 |  | 
Tomek
Premium
join:2002-01-30
Brooklyn, NY
 ·Packet8
·Verizon VoiceWing
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 Another names for corruption:
Lobbying, donations for campaigns, blacklisting.
Did I miss something?
Anyway, I'm happy that so far, congress has something to say. After all they should represent the people, not highest bidder.
Old Joke:
If pro is for, and con against,
What's the opposite of PROgress?
CONgress
--
Private First Class of United States Marine Corps | |
| | | 
NPGMBR
join:2001-03-28
Arlington, VA
1 edit | Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the count still stands at: Congress 0. Interests Groups 94585
This is the State legislature of West Virginia not the U.S. Congress.
Everyone always downs West Virginia for being ass-backwards and country but it seems their representatives are a helluva lot smarter than those of the other 49 states and the Distric of Columbia.
Good Job West Virginia! | |
| | | | 
SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 said by NPGMBR  :...it seems their representatives are a helluva lot smarter than those of the other 49 states and the Distric of Columbia. Good Job West Virginia! I wouldn't go so far as to say Virgina is the only state with some intelligence in the union. Other states have turned down ILEC lobby efforts as well. Texas (of all places) actually turned down lobby-induced legislation just recently. Still West V. did a good job. | |
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NPGMBR
join:2001-03-28
Arlington, VA
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 Sorry but you misunderstood what I said.
1) The state in question is West Virginia
2) What I meant was that NO other state has taken such a BOLD stance against lobbyists and actually looked at a piece of legislation before blindly making it law. | |
| | | | | | 
proudquaters
@optonline.net
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 Wow, west virginia is like the only state, (maybe louisiana) to tell the incumbant to go to hell... Pennsylvania tried, but VZ did the armtwisting polka, and some $$ killed (or reduced)the munis efforts there...
I'd be proud to get some of those west virginia (that's really a state in and of itself?) for my 50 state quarter collection...
They should redesign that quarter to read, FREE muni broadband for all, screw you verizon!
(Translated into southern gibberish for effect of course!) | |
| | | | xrobertcmx
Premium
join:2001-06-18
Sterling, VA
clubs:  | No kidding, I still can't believe this is West Virginia pulling this off.
--
4 More years and we won't have a country. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 said by xrobertcmx :No kidding, I still can't believe this is West Virginia pulling this off. Broadband only effects like, what, 2 people who have computers in WV? 
--
Win some of $250 in prizes. Try your luck with The Amazing Race Contest. | |
| | | | | | 
Captain_Avat
join:2001-09-06
Harpers Ferry, WV | Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 So what's next? Black, Jew or Mexican Jokes? | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 Oh lighten up. I was joking. Obviously WV is a little more progressive then what my state, Indiana was. At least WV told the lobbyists to go buzz off. My state got as far as voting on the bill.
--
Win some of $250 in prizes. Try your luck with The Amazing Race Contest. | |
| | | | | | diver165
join:2003-01-08
Ona, WV | Yep, my wife and I both have PCs here in WVa
 | |
| | | 
SpitefulCrow
Insert Witty Tag Here
Premium
join:2003-06-04
Berkeley, CA | Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself. -- Mark Twain
| |
| | 
Mac Bridger
Beat It Again Bill
Premium
join:2001-01-11
Smithton, PA
clubs: | Who woulda thunk it? West "By Gawd" Virginia doing it too. That's gotta be typo or something.
--
Your resident hillbilly expert. | |
| | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH | Re: Congress 1. Interests Groups 94585 and if all these munis work (like Washington's UTOPIA, WV's project, and others) I hope that other states will learn from it and drop/block the muni ban bills. | |
| | 
FTCXtreme
join:2005-03-14
New Braintree, MA
|  Finally someoen stands up. i wish Massachusetts would but, Verizon treats everyone but me good. That fact is broadband is the governments problem and they need to whoop some ass. Also we need get them people in PA FiOS Only some of PA got it, The Taxpayers deserve what the paid for GIVE IT TO THEM. Verizon has ripped us off for too long. WE MUST STORM VERIZON HEAD QUARTERS! | |
| Taget
join:2004-07-29 | Sounds like.... ...that either that is one chairman who will soon lose his job or it's just public posturing before he really does let them write the bill. | |
| 
Brianv5
Low Level Functionary
Premium
join:2001-01-20
Keyser, WV | I might move back! Hey, if that happens, I'd leave TN and go back home to WV. You go rednecks! Bring your shotguns to the senate and lay down the law to the lobbyists!
