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VoIP Taxation
States go on the offensive
Despite a recent ban on internet access tax, and an FCC ruling that declared states couldn't regulate VoIP, the debate over whether or not states can tax your VoIP connection rages on. Business Week notes that with billions in revenue at stake, the states are going on the offensive, in a move that could bring the same taxes and fees on your phone bill, to your monthly VoIP bill.
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sdsa
@wdc2-4.xx.79.xx.wdc2

sdsa

Anon

sadsa

asdsa

Googled
Yay, I have FIOS
join:2001-08-13
Orchard Park, NY

Googled

Member

Re: sadsa

You spelled 'Yay first post' incorrectly.

Government will always attempt to tax as much as possible, it's in their nature. They want to get their foot in this before it takes off so that as it grows so does their revenue. It's their way of 'investing' in the future, though all it does in reality is stifle growth.

I wonder how this would work if you have phone numbers in different area codes outside your state? For example if I had two numbers one in NY and another in CA would I pay VOIP taxes in both states?
chesney09
Premium Member
join:2004-07-26
Howell, MI

1 recommendation

chesney09

Premium Member

God forbid the consumer...

...Get a break from taxes on a few things in life...
Instead of taxing more.. How about you States clean up the slop... Quit with all the raises for our state politicians.. How about cutting the fat if you need more revenue... Better yet.. Give us some valid reasons to support your need for the added taxes other thatn.. "we Need it"

Daishi7
Premium Member
join:2002-02-24

Daishi7

Premium Member

Re: God forbid the consumer...

The answer is here »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li ··· arianism

see also: »www.lp.org/quiz/
vic102482
Premium Member
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD

1 edit

vic102482

Premium Member

Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

States do not know how to act. States are constantly sleeping in bed with private industry for baseball stadiums and the like. I remember one story about a county using "Right of Way" to level homes to build a hotel and some other crap, I thought those bills were reserved for roads and public works.

States dont know how to act, they tax too much, and are only looking out for themselves. Without the federal government and Supreme Court to step in and block alot of these measures wed all be shit to hell right about now.

Everyone has a story to tell about their state and some of the downright cruel things they have done. They dont care about the status of the US economy or supporting a reconstruction from the 2000 crash, just collecting measly taxes.

Shit how many people per state use VOIP, Im guessing no more than 10K in any given state. Each state probably isnt "losing" more than 100K per year from the ban on VOIP taxes, but watch your realestate taxes go up ten fold in retaliation.

Nick
Purveyor of common sense
MVM
join:2000-10-29
Smithtown, NY

Nick

MVM

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

Cablevision's Optimum Voice has 250k subs in 3 states.

Average of 80k per NY, NJ and CT
moonpuppy (banned)
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD

moonpuppy (banned) to vic102482

Member

to vic102482
The problem is, and you know this by living in MD, that government is constantly trying to please everyone and it can't be done.

Baltimore City charges twice for property taxes than any other county in MD, has the highest insurance rates, the worst schools and the worst crime. Yet, year after year, they keep begging for more money to fix it. They even just put in a telecommunications tax ($3.50/per phone line, pager and cellphone.) Why? They have no tax base. Most people either work menial jobs or are unemployed on assistance. This is just another revenue stream that can be pushed off as a "fee" instead of a tax.

Comptroller Schaefer has tried to charge state tax to mail order stuff for years and even posts state troopers are convenience stores across the border (Delaware, West Virginia, PA and Virginia) in order to catch people buying cigarettes without paying MD taxes (which are very high.)

This all stems from the loss of the telecommunications taxes lost when the internet became an information service.
vic102482
Premium Member
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD

vic102482

Premium Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

said by moonpuppy:

This all stems from the loss of the telecommunications taxes lost when the internet became an information service.
And factory after factory continues to close and relocate from Baltimore. Who the heck wants to run a busniess there when so much of it is going right back to the state treasury. You cannot tax yourself out of poverty, but you can very easily tax yourself into it. In PG county now so many people are opting to relocate to the cheaper surrounding counties like Charles County and (Forgot the county that starts right outside of Bowie:p).

The result? PG county is turning into another version of baltimore. You have the rich areas, and the rest of PG county. Dirt cheap and broke. Taxes dont work, cut the fat in the educational system and in other government programs first. You can only tax people so much before they pick up and leave. Look at California.

TheHelpful1
Premium Member
join:2002-01-11
Upper Marlboro, MD

TheHelpful1

Premium Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

said by vic102482:

Charles County and (Forgot the county that starts right outside of Bowie).
Talking Anne Arundel County?

