AT&T Working On iPhone Tethering Plan - But network concerns and 'paranoia' slowing things down...

AT&T Working On iPhone Tethering Plan
But network concerns and 'paranoia' slowing things down...
(old news - 09:58AM Friday Oct 24 2008)
tags: business · wireless · Cingular Wireless

Last August, rumors emerged that the iPhone would soon gain a long-desired feature. No, not the ability to cut and paste, or the ability to receive MMS -- but the ability to be tethered and used as a modem. According to MacBlogz, "problematic issues caused by AT&T’s cellular network" along with extreme caution by AT&T are causing development to go slower than expected. "Since I’ve worked here, I’ve never seen them be so worried about legalities," says an anonymous AT&T employee about the project.

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Forums » AT&T Working On iPhone Tethering Plan


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TKJunkMail
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Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

I don't think legalities is the main issue. It really looks like AT&T is worried whether their infrastructure can stand up to the load. Users already complain about 3G speeds lower than expected because of the numbers of users on a cell tower in heavily concentrated areas.

»www.macblogz.com/2008/10/23/ipho···network/

According to a colleague of mine who works with AT&T (who has been fairly accurate in the past).... “Regardless of how many billions of dollars AT&T pours into their 3G network, it hasn’t been stable enough to handle all you iPhone users,” he explained.

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permalink · 2008-10-24 09:25:45 · Print ·

en102
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Valencia, CA

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Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

AT&T's 3G network can't handle the 3G as it is... why add more fuel to the fire.
They need to add more spectrum. 5MHz isn't enough in most metros to handle both voice AND data traffic.
Eg. in Los Angeles, AT&T has 17.5MHz of GSM/EDGE spectrum for voice and data, while they are using 5MHz for both 3G voice and data.
3G capable phones will prefer 3G networks to GSM for voice and data, adding fuel to the fire.

permalink · 2008-10-24 11:27:39 ·

Joe12345678

join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL

Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

said by en102

:

AT&T's 3G network can't handle the 3G as it is... why add more fuel to the fire.
They need to add more spectrum. 5MHz isn't enough in most metros to handle both voice AND data traffic.
Eg. in Los Angeles, AT&T has 17.5MHz of GSM/EDGE spectrum for voice and data, while they are using 5MHz for both 3G voice and data.
3G capable phones will prefer 3G networks to GSM for voice and data, adding fuel to the fire.

Do they need more spectrum or more tower bandwidth?

permalink · 2008-10-24 13:35:07 · Print ·

en102
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Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

As the majority of my 3G voice calls either drop or handoff to GSM (even with full signal), I'd say YES.

Its kind of hard to think that AT&T (or any other company) could take a large percentage (lets assume 40%) of voice traffic and a higher number (lets assume 75%) of data traffic and stick it into less than 1/3 of the same spectrum.
Data is less of an issue, as for the most part, unless its _really_ overloaded (eg everyone streaming online or downloading many GB), it comes in peaks. Voice on the other hand needs a more circuit like connection (high number of users / small amounts of data/call, and can even use DTX to help).
5MHz may be ok for data
5MHz may be stretching it for voice
5MHz for voice + data with the volume of customers AT&T has in a large metro like Los Angeles is just WRONG.

permalink · 2008-10-24 14:24:39 · Print ·

en102 Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA	Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load UPDATE: AT&T has launched its 850MHz spectrum on 3G in Los Angeles (Santa Clarita at least). This _should_ help out coverage AND capacity. Channel 4385 on WCDMA 850 Channel 512 on WCDMA 1900
	permalink · 2008-10-25 03:05:00 ·

Gbcue E.I.T. Premium join:2001-09-30 Santa Rosa, CA clubs: ·T-Mobile US ·Skype ·Dreamhost ·Comcast ·AT&T U-Verse	Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load said by en102 : UPDATE: AT&T has launched its 850MHz spectrum on 3G in Los Angeles (Santa Clarita at least). This _should_ help out coverage AND capacity. Channel 4385 on WCDMA 850 Channel 512 on WCDMA 1900 Yes, that's the way it's been for a while. ATT always had some 3G on 850MHz.
	permalink · 2008-10-25 03:08:42 ·

en102 Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA	Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load Not in SoCal or even the Bay area.
	permalink · 2008-10-25 19:13:36 ·

Gbcue
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said by en102

:

They need to add more spectrum. 5MHz isn't enough in most metros to handle both voice AND data traffic.
Eg. in Los Angeles, AT&T has 17.5MHz of GSM/EDGE spectrum for voice and data, while they are using 5MHz for both 3G voice and data.
3G capable phones will prefer 3G networks to GSM for voice and data, adding fuel to the fire.

