AT&T, Microsoft, NBC Form Anti-Piracy SupergroupLump illegal P2P in with viruses to push filter ideology... 06:21PM Wednesday Sep 24 2008 by Karl Bodetags: legal · Fileswapping · business · PoliticsAT&T, Microsoft, Cisco, Viacom, and NBC Universal have joined forces to create a new lobbying coalition named "Arts & Labs," tasked with taking aim at piracy. The group is co-chaired by Mark McKinnon, former media advisor to the Bush and McCain campaigns, and Mike McCurry, who until last week was Chairman for the telecom-industry funded anti-net-neutrality group "Hands Off The Internet." McCurry outlines the group's purpose in today's press release: "We want consumers to have exponentially greater opportunities to access creative content in a variety of formats, and with confidence that they are safe from viruses, hackers, malware, illegal file trafficking and other net pollution that puts them at risk," McCurry said. There's no doubt the kids need to be protected from all the free TV shows they could possibly eat, but Consumer group Public Knowledge has a different take. "Combining the power and influence of AT&T and the entertainment industry means only that both are going to wage an all-out war for the right to filter every bit of data anyone sends across the Internet," says Public Knowledge's Gigi Sohn. Public Knowledge did have one nice thing to say about the new coalition. "We are pleased to see that Verizon continues to resist the incessant and misguided pressure from the entertainment industry," says the group. Verizon has consistently been one of the only major incumbent ISPs who've been very wary about the inherent dangers in becoming Internet content babysitters. Not coincidentally, most of the new group's members strongly favor ISP filtering of pirated content and apparently, lumping this content in with spam and viruses is the opening salvo of a new PR campaign on this front. AT&T has already stated they're testing piracy filters, while NBC Universal has gone so far as to suggest that piracy filters should be embedded in home networking hardware, something Viacom also agrees with.
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- New Zealand's 'One Strike' Piracy Law
- Ex-Verizon Exec Testifies To Pennsylvania Corruption
- VPN4Life is a Scam
- Verizon's Open Development Initiative? So Far It's A Joke
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ninjatutle
You can keep the "change"
join:2006-01-02
San Ramon, CA | Piracy will kill the internet as we know it... | |
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osubuck
@rr.com
 from:
ztmike 
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet No it wont, it will make the internet thrive on what it was originally founded for, sharing information. Its about time the companies and corporations that have been gouging people for money when its so easy to make a VIRTUAL copy of something. Nothing is being stolen, the original is still there, its all nonsense. IF anything happens out of this it will be free open source software thriving which needs to happen anyway. This is all a scam so ISP's can make a bigger profit while providing less service. I thought this was all pretty obvious, its no wonder why our economy is in such a condition is it now, everyone is so gullible and thinks whatever a corporation says is the TRUTH. The only truth is, everyone is in it for themselves and what lines their pockets the best, not about the consumer. | |
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ninjatutle
You can keep the "change"
join:2006-01-02
San Ramon, CA | Re: Piracy will kill the internet I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage.
The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. | |
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Ian
Premium
join:2002-06-18
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by ninjatutle :I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage. The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. This has little to do with piracy and all to do with a stranglehold on commerce. Their press release is missing some text.
"...also aims to ensure that artists, creators and innovators can safely share their works through new online distribution channels that we, and only we control and profit from, with confidence that their right to earn fair compensation for their creativity is respected."
"Co-chair Mike McCurry emphasized that consumers are the biggest beneficiaries in the Arts+Labs' vision. He then could no longer hold his composure and burst out laughing."
