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Microsoft's TV Stranglehold in Trouble?
Swisscom's troubles may worry U.S. telcos

If you take a quick look at the three largest bell next generation network and television plans, you'll notice they all have one thing in common: Microsoft. Judging from early attempts to implement Microsoft's solution overseas, that may not be a good thing.

•Verizon: Fios fiber to the home in select neighborhoods. Between 5 and 30MBps will be data bandwidth, the rest going toward video services. Microsoft has been signed as the software provider for their set-top boxes, and their TV service should start springing up in Fios wired markets mid-year.

•SBC: Fiber to the node (or curb), with VDSL to the home in select neighborhoods. SBC claims users will see 20-25Mbps worth of connectivity (data and video) to half of their subscribers (18 million users) within three years. Microsoft will handle the set-top software as part of a $400 million deal. SBC says they'll begin field trials of the TV service they've dubbed "U-Verse" in the middle of this year, with some IP-TV deployment towards the end.

•BellSouth:Fiber to the curb, with ADSL2+ to the home (eventually VDSL2). They hope to offer 12Mbps of bandwidth over a single copper line, or 24MBps over a line-bonded pair, offering a measly 4-6Mbps at first; Microsoft will handle the software for their set-top device.

The problem? According to this Register/Faultline report, Swisscom is having a hell of a time getting Microsoft's television software to actually work. While a large number of European providers are off and running using other solutions, Swisscom is finding Microsoft's solution expensive, clumsy, and difficult to manage.

It would appear Microsoft's typical business approach may backfire when it comes to IPTV. The report faults their system for being "overly complicated and impenetrable to the competition, an attempt to engineer an interface shut-out in the TV markets". Microsoft's solution also costs six times more than competing solutions.

The report also claims BellSouth/Micrsosoft IPTV trials have disappointed the bell, so they may decide to look at other solutions. With Verizon's launch the closest, they may be locked into using the Microsoft technology. Unless SBC goes with VDSL2, they might face a double whammy: dealing with troublesome Microsoft software and the bandwidth crunch of trying to deliver IPHD signal to multiple televisions.
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Master_AMD
join:2003-12-16
Dowagiac, MI

Master_AMD

Member

Too Much To Worry About Right NOW!

I'm first!!

Kfedka
Premium Member
join:2005-05-06
Spokane, WA

Kfedka

Premium Member

competition

The more compitition the better, before you know it comcast and other cable tv providers will end up lowering prices if everyone starts to more to iptv. Give it a few years to mature though.

nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium Member
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA

nixen to Master_AMD

Premium Member

to Master_AMD

Re: Too Much To Worry About Right NOW!

said by Master_AMD:

I'm first!!
You're first what?

First recipient of garbage IPTV software?

First to post a completely pointless in this discussion?

Tell us. We're just DYING to hear what you could be so excited about.

-tom

footballdude
Premium Member
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO

footballdude

Premium Member

Re: Too Much To Worry About Right NOW!

said by nixen:

First to post a completely pointless in this discussion?
Perhaps the first, but almost certainly not the last

SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX

SRFireside to Master_AMD

Member

to Master_AMD
I'M (lets see... 1,2,3...) Fourth!!

lyls
@adsl.tele.dk

lyls to Master_AMD

Anon

to Master_AMD
you have tainted AMD

barqsdrinker
What Can I Photograph Today?
Premium Member
join:2001-02-26
Apo, AE

barqsdrinker

Premium Member

If it don't work...

don't use it. If it is too costly, find a cheaper solution. Seems simple to me.
bogey7806
join:2004-03-19
Here

bogey7806

Member

FIOS

Stuck using D-Link and Microsoft. Wow.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02

1 recommendation

Karl Bode

News Guy

Re: FIOS

Yes, what could possibly go wrong.

Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY

Transmaster

Member

Bill Gates

Was upset the FCC did not mandate the Microsoft standard for HDTV. So Bill and his minions have moved into cable, and now VDSL. Comparing Microsoft based digital cable with Direct TV, and Dish Network is like comparing a turd and a black truffle. They both look about the same but while the Truffle is worth it's weight in gold, the turd just stinks. Thankfully people are starting to see this.

CPM
Broadband, DSL, cable
join:2001-08-24
Denver, CO

CPM

Member

Super Bowl Microsoft Style.

He is at the 50 the 40 the 30 he is going all the way he is at the 10..... Blue Screen of death.. thanks microsoft.

MIABye
Premium Member
join:2001-10-28
united state

MIABye

Premium Member

Re: Super Bowl Microsoft Style.

Or better yet, you are watching the naughty channel late at night when you hear the wife walking down the stairs. You try to switch channels, and the picture freezes. BUSTED!

Thanks Microsoft.

Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY

Transmaster

Member

Re: Super Bowl Microsoft Style.

said by MIABye:

Or better yet, you are watching the naughty channel late at night when you hear the wife walking down the stairs. You try to switch channels, and the picture freezes. BUSTED!

Thanks Microsoft.
LMFAO!:D:D:)

tangojoker
Peace
join:2004-01-25
Beaverton, OR

tangojoker to MIABye

Member

to MIABye
tremble with this thought :D

HardwareGeek
join:2003-11-15
Brooklyn, NY

HardwareGeek to CPM

Member

to CPM
I haven't seen a bsod since 98. However I see gsod on my mac all the time. Gray Screen of Death
cbs228
Geeks Of The World, Unite
join:2000-09-04
Saint Louis, MO

cbs228

Member

Re: Super Bowl Microsoft Style.

said by HardwareGeek:

I see gsod on my mac all the time. Gray Screen of Death
That shouldn't be happening. You probably have bad RAM or another hardware failure of some sort. Run the RAM diagnostics included on your Apple Hardware Test CD, and try swapping out your RAM chips until you find the problem.

DaDogs
Semper Vigilantis
Premium Member
join:2004-02-28
Deltaville, VA

1 edit

DaDogs to HardwareGeek

Premium Member

to HardwareGeek

Heres a Classic.
said by HardwareGeek:

I haven't seen a bsod since 98. However I see gsod on my mac all the time. Gray Screen of Death
Haven't had a frozen system since '98 either, right?
ross7
join:2000-08-16

ross7

Member

Every bit will be DRM'ed as well...

Can't wait for universal DRM'ed pay to view (no content saving, no copying, no sharing) bit by each and every copy-protected bit/byte in each and every TV-equiped room. Maybe they will be licensing the individual seating as well...or by the seated individual...Great googly-moogly, would that mean some folks might have to pay double on account of their fat-assed, four-eye'd couch-potato condition? Will there be ATM slots on the television sets? Will I have to accept EULA as my personal "Guide and ad-visor"? Will the TVs have a "reset" button for the inevitable BSOD? Will my on-screen guide get hijacked by CWS? Will there be "Pop-up" commercials when I least expect them? Will there ever come a time when I won't have to constantly patch or upgrade my TV-OS? If I can't afford to upgrade the TV-OS, will I be stuck in syndicated re-run land? Who do I call for service and support; SBC, or M$?

cdru
Go Colts
MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN

1 recommendation

cdru

MVM

FIOS != IPTV (at least not yet)