I thought ATT (75mil users) had 95Mhz of spectrum in LA. T-Mobile (30mil users) has 50Mhz.

permalink · 2008-10-24 18:53:53 · Print ·

en102 Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA	Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load Hell no. AT&T is running Cell A (25MHz - 12.5MHz paired) and PCS D (10MHz - 5MHz paired) as well as PCS B3 (10MHz - 5MHz paired) -- Canada = Hollywood North
	permalink · 2008-10-26 23:07:31 ·

ptrowski Got Helix? Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT clubs:	Jailbreak the phone... And use Netshare. Works like a charm.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 09:36:55 ·

TamaraB
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1 edit

Re: Jailbreak the phone...

said by ptrowski

:

And use Netshare. Works like a charm.

I don't think I want to void the warrantee on a $400.00 Device. However, I would love to be able to tether. The 3g speeds I am getting on my iPhone are better than my DSL speeds. 3g is averaging 600kbps here, and my DSL averages 350!

I live at the extreme CO distance for even having DSL, and Verizon DSL forces me to have POTS, which I don't use. SO I have to pay VZ for unused phone+slow DSL. If I could tether, I would drop VZ altogether. I am sure losing the monthly VZ bill would more than cover the tether charge from AT&T

Bob
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permalink · 2008-10-24 10:45:25 · Print ·

ptrowski Got Helix? Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT clubs:	Re: Jailbreak the phone... Understandable, but a restore in iTunes brings it back to the out of the box config.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:47:04 ·

TamaraB Question The Current Paradigm Premium join:2000-11-08 Brooklyn NYC ·Verizon Online DSL	Re: Jailbreak the phone... said by ptrowski : Understandable, but a restore in iTunes ..... Hmmmmm..... I thought there was a distinct possibility of "brcking" the thing. Perhaps that's just propaganda? Bob -- Motor Vessel - Tamara B. 43' Long-Range Trawler Cape Elizebeth ME. See her Here .
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:50:46 · Print ·

ptrowski Got Helix? Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT clubs: ·VOIPo ·Metrocast Communic.. ·AT&T DSL Service ·ViaTalk	Re: Jailbreak the phone... said by TamaraB : said by ptrowski : Understandable, but a restore in iTunes ..... Hmmmmm..... I thought there was a distinct possibility of "brcking" the thing. Perhaps that's just propaganda? Bob Yep... -- "So, Lone Star, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb." Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:55:08 · Print ·

kfsutops
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said by ptrowski

:

Understandable, but a restore in iTunes brings it back to the out of the box config.

Thank you. I never understand why people put out the "it will void your warranty" argument.

If the phone is broke so much that I can't be turned on, how the hell is Apple going to know it's jailbroken? They won't be able to. If it can be turned on and needs repair, restore it and have it repaired. Again, Apple is non the wiser.
--
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permalink · 2008-10-24 10:51:08 · Print ·

kfsutops Premium join:2002-08-19 Brandon, FL clubs:	It's not the Network I call BS on it being the network. The problem is that AT&T and Steve Joby Jobs are trying to figure out a way to charge even more to their iPhone users. -- "There are no stupid questions, but there are a LOT of inquisitive idiots"
	permalink · 2008-10-24 09:37:37 ·

gaforces United We Stand, Divided We Fall join:2002-04-07 Santa Cruz, CA	Re: It's not the Network Yes, the legality's of overcharging for "overages."
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:29:34 ·

kfsutops Premium join:2002-08-19 Brandon, FL clubs: 1 edit	Re: It's not the Network said by gaforces : Yes, the legality's of overcharging for "overages." I am not questioning the legality of it. I also don't care if they charge more. My point is that it is a charge issue and not a network issue. Which of course, is AT&T's choice. It's their network. -- "There are no stupid questions, but there are a LOT of inquisitive idiots"
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:54:31 · Print ·

en102 Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA	I'm sure they'll charge $60/month for a tethered plan.. the issue will be the 5GB limit. There are issues with 3G voice calls in general on the network... I would expect it to only get worse if they don't increase capacity (spectrum).
	permalink · 2008-10-24 17:37:43 ·

EZway join:2008-10-25 Fort Collins, CO	Re: It's not the Network Understand that they need to charge for high bandwidth use via tethering and am ok with reasonable rate so long as I can, in real time, see what my usage is right from my iPhone.
	permalink · 2008-10-25 13:42:24 ·

