 
calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| Good analysis .... Exceptional insight into companies that have had only one product to sell for 8 decades (a kilowatt of electricity.) These guys have no clue about running a real, non-monopoly business.
calvoiper
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VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
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John Galt
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Oceanside, OR
| Re: Good analysis .... said by calvoiper  :These guys have no clue about running a real, non-monopoly business. True enough...
But actually they are highly motivated to deploy BPL...but for their own reasons. They want to use it to do AMR or Automated Meter Reading. Having to deploy Meter Readers into the field is very costly for the utility.
The difference between doing AMR and providing broadband to customers is that the data for the AMR is on the order of bytes, literally, read once a month.
So...! Big difference...
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| | | BVT
join:2004-10-25
Mount Juliet, TN
| Re: Good analysis .... This has nothing to do with meter reading. There is well established technology in the field that does this. Most, if not all co-ops have transitioned to AMR already. All they need to do is change out the meter on each premises and they are done on the consumer end.
Any utility that still uses meter readers are doing so to keep from having to fire people. We have had AMR in my area for nearly 3 yrs. Up the road they have had it longer. Some even have AMR water meters | |
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calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| You are correct that there is at least an order of magnitude difference between capacity requirements for AMR and for consumer broadband. Accompanying that is an order of magnitude difference in the costs of the equipment to support those different capacities, as well.
It's also true that electrics are indeed motivated to deploy AMR capability--but that motivation has been there since at least about 1985, when small wireless devices readable from moving vehicles showed great promise of lower costs.
The problem? The power companies wanted to RAISE RATES to pay for the new equipment, regardless of the fact that this new investment would SAVE MONEY quickly. The companies, so used to investing money in anything (including cancelled nuke plants) and getting a return on it immediately, balked when state PUCs wouldn't support customers paying more for the utilities to save money.
Now the electrics see a new "win-win" for themselves (and a "lose-lose" for their customers)--install BPL, write the costs off as part of the equipment necessary to provide electric service and roll those costs into electric rates--but keep the revenues from consumer/business BPL in a separate "unregulated" account, i.e., pure profit.
Alternatively, they can keep all BPL costs and revenues separate in a segregated subsidiary--but then charge the electric utility unit through the nose for meter reading--again shifting much money from the regulated electric side to the unregulated BPL side. If their BPL meter reading rates are $1 less than the costs of manual meter readers, they'll claim "savings to the consumer" when in reality the savings have all ended up as additional BPL profit.
Utility economics and accounting, closely examined, makes Bernie Ebbers and Scott Sullivan look like saints.
calvoiper
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VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
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tryme2
| Re: Good analysis..San Diego Gas & Electric BPL DS2's Radio Friendly BPL Technology Puts Competition on the Defensive
Articles / dBNews Dallas
Date: Thursday, September 15, 2005 05:08:20
DALLAS -- Speaking at 2005 UPLC Annual Conference, Victor Dominguez, DS2's Director of Strategy and Standardization, outlined the reasons why DS2's 200Mbps powerline solution is the only regulatory compliant technology available for BPL commercial deployments.
Dominguez was dismissive about claimed alternatives to DS2.
Mr Dominguez was adamant about competitors claims "I think that we have put the competition on the defensive. Our competitors would love to have the flexible notching capabilities that we have for BPL and In-Home PLCs, but the truth is that they don't. DS2 has had dynamic notching since its first chip set and can mitigate radio interference in a programmable way and other PLC chipsets do not. We would like to thank our competition for the rumours propagated at several press interviews, they have been attracting attention towards one of the main competitive advantages of our technology, we mastered programmable notches in a 200 Mbps chipset more than 2 years ago, since then we have been shipping in volume for BPL and In-Home applications, and still remains to be proven that competition can follow us."
DS2's technology is well known in the BPL industry for being one of the first proponents of programmable notching in powerline communications, as the best method for addressing potential interference to radio services. DS2's 200 Mbps BPL technology, available in silicon since 2003, already implements this dynamic notching functionality, which has been tested in the field, in several commercial BPL deployments, and demonstrated in several BPL industry trade shows.
