 
lxAstrosxl
Premium
join:2000-10-13
Carol Stream, IL
clubs: | True. It would be annoying as hell to have almost every single person on flight talking on their cell phone for no reason because they are idiots and need something to do...it would be the worste flight ever. | |
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 | wirelesswoes
join:2004-02-12
Hialeah, FL | Re: True. They just want to make some cash. Most people (that I know) don't have Cingular's multimedia package and therefore have to pay for every txt sent and received. | |
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stet
Volitar Prime
join:2002-03-08
Warren, MI
| Re: True. That's what I'm thinking too. They are just using the general public's annoyance at cell phone use in confined spaces as a convenient marketing tool to promote their text messaging service, at 10 cents per message sent or received.
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I am of the stars.
I am called "Forever".
Eternity courses through my veins. | |
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sbdjaro
I Dunno
Premium
join:2004-01-29
Grand Junction, CO | Re: True. Exactly what I was thinking. My sister contributes usually $10 tacked on to our family plan every month because of 5 cent messaging. | |
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| Goldman
join:2002-06-21
Maumelle, AR
| said by lxAstrosxl  :It would be annoying as hell to have almost every single person on flight talking on their cell phone for no reason because they are idiots and need something to do...it would be the worste flight ever. I agree. Flights are cramped and miserable enough without having to hear the loud, obnoxious conversations of others for hours on end. I say keep the ban. | |
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Kfedka
Premium
join:2005-05-06
Spokane, WA
| Re: True. I flew aeroflot from seattle, wa to moscow, russia and they allowed cellphone usage and laptop usage, just as long as it wasn't during take off or landing. There didn't seem to be to many issues of loud cell phone talkers. On the other hand the flight was 12 hours non stop so all were dredged out. | |
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| | | russotto
join:2000-10-05
Collegeville, PA | Re: True. Not many cells in the northern pacific or over Siberia, so I don't imagine the cell phones would have worked most of the flight. | |
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| aeiouy
join:2004-08-05
Fort Worth, TX
| Yeah their motivation is very transparent. Allowing people who fly access to talk on their cell phones will increase their monthly usage without increasing revenue at all.
While, as others noted, the text and mail servers are still highly profitable on a smaller usage basis. | |
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MoviePhreak9
.
join:2002-07-17
India
| Nice Scam by Cingular Yeah I agree, its a great way for Cingular to make money. However I do see that it could be a liability if some how a plane crashes (which is inevitable) and someone is talking on their cell phone (which is also inevitable; even though the cell phone might not be the cause of the plane crash).
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I'm Brown, I'm Hindu, and no I won't bomb your house and I don't have a frickin' gas station or qwicky mart...But my dad has a quiznos :P | |
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| ossito16
join:2004-07-31
Whiting, IN
 ·RCN CABLE
| Re: Nice Scam by Cingular I agree with you. I don't want to be on some plane and die cuz some clown needs to use cell phone. phone calls are useless in the air. make calls b4 and after flight. Properly shielded laptops you can rent at ticket desk or from stewardess giving you internet access. | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Nice Scam by Cingular said by ossito16 :I agree with you. I don't want to be on some plane and die cuz some clown needs to use cell phone. phone calls are useless in the air. make calls b4 and after flight. Properly shielded laptops you can rent at ticket desk or from stewardess giving you internet access. The interference issue is a ruse to deflect attention away from the real problem which is the issue of cell system not being able to cope with phones being in contact with potentially thousands of cells; and that from what I was told by a reputable source, one side effect is that the callers don't get billed.
Think about it, if electronic interference were really an issue electronics would be banned from all flights, as they could be used to bring down planes. You really think they'd be banning razors and not something that could screw with the avionics?
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Beagles really should come in convienent 10 packs. | |
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| | | ossito16
join:2004-07-31
Whiting, IN | Re: Nice Scam by Cingular Yeah, I never thought about that, point taken. | |
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AlbertCrombie
@nsc.com
| No it is really because of the interferences. Whenever you use a GSM phone it creates interferences in the airplane radio system, so the pilot is not able to communicate properly with the ground station, which would be very dangerous especially while landing or taking off.
I remember one day we were on the ground already and the plane was in transit to the terminal and some people turned their cell on an the pilot made an angry announcement reminding people to shut it off.
for info your phone might not interfer, but GSM is not only usa frequencies...