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“Any claim that the root of a problem is simple should be treated the same as a claim that the root of a problem is Bigfoot. Simplicity and Bigfoot are found in the real world with about the same frequency.” – David Wong | |
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MrMaster
What If
Premium
join:2000-12-16
Austin, TX
clubs:
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by stomp357 :said by ninjatutle :I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage. The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. Why would you need more than what the caps provide? Anyone needing more than that is obviously a thief?  You're joking right? You should have used a different emoticon. probably one that was winking. | |
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stomp357
join:2003-04-13
Lake Charles, LA
·Suddenlink
 ·AT&T Southeast
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by MrMaster :said by stomp357 :said by ninjatutle :I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage. The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. Why would you need more than what the caps provide? Anyone needing more than that is obviously a thief? You're joking right? You should have used a different emoticon. probably one that was winking. Yes. Going by Ninjaturtle's opinion on how everyone's guilty of thievery for using P2P, his not wanting caps must mean he wants all that speed, & enormous data use to steal. | |
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kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
 ·Packet8
| said by MrMaster :said by stomp357 :said by ninjatutle :I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage. The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. Why would you need more than what the caps provide? Anyone needing more than that is obviously a thief? You're joking right? You should have used a different emoticon. probably one that was winking. You either don't have aa clue about the subject or about ninja's well-known anti-consumer and pro-RIAA/MPAA troll stature - either way your posts are hilarious.
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[BQUOTE=[user=bicker]]Waaaa waaaa waaaa. You just want what you want and don't care to factor in what is right or true. Your perspectives are un-American, and deserve far more ridicule than I'm prepared to pile on them.
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ninjatutle
You can keep the "change"
join:2006-01-02
San Ramon, CA | Re: Piracy will kill the internet Heaven forbids people actually pay for movies and music now | |
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cornelius785_nli
@verizon.net | excuze me poster child for the MAFIA or paid shill of the MAFIA. there are ways legal way to download massive amounts of data. | |
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dslhater
Premium
join:2001-09-24
Chicopee, MA
clubs:
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by KrK :First, the piracy filters. Then the "Hate speech" filters. Then the "Patriotic" filters.... then the "Damage the Economy" filters. Pretty soon, you'll either be in "Kiddie-Fun-Zone" walled garden internet.... or else you'll be a 'Terrorist' in the "illegal black market internet..." Walled garden internet? Don't give AOL executives any false hope. Shame on you 
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dream your dreams with open eyes and make them come true... | |
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CarterStClai
X-Out The W
join:2002-04-17
Sugar Land, TX | Neither can you. That's why you keep spouting the same flawed P2P argument. | |
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kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
·Packet8
| said by ninjatutle :I'd rather have piracy filters in place rather than capage. The P2P thieves can't handle the truth. Utterly irrelevant nonsense. | |
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ztmike
Premium
join:2001-08-02
Michigan City, IN
·Comcast
·AT&T Midwest
| said by osubuck :
No it wont, it will make the internet thrive on what it was originally founded for, sharing information. Its about time the companies and corporations that have been gouging people for money when its so easy to make a VIRTUAL copy of something. Nothing is being stolen, the original is still there, its all nonsense. IF anything happens out of this it will be free open source software thriving which needs to happen anyway. This is all a scam so ISP's can make a bigger profit while providing less service. I thought this was all pretty obvious, its no wonder why our economy is in such a condition is it now, everyone is so gullible and thinks whatever a corporation says is the TRUTH. The only truth is, everyone is in it for themselves and what lines their pockets the best, not about the consumer.
/End thread.
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ZZPERFORMANCE | |
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StickyFingers
@comcast.net
| said by osubuck :
No it wont, it will make the internet thrive on what it was originally founded for, sharing information. Its about time the companies and corporations that have been gouging people for money when its so easy to make a VIRTUAL copy of something. <sarcasm>
Yah, exactly!
Artists and software programmers don't deserve to be compensated for their work. I say copy/distribute their work and starve 'em to death!</sarcasm> | |
| | | | NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN
edit:
September 25th, @08:41AM
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet Except that they're not starving.
To the post above:
The only form of media that is being killed off is cd music because of a tyrannical business model. Software and movie sales are still rising, even with piracy being around every corner. Yes, it does hurt, but it's not making anyone go bankrupt, except for the music labels. But the artists are still able to profit large amounts of money by going on tour and self promotion through P2P and word of mouth. CD sales should completely die off, and the music should be freely distributed, and the Artist doing their own merchandise and touring to make money. If they are able to get out to millions of people, they don't need Epic Records swindling them out of 90%+ of the CD sales they generate. | |
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chRoniX10
Obama - Change that will NEVER happen
join:2004-05-22
Tarzana, CA | Long live P2P...