"Other competing technologies have some notches, but they are fixed, including the most advanced designs from followers (on top of that they exhibit performance below 40% our speed). This means that they fall short for the demands of regulators and consumers everywhere from the FCC to the European Commission who require that frequency bands can be selectively notched out, even after the equipment has been deployed. Operators deploying non-DS2 based solutions risk having their equipment withdrawn from the field because once it is out there, there is nothing that can be done to prevent interfence with radio signals. With DS2, however, any issues can be resolved even when the equipment is in the field by remotely disabling problematic frequencies thus complying with today's or future regulatory requirements and automatically avoiding any radio signals in any part of the world". Mr Dominguez placed special emphasis on the radio friendliness of the system.
In February this year, DS2's 200 Mbps powerline technology has been chosen as the baseline technology for the European utilities developing PLC standards to accelerate the adoption of low cost, high performance broadband access PLC. As part of the selection process, an extensive set of tests were performed, including notching functionality benchmarks for avoidance of potential interferences to radio services. In addition, report from Ofcom, the British telecom regulator recognised the significant advance represented "The flexibility of the DS2 product, with its programmable spectrum mask and downstream notching capability, represents a significant step towards a more EMC friendly PLT solution."
Specifically, DS2 BPL system can implement notches in any frequency band, not only in radio amateur bands. This means that the system can be adapted to changing regulations in several countries. For example, FCC recently prohibited BPL Operators to use frequencies within defined "excluded bands". Only products based on DS2 technology can be adapted to this new regulation remotely from the Operator's Network Operation Centre, while products based on competing chips would need to replace the hardware in the field.
DS2 200 Mbps the technology which underlies the majority of commercial access PLC and IPTV/ADSL deployments worldwide and has been built into equipment manufactured by the leading US, European and Asian BPL manufacturers. It is used by XDSL/IPTV operators like Telefonica and electricity giants such as Consolidated Edison, Duke Energy, EdF, EdP, Iberdrola and Endesa, to drive their broadband over powerline offerings. As of September 2005, the estimated number of consumers and businesses that enjoy access to IPTV, internet and voice-over IP services is estimated at 500,000, with more than two million homes passed in deployments with more than 30 power utilities world-wide.
About DS2
DS2 is the leading supplier of silicon and software for Power line Communications (PLC). DS2's award winning power line technology delivers data rates in excess of 200 Mbps to support multiple simultaneous video-streams, voice and data applications at low cost. DS2 is driving standardization activity in many international bodies.
About UPLC: www.uplc.org
About UPA
The Universal Powerline Association (UPA) is an International not-for-profit trade association working to harmonize global standards and regulations in the fast developing powerline communications market. »www.upaplc.org
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greg343675
@mindspring.com | WE in the Utilities are being asked to do more than read meters once a month. The frequency could be every 15 minutes. Also, we are interested in power quality, volts and amps per leg. | |
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jsimmons
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-24
Falls Church, VA
 ·Cox HSI
| Interesting Insight I once had exposure to an electric utility in an IT consulting engagement. My observation was that the organization was change-averse and antiquated from an IT technology perspective. If this is a commonality across many electric utilities, then the Energy Insights analysis could be right-on.
It has taken cable television companies a good long while to learn how to run large IP networks, and some are still struggling to get it right. Why would the power industry be any different.
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"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler."- Albert Einstein | |
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
| Re: Interesting Insight Well one thing about BPL when it falls flat on it's face in the States like it has everywhere else BPL backers can't claim it wasn't given a chance it will die a natural and highly deserved death.
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Low voltage Tech's are wimps, Real tech's use 45 pound filament transformers, plate voltages no less then 2400 volts with at least 10 amp's lighting 8877 triodes...BPL I'm coming to get you. | |
| | | Vonage User
join:2004-05-15
Hillsborough, NC | Re: Interesting Insight whatever happened to the Duke Power Trials that were going on earlier this year. | |
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crtl2
| Re: Interesting Insight Broadband over power lines another choice for high-speed Internet access
Knight Ridder - Wednesday, September 28, 2005
Knight Ridder Newspapers
By Akweli Parker
PHILADELPHIA _ In most areas, getting fast Internet access at home means choosing between cable modems and DSL service.
Now, consumers in a few markets can add "BPL" to that list.
BPL stands for broadband over power lines, which provides Internet speeds comparable to the phone company's digital subscriber lines, but uses the electric utility grid instead of phone or cable-TV lines to carry the Internet signals.
"We believe the technology is there and the pricing is right," said Joe Balaban, a spokesman for Pittsburgh utility Duquesne Light Co. and its BPL subsidiary, Duquesne Broadband.
So far, there are more than 40 deployments of BPL technology nationwide _ mostly trials, but also a handful of fully commercial systems, according to the United Power Line Council.