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More power never hurt anything. | |
| 
CylonRed
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-06
Bloom County
 ·Speakeasy
| Finally.... Legislators standing up to the lobbyists and declaring themselves as representatives for the people and the state. About time - I can only hope more states do the same including Ohio....
--
Brian
America's Army Forum Moderator and America's Army Beta Tester | |
| |
FTCXtreme
join:2005-03-14
New Braintree, MA
| Re: Finally.... Yeah baby now only 100 senators and like 400 house members to go, This country need people to fight for Us, the fact is that one of the parties needs to push this, Hell If the Democrats pushed for our rights, I'd become a democrat Im a republican, and woudl becoem a democrat if the pushed for our broadband. | |
| | | | dsless
join:2001-05-16
Pittsburgh, PA
| Verizon is busy doing nothing to prompt broadband in our state. Hell will freeze over before verizon will put an RT up to my area (I am only 25k away.). Verizon, were is the FIOS roll out for WV?  :p;):(:D | |
| | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH
 ·Dreamhost
·Armstrong Zoom In..
| Re: Verizon is busy doing nothing Knowing Verizon and SBC, probably on the other side of 'never'.
It is rediculus that even some areas would never be considered 'marketable' to the corporations, and now blocking their one chance at getting broadband through government?
What have the corporations been smoking (then passing it to the gov. reps.)? | |
| Lincoln99
Premium
join:2005-03-24
Pleasant Grove, UT | Finally, some courage The primary reason American is such a great place is because our leaders in the past had the courage to lead.
Taking orders from a selfish monopoly, like Verizon, is NOT leading.
Well done West Virginia! | |
| 
sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT | Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! His name is John Ruddick.
Email and phone:
Phone: 304-344-7234
E-mail:john.r.ruddick@verizon.com
Maybe if the PUBLIC lobbies HIM to KNOCK IT OFF, Verizon will get the message?
So lets get at it!
Email him.
Call. him. | |
| | Sunburn
join:2000-10-05
Denver, CO
| Re: Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! said by sweintz :His name is John Ruddick. Email and phone: Phone: 304-344-7234 E-mail:john.r.ruddick@verizon.com Maybe if the PUBLIC lobbies HIM to KNOCK IT OFF, Verizon will get the message? So lets get at it! Email him. Call. him. You guys obviously don't understand the real issues here for the telecom industry and technological innovation which benefits the consumer. Such is the gullible ignoramus...in the majority.
Produce legislation to subsidise Verizon's competition and you will never see them invest another dollar in their Fiber roll-out plans. They are a company that has to make a profit or go out of business.
Once this municipal network is up it will advance and be upgraded at a rate akin to standing still. Without the ability to leach off the technological advancements that capitalism produces munis will have to tax you at a rate of 10x your annual income to advance at the same rate.
Companies do R&D to beat their competition. If you think socialism will accomplish the same results then your a clueless fool. If this was implemented in 1995 you would not even know the internet as it exists today....you would still be on dialup. | |
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NPGMBR
join:2001-03-28
Arlington, VA
1 edit | Re: Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! Dammit ....... I Second, Third and Fourth that.
Out Freakin Standing | |
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fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium
join:2001-05-25
Limbo | Well said. To quote another. . .
"Oh, you magnificient bastard!" --Apu | |
| | | dsless
join:2001-05-16
Pittsburgh, PA
1 edit | Please show me where Verizon has made a big investment in communications infrastructure in our state? Verizon has had a free hand to invest and deploy communications products. But for the most part the rural area of this state has received jack from Verizon. So your statement really doesn't stand here.
edit caus I can't type. | |
| | | 
TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
 ·Sprint Broadband D..
| Ok, cluestick time, as much as it pains me(not):
Q: What spurs advancement in a pure capitalistic society?
A: Competition
Q: Then why let the munis get into the mix?
A: Because what we have are regional and super-regional natural monopolies, that essentially function together like a cartel? They don't want their monopoly positions threatened.
Q: Aren't monopolies, by nature, anti-competition?
A: Very good. Yes they are.
Q: Why are they allowed to exist? Aren't monopolies illegal?
A: Where they are anti-competition in the marketplace? Yes. But there is a turd in the regulatory punchbowl: campaign contributions. No legislator or member of the executive branch wants to bite the hand that feeds it. So they give the incumbents a free pass.
Q: Well, why are the incumbents not engaging in capital investment, IE: rolling out new services and infrastructure?