This group wont do squat to curb p2p, just another big waste of money. No anti-piracy organization will be able to stop the growth of P2P which is the millions if not more...
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~smooth operator~ | |
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elios
join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO
·Mediacom
edit:
September 25th, @01:21AM
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet pretty much
and seeing how fast the net became accepted and then P2P
the law of excelrating returns says the what ever replaces P2P will become even bigger even faster
there for it this kind of stuff will never go away
Welcome to the knee of the Singularity | |
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Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
 ·Site5.com
·AT&T Midwest
·Comcast
| said by Doctor Four : ninjatutle is a well known anti-piracy/p2p troll around here. It has already been demonstrated time after time that it is impossible to stop p2p in any way, shape, or form. Yet the MAFIAA which he and others of his ilk seem to support keep spending millions of dollars on so-called "technology" like Audible Magic's Copy Sense, only to have them fail epically and utterly. Filters will not stop copyright infringement online, nor can they differentiate between "legal" and "pirated" content, no matter what anyone may say to the contrary. And losses to the industry from p2p are a drop in the bucket compared to those from bootlegging, which is far more common. I love how people who have a differing opinion to what is popular is known as a troll. Is that just because they don't agree with your stance?
Oh, and since we are just throwing out opinions here....the losses to the industry from P2P are far worse than bootlegging. I know countless people who use P2P for software, music, games, and movies and don't spend a dime on these things in the stores. Bootlegging requires you to be in the right place at the right time to buy a physical product. Much easier to download and run. | |
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sivran
God Save The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs: | Re: Piracy will kill the internet A wise programmer once said, "don't worry when your software is pirated. Worry when it isn't." | |
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Ian
Premium
join:2002-06-18
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by sivran :A wise programmer once said, "don't worry when your software is pirated. Worry when it isn't." Ha! That's awesome. Never heard that one. | |
| | | | | | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| said by sivran :A wise programmer once said, "don't worry when your software is pirated. Worry when it isn't." i think this is very accurate, look at photoshop. great program and the piracy rates prove it.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | | | | | tgreaves
join:2008-03-20
| said by chRoniX10 :Long live P2P... This group wont do squat to curb p2p, just another big waste of money. No anti-piracy organization will be able to stop the growth of P2P which is the millions if not more... I agree.. I have used pirated software before (not going to mention what) but it was a few pieces of software that I could have never bought on my own and would have never learned how to use with getting a pirated copy..
After I learned said software I convinced my company to purchase and begin using this software.. We have many machines running this software now and the company who wrote it made alot of money.. | |
| | ja2007123
join:2007-10-06 | Thanks Pirates, the Internet was good thing afterall. | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | said by ninjatutle :as we know it... No. Corporate greed will. | |
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swhx7
Premium
join:2006-07-23
Elbonia
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by ninjatutle :Piracy will kill the internet as we know it... said by KrK :No. Corporate greed will.
Well I try not to be so pessimistic, but it's threatening to.
If anyone doubts the parent post, look at the press release (again) and instead of the bits about piracy, notice the language. The whole concept of the internet assumed there is a totally commercial one. Citizens are called "consumers" and expected to pay for all the "content" they "consume", buying it from profit-oriented vendors. There is no room in this vision for any non-commercial communication, public interest, or non-exploitive human relationships.
