 Pixie74
join:2006-09-10 Glen Allen, AL
| Ironry I remember I had posted in a news story before about cell phones and how it caused cancer/brain tumors. Ironically (and no it wasn't caused by a cell phone) a few months later I was diagonsed with a pituitary tumor. I find that it was rather ironic but I still use my cell phone everyday as my primary communication device and my mother asked the doctors many times if it was caused by a cell phone and it's not, actually it may be hereditary. | |
|  |   Mospaw What time is it again? Premium,Mod join:2001-01-08 Las Vegas, NV
·Cox HSI
·Embarq
Host: Road Warriors, Not.. All things Macintosh Automotive
| Re: Ironry To paraphrase Newton: "For every study finding, there is an equal and opposite other study finding."
I think too many academic studies can cause cancer. All that bleached paper running around. Lots of thinking, correlating data and so on. Makes my brain hurt just thinking about it. | |
|  |  |   winsyrstrife Zillion - Master System Premium join:2002-04-30 Brooklyn, NY clubs: | Re: Ironry Agreed fully.
Are aspirin and chocolate good or bad for you this year???  | |
|  |  |  |  claudeo
join:2000-02-23 Redmond, WA | Re: Ironry (dark) chocolate is *always* good for you. As long as the first listed ingredient is chocolate and not sugar, it's a heck of a lot better than nothing (and more pleasant, too).  | |
|  |  |   Midak Doctors suck Premium join:2002-02-26 Yonkers, NY | Funded by... The study was funded by Nokia  | |
|  |   TK Junk Mail Go ahead, make my day Premium join:2002-03-03 Margate City, NJ clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Funded by... said by Midak :The study was funded by Nokia I know you were kidding, but there is actual truth here. The doctor and organization that led the research, John Boice, a Vanderbilt University professor and scientific director of the International Epidemiology Institute in Rockville, Md., get funding from - guess what - cell phone companies.
»www.cspinet.org/integrity/nonpro···ute.html
According to Bloomberg Financial News (Mobile Phones Don't Cause Brain Cancer of Leukemia, Study Finds; 2/26/02), IEI completed a study that cost $373,000 and was funded in part by Denmark's largest phone company, Tele Danmark A/S, which is partially owned by SBC Communications, and the second-largest mobile phone service in Denmark, Sonofon A/S, owned by Telenor AS and BellSouth Corp. So, while the study appears good for cellphone users, it should still be looked at skeptically. At least as skeptically as the BBR editors look at studies by conservative think tanks about wifi, like on today's front page. -- -- My BLOG My Web Page | |
|  |  |   emilf Premium join:2000-06-14 Alpharetta, GA
| Re: Funded by... Actually you are wrong. The study referenced in your link was published back in 2002. The study this article references is a study that was just completed by the Danish Cancer Society (»www.cancer.dk/cancer/the+danish+···ety1.asp) which is an independent non-profit whose aim it is to:
•prevent the development of cancer
•improve patients chances of successful recovery
•limit the physical, psychological and social side-effects of cancer
In case you can read Danish here is an article with a little more info: »www.cancer.dk/cancer/nyheder/art···rne1.asp
Basically they are saying that the conclusions on the study are pretty solid and they don't expect to see any long term effects since people using cellphones for more than 10 years actually were slightly less likely to develop brain tumors than the general population.
They are planning two additional studies to overcome shortcomings in this study. The study did not look at the correlation between actual daily usage of the phone and cancer; and also did not look at cancer in children and youth. | |
|  |  |  |   TK Junk Mail Go ahead, make my day Premium join:2002-03-03 Margate City, NJ clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Funded by... »www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16059841/But even the lead researcher doubts it will end the debate.
Theres really no biological basis for you to be concerned about radio waves, said John Boice, a Vanderbilt University professor and scientific director of the International Epidemiology Institute in Rockville, Md. Nonetheless, people are.
