 
ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Hollywood, FL
clubs:
 ·VOIPo
1 edit | I guess so... Espicially when you tell the person calling it is going to take two days longer just because they are talking to someone in the U.S.
Probably takes up to two days longer because they fill in the paperwork then fed-ex it to India to have it processed. | |
|  | raman3007
join:2004-03-30
Bothell, WA
| Indian here.. Hi Guys, Indian here..
1995: WTO was formed and globalization pushed down the throats of many developing nations by the G8.. The US pushed almost all countries to open up their markets.. including India. India used to heavily subsidised its agriculture... the US demanded India to stop that, as that was unfair competetion. India had to comply to be in the WTO.. and guess what.. many poor farmers were driven to near starvation without government help. Remember the collapse of economies in Mexico and Argentina ?
1999: India emerged as a top software exporter, thanks to Indian government's software friendly policies and the very Indian craze for higher education. Indians realized all that software takes is a little brain.. and believe me, there's plenty of it in India. Well, 'globalization', the thing that Americans pursued so vigorously, became a big advantage for India, and we took globalization back to its home...the USA !!..
Now that globalization hurts, its very preachers, the Americans are squirming.. !!!
WHY ??? I ask.. it is a global economy, you said.. open up your markets, you said.. NOW WHAT ??????? Where is all the so-called American FAIRNESS gone ??..
Come to reality guys.. this is the new world order.. an order that you guys started..
Let me ask you a question: What if the big corporations decided that it would be much cheaper if ALL their operations were shifted to India ? Microsoft, IBM, Intel, you name them.. they have a presence in India now.
Would you stop buying Intel processors, or Microsoft Windows, or Office, or the Oracle DB, or Cisco's routers, or Nortel's switches, or Motorola's phones (believe me they ALL are in India now.. and many more!)...
That said, I will still say: I have a lot of respect for the American civilization.. you guys are the best.. you've shown the world the way to live a good life full of freedom.. the way to develop..
It will be a matter of time before you guys are at the TOP.. !!!! | |
| 
Steve
Pipe Wrench Fight
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Yorba Linda, CA
1 edit | "Incentive" more powerful than "intention" It's amazing what happens when there is an actual cost to opposition of outsourcing.
... and I'd be curious to know if they have stats on repeat overseas redirects. "What % of people who went to an Indian call center on their first visit chose to wait for a U.S. call center on subseqent visits". This might be more enlightening.
Steve | |
| 
GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
2 edits | There are tariffs on goods... Too bad there aren't tariffs on labor. There needs to be incentive rather than punishment for U.S. companies to continue operating here. E-Loan certainly isn't the only one. People criticized Ross Perot about the giant sucking sound but the principle is the same. You can't have $30-$50K a year US labor directly competing against $1 labor and expect us to compete. At the same time, regulation, lack of tort reform, high worker's comp rates all create the incentive to fire Americans even if the wages were equal. And after all this outsourcing have we seen massive cuts in pricing as a benefit? Are we suddenly getting much superior service? ELN's service way cheaper? Loans from E-Loan cheaper? Hell no, corporations just pocket the savings and give a bit to politicians who continue these lop-sided trade policies. E-Loan is just another example of this much much larger problem.
--
Bush is a Fascist. Republicanism used to be about individual liberty and smaller government. Bush represents neither. He is a religious zealot who is looking to turn this nation into a theocracy. I'm a life long Republican who will vote AGAINST Bush. | |
| | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: There are tariffs on goods... quote:
Too bad there aren't tariffs on labor.
There needs to be incentive rather than punishment for U.S. companies to continue operating here.
corporations just pocket the savings and give a bit to politicians who continue these lop-sided trade policies
You kind of have a non-sequitur here. First you lament the lack of Government control (tariffs, which are are government control in the form of punishments). Then you say we need incentives rather than punishments (What type of non-punishment type of incentives do you have in mind?).
So, if we have more governmental regulation and control over those evil corporations are we not in essence centralizing power and giving more control to the corporations who are greasing the politicians?