GSM400 450.4 - 457.6 MHz paired with 460.4 - 467.6 MHz
or 478.8 - 486 MHz paired with 488.8 - 496 MHz
GSM850 824 - 849 MHz paired with 869 - 894 MHz
GSM900 880 - 915 MHz paired with 925 - 960 MHz
GSM1800 1710 - 1785 MHz paired with 1805 - 1880 MHz
GSM1900 1850 - 1910 MHz paired with 1930 - 1990 MHz | |
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| | | | bart99gt
join:2001-03-24
Newnan, GA
| Re: Nice Scam by Cingular Aviation Nav and Comm frequencies are between 108 MHz and 137 MHz. Distance Measuring Equipment(DME)uses frequencies between 960 and 1215 MHz. There are also some non-directional beacons (NDB)located between 190-535 KHz, but they are being phased out in many areas and are more likely to receive interference from AM radio stations and lightning than a cell phone. I've used my cell phone countless times when flying in private aircraft (where there is no ban, it is up to the discretion of the pilot) and I have never seen a cell phone, GPS, laptop, etc., interfere with the radios in the aircraft. I doubt the FAA would even consider rescinding the ban if there was any possibility that a cell phone could really interfere with the navigation and communication equipment in an airliner.
These are fairly standardized frequency assignments worldwide so that aircraft from virtually any nation can communicate and use radionavigation beacons all around the world. I doubt that there are cellular frequencies anywhere in the world that overlap frequencies used in aviation. | |
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Albertcrombie
@nsc.com
|  Re: Nice Scam by Cingular
Oh and what about when i move my phone next to my speakers and I hear this weird intermittent noise ??
Come on, the cell phones might not interfer with the airwaves between the pilot's radio system and the ground station radio system but they are creating disturbance in the pilot radio system.
Now imagine hundreds of cell phones being used by passengers in the airplane, each trying to communicate "louder" than the other, increasing the watts of power of the radio signal, all creating this noise on the radio of this guy who has all those lives in his hands.
Please keep the cells banned on airplanes.
Oh and by the way a GPS handset will not create any interferences of any kind since it is only receiving the GPS signal and not sending anything back... | |
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| | | | | | raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN
| Re: Nice Scam by Cingular said by Albertcrombie:
Sure, so whenever I turn my cell on and place a call next to my computer monitor (75Hz) and the screen becomes blured momentarily it is because of my girlfriend's hairdryer, right?
Oh and what about when i move my phone next to my speakers and I hear this weird intermittent noise ?? Your laptop is not even close to being shielded as well as the avionics in a typical aircraft. The interference is from low level harmonics and the circuit paths in your unshielded laptop are acting as a small antenna.
Aircraft electronics have to be highly shielded to protect against other system on the aircraft.
Aircraft transmission and receiving systems are also very, very selective in the frequencies that they allow to pass and odd harmonics are not on the list.
Besides, you 75HZ laptop screen is operating at a much higher frequency. The 75HZ is simply the refresh rate and is the number of times a second the screen is redrawn. Has nothing to do with the internal operating frequencies of the laptop.
Your statement about the laptop 75HZ, and your girlfriends hairdryer (motor with brushes that produces lots of harmonics from the slight sparking of the brushes) indicate that you know little about radio frequencies and how they work.
If an airplane can tolerate a lightning hit with more than a few watts of power (1.21 gigawatts according to Doc Brown), your cell phone is not going to be a problem.
The experts know and if there was even the slightest risk of compromising aviation electronics cell phones would not be allowed. | |
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alphapointe
Premium,MVM
join:2002-02-10
Columbia, MO
clubs: | Re: Nice Scam by Cingular "What the hell is a gigawatt?" | |
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| | | | | | | | KB2PSM
join:2002-08-06
Long Beach, NY | Re: Nice Scam by Cingular giga stands for 10 to the 9th power.
In the above example, it refers to 1,2100,000,000 watts. | |
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koolman2
Premium
join:2002-10-01
Anchorage, AK
·GCI.net
 ·Clearwire Wireless
| Re: Nice Scam by Cingular said by KB2PSM :giga stands for 10 to the 9th power. In the above example, it refers to 1,2100,000,000 watts. He was quoting the movie, "Back to the Future".
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A bus station is where a bus stops. A train station is where a train stops. On my desk, I have a work station. | |
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| | | | | | | | raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN
| said by alphapointe :"What the hell is a gigawatt?" Enough to crinkle your rectum by golly.