So Boice and colleagues at Copenhagens Danish Cancer Society plan to continue tracking the Danish callers until at least some have used the phones for 30 years. Yes, I know it wasn't the same study. But the lead researcher that did this study and his institute have accepted money from the cell phone companies for past cellphone cancer studies. Proof of who funded this particular study will have to wait a year or more until the relevant forms are filed with the government. But since the lead researcher in this study has accepted cellphone company money previously, I'll remain skeptical. -- -- My BLOG My Web Page | |
|  |  |  |  |   emilf Premium join:2000-06-14 Alpharetta, GA
| Re: Funded by... I am not sure where the author of the article got the idea that Boice was the lead researcher, I have not seen any mention of that elsewhere. However there is no need to wait to see who funded the study. It was funded by the Danish Cancer Society and not by any industry interests. I also found an article in English that details the results of the study:
»www.medpagetoday.com/Neurology/B···/tb/4634
While I couldn't agree more that it is extremely important to look at the source of any study, I think that it is also important to look a little deeper into the background if you are going to imply that the results are tainted. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |   TK Junk Mail Go ahead, make my day Premium join:2002-03-03 Margate City, NJ clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Funded by... said by emilf :I am not sure where the author of the article got the idea that Boice was the lead researcher, I have not seen any mention of that elsewhere. »jncicancerspectrum.oxfordjournal···/23/1707
ARTICLE Cellular Telephone Use and Cancer Risk: Update of a Nationwide Danish Cohort
Joachim Schüz, Rune Jacobsen, Jørgen H. Olsen, John D. Boice, Jr, Joseph K. McLaughlin, Christoffer Johansen
Affiliations of authors: Institute of Cancer Epidemiology, Danish Cancer Society, Copenhagen, Denmark (JS, RJ, JHO, CJ); International Epidemiology Institute, Rockville, MD (JDB, JKM); VanderbiltIngram Cancer Center, Vanderbilt University Medical Center, Nashville, TN (JDB, JKM) Proof, at least, that he was one of the authors. -- -- My BLOG My Web Page | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  |   emilf Premium join:2000-06-14 Alpharetta, GA
| Re: Funded by... Sure, I am not disputing that. He has previously participated in a study that found no direct link between cellphone usage and cancer, and that study was funded by a carrier. While it certainly gives you reason to look at the results and methods used it does not automatically disqualify the results as false.
In either case just because Boice has participated in another study does not mean that the new study has incorrect results or conclusions.
The interesting thing to look at here is, as you correctly stated, who funded the study, and does the organization funding the study have any vested interest in reaching a particular conclusion. In this case the Danish Cancer Society if anything would have an interest in showing a link since it is their mission to promote awareness about cancer and a link would create a very high awareness. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |   Michieru zzz zzz zzz Premium join:2005-01-28 Miami, FL | Re: Funded by... Usually in administration if they receive funding from a company they will do what's in there funders best interest. People especially those who know politics will always be skeptical even if the information is indeed accurate. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |   emilf Premium join:2000-06-14 Alpharetta, GA
| Re: Funded by... And the Danish Cancer Society is not company sponsored. The vast majority of their funds come from being mentioned in wills, membership fees, lotteries and the Danish government. Even though they might get some donations from companies, they would not affect the outcome of any studies. That's just not the way things are done in Denmark.
Should that ever happen there would be a huge outcry and the credibility of the organization would be ruined leading to the loss of their main income streams. Not something they would want to risk even if offered.
But yeah - being skeptical is good. You should always consider the bias of your source. However there is a difference between being a skeptic and being paranoid  | |
|   xerxes3642
join:2006-02-24 Saint Charles, MO | I met a lawyer who was representing a cell phone company that hired a firm to study this. He wouldn't tell me the results, just that the results will remain unpublished and that He (the lawyer) doesn't use a cell phone anymore. | |
|  |   morbo Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22 00000 clubs: | Re: I met a lawyer more details please. | |
|  |  |   xerxes3642
join:2006-02-24 Saint Charles, MO | Re: I met a lawyer don't really have any, like I said, he wouldn't tell me the results. I met him at a conference of NATOA (which has nothing to do with cell phones, but he worked for them as well). Maybe he was full of crap. | |
|  |  |  |   morbo Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22 00000 clubs: | Re: I met a lawyer i guess the question is, did you believe him enough to change your cell phone usage? | |
|  |  |  |  |   xerxes3642
join:2006-02-24 Saint Charles, MO | Re: I met a lawyer NO, but I also smoked for 10 years. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |   artulo Fish Hook Guy
join:2003-07-11 Madison, WI | Re: I met a lawyer I'll drink to that!  | |
|  |   swhx7 Premium join:2006-07-23 Elbonia
·RoadRunner Cable
| This is actually very common and notorious.
When private parties (corporations, or foundations that rely on corporate grants, etc.) fund research, they often retain a right to prohibit publication of results. And predictably, results that are unfavorable to the sponsors don't get published.
(This also happens in other areas, for example in Microsoft-funded comparisons with Linux, but obviously is of most concern in regard to human health.)
It has become such a scandal that there was even a bill in Congress a few years ago to require disclosure of all studies of health effects (it may have been limited to drug research). I don't know what happened with it.
This problem is part of the larger "cult of no evidence". If you are told that there is "no evidence" that something is harmful, it may seem convincing if you imagine that scientific research is impartially aimed at protecting the public. In reality, a large proportion of all research is funded by profit-oriented companies, and consequently no study aimed at finding harm from corporate products or services will ever be done unless it is required by law (and even then it may be repeated and the results not published until they look favorable).