Duquesne's premium offering, launched in August, provides download speeds up to 3 megabits a second for $30 a month _ $13 less than Comcast Corp.'s 6-megabit cable-modem offering, and equivalent to the price of Verizon Communications Inc.'s 3-megabit DSL service.
A cheaper but slower option from Duquesne costs $20 a month.
Currently, Duquesne is offering BPL only to about 2,800 people through a small pilot program in the Pittsburgh suburb of Monroeville.
"We've had zero problems with it," said Steve Reese, a Monroeville, Pa., resident and one of Duquesne Broadband's first customers. "It's fast. It's never kicked us off. It's been fantastic."
Reese, a schoolteacher, said the service helped him do research he could not do at work, since computers there often were occupied or performed erratically.
The closest utility to the Philadelphia region now providing broadband over power lines is Allentown-based PPL Broadband, a subsidiary of PPL Corp. It has limited the service to five relatively small areas, and several hundred customers have signed up. The price ranges from $35 to $40 monthly for service up to 1.5 megabits per second, with the more expensive offering including e-mail and Web hosting.
Exelon Corp., of Chicago, which is the parent of Peco Energy Co. and is acquiring New Jersey's Public Service Enterprise Group Inc., said it had no plans to offer such service in the near future, but it said it was closely watching developments in the technology.
"We might certainly consider a pilot at one point but aren't at that stage now," said Dan Hill, senior vice president and chief technology officer for Exelon. "We're just being very careful with understanding the business model. ... There certainly have been some interesting advances in the technology."
Utilities differ in the way they provide broadband over power lines, but it basically works like this: At one site, the utility has a connection to the Internet backbone, and computers that convert Internet traffic into signals of a frequency that can be carried by power lines into customers' neighborhoods.
As for getting that signal over the normally expensive and tricky "last mile" into a customer's home, the power company typically uses a relatively cheap and simple method of entry: "Wi-Fi" technology that beams the signal from the utility pole into the house. In dwellings where Wi-Fi might not reach, such as apartment buildings, the signals can travel through the building's existing electrical wiring and wall outlets to the customer's computer, given the right equipment.
One obstacle is that sending Internet signals through power lines can interfere with low-power radio transmissions, including those of amateur radio operators.
"Ham radio operators are not against BPL," said Alan Pitts, a spokesman for ARRL, the national association for Amateur Radio.
"We are against the interference. When you go putting energy in those frequencies on unshielded electric lines, it will turn those lines into an antenna."
This is a public safety issue, Pitts said, because the hams _ who number nearly 670,000 in the United States _ "come through regularly when nothing else works" to coordinate emergency responders and relief efforts.
PPL said that while it had experienced a few incidents with ham radio operators, the problems were solved by "notching," or reserving chunks of the radio spectrum for the hobbyists. The utility said it had no reported problems with fire, police or rescue radio systems.
In some cases, PPL says it has traced reported interference to sources other than power-line broadband. When one man complained of interference, "we found out it was his Ionic Breeze air cleaner in his house," said Alan Richenbacher, chief network architect for PPL Broadband.
Still, amateur radio operators say there is evidence that Internet signals, when carried as radio frequencies over medium-voltage power lines, can disrupt other radio signals a half mile or more away. They complain that the Federal Communications Commission, by failing to take stronger action regarding BPL, "broke its own prime directive ... to protect the licensed services from interference," Pitts said.
Not so, countered Bruce Franca, acting chief for the FCC's office of engineering and technology.
"We amended our rules to put many more requirements on broadband over power lines," he said.
"The president has made the provision of broadband services to the American public a national priority," Franca said. "So we're looking for ways to provide broadband to the American people, and the more ways you can do it, the more beneficial. We weigh that against the impact on licensed radio services."
One encouraging sign for ham operators, Pitts said, was Motorola Inc.'s rollout this year of a BPL method that avoids interference by combining low-voltage lines with frequency notching.
Some quarters of the investing community think broadband over power lines is a potentially profitable gamble.
Google Inc., which operates the Internet's most-used search engine, in July invested $100 million in BPL operator Current Communications Group L.L.C., of Germantown, Md. Also, PA Early Stage Partners and other investors recently invested $1 million in Duquesne Broadband's co-owner, Pittsburgh-based BPL Global Ltd.
Michael Bolton, PA early stage managing director, said the technology's potential went far beyond Internet access. Other potential applications include remote building management, which could give companies huge energy savings; "smart grid" capabilities that save time and money on diagnosing needed power line repairs; and security solutions using broadband.