Perhaps I should have written it a jiga-watt and perhaps it would ring a bell if you were to go back to the future. | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| So we're just lucky Al-Q hasn't noticed this huge threat.
Again, I remind you razor blades are banned (something that would relatively easy for anyone with a pair of shoes to defend against, might lose a passenger or 2), but we're allowing dangerous RF emitting equipment on the plane. Think about it.
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Beagles really should come in convienent 10 packs. | |
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| | | | | | bart99gt
join:2001-03-24
Newnan, GA
| Umm, maybe if it was sitting right next to the radio. Every kind of interference you described only has an effect if the phone is within a few inches of the device in question. Also the devices you mentioned are not designed (nor are they required) to shield themselves from such interference. Aircraft radios on the other hand have to be designed to reject any spurious interference from other RF transmitters in the area by using notch and bandpass filters that reject any out of band interference. Both the FCC and FAA have very tight regulations and testing that these radios and intercoms must pass before they will be approved for use in an airplane. In fact, there has been no documented case of a cell phone actually interfering with the radio or avionics in any airplane. They were banned over concerns of potential interference nearly 14 years ago, when most phones operated with a far higher power output than they do today.
I bring up handheld GPS devices only because many airlines have banned their use inside airliners for the same non-existant interference issue. If that were the case then there would be countless general aviation aircraft having regular avionics malfunctions from pilots using them. | |
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| | | | | | voyager6868
join:2003-01-29
Lynnwood, WA | Dude, you must have a really crappy monitor and speakers. My phone sits next to my speakers & monitor all day long (I answer calls with a headset) and I've never heard any crackling and never see any screen disturbance. | |
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birke
@63.89.x.x | yep, i think you're right. once again, the mighty dollars rules the day. | |
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| Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| the GPS thing i never understood because a handheld GPS and infact any civilan GPS can only pickup the signal. as far as i know only very highest clearence could send anything back to the GPS sats from a moble station.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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MPScan
Premium
join:2001-08-24
Boston, MA | 'Net is better.... On the AP wire about this story it also included how United Airlines internal research showed that something like 82% of business travellers would rather have internet access in the sky vs. cell phone availability. | |
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Sebastian
Premium
join:2000-12-22
New Haven, CT | Re: 'Net is better.... they aren't stupid.. of course they rather you use text/email. my plan:
phone call: free
text/email: 10 cents | |
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CPM
join:2001-08-24
Miami, FL | Re: 'Net is better.... Well then you have a bad plan.. I get free text and email. | |
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Sebastian
Premium
join:2000-12-22
New Haven, CT
| Re: 'Net is better.... i have free incoming. there are no "free" text messaging plans on cingular unless you pay an extra fee.. which still isn't free because you're paying a fee. verizion for example charges for incoming and outgoing.
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BBR Gaming Server Admin.
gaming.broadbandreports.com, cstrike-planet.com | |
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Unregistered User
 from:
timcuth
| Airlines should just say no Where are the airlines in all this? They should just step forward and say that they will not allow cell phone use on their planes. That will end this once and for all.
I own a cell phone, and the only non-emergency use I can see for them on a plane is if you're sitting on the runway behind 10 other planes, and you need to call someone and say you'll be late. If that should happen, the pilot should make an announcement that passengers may turn their phones back on and use them for the next five minutes, after which time another announcement would be made that they must be turned off. Simple as that.
People do not need to be in constant touch with others, unless there's some kind of dire emergency, and, no, this doesn't include planning an upcoming business meeting or calling a broker to buy or sell stock. All of these things should've already been handled before the flight, or they can be handled after the plane lands. And even in the case of an emergency, anyone on a plane is going to have little ability to actually do anything about it until they're back on the ground anyway, so leaving a voicemail is just as effective as calling them. When the plane lands, they can get the message and deal with it. | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Airlines should just say no said by Unregistered User:
Where are the airlines in all this? They should just step forward and say that they will not allow cell phone use on their planes. That will end this once and for all. That's just slightly better than an airline coming forward and saying "We will not carry any business travellers". The fact of the matter is all but a couple airlines make their money on business travelers, who don't fly on the standby nonrefundable super cheap ticket, and these are the people that are going to want to use cell phones the most.
Face it, for the most part, if you bought a discount ticket the only reason you're on the plane is because no one else was there to pay full price.