Why is the corporation always the evil one?
An employee demands more money and claims that the employer is taking advantage of them. Evil Corporation!
Investors demand that a corporation maximize their profits and again, the corporation that is the evil party for complying with the demands of the investors.
How many of you Microsoft Millionaires out there hate Evil Microsoft for giving you a job and making you rich?
I'm confused.
quote:
At the same time, regulation, lack of tort reform, high worker's comp rates all create the incentive to fire Americans even if the wages were equal.
Government, government and government.
Government should stay our of business. Sure, there will be problems, but the market has a way of correcting itself in a more efficient fashion than government.
If you keen on Tariffs, you might want to read up on the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act 1930. | |
| | |
GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
1 edit | Re: There are tariffs on goods... Tariffs penalizing labor imports no matter who they're from. Non-punishment incentives would include increased tax relief for offering healthcare, relaxing of burdensome regulation, quicker depreciation schedules for worker operated equipment...things that make employing people here easier and more affordable for business. In the long term any lost tax "revenue" is recouped by having more people paying taxes. IMHO, it's way better to have way more people paying a little, that a few people paying a lot.
No one said corporations are evil other than you. They are put into the outsourcing position by unfair trade policies that allow countries who ignore basic human rights like China, or near slave wage paying foreign business to flood the US markets. It's not enough to have trade. You have to have FAIR trade. The only thing free trade does is reduce our standard of living to the lowest bidder.
--
Bush is a Fascist. Republicanism used to be about individual liberty and smaller government. Bush represents neither. He is a religious zealot who is looking to turn this nation into a theocracy. I'm a life long Republican who will vote AGAINST Bush. | |
| 
bmupton
join:2001-08-19
Saskatoon, SK
| What I see... What I see when I read this article is: "companies delaying service by american employees so they can justify overseas, cost cutting phone centers"
--
psychowolfman, webmaster
»www.saskmetal.com | |
| | | 
Roundboy
Premium
join:2000-10-04
Drexel Hill, PA
| ha i can't possibly see why it takes a us based company LONGER to process then sending them to India.
Unless of course they gave higher priority to India / set up faster access over their american counterparts.
This is a great article to make it say exactly what they want you to hear... without knowing all the facts
--
** 256 Man Lan **Feb 27th - 29thhttp://www.thegxl.com | |
| | yabos
join:2003-02-16
Ingersoll, ON | Re: ha Probably because they have 500 Indian workers for the price of 5 American workers, so they just have way more employees in India, and the American call center is understaffed. | |
| 
inteller
Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK | what a load of crock There is no logistical reason why a US originated call should take LONGER in the US. This is a slap to the face of American labor. This just shows that companies will go to any length to justify the bilking of American workers. | |
| 
LD 50
join:2000-08-28
Milford, NH
clubs:
| Such a kind people Wipro, which does the work for E-Loan, has been watching the furor from India. "We're very concerned about the angst that is there," says Sangita Singh, Wipro's chief marketing officer. "Our heart reaches out to the people getting affected with all the job losses." --
"When the Government fears it's people there is LIBERTY, but, when the people fear their Government there is TYRANNY” - Thomas Jefferson | |
| 
LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA
2 edits | Those Damn Consumers Someone should pass a law making it illegal for consumers to buy cheaper goods and services. That will fix this problem. This will fix it.
But seriously, for the life of me I don't understand why people are upset about this. For one thing India has a billion people so they have what economists call comparative advantage in labor resources. More of a supply of workers means a cheaper price. Second, we in America want to be able to sue at the drop of a hat and we have [insert bugaboo here] placing all sorts of onerous regulations on industry (for good or for ill). Really, what do we expect? And what is John Kerry gonna do about it?
And another article for you protectionists.
"Lunches don't get free just because you don't see the prices on the menu. And economists don't get popular by reminding people of that." --Thomas Sowell | |
| | Noodlin
join:2003-07-11
Monterey Park, CA
| Re: Those Damn Consumers “For one thing India has a billion people so they have what economists call comparative advantage in labor resources.”