"This is a $300 billion market opportunity over the next 10 years," Bolton said.
Michael Cai, a senior analyst with Dallas research firm Parks Associates, does not expect broadband over power lines to take much business away from DSL and cable modems, which have become well-entrenched in many high-population areas. "It's best positioned in the underserved markets," Cai said of BPL.
Plus, with prices for lower-speed DSL access beginning to drop below $15 a month in many areas, BPL operators may have a harder time carving a niche in those places. Price, after all, was what drew Duquesne customer Reese to the power-line technology.
"Forty dollars a month is really a lot of money," Reese said. "At $19.99 _ that's a lot more doable."
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ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN
clubs: | AMR is not always automatic We have AMR installed at the place where I live, and yet in the winter for some asinine reason the gas co. does "estimated" reads, and they give you hell and asses a fee when you do a USER read. | |
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John Galt
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Oceanside, OR
| Re: AMR is not always automatic said by ctceo :We have AMR installed at the place where I live, and yet in the winter for some asinine reason the gas co. does "estimated" reads, and they give you hell and asses a fee when you do a USER read. The reason is because these systems do not always work "as advertised".
I have been to many buildings that have the hardware installed, but the meter readers still make the rounds.
That is why the BPL would work for the utilities...it uses the existing infrastructure and does not rely on radio signals.
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rf_engineer
join:2003-08-04
USA
| Re: AMR is not always automatic said by John Galt :said by ctceo :We have AMR installed at the place where I live, and yet in the winter for some asinine reason the gas co. does "estimated" reads, and they give you hell and asses a fee when you do a USER read. The reason is because these systems do not always work "as advertised". I have been to many buildings that have the hardware installed, but the meter readers still make the rounds. That is why the BPL would work for the utilities...it uses the existing infrastructure and does not rely on radio signals. There's plenty of AMR systems that use PLC which is the low bandwidth non-interferring predecessor to BPL. I've had PLC based AMR for years at my house and nearly every meter I've seen in the past several years here in Eastern PA is a PLC based AMR meter.
BPL does rely on radio frequency signals, it's just they are riding on a powerline. PLC uses existing infrastructure much more than BPL. BPL needs repeaters and transformer bridges all over the place. PLC doesn't need transformer bridges or nearly the number of repeaters since it's low frequency and can actually travel somewhat well on the line since it's within frequencies that power line construction can actually carry. BPL takes the PLC concept over the limits and tries to compensate for an insufficient physical medium with digital modulation techniques, oodles of repeaters, and modern marketing techniques. | |
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ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN
clubs:
edit:
September 28th, @10:56AM
| I totally agree with BPL. But I'm not holdin' my breath our for the AMR services to work. Hell, Out local "Mishawaka Utilities" doesn't even accept ANY form of electronic payment, Not even Check by phone. Withe them you have these options for paying your Electric/Water/Sewage Bill:
Cash
Money Order (Of varying types)
Handwritten Checks (i.e. Personal, Business, and so on...)
THAT'S IT. | |
| phaqu
join:2005-05-26
Marietta, GA
·Comcast
| Anything the power company... has its hands in, at least in my area,will be a total and complete disaster. If I had any other choice, I would go elsewhere. I feel like Im in a utilities hell where I live. Seems like all of them, gas,power,phone,cable,have their heads up their ass and their hands in my wallet. Broadband from those clowns? No way. Maybe somewhere else, but not here. | |
| Ham band guy
join:2005-07-13
Minneapolis, MN
| BPL;Hype vs Reality
I agree,there is much hype when it comes to BPL. Especially if one looks at the number of commercial BPL deployments(not trials) as compared to DSL and cable,it's painfully obvious.
In terms of AMR, we have Xcel Energy and they have a system of wireless meters with repeaters scattered around my neighborhood. This has been working well for years(even when they were known as N.S.P.). From what I've learned from Xcel(have been dealing with them on line noise issues with HF ham radio and a MAJOR remodel,electrical upgrade of my house). They already have grid control and management in place in addition to the AMR. Additionally,I've asked them about BPL and the general response from the field people is they know what it is,but they are not going to get into it.
Like I've stated before, by the time BPL gets standardized and somewhat stable,other technologies will advance to a point of price and performance that will leave BPL in the dust. Hey just my .02
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Friends don't let friends use home edition anything! | |
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BPL: Hype Vs. Reality