Free market capitalism can produce good outcomes, but the for-profit corporation with legal status of a person and power to influence government is a toxin to society just as HIV or asbestos is to the body. They are sociopaths, and their press releases are always deceptive advertisements. A pretence of civic-minded motives on the part of a business is a sure sign of lying for profit. | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
edit:
September 24th, @11:53PM
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet said by swhx7 :If anyone doubts the parent post, look at the press release (again) and instead of the bits about piracy, notice the language. The whole concept of the internet assumed there is a totally commercial one. Citizens are called "consumers" and expected to pay for all the "content" they "consume", buying it from profit-oriented vendors. There is no room in this vision for any non-commercial communication, public interest, or non-exploitive human relationships. They are very very careful in their choice of language. Notice, they can't call it "Information" or "Data" because then they would be saying "We need to filter and block information" which is 100% what they are actually TRYING to do, but it sounds very, VERY bad (and well it would be) so they refer to it as "content". The Internet was never about "consumers" being spoon-fed the content they WANT you to see. That's what TV, radio, etc is for. The Internet has always been about networking and sharing. THE VERY ESSENCE OF A NETWORK IS TO SHARE DATA, FILES, INFORMATION. Sure, it can be used to provide entertainment, but that's only a secondary concern.
However, for some people, everything is always about money, and how much more of it they can get, by any means. If the Internet is becoming a medium in which content can be distributed and sold for profit, then they want not a share, but control over all... they want to be able to block competition, and ensure all such content comes through them. They wish to be the gatekeepers, holding all the keys to the Internet, controlling all access, and only allow people to proceed if they approve of, and can charge a suitable fee for, said access.
Free market capitalism can produce good outcomes, but the for-profit corporation with legal status of a person and power to influence government is a toxin to society just as HIV or asbestos is to the body. They are sociopaths, and their press releases are always deceptive advertisements. A pretence of civic-minded motives on the part of a business is a sure sign of lying for profit.
It's sure heading that way... and it appears they want to "upgrade" the toxicity to the level of oh, say ingesting Cyanide.
This brings up an interesting related issue; That of Metered billing or overage charges. Once such a model is in place, their goals will have been greatly advanced, as "Consumers" will now be paying for information.... no matter who created it. In effect they will be able to profit off the works of everyone out there, without having to compensate anyone. They will make money by forcing you to pay for access to information. Even information you don't want. Man, what a cash cow that could be. The Toll-boothes on the Internet. | |
| | | | | jester121
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
·ViaTalk
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet Pretty funny stuff krk. For someone railing on about semantics you certainly chose your words carefully. "Filtering information" certainly sounds ominous, but a game or DVD or song isn't "information".
And part of your "essence of a network" is CONTROLLED access to those data, files, and information. For as long as computers have been hooked together there have been passwords and security restrictions. Anarchy doesn't end up being much fun for anyone. | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
edit:
September 25th, @12:10AM
| Re: Piracy will kill the internet That doesn't change anything I said, however. The very purpose of a network is to share files, data, and information quickly and efficiently. I'm not calling for anarchy, but neither am I for a Quasi-Government/Corporation match made in hell vetting and deciding what citizens can or cannot access, post, read, download, or whatever.
We already have sweeping, far reaching, extremely punitive laws on the books about Copyright. We don't need a new public/private agency to "protect" their business interests by quashing us.
It's a very small step from "Piracy filters" to "Illegal Information" filters.
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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swhx7
Premium
join:2006-07-23
Elbonia
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by ninjatutle :Re: Piracy will kill the internet as we know it...
Actually, what astute readers can infer from the article is that the value of the internet is in danger of being killed by anti-piracy efforts. | |
| | Binary
join:2007-12-29
Creston, WV
 ·HughesNet Satellit..
| said by ninjatutle :as we know it... eh? its like saying myspace kills the internet | |
| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| Corporations will kill the internet not piracy.
they already want to fill our computers with rootkits just to play their latest games or music CDs. and if that rootkit DRM detects something it doesnt like it wont run the said game/media.(there is a class action suit against EA atm about spore having SecuROM spyware err rootkit drm.)
P2P is causing zero noticeable loss to the industry, when something good comes out people still pay(each of the LOTR movies made close to a billion in theater ticket sales, not counting DVD and Collector sets sales) ironicly it was also the most pirated movie when it came out.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| you remind me of the gun control people who think guns can only be used for crimes.
P2P has legal uses, 10 million people do one of those legal uses whenever World of Warcraft patches.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | buzz_4_20
join:2003-09-20
Presque Isle, ME | How many got broadband for downloading music?