Sounds like a line right out of my Econ Textbook.
On the subject of economics; one questions arises’ is that, if the main customer base of these companies are indeed Americans, then outsourcing can be the undoing of these companies. By outsourcing, the wealth of you main customer base will diminish (the unemployed American worker). With this diminished customer base, your operations as a company will also diminish due to a lack of funds available by the customer base (again, the unemployed American worker). This lowering effect will force the company to resort to even more drastic measures, perhaps even more outsourcing. Regardless, you can see how these chains of events can spiral downward quickly. | |
| | | toasterhead1
Toasterhead
join:2002-07-01
Norcross, GA
clubs:
2 edits | Re: Those Damn Consumers Another question also arises, if the product becomes much more expensive then not outsourcing will be the undoing of these companies.
Lets say company A is a computer company. They place there call information centers in India. Because the labor is cheaper there, employees can be hired cheaper. Not only does this lead to lower wait times for the customer, but it also lowers cost as the can afford more employees at a lower price.
Lets say company B is in the same industry, except there support technicians are in the USA. Lets say U.S. employees are 10x more productive then the Indian employees, they can take more calls and be more helpful. However an Indian employee cost $10 a day with no money paid to the govenrment, while an American cost $100 a day then on top of that are all the government fees -> SHA requirements, EEOC mandates, Social Security and Medicare, Family Medical Leave and many other workplace regulations. Added to worker costs that businesses incur are: Americans With Disabilities Act, Clean Air Act, Endangered Species Act and many other regulations . Suddenly, the Indian employee is the best way to go or else noone will buy there product because it will be way to expensive to compete. The consumers that do buy the product will be unable to purchase many "american made" products as they will alll be way overprice, thus leading to american employees demanding more wages and that leads to unemplyoment and higher product cost. Oops hey look were really in an endless spiral this time!
Lets say you want to protect American jobs.... what are you going to do? They are not our jobs, they are no America's jobs, they are the companies jobs and they can do what they want.
What do you want the government .. the president to do? Do you want some federal law that prohibits companies from transmitting information overseas by the Internet (I'm sure people at DSLreports would love that) , having that information transformed or modified, and then shipped back? And tell me just how do you enforce that law? Does that law then apply to you also if you seek information from a company that is located overseas, thus depriving a domestic company of your business? These companies aren't shipping parts overseas and completed products back. All they do is ship information overseas by phone lines or the Internet. | |
| | | | yabos
join:2003-02-16
Ingersoll, ON | Re: Those Damn Consumers There's a law that says you must hire a certain number of minority workers. Why don't they make a law that says you can't hire out more than X amount of work overseas? | |
| | | | | toasterhead1
Toasterhead
join:2002-07-01
Norcross, GA
clubs: | Re: Those Damn Consumers Because then the company moves its headquarters out of the U.S. so it is not under the laws of the U.S. and just exports its products to us. Even more unemployment. | |
| | | | | rockjock
join:2003-10-14
Salt Lake City, UT | Bah! You're misinformed, there is no such law. | |
| | | | | | yabos
join:2003-02-16
Ingersoll, ON | Re: Those Damn Consumers There is in Canada IIRC. | |
| | | | | | | rockjock
join:2003-10-14
Salt Lake City, UT | Re: Those Damn Consumers Sorry, I thought we were talking about American companies. My bad. | |
| | | | 
Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| People don't care how it's done they want "their" job at a "fair" salary, who cares that they'll be in the same boat when prices skyrocket. What most people fail to understand is that a particular job at a particular salary is not a right.
The fact of the matter is the economy is changing. People who are able to adapt and are willing to be flexible, will prosper; those who are of the mindset of lifetime employment at "fair" (read: astronomical) wages, will be the ones in the unemployment lines.