A: Capital Investment, the engine that truly fires this US economy, is very down, across all segments of industry. This is because of the reliance on the quarterly report. Every three months, corporations that are publicly traded on the stock markets must present said reports. Said reports are them poured over by Wall Street Analysts. If the analysts do not like the amount of profit that company has made for the quarter, they downgrade the company's stock. Capital investments eat into a company's profit margin. So they do not invest, instead building up large amounts of money in the bank, which is used to buy out other corporations, in many cases. This is a closed-loop situation that provides nowhere near the benefit to the economy as would a robust capital investment climate. Especially when they buy companies and fire a few thousand souls.
Q: Well, to me, that seems like...
A: Yup. Municipalities and states are practicing economic self-determination. Entrepreneurship, if you will. They know that near-universal deployment of 21st century telecommunications infrastructure, into their areas, will present great economic and societal benefits. That said infrastructure must come in to their areas, if they are to grow new industry and new jobs. They know that they must do it if the incumbents won't, and to date, they haven't.
To the poster I was answering: Read this a few times, try to absorb the easy concepts and please, enough with the squawk radio economics. They are tired and broken, especially as regards this issue.
If the incumbents wish to live by the sword of their arcane and eldritch demographic and population density data, then they can die by said data. The people will just kick this thing in the ass on their own. | |
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NPGMBR
join:2001-03-28
Arlington, VA
2 edits | Re: Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! Holy BroadBand Bites Batman; Another Outstanding Post! | |
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FTCXtreme
join:2005-03-14
New Braintree, MA
| Re: Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! If you have any intelligence you'd realise that Verizon has not made an effort to come out in that area, Why should people be without broadband? Why can't that network their community? You honestly don't know what its like not having broadband, not being able to game, or download crap. I have friends who have broadband, you think I really want it? YES I'd love to have broadband, the fact is We as amercans have the right to choose, It would be as a matter afact unethical to block people from networking their community. Broadband is a service, which is becoming a necessity not only for Fire Dept, Schools, Town Governments, But if Im correct all of these HAVE T1 or soem sort of connectivity paid for by the government and our taxes. Which is good but couldn't we use our taxes to pay them to put a WiFi antenna or something there? Im sure a Fire DEPT nds T3, but most likely at most it'd use about 5 MBs of connectivity. Couldn't we pay for someone to put in a Remote Dslam and hook it up to a T3 line? We already pay for town government school ETC ETC's T1 and T3 lines. The fact is this, a town netowrking up would beneifit the residents, the company that provides the T3 or oc3 line, The Town itself because of the income from the service. | |
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sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT
2 edits | said by TScheisskopf :Ok, cluestick time, as much as it pains me(not): Q: What spurs advancement in a pure capitalistic society? A: Competition Good post, and I agree with all you said, BUT I'd add:
Competition drives capitalism WHEN, and ONLY when, there is profit to be made. Rolling services out in rural areas where population is sparse usually produces a LOSS to private companies. Regardless of the state of the economy and the availability of cheap (ie: low interest) capital Even at 0% interest, this sort of thing is often a losing proposition for private enterprise, oftentimes with ROI's in the 3 digit range.
Frankly, i'd rather see the government pass equal access legislation for broadband - if you supply it for some areas you service, you need to supply it for ALL areas you service. Problem is, I think some companies would simply choose not to offer broadband at all then, once they ran the numbers.
Fact is sometimes there is a definite need for something that will NEVER be profitable to provide. That is where a purely capitalistic system fails.
I DO think the government has a bad habit of trying to fix things that do NOT need fixing, but I don't see this as one of those cases. | |
| | | |
lyls
@tele.dk | but socialism! ITS EVIL NO COMMIE BROADBAND PLEASE............ | |
| | | 
jhboricua
ExMod 2000-01
join:2000-06-06
Minneapolis, MN
clubs:
2 edits | said by Sunburn :You guys obviously don't understand the real issues here for the telecom industry and technological innovation which benefits the consumer. Such is the gullible ignoramus...in the majority. We beg to differ.
said by Sunburn :Produce legislation to subsidise Verizon's competition and you will never see them invest another dollar in their Fiber roll-out plans. They are a company that has to make a profit or go out of business. And that is different from Verizon now in what way? Is not like they don't get billions in tax breaks only to fail to live up to their promises.