As far as all the taxes, MD is now proposing a 'hummer' tax on all SUV's over 6000lbs. Uhh, didn't Dubya just have an incentive tax 'break' to get people to buy these behemoths? Add in 'mileage' tax they want to compensate for all the people who are switching to hybrid cars and paying less gas tax...when's it going to end? (Yes...when you die..)

Brings to mind Monty Burns (Simpsons) statement as the feds were taking him away when he took that million-dollar bill. Eventually people will wise up and realize they're being taxed into slavery and take action.
rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

rradina to moonpuppy

Member

to moonpuppy
Do they have a city income tax? This is my favorite kind of tax. St. Louis has a 1% city income tax. If applies if you work within the city's borders. That's right, you can live somewhere else but if you work there, they get you. If they can do this, do you think it will matter if you live in LA and have a phone number in NY? They'll tax it without even a second thought. In either case, do you get any say in how the tax is used? Hell no. Isn't this one of the key reasons this country declared independence almost 230 years ago? We didn't learn much..... did we?

But what the hell, all's fair in war, politics and religion? Aren't most forms of all three simply talking about the same thing? Most religious leaders practice politics and most politics lead to war.
moonpuppy (banned)
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD

moonpuppy (banned)

Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

said by rradina:

Do they have a city income tax? This is my favorite kind of tax. St. Louis has a 1% city income tax.
Yeah they do. Take your state tax bill and cut it in half and that is your city tax bill.

What you describe is a commuter tax and no one will go for that. I know a few companies threaten to leave downtown if that went into effect.
said by Kearnstd:

the gov of Mass tried that once in new hampshire, the governor of NH said hed arrest the MA state troopers if they tried to enforce anything outside of MA.

Well, what the troopers are doing is waiting in the parking lot of the stores and using cell phones to call their com-padres over the state line with license plate numbers to pull over once in MD.

SpitefulCrow
Insert Witty Tag Here
Premium Member
join:2003-06-04
Berkeley, CA

SpitefulCrow

Premium Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

How is it legal for a state to arrest/fine someone for taking business out of state to avoid a disgustingly high tax rate?
Last time I checked we had a free market economy here.
moonpuppy (banned)
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD

moonpuppy (banned)

Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

said by SpitefulCrow:

How is it legal for a state to arrest/fine someone for taking business out of state to avoid a disgustingly high tax rate?
Last time I checked we had a free market economy here.
Believe it or not, there is a law in MD that says you cannot import more than 2 cartons of cigarettes for personal use. The reasoning behind this law is so people don't circumvent the state taxes put on cigarettes. Right or wrong, it is the law no matter how crappy it is.

SpitefulCrow
Insert Witty Tag Here
Premium Member
join:2003-06-04
Berkeley, CA

SpitefulCrow

Premium Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

said by moonpuppy:
said by SpitefulCrow:


How is it legal for a state to arrest/fine someone for taking business out of state to avoid a disgustingly high tax rate?
Last time I checked we had a free market economy here.
Believe it or not, there is a law in MD that says you cannot import more than 2 cartons of cigarettes for personal use. The reasoning behind this law is so people don't circumvent the state taxes put on cigarettes. Right or wrong, it is the law no matter how crappy it is.
Saying "it is the law" is such a crappy way to avoid having to deal with something. It's a bad law and as such should be changed. This is why we have a democracy - write to your representatives and tell them to change the law. If they don't, vote them out.

calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA

calvoiper

Member

Re: Exactly why they do not deserve the Power

States are not free to prevent their residents from buying products out of state. (With possible exception of alcohol, which is under US Sup Ct review as we write.)

States are free, however, to levy taxes on products you bring in from other jurisdictions SO LONG AS those taxes are not higher than those levied on products sold in the state.

If you bring in 10 cartons of cigs to MD, I'll bet MD punishes you for evading the tax on 8 cartons, not for bringing more than 2 cartons.

calvoiper
moonpuppy (banned)
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD

moonpuppy (banned) to SpitefulCrow

Member

to SpitefulCrow
said by SpitefulCrow:

Saying "it is the law" is such a crappy way to avoid having to deal with something. It's a bad law and as such should be changed. This is why we have a democracy - write to your representatives and tell them to change the law. If they don't, vote them out.
Don't smoke.

MD is known for tryng to tax everything under the sun (almost like NJ.) Our comptroller loves taxes and once tried to raise the gas tax 10 cents. Even Baltimore City now adds an energy tax to everyone INCLUDING non-profits.