The solution isn't banning cellphone use, it's in the airlines being willing to enforce a set of close quarters decency rules; but seeing how most have no problem watching someone spend 4 hours plastered to the window because some fat guy didn't have the decency to buy 2 seats, (and in fact insisted on the middle seat so he could use the aisle and window seats to expand into) I don't see this happening anytime soon.
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Beagles really should come in convienent 10 packs. | |
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Unregistered User
| Re: Airlines should just say no I've figured out how to fix the fat guy syndrome. Just pull down that little arm rest. He can try to expand all he wants, but a pointed object made of hard plastic and metal won't feel so good poking into his gut...side...blubber...whatever. | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
1 edit | Re: Airlines should just say no said by Unregistered User:
I've figured out how to fix the fat guy syndrome. Just pull down that little arm rest. He can try to expand all he wants, but a pointed object made of hard plastic and metal won't feel so good poking into his gut...side...blubber...whatever.
Until the stewardess tells you to raise the armrest because there's no empty seats on the plane for the guy to move to..
I have yet to fly a Pittsburgh to Tampa flight that wasn't full. At least with my new job I get to jump seat on non-commercial flights; I'd much rather put up with ungodly flight schedules and a sore arse than be wedged into coach :P
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Beagles really should come in convienent 10 packs. | |
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| Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| question is how many business men want their phones in flight? lots from what i hear consider the flight to be their only time of freedom from the office calls and blackberry messages in today's world.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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flyer545454
@comcast.net
| Oh, Cingular, come on! Let's be honest... What really makes me mad is that Cingular is really opposed to lifting the ban because they are scared of what that might do to their terrestial cellular network which may go crazy with people switching cells every minute becuase they are in the air (the system probably won't handle this well) not becuase they are worried that talking on the airplane will be annoying to other people. What is really annoying is that they are positioning this as if they are concerened about other people while they are really only concerened about themseleves. | |
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djrobx
join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA | Re: Oh, Cingular, come on! Let's be honest... Uh, wouldn't the same apply to people using text messaging, which is what they're trying to encourage?
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\\ROB - a part of the SCB local network | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| Re: Oh, Cingular, come on! Let's be honest... said by djrobx :Uh, wouldn't the same apply to people using text messaging, which is what they're trying to encourage? I imagine a burst transmission (such as a text message) would be significantly less of a problem then a sustained connection (such as a phone call). But it's a moot point because AFAIK lifting of the ban is to be accompanied with installing a microcell on the plane so that the phones won't transmit with enough power to interfere with cells on the ground.
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Beagles really should come in convienent 10 packs. | |
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roamer1
sticking it out at you
join:2001-03-24
Atlanta, GA
clubs:
| Huh? so Cingular is opposed to lifting the ban because of the annoyance of voice calls...but then is wanting to tell its customers to use text messaging and other network-based services that would still be restricted if the ban isn't lifted? It's as if the left hand doesn't know what the right hand wants...but that's par for the course for Cingular these days. 
-SC
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"it seems like all you ever buy is Abercrombie and cell phones" --a friend | |
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joako
Premium
join:2000-09-07
/dev/null
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| Re: Huh? I thought that for in-flight cell use a "mini-tower" is installed inside the aircraft... so basically it is the same as in-flight phones that are, or were, installed in current aircraft (same rates and all) except that you use your own cell phone. You are essentially "roaming" on the in-flight network and Cingular would not see any revenue from that setup.
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Interpol and Deutsche Bank,
FBI and Scotland yard,
CIA and KGB,
control the data, memory. | |
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anonpronman
@dsl.net | NO in flight phones please... I'll have the strangle the idiot next to me that can't hear the other party is screaming into the phone. Maybe only FIrst class will have a ban on cell phones and let the peons( oh wait average citizens) live in hell!. | |
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Hektorz
@65.242.x.x
| Radio | |
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| averagedude
join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ
·Cox HSI
1 edit | Re: Radio The wireless players like Cingular and Verizon created this situation by making phones so popular. Now they get to engineer a fix to people who want use their phones on a plane during cruising (IMO phones should stay off during take-off and landing)
It seems to me that they are just complaining because they can't figure out a way to make a dollar on it. So they feel if they can't make a buck then no one should. The wireless players don't own planes and have no real power to get micro-cells into planes.