said by Sunburn :Once this municipal network is up it will advance and be upgraded at a rate akin to standing still. No, no, no. Let me fix this. Once this municipal network is up, verizon's network will advance and be upgraded at the rate of a crippled snail, up from the comatose snail speed. There, much better.said by Sunburn :Without the ability to leach off the technological advancements that capitalism produces munis will have to tax you at a rate of 10x your annual income to advance at the same rate. And the proof of that is in Verizon's own research. Is gotta be true!!!
said by Sunburn :Companies do R&D to beat their competition. If you think socialism will accomplish the same results then your a clueless fool. If this was implemented in 1995 you would not even know the internet as it exists today....you would still be on dialup. If this were implemented back in '95, we wouldn't be trailing all the other developed nations in broadband speeds or penetration. We all would be connected by fiber by now.
--
Jose A. Hernandez * IT Technician * MPLS, Minnesota, USA * My website: Zerochill | |
| | | moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by Sunburn :You guys obviously don't understand the real issues here for the telecom industry and technological innovation which benefits the consumer. Such is the gullible ignoramus...in the majority. Produce legislation to subsidise Verizon's competition and you will never see them invest another dollar in their Fiber roll-out plans. They are a company that has to make a profit or go out of business. Once this municipal network is up it will advance and be upgraded at a rate akin to standing still. Without the ability to leach off the technological advancements that capitalism produces munis will have to tax you at a rate of 10x your annual income to advance at the same rate. Companies do R&D to beat their competition. If you think socialism will accomplish the same results then your a clueless fool. If this was implemented in 1995 you would not even know the internet as it exists today....you would still be on dialup. PLEASE....I have said this before and will continue to say it.
"If the Bells had developed broadband access that ANYONE could use and was as fast as cable, then there would be no contest."
However, they fell asleep and are trying to catch up. DSL, while an o.k. technology, is very distance sensitive. Unless you are close enough, you won't get max speeds.
If a muni system wants to deploy to an area THAT IS NOT SERVED BY THE LOCAL TELCO OR CABLE COMPANY, then let them. Otherwise, there will be nothing more than empty promises from the same telcos and cable companies.
Plus, the telcos had to be forced to deploy standard POTS everywhere. | |
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sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT
| Re: Lets tell this lobbyist how stupid he is! said by moonpuppy :Plus, the telcos had to be forced to deploy standard POTS everywhere. Yes. How soon we forget that. In a purely capitalistic system we would likely have at least 5-10% (maybe more? I'm blindly guessing here,...) of our population with no phone or electricity. Why run 20 miles of wire to service three people when the cost of doing so can't possibly be covered by what you can charge for those services? | |
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fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium
join:2001-05-25
Limbo
·Skype
| Hate to bring this up, but the U.S. already has "socialist" ideologies when it comes to certain utilities. Ever hear of an Electric Cooperative or more specifically the NRECA (»www.nreca.org/nreca/About_Us/Abo···_NRECA)?
That concept was established because the "for profit" utilities wouldn't take electricity to rural areas because it "wasn't profitable".
If programs like that hadn't developed, it's entirely likely there would STILL be farmers in rural America waiting for electricity. Now can you imagine what a hindrance to U.S. dominance it would be to have a large portion of our population still doing things by hand. Fast forward 60 years and imagine what kind of limitations we face against other advancing industrialized nations if significant portions of the U.S. don't have reasonable internet access for industry and business. Internet access isn't only about downloading pr0n for the residential user, many companies rely on it.
Also, since you don't see any huge nationwide Cooperatives taking over the likes of PJM, AEP, TVA, MECS, PG&E or any of a handful of other very large for profit utilities, obviously the concept isn't significantly hindering competition or bankrupting the IOUs.
--
When people are free to do as they please, they usually imitate each other. | |
| |
FTCXtreme
join:2005-03-14
New Braintree, MA
| Good question, but the problem for me is, in a town of 1,000 people, shouldn't I be able to get it? The problem is this, Verizon wont be upgrading DSL. FiOS is coming, some of us wont see it for 20 years, whats that mean? You're shit out of luck I living in Massachusetts may see FiOS earlier then you guys but then again this is Verizon we're talking about, So FiOS within 2 years for me is a reality, but it's gonna take longer for you guys, as soon as I get DSL Cable or FiOS, I will not even go to Broad Band reports, I've had to fight and argue for broadband for a long time as soon as I get it, XBOX LIVE TIME  . Until then these forums will be my home, I will argue and look at news articles and devise way to piss off verizon into giving me broadband MUHAHAHAHA. Also though the most applicable way to solve the shortage of broadband, is through cable, Cable the root of all evil in this world, is the easiest solution. My message to Verizon is "GIT R DONE!" | |
| jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH
·Dreamhost
·Armstrong Zoom In..
| Waiting... For how long now has next-generation internet been waiting to be deployed?
