. | |
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| |
| 
RadioDoc
Sortofadog
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
Chicago, IL | That's nice. Why not drive over to the Portals and do it in person. I'm sure they'd be thrilled to see you. 445 12th St. SW.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
|
srobmw
join:2005-10-01
New Windsor, NY | USF The only thing that amazes me is that people are actually surprised by this. | |
|
sancraig
join:2003-11-05
Saint Louis, MO | Go figure Hmmm so AT&T and their ilk lets the NSA in then the FCC rules favorably to them .... How odd. Lol | |
|
Currupt FCC
@dslextreme.com
| FCC & AT&T + BUSH ARE IN BED 1. Reduce the costs for DSL
2. TAX the VOIP companies and make them pay into the telco slush fund so they can build out public networks they don't have to share
This whole thing stinks and all most of you can do is wonder if your piddly bill will change by a buck or two... | |
|
Corrupt FCC
@dslextreme.com
| 1. Reduce the costs for DSL
2. TAX the VOIP companies and make them pay into the telco slush fund so they can build out public networks they don't have to share
This whole thing stinks and all most of you can do is wonder if your pidly bill will change by a buck or two...
Telco deregulation and consolidation are soon going to drive up prices. Just look at the energy industry... | |
|
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| Lets see what "mission accomplished" means to the middle class under republicrat (yes, democrats are complacent conspirists in this) leadership.
8 years of fear mongering.
8 years of 1984 style privacy intrusions & (the president had it right, "crusade")
8 years of un-steadily rising/lowering-then speedily rising fuel prices.
8 years of conservative buildout of the internet, when compared with the 10 previous years of unprecedented growth.
8 years where middle class taxpayers got clobbered with STATE taxes which were DOUBLE & TRIPLE the meger federal tax cut, including the unfunded mandate of NO-CHILD-LEFT-BEHIND,etc,
and NO HALIBURTON CONTRACTOR LEFT BEHIND, and the all-mighty war on 'terror'.
The people who go to the ballot box should remember that they reap what they sow & as you do onto your neighbor, so is done onto you. Create an atmostphere in the middle-east conducive to a small self interest of commodities companies, and you reap the rewards of the million cuts of death in taxes and reduced freedom, not expanded freedom.
Don't vote democrat either, I say get someone else besides the "MACHINE" candidates in office!! Your clammering for alternative fuels, you should be running for the hills for politicans that are not controled by the two-faced repubicrat machine. | |
|
| 
Tsume
My little Toby.
join:2004-02-23
Winter Park, FL
·ViaTalk
·Cox HSI
| Re: another pogroms tax on the middle-class. Omg, an almost political statement here that makes sense!
When I'm old enough to vote, y'all can bet I'm going to "throw my vote away" (that's what everyone calls it when you want to vote for someone with a brain I guess.) Voting for replbli/crats is more of throwing it away anyway =/
--
"True warriors do not follow paths, they make them. It is not just their desire, it is their nature." (Battletech) | |
|
BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| "5. Regulatory Cost Recovery Fee
BellSouth imposes a Regulatory Cost Recovery Fee of $2.97 per month to offset costs incurred in complying with regulatory obligations. This fee, in the aggregate, offsets BellSouth's Universal Service Fund payments for the DSL used in our FastAccess DSL Service and recovery of other expenses incurred to support specific regulatory requirements unique to BellSouth as a DSL provider. This fee is not a tax or charge imposed by a government entity.
The Federal Universal Service Charge: All telecommunications service providers are required to contribute to the Federal Universal Service Fund. The Universal Service Fund subsidizes programs for schools, libraries, and health care providers. BellSouth recovers the cost of these contributions through a surcharge on its customers' bills."
Well since you no longer have to comply with this I expect this to be dropped. | |
|
|
cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Bellsouth better drop that $2.97 charge off my bill No they have a loophole. It will just read "This fee, in the aggregate, offsets BellSouth's recovery of other expenses incurred to support specific regulatory requirements unique to BellSouth as a DSL provider." They still will have some type of regulatory requirement, it just won't include USF.
--
Quis custodiet custodes ipsos? | |
|
| | |
tc1uscg
join:2005-03-09
Saint Clair Shores, MI
·Comcast
·WOW Internet and C..
edit:
June 21st, @09:00PM
| If the area can't be served by cable, then why are they using a blanket formula to get the cost? Why should Joe VoIP user have to pay more then they should when Mr Farmer in the middle of Iowa only has POTS and a DISH? Well, even if VoIP went up 3.00 more a month, how many of you would DUMP it and go running back to AT&T? No many I'm sure. So suck it up. It's not the paying extra is the problem, if they are going to regulate, then hold them to the same standards as legacy telco's. If they have an outage in the middle of a friday afternoon just because they want to do a "network upgrade" and knock down half the network, they pay thousands if not a couple of mil for doing it. Like I said, if they gotta pay, make them come up to the same standards as the rest of the telecommunications world. As far as it not being a TELECOM service? What kind of crack are you on? The moment telco's (Sprint, Globalcrossing, MCI (Now Verizon) got their little hands in the pot and started providing backbone, regardless how the signal is converted, it's still communications and with that thought.. why is wireless phones hit with these taxes too? They use the free airwaves, not someone else's coax. Geezzz.. | |
|
stridr69
join:2003-05-19
San Luis Obispo, CA
edit:
June 22nd, @12:32AM
| "Reuters notes how VoIP users face rate increases (likely around $1.75 per month)...
wow!
Now, thats a pretty steep rate for VoIP users!
Here's my current pricing per month for USF fees:
Verizon Wireless: 78 cents
ATT(hardline phone) 47 cents
Granted, VoIP users should pay SOMETHING as far as USF fees goes, as they use either cable or a DSL line to initiate/terminate a call..but $1.75 a month??!!
Why not just bend over and grab those ankles as tight as you can-cuz that's rape, big time!!! | |
|
| BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| Re: My take.. said by stridr69 :"Reuters notes how VoIP users face rate increases (likely around $1.75 per month)... wow! Now, thats a pretty steep rate for VoIP users! Here's my current pricing per month for USF fees: Verizon Wireless: 78 cents ATT(hardline phone) 47 cents Granted, VoIP users should pay SOMETHING as far as USF fees goes, as they use either cable or a DSL line to initiate/terminate a call..but $1.75 a month??!! Why not just bend over and grab those ankles as tight as you can-cuz that's rape, big time!!! Why should they pay ANYTHING? The USF is so people in rural places can get phone service or cheaper POTS phone services. You can't use VOIP unless you have cable or DSL and those things aren't offered in the boonies. So VoIP should pay a tax that helps it's competition? That's like Wal-Mart paying a special tax to help Target build stores in areas where Wal-Mart is the only store and helps Target keep it's prices low. | |
|
| |
Jeffre
@optonline.net | Re: My take.. Regulatory Recovery Fee $0.99
Emergency 911 Cost Recovery $0.99
Sales Tax $1.36
YAY FOR VONAGE passing the cost allong to me! | |
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|
FCC Regulates VoIP
Locked in yearly plans....