--
Japan-- Now with 30% more climbable telephone poles!! | |
| | | | namespace
join:2002-12-22
31337
| I think the answer is to tax exported labor and cut government funding to those who do export jobs. However, this will probably just cause companies to leave the U.S.
...and around and around we go...
Another idea is to be good americans and not support companies who export american jobs. But pay $39.95/mo instead of $29.95/mo for DSL? ... *shudders
Then again, I use speakeasy and don't shop at walmart so I don't have room to talk. | |
| | | | 
dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by toasterhead1  :
Not only does this lead to lower wait times for the customer, but it also lowers cost as the can afford more employees at a lower price.
Wait times arent really lower if you factor in how many calls it takes you to make before you get someone you can halfway comprehend.
--
You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
| | |
LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA
3 edits | Your analysis breaks down because of fallacy of composition: outsourcing does not affect all workers. Sure the ones who have lost their jobs are worse off (for the time being) and many here will cry them a river. But there are two overarching benefits to allowing eeevil companies to buy labor from the cheapest source.
First, the net effect is that prices are lower for everybody; in fact, you can take the surplus from gains to trade and directly compensate those who have lost their job and still come out on top.
Second, the unemployed workers are freed up to do more "useful" work. If congress had passed a law banning the automobile, not only would we be worse of for not having convenient transportation, many other industries would have a hard time finding workers because they are all still making buggy whips and horse shoes.
America may be at a disadvantage in terms of sheer number of workers, but we are at an exceptional advantage because of our technology and capital that we have working with labor—that's why our per capita output (GDP) is c. $36k when the rest of the world is lucky to make $10k (India's is $2.6k). Unfortunately, we have many forces here that make us uncompetitive, viz. tort laws, regulations, employment laws, our corporate taxes are the highest in the industrialized world (40%! can you imagine risking all but only getting to keep a little over ½ of what you make?) , not to mention a weak education system that scores relatively low compared to other countries. If we were to address these issues, we should have no problem competing with more populated countries.
[edit]
Another Williams article right on point.
[/edit]
--
"Lunches don't get free just because you don't see the prices on the menu. And economists don't get popular by reminding people of that." --Thomas Sowell | |
| | | | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: Those Damn Consumers I was getting pretty frustrated reading the responses to these articles. It's nice to read some rational thoughts at last.
I agree with Dr. Walter Williams to a point, but I do not believe that government intervention will help. Matter of fact, government intervention usually makes things worse.
As you have pointed out, government regulations, employment laws, corporate taxes rates are killing us more than cheap Indian workers. It's always easier to blame the foreigner then to look at yourself in the mirror.
The weak STATE FUNDED education system is just another way our invasive government is damaging our ability to thrive. Get the government out of education and just watch us improve that system without their so called help.
The following from Dr. Walter Williams....
quote:
Then there's the consumer side of things. Years ago there were loads of corner grocery and hardware stores. Because of selfish consumers, motivated only by getting something cheap and not caring about what happens to small businessmen and their employees, these stores are mostly gone. They've been replaced by huge, impersonal supermarket chains and super hardware stores like Home Depot and Lowes. Had my proposed law been on the books small grocery and hardware stores would not have gone the way of the dinosaur.
I run a small ISP. We do T1, Frame Relay, DSL, dial up, and some Co-location and Consulting. We are a very good ISP. We focus on having top notch non out-sourced customer support and very reliable service. We have almost no downtime and try to answer every call with a human during normal business hours. After hours we we can be paged and we will respond in under 20 minutes. Our base rate for our low end DSL service is $40.00 a month, Qwest and Verizon will add $18.00 to $37.00 additional dollars for the loop charge. That brings my DSL to somewhere between $58.00 and $77.00 for low end DSL. We have a small but very loyal client base who are happy to pay for the excellent service we provide. We are very efficient with our dollars and employee 4 people. Even with all that, we barely make a livable wage.
In spite of all that, most of the calls from new folks looking for service tell me my prices are way out of line and they will shop elsewhere. They will choose MSN, VOL or some other big name low cost ISP.