I suspect piracy created the internet as we know it. | |
| | | NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN | Re: Piracy will kill the internet I got broadband so that......wholesome pictures....didn't load one row of pixels every 5 seconds. | |
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dnoyeB
Ferrous Phallus
join:2000-10-09
Southfield, MI | I use it mainly for newsgroups and email and web browsing. Large bandwidth use from me is typically a torrent to a new Mandriva ISO. Or maybe Eclipse.. | |
| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | i smell a Photoshop tester!!! 
i think PS has to be #1 on the pirated list.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY | said by ninjatutle :as we know it... FIxed it for you. | |
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texans20
Johama McBama 08
Premium
join:2002-09-28
Texas!
clubs:
| I'm not scared I've been downloading stuff online for well over 10 years. It's just as easy now if not easier to get what I want when I want today as it was when this whole thing got started. I suspect it'll be just as easy for the next ten years.
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We have two political parties in America. One is evil, and the other is stupid. Sometimes, they get together and do something both evil and stupid. That's called bipartisanship. | |
| | pspcrazy
join:2008-02-06
San Diego, CA
·DSL EXTREME
| Re: I'm not scared hehe if it will kill the internet as we know it then so be it. That would be considered progress you know I'd rather have 10 years of unhindered internet free from fear of being sued/jailed due to my 10 year old son downloading a movie when i'm not watching then 100 years of crippled internet with fear written on it. | |
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fghg
@chevrontexaco.com | Re: I'm not scared Look out the window, the sky is falling! Run to your bomb shelter, you better stock up on 5 years worth of supplies. You never know when it will end.. | |
| ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL
| Unworkable Filtering content is completely unworkable. People are already using encrypted VPN's to access corporate networks. What makes anyone think they won't be used to access pirated content if some ISP decides to try to filter it?
In fact, maybe all traffic needs to be encrypted. I don't support piracy, but I don't see any legitimate reason my ISP should be filtering my traffic in this way. And who's going to be responsible when such a system hits on false positives and blocks legitimate content? I can just hear the ISP's now. "We're really sorry about that, but you have to understand that nothing is perfect, and you're going to have to accept some inconvenience so that pirated content doesn't get through. And besides, what the entertainment industry wants is far more important to us that what you want...I mean, what the entertainment industry wants is for all users to have a safe and controlled...um, I mean secure Internet experience." | |
| | amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
·Cox HSI
| Re: Unworkable I wouldn't say completely unworkable, but you bring up interesting points.
The "oops, we blocked you and reported you to our corporate overlords, the FBI, and um, sorry we thought you were a filthy pirate" excuse seems destined to become more common.
This will no doubt ruin the lives of some innocent people.
Even worse than the lawsuits currently happening I'm sure.
Sadly, apologists fail to see what's wrong with that. The whole "I ain't got nuthin' to hide" crowd will probably be herded along with minimal fuss.
Welcome to the "Metaverse" | |
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DaMaGeINC
The Lan Man
Premium
join:2002-06-08
Greenville, SC
clubs: | So now we have to worry about legit companys.. Sending out virus's and spam. WOW | |
| | | IndyDoug
join:2003-10-26
Indianapolis, IN | The ISPs Agenda The major ISPs, in partnership with the Federal government, will water down and filter the Internet so much that it won't be worth the $81/month for a subscription. Grab all the music and porn now while you can. | |
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cornelius785_nli
@verizon.net
| Re: They can't stop encryption. From what I've heard/read, the DMCA more or less says you can't crack or tamper with encryption stuff. I've read several companies using (or thinking to use) the DMCA to sue people that have cracked/tampered/or whatever to their encryption scheme. Specifically, I've heard how some group is claim they have broken HDCP and have a paper written, but are unwilling to release because of the DMCA.
My idea, is why does the DMCA have to work only for the media giants and the MAFIA, can't we (the lowly buyers/users/etc.) figure out how to make the DMCA work for us? I'd sure love to see the day that the MAFIA is handed a DMCA notice for perhaps cracking/tampering with someone's encryption algorithm. I suppose it is time to pass the pipe now... | |
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