Bresnan Waiting On DOCSIS 3.0Says modems are too expensive right now ( old news - 01:29PM Thursday Feb 26 2009) tags: competition · coverage · business · alternatives · bandwidth · cable · Bresnan OnlineBresnan Communications (see our user reviews) is the nation's thirteenth largest cable operator, serving customers in Colorado, Montana, Wyoming, and Utah. Bresnan tells attendees of a DOCSIS 3.0 conference in Denver that they're installing Cisco uBR10012 cable modem termination systems (CMTS) in select markets, but they're not embracing faster wideband speeds just yet -- in part because of the cost of DOCSIS 3.0 cable modems. Well, that and the carrier's biggest competitor is Qwest, whose 12Mbps and 20Mbps ADSL2+ offerings are in limited markets. We've explored how Bresnan is seeing some municipal fiber competition in Wyoming, though even that's capped at just 10Mbps/5Mbps. Like many cable operators, Bresnan has found that running ads that confuse last mile and core network fiber is a less expensive competitive alternative.
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 neufuse
join:2006-12-06
Indiana, PA | deploy and buy why not let the people who want it now just buy the DOCSIS3 modems? yes i know they are not retail avaialble yet.. but you could still sell them to the user via the cable co. | |
|  | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Re: deploy and buy The modems are expensive so I hear. As much as a few hundred $$$s. | |
| | | | | | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
 ·Comcast
 ·Qwest.net
 ·magicjack.com
 ·BeeCreek Communica..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: deploy and buy Wait...that's like saying a car isn't limited by speed, jsut by how fast it can go.
DOCSIS 3 bonds channels to allow for extra bandwidth, and thence higher quality of service, and thence the ability for higher speed packages. Yes, you can push 30/5 over DOCSIS 2, but it's hard to do. DOCSIS 3 is all about headroom.
Also, DOCSIS 3 isn't for 12/2. It's for 22/5 or 50/10 or 60/5. It's pointless if your node isn't overcrowded on the last mile an you'r eonly offering 10/1, but as speeds increase yoou're gonna want better DOCSIS.
Again, DOCSIS 3 allows for Nx38/30 (and eventually Nx30) connectivity on the last mile. It alleviates congestion issues, and allows for greater speeds.
Of course, fiber can do all of this no problem, but you know the spiel... | |
| | | | | koolkid1563
Premium,MVM
join:2005-11-06
Powell, WY
clubs:
·Bresnan Online
| Re: deploy and buy The Bresnan node we were on had 200+ subs on it according to what one of the techs told me. The internet always slowed to a literal crawl during peak hours and we couldn't expect to get any download speeds above 2Mb/s no matter what time of the day it was. Their claim is that no server (not even Microsoft's or Nvidia's) can push anything faster than 2Mb/s and that their network is more than adequate to handle it...Though they also said that I could only expect downloads of 2Mb/s max on their 15/1 tier. I could do it on my 10Mb/s connection on U-verse and I can do it now on the 10Mb/s FTTP connection I have through Powellink. Right now Bresnan is offering 8/384 or 15/1, but neither tier actually delivered.
DOCSIS 3 might help with the oversubscribed nodes giving them more headroom, but I don't think it will help their network backhauls which seem saturated as well. I also don't expect them to be upgrading the Powell market anytime soon if ever. On the TV side they haven't deployed VoD here due to the deployment costs being too high, so I doubt they will do anything with the internet either. In the meantime, the Powellink network will have time to mature and flex it's muscles and get a couple faster tiers going while Bresnan remains on DOCSIS 1.1. | |
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Pizz
Hi
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: deploy and buy It's all about the last mile run, with MSOs. Majority of these last mile runs, are all running on outdated hardware. I don't understand why the Cable COs just improve that in their network, instead of doing inept patch jobs, or implementing a service, they cannot provide. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | percosan
join:2002-03-13
San Francisco, CA
| Re: deploy and buy Careful ... you can deploy FTTH and still offer a crappy service.
DOCSIS 3.0, if deployed, will achieve the objectives you describe below.
-s
said by iansltx  :So I hear. It's pitiful when a provider like Bresnan not only has node congestion issues (caused by DOCSIS 1.1 plus high people counts per node...though honestly 200 or so is average) but also has uplink bandwidth problems despite their use of cheap networks (360 etc.). Bottom line: PowelLink is an amazing example of what places should do. That is to say, provide FTTH, high upload/download speeds, non-sucky access by building out their own infrastructure (fiber) that pretty much won't have to be replaced ever again  | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: deploy and buy i don't see cable having any issues. they're fiber is farther out to the customers and can quickly run the last mile to fiber as well. I wouldn't doubt many new build outs and upgrades have the FTTH/HFC equipment at the nodes just for that. | |
| | | percosan
join:2002-03-13
San Francisco, CA
| DOCSIS 3 modems are about $20 to $25 higher in price and this is expected to drop with volume.