What is the point of all this? Primarily that people are hypocrites. They scream when they have to pay for service even when they have no clue on the cost of deployment. Then they reward big companies for being cheap by purchasing their products and services. Then they scream when those companies try and do the same thing they just did and go out and buy the cheapest service.
Even with all this, I do not want a law that requires people to buy my services, or a law that requires other big name ISP's to raise prices so that I can more easily compete.
Consumers are driving big business over seas, pure and simple. Tell me how many adds you hear today that say, "unlimited" or "cheap fairs" or "FREE". Nobody says "High Quality" or "Reliable" or "Worth the Extra Money". Why? Because nobody wants to pay for it, they always think they are smarter if they get it cheaper. | |
| | | | |
LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA
| Re: Those Damn Consumers said by sherpaboy :
I agree with Dr. Walter Williams to a point, but I do not believe that government intervention will help.
Well, Williams is merely trying to illustrate how absurd it is to think that government can write a law to fixed all these perceived ills. He would never seriously advocate government intervention as a means of attaining "fairness." To wit: Congressional Miracles.
Your story of your ISP operation reminds me of my landlord who bought the cheapest heat pump/AC possible and then complains that his energy bill went up. This is also the same guy who calls tech support for his cell phone just to have someone to talk to, so people like him are another reason why there is outsourcing—he is wasting resources.
--
"Lunches don't get free just because you don't see the prices on the menu. And economists don't get popular by reminding people of that." --Thomas Sowell | |
| | 
jason_k
@charter.com | Sounds like a professor I had in college, really a bunch of crap if you think about it. Better hope your job is not replaced by one of those billion. Why don't you comparative advantage yourselve out of here. | |
| | |
LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA | Re: Those Damn Consumers Sorry fella, gains to trade is an iron-clad law of economics. And as for comparative advantage, why don't we grow bananas in Minnesota? | |
| | davork
join:1999-08-21
Jersey City, NJ | here in Europe (where I am this week), they've outlawed the importation of *legal* *non-pirated* CD's and DVD's from Hong Kong
Sounds like Valentine's mob can't stand internal competition! | |
| djrobsd
join:2002-01-24
San Diego, CA
| overseas workers suck Well, I guess I won't be refinancing any of my auto loans with Eloan any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Such a shame too, because the last time I refinanced with them, they gave me such great service, and 100% of the time I was dealing with a US employee in California. Guess things have changed since I last did business with them.
NO MORE. | |
| | rockjock
join:2003-10-14
Salt Lake City, UT
1 edit | Re: overseas workers suck said by djrobsd :
Well, I guess I won't be refinancing any of my auto loans with Eloan any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Such a shame too, because the last time I refinanced with them, they gave me such great service, and 100% of the time I was dealing with a US employee in California. Guess things have changed since I last did business with them.
NO MORE.
I love these shameless hypocrites. Well, I guess you better not buy anymore designer clothing, or electronic products, or automobiles, or just about anything! Guess What!!! Over 90% of what you buy has a tag on it that says: Made in the [NOT USA]
There's nothing wrong with having a global economy. Do you even realize how many foreign corporations have operations in America that employ *GASP* American workers?? Get used to it and adjust or go get in line for your next unemployment check.
Cheers!  | |
| | |
See 10 replies to this post | |
| joebear29
join:2003-07-20
Alabaster, AL
| said by djrobsd :
Well, I guess I won't be refinancing any of my auto loans with Eloan any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Just out of curiosity, what is the make/model of your car? | |
|
ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Hollywood, FL
clubs:
·VOIPo
| No incentives??? I had to post again. I just read the article again and saw the following:
"Mr. Larsen said he was surprised that the company, based in Pleasanton, Calif., didn't have to offer a financial incentive to encourage customers to use the offshore processors."