VOIP would be just another revenue stream.

calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA

calvoiper to rradina

Member

to rradina
said by rradina:

If they can do this, do you think it will matter if you live in LA and have a phone number in NY? They'll tax it without even a second thought.
I'm guessing that some locale will go tax free, and then Vonage will be giving everyone NPA-NXX numbers from that exchange....

calvoiper
Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium Member
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ

Kearnstd to moonpuppy

Premium Member

to moonpuppy
quote:
Comptroller Schaefer has tried to charge state tax to mail order stuff for years and even posts state troopers are convenience stores across the border (Delaware, West Virginia, PA and Virginia) in order to catch people buying cigarettes without paying MD taxes (which are very high.)

the gov of Mass tried that once in new hampshire, the governor of NH said hed arrest the MA state troopers if they tried to enforce anything outside of MA.

but this VOIP thing brings up an interesting theory, if say CT put a tax on this could i avoid it by taking an NY area code. living right at the state line the next town over is still a local call.

schmunk
Premium Member
join:2001-03-03
Defiance, OH

2 edits

schmunk

Premium Member

The States need their "Money"

For pork programs sports shit, sports schools, clinics, family services, ect, ect Shit that is not needed! the states do'nt get the message! That why people want there money to work for them only, not going to state goverment to waste! The goverment does not know how to layoff or cut back on spending!
raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN

raythompsontn

Member

Re: The States need their "Money"

said by schmunk:

For pork programs sports shit, sports schools, clinics, family services, ect, ect Shit that is not needed! the states do'nt get the message! That why people want there money to work for them only, not going to state goverment to waste! The goverment does not know how to layoff or cut back on spending!
Well, I can think of one good use for the money. That would be to send some people back to basic schooling for the proper use of words and abbreviation such as "etc." and "don't." Also the proper use of "there" and "their" when used in a sentence. Let's not get into spelling issues as they are easy to make typing a long word such as "government."

Education would be a good use for the additional revenue.

algorithm3
And I Should Care - Why?
join:2001-07-23
Huntington, NY

algorithm3

Member

Re: The States need their "Money"

said by raythompsontn:

Well, I can think of one good use for the money. That would be to send some people back to basic schooling for the proper use of words and abbreviation such as "etc." and "don't." Also the proper use of "there" and "their" when used in a sentence. Let's not get into spelling issues as they are easy to make typing a long word such as "government."

Education would be a good use for the additional revenue.
I guess you're what passes for a snide (psuedo-?) intellectual in TN.  Pattern yourself after Al Gore?

We're all very impressed, I'm sure.
raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN

1 edit

raythompsontn

Member

Re: The States need their "Money"

said by algorithm3:


said by raythompsontn:

Well, I can think of one good use for the money. That would be to send some people back to basic schooling for the proper use of words and abbreviation such as "etc." and "don't." Also the proper use of "there" and "their" when used in a sentence. Let's not get into spelling issues as they are easy to make typing a long word such as "government."

Education would be a good use for the additional revenue.
I guess you're what passes for a snide (psuedo-?) intellectual in TN.  Pattern yourself after Al Gore?

We're all very impressed, I'm sure.
You can guess all that you want but you would be incorrect. I was simply making an observation.

As for patterning after Al Gore! Nope, not even on a bad day. I spent considerable effort making sure that some of Al's missteps were brought to the forefront during the 2000 election.

As for being impressed, thanks. But don't speak for others.

fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium Member
join:2001-05-25
Limbo

1 edit

fireflier to algorithm3

Premium Member

to algorithm3
Why do you appear to assume/infer someone from Tennessee could only be a (pseudo?) intellectual or that reasonable intellect is implausible? Is it not possible for people in particular geographic areas to be genuine full-fledged intellectuals, or is that privilege only reserved for the large coastal city populous?

hailinfantry
Bizarro Quinn
Premium Member
join:2004-01-18
Brooklyn, NY

1 edit

1 recommendation

hailinfantry to algorithm3

Premium Member

to algorithm3
said by algorithm3:
said by raythompsontn:

Well, I can think of one good use for the money. That would be to send some people back to basic schooling for the proper use of words and abbreviation such as "etc." and "don't." Also the proper use of "there" and "their" when used in a sentence. Let's not get into spelling issues as they are easy to make typing a long word such as "government."

Education would be a good use for the additional revenue.
I guess you're what passes for a snide (psuedo-?) intellectual in TN.  Pattern yourself after Al Gore?

