 
herdfan
Premium
join:2003-01-25
Hurricane, WV | What do you expect from McPaper? | |
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sycocowz
join:2002-06-13
Ottsville, PA | Re: What do you expect from ha yeah, they have USA today at my local McD | |
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bpx
join:2003-01-25
Saint Augustine, FL
 ·Comcast
| yeah, i never read that paper anyways, its all old news when it comes out, just like this article. regular readers of this website already knew that we are not on top of the broadband users list. who the heck cares anyways??!! pretty sad they didnt have any other news than that!!
USA TODAY = crap DSL REPORTS = DA SHIZNIT
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Nice guys finish last. | |
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aj0439
join:2003-12-09
Arcadia, CA | they have 45DL for Japan now!! | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
edit:
January 19th, @04:48PM
| Celebrate the freedom of choice If people en mass demanded it, companies would deploy it. But unlike some countries, people here have alternate ways of communicating cheaply and obtaining news and in a lot of countries the government aids in deployment rather than being an over-regulating, over-taxing burden on business.
Sure there are some isolated areas here that don't have broadband but the same could be said for any nation with large rural populations, but that is a small cry from the minority of have it available but don't get it 'cause they don't want it. Squeeze us all into major cities, get the gov't off the backs of business and we would have 100% deployment too.
But as I see it, for the most part those who want it can get it should they choose to. They just ain't choosing to. | |
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2kmaro
Think
Premium,ExMod 1 BC
join:2000-07-11
ColossalCave
clubs:  
| said by GNXPower  :
If people en mass demanded it, companies would deploy it.
And that is part of the "capitalism" equation - of course, industry has been known to hype a product to increase demand.
Look at the countries that are ahead of the U.S. - each one has had huge support from the government, overcoming hurdles such as funding, regulation and compatibility of equipment. Most have built on existing technology (DSL, Cable) that was pretty much pounded out and proven here in the U.S.
I offer that up as "reasons" for our 11th place, as opposed to being an excuse for it. But there is little doubt in my mind that the combination here in the U.S. of regulations, private ownership and funding, and continued R&D into alternative broadband delivery technologies has all combined to slow the spread of available technology.
We need to also keep in mind where the focus of the news article was at: "broadband in relation to business". It was speaking of broadband as a necessary tool for business growth, not pointed at the individual residential accounts at all as a "necessary utility". Looked at from that viewpoint I definitely agree it is a "utility". I look at prospective government contract work on a daily basis and I do it on broadband. I can review potential work offerings about as fast as I can read (at a pretty good clip) - goodness only knows how long it would take me each day to go through those things on dial-up! I'm talking taking a look at 100+ page Word files, not some quick blurb sent to me via email, although it is a broadband delivered email that alerts me to new offerings. In this arena, my competitor on dial-up is definitely on crutches in the race for finding new business.
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Good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgment. Barry LePatner | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
edit:
January 19th, @09:17PM
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice A company's decision to remain on dial up is more often than not a "choice" as a source of broadband is present in the vast majority of markets.
Even fractional T-1 isn't cost prohibitive to business, even small business who have such a need for a quicker connection. Especially in SoCal...as far as COB go, broadband, even fractional T-1 priced broadband is near the bottom of the list.
It's consumer (residential and business) choice that has us 11th. It seems to me Americans simply don't have the need for speed. For communictations and entertainment, we (both residential and business) have so many choices that HSI loses priority, even at $26.95 price points.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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| | | 
ya
@adelphia.net
 from:
dadkins
PliotronX
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice It's consumer (residential and business) choice that has us 11th. It seems to me Americans simply don't have the need for speed.
Oh, we have the need for speed. But when some actually use it, they get hit with invisible caps. | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice With who Comcast...Cox...who else. Not SBC, not Verizon, not a vast majority of providers. Sure, while their TOS may leave the door open, few providers are actually enforcing download limits.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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| | | | lesopp
join:2001-06-27
Land O Lakes, FL | Eleven reasons for eleventh place.
1 FCC
2 Verizon
3 SBC
4 Bell South
5 Qwest
6 Time Warner
7 Cox
8 Charter
9 Comcast
10 Cablevision
11 Adelphia | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
edit:
January 20th, @11:56AM
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice nm | |
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rog
Premium
join:2002-07-03
BC | Can be all summed up in one word...greed. | |
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| | | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice Almost all humans (and all animals) are greedy, it's not a bad thing. Greed is what got us out of caves and into homes. Greed is what helps you and I have some of the highest standards of living in the world. Greed is why our ancestors are here in North America. Greed is deeply rooted in the creation of the Internet. Did you think it was designed and built out of altruism?
Which one of us does not want more than we have? If you were making $75,000.00 a year and the boss offered you a $25,000.00 raise would you say, "No thanks, $75,000.00 a year is plenty, I'll pass". | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
| Since when is wanting to be successful or better themselves greedy? I guess we'll call you greedy the next time you ask your boss for a raise. No one is holding a gun to anyone's head forcing them to buy broadband.
Who is to say that those who want more speed for the same or less money aren't greedy.
So-called greed goes both ways then.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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rog
Premium
join:2002-07-03
BC
·Shaw
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice said by GNXPower :
Since when is wanting to be successful or better themselves greedy? I guess we'll call you greedy the next time you ask your boss for a raise. No one is holding a gun to anyone's head forcing them to buy broadband.
Normal needs and wants only become greed when they reach the magnitde where they start getting in the way of (in this case) progress. | |
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| | | | | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice Greed? Like when consumers demand Unlimited 3MB over fiber to their home but only want to pay $25.00 a month for it.
Most BB users would be just fine with 384kbps (over Cable or DSL), but they always say they are getting ripped off if they have to pay $60.00.