Personally, I feel the planes should have micro-cells on board with really high roaming charges. If someone knew that a call would be $5+ a minute that would keep conversations short. The pilot could also have an off switch to the micro-cell in case of problem passengers or if the flight is a red-eye and not to disturb sleeping passengers. | |
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Hektorz
@65.242.x.x | Re: Radio Micro cell in the plane...yeah...I like the idea. How is going to be linked (T1 or MW) is another thing, but I like it ! | |
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phunkysmell
@comcast.net
| more pulling the wool over Of course talking on the phone would be horrible in an airplane and could be used by terrorists. LOL, I'm sure that is why there are Verizon phones in every seatback! Yes they are expensive so nobody uses them, but so would using your own cell phone because you would be roaming on the plane's picocell (probably provided by Verizon).
I do think that most people while averted to talking/yelling would go for allowing texting (and games, ebooks, web, email, etc.) that you would normally do on your cell phone besides talking. The problem is there is a big gray area in the area of VoIP. And if a terrorist could use a cell phone to coordinate attacks then they could just as easily use a seatback phone or a laptop (using wi-fi services like Connexion), not to mention they could still have cell phone bomb triggers in the luggage compartment regardless of any rules (after all rules are only for the abiding).
And has anybody seen that many big laptop manufacturers are close to releasing laptops with built-in cellular connections (for both voice and data)? What flight attendant is going to know that your laptop is emitting a cellular signal? Next to be banned on airplanes, laptops!
Oh and most people still don't realize the idiotic list of electronics still banned on airplanes: FM radio RECEIVERS, GPS RECEIVERS, TV sets, etc., stuff that doesn't broadcast a signal other than maybe some leakage from power supplies/modulators (stuff you get with all electronics, even approved devices). | |
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Jeff9988990
@comcast.net
| My facts I am in support of letting people talk non-stop on cellphones on flights. Think about this: you can't really do much on a flight... aka; wasted time in the air. I know i wouldnt want to wait2 hours or more to talk to my girlfriend or friends. Plus i could use the internet and keep occupied. and YES people DO need to be in CONSTANT touch with others. My Tmobile PDA cell plan:
300 Min @ $30/month, UNLIMITED txt at $10 per month and Unlimited Data (Internet) at $20 per month. Id be more likely to use internet and txt than voice on a plane, cause most of my conversations i like to keep secret from others and not let them hear | |
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bobny1
join:2004-09-10
Bronx, NY
| Tired of nonsense! It reminds me of a memo sent out by Mobil regarding cell-phones igniting fuel pumps during customers fill-ups. It could be true!, but how often have you seen an explosion caused by a ringing cellphone of someone pumping next to you. It could be possible but extremely remote. If cell-phones are able to jam the on-board electronics. How come they don't setup a peripheral of at least a mile around the airports, specially those next to the highways exposed to millions of passing cars and cell-phones?. | |
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ben14
join:2003-10-29
Boynton Beach, FL
 ·ViaTalk
·Comcast
| Cingular has no right to an opinion. I can't see where its Cingular's business telling me how and when to use my cell phone. As long as I pay my bill.
I already think the methods used to gentrate extra income from us borders on fraud.
If the FAA says its safe than I say use your phone politely and quietly. | |
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aitech
Guru. Kneel
join:2000-12-19
Boston, MA
clubs:
| Obnoxious a*holes is the problem.
People are complete idiots. I cannot stand it. Unless you are one of these people, I'm sure you don't want to hear some moron loudly yapping into their phone for 3 hours during a flight about "oh my god, you know what she said..." "...yea.. and then he was like, i'm leaving... and she was like, fine go...".
Please. People have no manners whatsoever anymore. The next time I am having lunch with someone and they decide to take a phone call in the middle of lunch that takes up 20 minutes while I eat my lunch, I'm going to choke them with that damn phone.
And, btw, my cell phone is essential for work, and I log between 1,500 - 3,000 minutes a month on my cell, every month. So I use it PLENTY - and I manage to walk down the sidewalk w/o my phone attached to my ear, eat lunch with others w/o taking a call, etc. So it's possible.
GET OFF THE F*KIN PHONE PPL!!!
I'm starting to think this is the emergence of a trend of poor/incomplete socialization of people during childhood/teen years due to lack of face-face human interaction. They don't learn how to act in public correctly, don't socialize properly, and do not develop concern/respect of others.
Troubling. | |
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Cingular Opposes Lifting in Flight Cell Phone Ban
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