Hmmm... No they did not have to offer an incentive. But they do turn the customer away from using a U.S. based rep by telling the customer up front that there may be a two day delay in their processing. I think tactics like this should be illegal. | |
| 
birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
 ·Verizon FIOS
| We feel your pain... From the WSJ article:
Wipro, which does the work for E-Loan, has been watching the furor from India. "We're very concerned about the angst that is there," says Sangita Singh, Wipro's chief marketing officer. "Our heart reaches out to the people getting affected with all the job losses."
The editors forgot to include the rest of the quote from Sangita Singh.
"But, there are winners, there are losers. We are glad to be on the winning side for a change." Singh continued, "Our hearts are jumping for joy. A dollar goes a lot further when everyone is hungry and willing to settle for less." | |
| 
martmann
join:2000-12-11
Federal Way, WA
| Maybe a delay, maybe not. Maybe there is a 2 day delay in processing, maybe there isn't. Maybe there is a delay, and there is a reason for it (like fewer US workers doing more per person), or maybe there is a 2 day delay, for no reason, strictly to encourage using the India option.
Seems like they're testing the water before jumping in, and the 2 day bait, has caught enough fish to convince them to jump. | |
| |
Steve
Pipe Wrench Fight
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Yorba Linda, CA
| Re: Maybe a delay, maybe not. said by martmann :
Maybe there is a 2 day delay in processing, maybe there isn't. Maybe there is a delay, and there is a reason for it (like fewer US workers doing more per person),
Or, a clever way, would be for E-Loan to fund both call centers at the same amount: since the Indian workers are so much less expensive, they can provide more staff to handle the requests in a more timely manner than their lesser-in-number U.S. counterparts.
Steve
--
Stephen J. Friedl * Security Consultant * Tustin, California USA * my web site | |
| Dodge
Premium
join:2002-11-27
clubs:
| This is complete and utter BS Many people will call e-loan last minute when their paymentsa are due or some other emergency. So of course these people are going to pick the faster option.
And on the brigher note E-Loan just made my personal shitlist, although I am starting to suspect that fairly soon I will not be able to do business with any american company:( | |
| | 
91439306
15,000 Watts of Bass Power
join:2002-10-16
New Milford, CT
| The Problem with a World Economy This competition between living standards/wages is direct across rich & poor nations now because of the global nature of the economy of today.
In the past, we had a separatist economy, where much of US goods were consumed in the US and very little was imported.
Now that we are finding labor pools outside the US, this raises the interesting spectre of whether Americans have enjoyed an artificially-high level of lifestyle, which is destined to be equalized with the rest of the world in short order, or whether a double-standard lifestyle can exist in the same economic system across rich & poor nations engaged in commerce.
One thing that seems to happen is a certain amount of job loss. Those people are left to look for other employment; whether they find it is yet another pathway in this increasingly-complex economic model.
One thing is for certain, that if the tax demands of government do not scale with the new 'world income parity', there are going to be a lot of economic implosions and a rise in tax delinquency as persons used to living on $20,000 a year or more might have to learn to live on $1500 a year in a global market in order to remain competitive. Now let's say the average homeowner lives in a basic starter home with an annual tax burden of $5000. On a salary of $20,000, this burden is manageable. But on a salary of $1500, under the global parity, clearly that family would have to move to government-subsidized housing.
While goods all around would fall in price, the cost of government, historically, has never fallen in price. So I wonder how the global market parity of base salaries is going to pan out in the mid to long run.
Curiously enough, my wife and I just refinanced our SUV with E-Loan. We save $67/month over what Ford Credit was offering. The transaction was handled over the internet and by phone, papers were signed, they picked up the UPS overnight costs to ship the papers back to them and in a few days we received verification from Ford that they were paid in full. I was skeptical of doing an online loan, but this company has made the process easy and saved us a significant amount of money by lowering our interest rate.
--
Take care,
Mark & Mary Ann Weiss
Hear my Kurzweil Creations at: »www.dv-clips.com/theater.htm
'»www.dv-clips.com
'»www.mwcomms.com
'»www.adventuresinanimemusic.com
| |
| | 
lakino
Premium
join:2003-04-03
Campbell, CA
| Re: The Problem with a World Economy said by 91439306 :
This competition between living standards/wages is direct across rich & poor nations now because of the global nature of the economy of today.