Thus, the assurances about "no evidence" of harm are worthless until the conflicts of interest are removed from the research sector. | |
|  xlimitx
join:2001-12-31 Wilkes Barre, PA edit: December 6th, @07:15PM
| Cancer is not caused by cell phones... It's caused by the RF coming off of TV and FM antennas. | |
|  RandomSCGVBV Not authorized. Premium join:2006-04-07 Virginia Beach, VA | Irony: I believe that one day scientists will prove that fear and paranoia cause cancer. | |
|  |   PolarBear The bear formerly known as aaron8301
join:2005-01-03 Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| Re: Irony: Paranoia. Definitely. I have to agree.
And this theory will be proven when the woman who claims Wi-Fi makes her sick, gets cancer! LOL  -- "I invented it, Bill made it famous." --David Bradley, the inventor of Ctrl+Alt+Del. | |
|   PolarBear The bear formerly known as aaron8301
join:2005-01-03 Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| If you believe it... If you believe that cell phones cause cancer, than you need to get rid of and never go near the following items:
Cell phones, cordless phones, TVs, DBS dishes, XM or Sirius radios, any two-way radios, FM, AM or SW radios, microwave ovens, wireless routers and APs, RF remote controls (including the remote that unlocks your car), and (in my case) my local ISP's giant wireless AP on the hill whose signal blankets the entire town!
If a 1 or 2 watt cell phone causes cancer, the world would look like Stephen King's The Stand right now from 1000 watt microwave ovens! I know, microwave ovens are contained in Faraday cages, but at 1000X the power of a cell phone, IMHO they emit as much if not more RF than a cell phone.
Honestly folks, devices are emitting radio signals all around us constantly. Choosing not to use cell phones for fear of cancer is like choosing to smoke 19 cigarettes a day in stead of 20, thinking it is that 20th one that will give you cancer. -- "I invented it, Bill made it famous." --David Bradley, the inventor of Ctrl+Alt+Del. | |
|  |  lrtc
join:2004-06-05 Toronto
| Re: If you believe it... I know what you are saying that its all around us. But its like saying who cares Im exposed from other forms of radiation. By that logic then smog is bad right I cant avoid it, so is smoking so its ok to start smoking because Im going to be exposed to bad air quality anyways. Another example is that fat is in all foods there is nothing I can do about that so I guess its ok to eat McDonalds and super size everything. Im going to eat fat either way right?
You cant avoid these things but you can limit yourself to them. You dont have to be paranoia about them either. External sources or radiation such as satellite communication and even cell towers arent that bad. As the signal propagates air, foliage, other signal and their harmonic resonance will all interfere with the signal and it will degrade the signal strength very rapidly. If you talk on your phone for 3 hours a day and the antenna is only 0.5 inches away from your head, I would tend to think it might affect you in some way. There have been other studies about cell phone use with different conclusions. Im not saying that everyone should stop using them but I think moderation is the key. | |
|  |  |   Michieru zzz zzz zzz Premium join:2005-01-28 Miami, FL | Re: If you believe it... The point he is trying to get across to those who cry and complain about being exposed to radiation have no real clue of what they are being exposed too. He is not saying that it's ok but, simply making you aware of such things. | |
|  |   swhx7 Premium join:2006-07-23 Elbonia
·RoadRunner Cable
| Obviously if all EMF radiation caused illness, the causal link would have been noticed and verified long ago. If it were even a lesser but still definite relationship like "all EMF radiation of a certain frequency always causes a certain health effect", that too would be relatively obvious and detected and verified by now.
So if you're attributing such simplistic positions to those you criticize, you're either setting up a strawman or mistaking what it is they suggest. The idea is something more like subtle or long-term effects in susceptible individuals, from certain kinds of exposure. This kind of possibility has not been ruled out.
I'm not claiming that such a hypothesis is correct. All I'm saying is that it's illogical to reason, "everyone is exposed to radio waves all the time, and most people don't get cancer, and in those who do it is often traceable to other causes - therefore all EMF radiation is always safe for everyone". | |
|   Rob A Jets AFC East Champs Premium join:2005-01-17 Pompton Plains, NJ | Duh Why would they? | |
|  claudeo
join:2000-02-23 Redmond, WA
| And the following The following definitely cause cancer as long as you live long enoug: Smoking, eating processed foods, teflon frying pans, any wireless device, the daily stress of potentially lethal decisions when merging on a freeway, alcohol, abstaining from alcohol, chocolate, abstaining from chocolate, caffeine, abstaining from caffeine, reading online forums, not reading online forums. The following is definitely incurable and terminal, with a 100% death rate: Life. Oh well...  | |
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