Verizon: Fios fiber to the home in select neighborhoods. Between 5 and 30MBps will be data bandwidth, the rest going toward video services. Microsoft has been signed as the software provider for their set-top boxes, and the IPTV service should start springing up in Fios wired markets mid-year.Huh? Verizon IS NOT doing IPTV, at least initially. From this article:
quote:
With five towns – Beaumont, CA and four in the Greater Dallas area – now having granted the company cable franchises and fiber construction underway in 12 states, the company says it is well positioned to begin delivering TV services later this year. As described in its Beaumont franchise application, Verizon’s plan calls for use of terrestrial OC-48 Sonet rings on long-haul and regional networks to carry all but local programming from a national super headend out to metro video hub offices, where local broadcast and PEG programming along with ad insertion and IPG are to be added to the video stream. The local fare along with some of the nationally distributed content will be delivered in analog as well as digital format, with all content modulated to RF at 50 to 870 MHz onto 256 QAM carriers and sent out at the 1550 nanometer wavelength to video serving offices at interfaces with local franchises.
Basically it's just like digital cable, just some of the back-end hardware is different. The fiber just gets modulated onto the coax at the ONT, not up some telephone pole at the front of your addition.

Video is sent down the fiber at a different lambda then what voice or data traffic is sent, so there isn't any bandwidth sharing going on. Well, technically it is sharing bandwidth of the actual fiber cable itself, but it's not sharing the same bandwidth within the same lambda. Increasing the resolution or picture quality of the video isn't going to slow down your data or voice speeds.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02

Karl Bode

News Guy

Re: FIOS != IPTV (at least not yet)

Yes, correct, thanks. Changed "IPTV" to "TV". Still using Microsoft software, however.

»www.microsoft.com/tv/con ··· _05.mspx
bmn
? ? ?

join:2001-03-15
hiatus

1 edit

bmn

Good for Bellsouth...

The report also claims BellSouth/Micrsosoft IPTV trials have disappointed the bell, so they may decide to look at other solutions.
Its good to see Bellsouth realizing that just following the Microsoft name doesn't alway pan out... There are plethora of other IPTV vendors who are probably much more focused on their IPTV products than Microsoft is now.

rit56
join:2000-12-01
New York, NY

rit56

Member

Microsoft

Look at the bright side of it. If it's a Microsoft box eventually someone will hack it and figure out a way to pop open up the box meaning free premium cable channels for everyone.
Newegg4
Comcast steals modems
join:2004-11-14
Norcross, GA

Newegg4

Member

MS and DRM

Software from MS means DRM comes bundled at no extra charge.

inteller
Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK

inteller

Member

Re: MS and DRM

in general the TV producers want DRM.

toddbs98
join:2000-07-08
North Little Rock, AR

toddbs98

Member

Re: MS and DRM

Ok for all the Microsoft haters here what do you offer as a better solution? Not something you think might be better, but that is in use now and is proving to be a better solution than what Microsoft has to offer.
Newegg4
Comcast steals modems
join:2004-11-14
Norcross, GA

Newegg4

Member

Re: MS and DRM

I don't hate MS. I love Windows and other software from them without DRM.
Mordhem
Love it, Hate it.
join:2003-07-10
Baltimore, MD

Mordhem

Member

Re: MS and DRM

I also agree with saw

realityhurts
@dsl.sntc01.pacbell.n

realityhurts to toddbs98

Anon

to toddbs98
What are the MS alternatives?
1. Routers: SkyStream, Tut Systems, UTStarCom, Minerva...
2. STBs: Pace, Amino, Createl, UTStarCom, GlobeCast...
3. Middleware: Minerva, Myrio, UTStarCom, WorldGate,...
4. Operating Systems: Linux, VxWorks, Nucleus,...
4. Service Providers: Over 100 telephone service providers
servicing US medium to small towns and rural areas,
as well as NTT Japan and other European providers.
These guys are earning money today from delivering IPTV
to their customers, and none of them use MS, except maybe for their employees to play games.
These medium to small guys couldn't care less about
MS. They just went ahead and did it. Only the big bozos
like Verizon and SBC are falling for the MS bull.

Do your homework. Check out these links:
»www.tutsystems.com
»www.skystream.com
»www.myrio.com
»www.minervanetworks.com
»www.kasenna.com
etc.

And NO, I don't work for any of these guys.