We're all very impressed, I'm sure.
So what you're saying, in effect, is that Huntington, NY is an intellectual haven for these United States? Wait...I can't think of a single thing that little berg has contributed to this nation...aside from you.

Now, What about Oak Ridge, TN. Ah yes, the MANHATTAN PROJECT. Do you know what that little thing was? I doubt you do. Here's a hint: Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Yea, Oak Ridge, TN has intellectuals and scientists...famous ones that work with the Energy Dept to this very day. How about Huntington, NY? Checkmate

I love the way you utilize a Signal Corps (US Army) avatar and spread your BS on this site. Almost as though the Army endorses that. Not very soldier-like conduct at all. The guy was making a simple observation. Don't like it? Hey mod it. If you're that sensitive, you're in the wrong profession.

Then again, you're signal...
xrobertcmx
Premium Member
join:2001-06-18
White Plains, MD

xrobertcmx

Premium Member

Re: The States need their "Money"

I believe we used the term Poge.

Crypto5
Premium Member
join:2001-01-07
Saint Charles, MO

Crypto5 to schmunk

Premium Member

to schmunk
I think we should work on getting the government to run with no money at all. Wouldnt that be cool?

*snicker*

qdemn7
Smurf in My Loop
Premium Member
join:2003-09-16
Fort Worth, TX

qdemn7

Premium Member

Politicians are Like Crack Whores

VOIP will be taxed, it's inevitable. Politicians with taxes, are like crack whores with crack, neither one can ever say no. Besides it takes lots of tax money to fund the "Bread and Circuses", that politicians use to buy votes to show how much "they feel our pain".

joeb0000
@snet.net

joeb0000

Anon

Re: Politicians are Like Crack Whores

You said it.

woody7
Premium Member
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA

woody7

Premium Member

Hmmmm.........

Why don't they look for "new ways" to save frikken money....

TheHelpful1
Premium Member
join:2002-01-11
Upper Marlboro, MD

TheHelpful1

Premium Member

Re: Hmmmm.........

said by woody7:

Why don't they look for "new ways" to save frikken money....
Because 'save' is not in their dictionary. There's only Lie, Tax, Spend...You get the picture.

zoebisch01
join:2003-11-10
Julian, PA

zoebisch01

Member

Another new tax...

Wow, I wonder what else hasn't been taxed...I'm sure if we brainstorm, we can come up with something! Hey, I've got it we can charge a 'privilege to live here tax', or how about a viewing tax, they could invent little meters that implant into our eyeballs that tax us for when our eyes are open and then, they can figure out how to charge a tax if you decide to walk around with your eyes shut all the time...I think it would be a win-win situation.

•••••

PhoenixDown
FIOS is Awesome
Premium Member
join:2003-06-08
Fresh Meadows, NY

PhoenixDown

Premium Member

Real Simple solution

Dont pay it. We need to organize a screw taxes month where everyone across the country just refuses to pay taxes on thier invoices.

NoVOIPTaxation

Anon

Re: Real Simple solution

As soon as it taxed, I'll cancel my service. I dont mind paying 20 bucks for something I dont use a lot but is nice to have.. But start taxing and now we are talking 30+.. no thanks.. I'll just use my cell phone.
Zorglub8
join:2000-11-18
Fremont, CA

Zorglub8

Member

I don't understand the big deal

Taxing Voip like regular POTS seems fair and logical to me. Otherwise, POTS users end up subsidizing VOIP users.

Now, we can all have different opinions as to what the right level taxation should be, but that's kind of beyond the point. If you don't want VOIP to be taxed, then other phone services need to be tax free too.

•••••••

joeb0000
@snet.net

joeb0000

Anon

The american way.

IF you haven't figured out that corporate america runs the united states then you need to wake up..

Tax the poor while the rich get richer..

That is the american way..

Oh an being able to sit on my ass and have 15 kids to collect welfare.. that is the american way as well

hailinfantry
Bizarro Quinn
Premium Member
join:2004-01-18
Brooklyn, NY

hailinfantry

Premium Member

Re: The american way.

said by joeb0000:

IF you haven't figured out that corporate america runs the united states then you need to wake up..

Tax the poor while the rich get richer..

That is the american way..

Oh an being able to sit on my ass and have 15 kids to collect welfare.. that is the american way as well
Good to see the American Way is determined by an anonymous troll and less than .0001% of American Familes (15+ Children, receiving government assistance).

If you think welfare programs are the largest drain on our economy, think again.