Price is not the issue. The issue is the lack of desire to deploy higher speed services lacking competition.
-p
said by iansltx :The modems are expensive so I hear. As much as a few hundred $$$s. | |
| | | | | | | | | percosan
join:2002-03-13
San Francisco, CA
| Re: deploy and buy I can guarantee you that this is accurate. Again, the Linksys modem cited below is another example of a proprietary (read NOT DOCSIS 3.0) cable modem that implements downstream channel bonding on 3 channels. When you read the text of their documentation, they are careful not to call it a DOCSIS 3 modem.
The minimum channel bonding requirement to be considered DOCSIS 3.0 is 4 in both the up and down stream. There are more feature (less headline but important) that are also included in DOCSIS 3.0.
No clue what the $500 is ... but I am sure that this is not the price of D3 modems that are available today.
-s
said by espaeth :said by percosan :DOCSIS 3 modems are about $20 to $25 higher in price and this is expected to drop with volume. Price is not the issue. The issue is the lack of desire to deploy higher speed services lacking competition. I suggest you look at a parts catalog again. Even the Linksys WCM300-NA "linksys D3.0 DS Channel Bonding Cable Modem-DOCSIS" is still listed with an MSRP of $500. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by percosan :Price is not the issue. The issue is the lack of desire to deploy higher speed services lacking competition. You hit that nail right on the head!
thats why the "select areas" cable is deploying D3 in, are fios areas[haves]
--
When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
| | | | | percosan
join:2002-03-13
San Francisco, CA
| Re: deploy and buy This begs the larger question ... what is the "true desire" for much higher speed access. It is easy to say more is better but at what point does the value proposition change??
I agree that DOCSIS 3.0 deployed to support DOCSIS 2.0 service classes makes no sense ... unless there is an expectation that the mass market customer will eventually be purchasing a product with access speeds exceeding 20 Mb/s.
-p | |
| | | Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO
| jadebangle
You do not need a 50Mbps tier to take advantage of D3. D3 CAN be used to increase speed, but it can also be used (without speed tier increase) to help with channel congestion. A D3 modem has 4 channels(downstream currently) to split or pick and choose from. If channels 1-3 are fully congested, but channel 4 is clear, the modem can download on channel 4. If all 4 channels are congested it can distribute its load (from that individual customer) evenly across all 4 channels or any combination that best fits the needs. Now all that assumes that the issue is at the node and not between the node and the internet. | |
| iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Qwest is 12 Mbps and 20 Mbps And probably doesn't have either in Bresnan areas :/ | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: Qwest is 12 Mbps and 20 Mbps said by iansltx :And probably doesn't have either in Bresnan areas :/ Try 10mb and 17mb. don't forget the 15% overhead you give up in PPPoE/A!
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
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Simba7
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
| Can't Wait! I have Bresnan's 15/1 package and I utilize it every day. Sometimes it drops to 8/1, but that's because the modem received the wrong file. After a reset, it fixes it quickly.
I'm a speed junkie, so the faster the better! I'd be willing to pay a little extra for faster speeds.
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Bresnan 15M/1M|Mine[P4HT 3.2GHz,2GB RAM,2x1TB HDDs,WinXP]|Wife's[P4 2.4GHz,1GB RAM,60GB HDD,WinXP]|Router[2xP3@1GHz,640MB RAM,18GB HDD,Allied Telesyn AT-2560FX,Kingston KNE100TX,2xDigital DE504,Compaq NC3131,iPro/1000DP,Blitz BWI715,Gentoo] | |
| tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| price deflation vs the three ringed last mile isp biz we hear so much about price deflation.. but it's a matter of defensive deployment in the wake of telcos taking cable's customers back. originally, telecom (phone, then small band analog modems to broadband) was a telco market. cable is a relatively new (35-40year player, whereas telephone goes back several decades beyond that).
while there is cost reduction in the isp business.. the last mile industry has hit a brick wall and bounced. higher rates & crappy terms of service are disilusioning the faithful from that dream of a "broadband/triple play price war". the economic times we live in post Bush 2000-2008 are nothing like we've seen before. many people in industry after industry thought the rules of proper conduct didn't apply to them (not just the banks, mortage industry & borrowers). now more and more people will pay for those mistakes who had nothing to do with the bad behavior in the first place.
Welcome to 2009. Sorry to say, most cable companies will not meet their deployment goals, and if they do, will not provide the higher so-called unlimited bandwidth which would be the primary benefit of such upgrades or for a price/terms of service which are agreeable to the consumer. So, in summary: nothing to see... move on.
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