Any questions?
ricep5
Premium Member
join:2000-08-07
Jacksonville, FL

ricep5

Premium Member

Business Model

I am curious how IPTV will work financially,

- Bandwidth for 1 IPTV channel is one thing, but try supporting multiple channels throughout a home
- What if you have PVR that can record multiple channels at the same time?
- Cable at least has dedicated bandwidth assigned to each channel (analog), less so for digital cable. Technically, you can hook up 89 TV's for each channel and they will all work on cable.
- So does that make IPTV more efficient or just more profitable?
- What if you want several PIP's going? I have seen sports junkies run several PIP's so they can flick to an event quicker
- How long does it take to sync a channel when you surf the dial, digital cable boxes are already slower as they work harder to sync each channel as you surf, will IPTV be even slower?

I find it odd that in a world of caps, that someone is offering an IP based service that in essence, has no caps, since technically you can have your TV on night and day.

What happens when the whole US wants to watch the finale of some show, will there be congestion in the downstream link? Will they throttle the demand for that episode which will show up as decreased resolution? (similar to a power brownout?)

Will IPTV traverse a national backbone, or will it be like cable with a local dish and antenna array with a IP based head end?

If it is based on IP, why can't I just have an account and watch from anywhere in the US, and not just my home? Oh yeah, can't manage the delivery I guess when you are some 1000 miles from the IP based head end.

Just some questions on why IPTV exists.

GilbertMark
Premium Member
join:2001-05-02
Gilbert, AZ

1 edit

GilbertMark

Premium Member

Oh wonderful.

I can relate to Swisscom. I spent 20 years having a "hell of a time getting Microsoft's...software to actually work" also. I also found Microsoft's solution expensive, clumsy, difficult to manage and annoying. So I left them for a better solution.

Oh boy another new technology for Microsoft to completely **** up.
knifermcstab
join:2004-03-29
Cleveland, OH

knifermcstab

Member

Re: Oh wonderful.

Microsofts software has always been inferior to the competitions. If they would just run linux on it then that would solve all their problems. Cheap, easy to use and actually works the way you want it.

Poor poor microsoft. if they dont change their ways soon they will eventually go out of business because first all major companies will stop using window due to price and security issues. then the world.

toddbs98
join:2000-07-08
North Little Rock, AR

toddbs98

Member

Re: Oh wonderful.

How is Microsoft expensive? It is competive with commercial versions of Linux. And since Linux servers are the most hacked around I dont see your point on security either.
If all Linux distributions are so perfect why do they keep coming out with upgrades?
Im not saying Microsoft is the best choice for every application because it isn't. It is just the uninformed,biased, ignorance based bashing that bothers me.

Realityhurts:
Thanks for the links but after looking thru them I didn't see anyplace where they showed these products in large scale use and anything about any problems that may have occurred with them. I guess since they are Microsoft products it isn't worth the anti-Microsoft presses time to report on them.

lyls
@adsl.tele.dk

lyls

Anon

Re: Oh wonderful.

nice try but you didnt come up with anything proving otherwise..... atleast he actually did show other products

itguy05
@192.234.x.x

itguy05 to GilbertMark

Anon

to GilbertMark
So you finally saw the light and got a Mac?

HaveWeLearnedNothing
@shawcable.net

HaveWeLearnedNothing

Anon

Same old story

>>"Swisscom is having a hell of a time getting Microsoft's television software to actually work. While a large number of European providers are off and running using other solutions, Swisscom is finding Microsoft's solution expensive, clumsy, and difficult to manage."

LOL! Gosh....who'd a thunk! Don't worry, they should be able to fix it up in 5 or 10 years.


Truth is
@mem.bellsouth.ne

Truth is

Anon

Microsoft

MS has done a great job with Xbox live,I dont think there will be many problems with IPTV.I do not care for some of their product,but they did not get where they are today without successful products.

lyls
@adsl.tele.dk

lyls

Anon

Re: Microsoft

marketing is everything these days.... i mean they continue to FABRICATE popstars and people buy the crap