Hell, many asian countries are probly working on Gen-5 right now, while we are stuck with Gen-.5!
For years now we have been doing everything but screaming at the providers for faster speeds, and nearly every time they found some excuse to forgo it (My personal favorite is SBC's "Fiber is not a proven technology").
If the internet companies wont provide it, at least we can get it from somewhere...
If munis work out (which I believe they will), I hope it:
1) Gets the cable/telcos off their butts and moving on next-gen deployment without all the excuses (currently awaiting the 'not enough funding due to current mergers' excuse).
2) Satisfies our own frustrations of corporate bypassing, and provides us with next-gen broadband that we have been dieing for.
3) Lets other states that are trying to pass muni-bans see the light and kill the bills (no movie-pun intended). | |
| | 
icex _
Premium
join:2004-05-22
USA
clubs: | Re: Waiting... so, does this mean (i am from WV), that my area might finaly get dsl?
--
Please visit my website.»icextest.jchchost.com | |
| Cyber2lz
join:2001-11-15
Odessa, FL
·Verizon FIOS
·RoadRunner Cable
| duh !! Sunburn said,
"They are a company that has to make a profit or go out of business."
Uh, my vote, in the case of Verizon, is the latter!
Just a thought!
--
If you're not livin' on the edge, you're takin' up too much space ! | |
|
CancerMan
@trianaenergy.com
|  Mountaineers call your representatives
If you are in WV and want broadband but cannot get it - I would encourage you to call your representative's office in the House and Senate of WV and voice your support for this bill - nicknamed, "ETOPIA." | |
| | 
plk
bo may sleep in loft
Premium
join:2002-04-20
Ogden, IA
| Re: Mountaineers call your representatives I want to second CANCERMAN's suggestion. Send a e-mail,call and post a sign in your front yard supporting ETOPIA. You neighbors probably don't even know what it is.
If someone posts the e-mail address of some of the reps of the state, I will send them one even though I am in Iowa.
--
Thermaltake 2000a/Asus P4C-e/p4 3.4/ocz3500 2x512/WD.2x200g/raptor2x74 raid 0/ATI 9600/APC sua 1500/Logitech z-680/ Samsung 213t LCD/MX 1000 | |
| 
xdeadhead
220, 221, Whatever It Takes.
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Mechanicsburg, PA | Verizon lobbyist 'furious' verizons customers "furious-er"
VOL sucks balls. | |
| | dmbxc
Premium
join:2005-02-14
Buckhannon, WV
clubs:
| Re: Verizon lobbyist 'furious' This much talk about West Virginia with no mention of March Madness....whats going on. On a serious note, I hope this does work out for the best but for some reason I don't see this bill passing  | |
| LKMcMillen
join:2001-11-30
Riverside, CA | Re: Verizon Lobbyist, furious! Mr. Ruddick must have thought he was in California. | |
| PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
| Any day a Verizon lobbyist is furious ... ... is a very, very good day indeed.
quote:
Ruddick responded, "This is different than water and sewer."
Not in the 21st century, it's not. It's just as necessary for a viable, prosperous community.
quote:
Levine told the committee that this type of government promotion of technology is what has allowed Ireland to go from an 18 percent unemployment rate in 1987 to become the hottest economy in Europe with unemployment at less than 3 percent.
Exactly!!! And do you know why Northern Ireland has 100% broadband availability? Because of exactly the type of public-private partnership envisioned here.
Look, Verizon blew it. They only deployed broadband to a fraction of their area, and everytime someone outside that area asks when they will get it, Verizon tells them they have no plans. So of course these communities will want to do it themselves. Why should Verizon care, anyway, if they don't want to provide service to these communities.
--PDXPLT (who lives in Verizon territory, and will never be provided with broadband from Verizon). | |
| |
new policy
@optonline.net
| Re: Any day a Verizon lobbyist is furious ... I wonder if it is the new policy to eventually deploy everwhere there is current copper outside plant? Or would that be too cost prohibitive?
Its A LOT OF FIBER to deploy...
Some people really don't need it, and concievably there are phone lines in places where (gulp) there is no power... | |
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Re: Finally....