Jailbreakit @cox.net	Jailbreak it I've been tethering for a year or more now. Who needs netshare, do it for free by jailbreaking.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 09:49:50 ·

gopnick join:2005-01-07 Benton, AR	Network issues There is no question that it is a network issue. Bandwidth on the backhaul side of things is terribly slow for all carriers, not just AT&T. There are millions of iPhone users out there and they (we) could clog the data network quickly.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 09:59:36 ·

major marco Res Firma Mitescere Nescit Premium join:2003-02-13 Stepford, CA clubs:	Re: Network issues said by gopnick : Bandwidth on the backhaul side of things is terribly slow for all carriers, not just AT&T. Yes, we're all quite aware of the mythical bandwidth shortage. Corporations must create artificial shortages in order to justify pounding the rest of us in the ass with overage fees.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 10:28:31 ·

djrobx

join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA

·PHONE POWER

Re: Network issues

Or in this case, tethering fees.

Remember, AT&T charges double the monthly data rate for the ability to tether. What a ripoff!

They've just never really put the effort into modifying firmware on phones to enforce it, so many people have been able to do it without paying extra. Sounds like this time they're actually going to try and lock the software down.
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permalink · 2008-10-24 11:28:15 · Print ·

BOGBS
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2 edits

said by major marco

said by gopnick

:

Bandwidth on the backhaul side of things is terribly slow for all carriers, not just AT&T.

Yes, we're all quite aware of the mythical bandwidth shortage. Corporations must create artificial shortages in order to justify pounding the rest of us in the ass with overage fees.

It's not so mythical when you have towers that don't have fiber going to them. I'm sure there are quite a few of those. Even if you're fed by DS3, that still limits the bandwidth, if you have quite a few customers utilizing services.

I take it you have little, to no experience in the telecom field, at least facilities side. You can't just flip a switch, and get an improved back haul. No offense meant, but it takes quite a bit of work, and engineering, to make sure outages are minimized.

It can be quite simple, theoretically. It could just include card swapping, mux upgrades, but that takes many departments, and hands to facilitate. Also, many of the companies have to work with the local RBOCs/ILECs, so there's another company to work with.

Either way, a balance has to be struck. A lot of towers don't have enough bandwidth on their back hauls some of time time. If tethering is thrown in, that creates more demand, thus driving the need for upgrades. That's unless you want everyone to have a horribly slow data service experience.

permalink · 2008-10-24 12:22:45 · Print ·

WK9 @uci.edu	ATT sucks ATT cant support the customers they have now with any type of reliable service....being one sucker who bought his iphone and is using them i know this first hand. they need to upgrade their network big time if they plan to bring on tethering cause reception and reception quality with the iphone are horrendous in LA/OC metro.
	permalink · 2008-10-24 13:23:35 ·

en102
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Re: ATT sucks

Its more than just the iPhone... most 3G phones are experiencing unreliable service.
AT&T CS told me to disable 3G on my phone since I wasn't using data, and it is more reliable.

This is mostly a capacity issue... there isn't enough capacity/spectrum to handle the volume.

Sprint/Verizon have 1x for voice/data and EVDO for data.
AT&T has GSM/EDGE for voice/data and 3G for voice/data.

Note: Sprint/Verizon have voice on 1x only.

permalink · 2008-10-24 21:33:27 ·

lynxy

join:2003-07-27
Danvers, MA

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Very Slow internet

I switched my ATT/HTC Tilt to GSM 850/1900 - have no problems, 3G sucks now. I have 20-30% 3G dropped calls in N-East MA (my home).
I have had ATT for almost 5 years now and now I'm ready to jump on VZW boat. I need phone to talk first of all.
And all this apple toys make my life more difficult.

My contract is over 2 March 2009, if they do not change anything may be I switch to VZW or T-M. Don't know yet which one is better.

permalink · 2008-10-25 16:40:00 ·

Chaldo join:2008-03-18 West Bloomfield, MI	Re: Very Slow internet Just disable 3G when you doing calls/texting for now if you can.. I did that to my Blackjack and GSM works perfect.
	permalink · 2008-10-26 22:33:29 ·

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Forums » AT&T Working On iPhone Tethering Plan


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Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

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Re: Mostly worried about their infrastructure handling the load

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Jailbreak the phone...

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It's not the Network

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Re: It's not the Network

Re: It's not the Network

Jailbreak it

Network issues

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ATT sucks

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Very Slow internet

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