In the past, we had a separatist economy, where much of US goods were consumed in the US and very little was imported.
{rest snipped to save bandwidth}
This is a great post! Very reasonable and non-judgemental. I agree with you 100%. It's going to be very interesting to see how the US and perhaps Europe/Japan keep their governments afloat as the international price of labor falls dramatically in the future. The government can't directly outsource--although they can contract out work to third party service providers or contractors--and they can't lower wages of their workers, so how will the governmental workers' wages be affected in the future? As the labor wages of private industry of industrialized nations fall--and as the developing nations' labor wages rise--what will indeed happen to governmental workers' wages? That's a fascinating point which I've never given much thought to.
--
In an uncertain world, there is absolutely no security in banding together. -- Robert X. Cringely | |
| 
DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey
 ·Comcast
·Patriot Media
 ·Cingular Wireless
| When disaster strikes? The question on my mind, is if like say a Typhoon hit india, or some natural disaster, and communications where down for a significant time. Wouldnt this devastate them. At least in the US, we would be affected also, but the excuse, would sound like this.
"Do to weather conditions, eloan, dell , and netgear cant take your call", meanwhile watching the weather channel, there isnt a cloud in the sky.
--
Products unsupported in the USA, so far. Dell PC and Netgear | |
| | 
pcscdma
Chocobo Chocobo Random Battle
Premium
join:2004-01-14
Winterset, IA
clubs: | Re: When disaster strikes? Doesn't India have WMDs?
I thought they had a nuclear program going on?
--
The smarter computers get, the more faith I put into Newton's 3rd law. | |
| | | 
Vvian Kalyss
join:2003-10-14
Stage 5.0
clubs:
| Re: When disaster strikes? They do. They also have a (on-and-off hostile) neighbour who also has WMDs (Pakistan).
Small world isn't it 
--
" Lust will not keep, something must be done about it " | |
| scooby208
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
| Top positions go first For the people who defend outsourcing......lets see how you feel about it when it finally impacts you. If the primary objective of outsourcing it to cut cost then stockholders lets start with the top and highest paid positions of each corporation.... | |
| |
See 11 replies to this post | |
| | scooby208
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
2 edits | Re: Wired Magazine Wired article
www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.02/indi.. | |
| scooby208
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
1 edit | Wired article on outsourcing Is this type of change really good for America .......when eventualy all jobs will be impacted...The standard of living will be third world like.... As the article says there will be two classes of people....the very very rich and the very very poor......... America wake up before it's to late.
Wired article
»www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.02/india.html
Shirley Turner represents the 15th District in the New Jersey State Senate
"We can't stop globalization," Turner says. But outsourcing, especially now, amounts to "contributing to our own demise." When jobs go overseas, governments lose income tax revenue - and that makes it even harder to assist those who need a hand. Losing IT jobs has particularly frightful consequences. In a jittery world, "it's really foolish for us to become so dependent on any foreign country for those kinds of jobs," she says. What's more, she continues, it imperils the US middle class. "If we keep going in this direction, we'll have just two classes in our society - the very, very rich and the very, very poor. We're going to look like some of the countries we're outsourcing to."
Her solution is simple: America first. Support American firms. Put Americans back to work. And only then, after we reach full employment, will outsourcing be an acceptable option. "If we can't take care of our own first, we shouldn't be looking to take care of other people around the world," she says. "If you're a parent, you don't take care of everybody on the block before you make sure your own children have their basic needs met."
I want to protect America. I want to protect jobs for Americans."
"But isn't part of this country's vitality its ability to make these kinds of changes?" I counter. "We've done it before - going from farm to factory, from factory to knowledge work, and from knowledge work to whatever's next."
She looks at me. Then she says, "I'd like to know where you go from knowledge." | |
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