I've never understood why people think that $15.00 to $20.00 for dial up service is ok, but 10 faster for digital service for only 3 times the price is a rip off. | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice said by sherpaboy :
I've never understood why people think that $15.00 to $20.00 for dial up service is ok, but 10 faster for digital service for only 3 times the price is a rip off.
The answer to that is simple...consumers are GREEDY!
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Wow! I really expected to hear the typical "We Suck" or "We need more Government intervention to fix the problem", or "Kill the telcos".
Thanks for posting a rational comment.
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| Koto
join:2001-06-03
Chico, CA
| Chico, CA. We must be behind the others. I have a few clients that would love to have BroadBand. SBC has yet to respond to their plea otherwise than "call us back in a couple of months". A "couple of months" started about a year ago. Not everyone that wants it gets it. However, we are just a population of 100,000 in the greater area. | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: Celebrate the freedom of choice said by Koto :
Chico, CA. We must be behind the others. I have a few clients that would love to have BroadBand. SBC has yet to respond to their plea otherwise than "call us back in a couple of months". A "couple of months" started about a year ago. Not everyone that wants it gets it. However, we are just a population of 100,000 in the greater area.
They can't get a fractional T-1? Sure it's not $27/mo, but it's still affordable by business standards and has superior reliability and superior availablility for business.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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FLECOM
Bay Networks Freak
Premium
join:2003-03-03
Miami, FL
| Anyone Suprised? quote:
because Industry wants us to be
no! lies! big business is always does what is in the interest of the consumer!!! anyone who sais anything else is telling lies!!!
and in the real world we are all at the mercy of evil companies that feel that 1.5/256 is worth $50 a month...
if it wasnt for other companies deploying DSL the bells would have never done it, i mean why? why would they sell you 1.5mbits of bandwith for $50 a month when they can twist your nipples and make you pay like $600 for a T1? back in the day you didnt have a choice
which is why im not suprised that USAToday has "discovered" that broadband sucks here in the US | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
edit:
January 19th, @04:51PM
| Re: Anyone Suprised? said by FLECOM :
and in the real world we are all at the mercy of evil companies that feel that 1.5/256 is worth $50 a month...
$50 a month? Who charges that any more? Not even Comcrap tops $50 a month any more. Look at SBC, $27/mo, Verizon $30-$35...hardly a bad deal and the workings of evil anti-consumer organizations. I wish all ISP's were so evil.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: Anyone Suprised? I forgot about that...and it sucks. Wonder where my bundling discount was...I was paying the same $43 before and after the advent of these so called discounts.
Penalties is more like it. Anti-DBS penalties.
Glad I ditchen them for DSL...30% cheaper for similar speed.
But my point was, speeds here are getting faster and prices cheaper. Comcrap was definately a bad example. My bad. It just seems to me that people for the most part can get broadband, they simply don't want it, at any price.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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| | TACSPEED
Premium
join:2001-04-14
Tacoma, WA
·Advanced Stream
| quote:
$50 a month? Who charges that any more
How about Qwest with MSN, $44.95 plus an additional 10 bucks a month for their bloated phone package. Net charge, 10 bucks plus 44.95 for a grand total of 54.95 per month.
This does not include the fact that you have to have Qwest's basic phone service at about 13 bucks a month plus fees and taxes to even get DSL!!!
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Fiber Optics is the future of high-speed internet access. Stop by the BBR Fiber Optic Forum. | |
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GNXPower
Got Boost?
Premium
join:2003-12-18
Huntington Beach, CA
edit:
January 19th, @05:38PM
| Re: Anyone Suprised? What else you want to add on there? How about the electric bill. The VAST majority of people already have POTS and as you state, even the bloated Qwest with MSN isn't more than $50.
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Mac Truth »members.cox.net/clyqz/macs.html | |
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| | | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA |
Who put those taxes and fees on the qwest phone bill? | |
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kfkfkf
@cmc.net | $44.95? I'm paying $21.99/month for their Choice DSL package (256Kbps/256Kbps). And no, this isn't an intro/special rate. | |
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| | | | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: Anyone Suprised? The $21.95 is actually the DSL only (often referred to as "the loop"), no ISP included. The price for Choice has actually dropped to $15.00, but you still need to get an ISP. The cheapest I have seen here in Seattle is about $18.00, which would bring your total to $33.00. Then there is the modem rental for $3.00 a month which brings you to $36.00.
Cheers.
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| | Saradin
join:2003-05-03
| »www.patmedia.net/patriot/HSD_Packages.html
Well, the service is 1500/512, but still 45$ bundled with cable TV, 55$ without
Course, this is the same company that took over RCN's cable holdings in central Jersey, hiked up price by a few bucks, and lowered upload cap from 800 to 512 (or from 800 to 128 to 512 rather) | |
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| | BunnYwood
Premium
join:2002-06-19
Sioux City, IA
| Try CableOne.net
They don't even offer 1.5 down. DSL just recently became available and I certainly don't consider where I live the sticks. | |
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| | clucas001
join:2003-11-11
Mechanicsville, MD | I can only get cable Internet through GMP. Since I don't have cable TV, 512k/256k cable Internet would cost me $80/month. Under $50 and I'd be hooked! | |
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| | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| If you are in Verizon Territory you can't get it for $50.00 unless you use VOL. If you hate VOL, Verizon will charge you $37.50 just for the privilege of connecting to the ISP of your choice. To stay at the $50.00 price point an ISP would have to sell the Internet Service for only $12.50. There are plenty of ISP's selling $55.00 and above service here in Washington due to Verizon's loop charge. They are surviving because they deliver superior customer service compared to VOL.
Next to MSN, VOL is the Worst ISP in Western Washington. They are losing money at their current $40.00 price point, and a vain attempt to drive the independents out of business. When it comes to price be careful what you wish for, there is a downside to cheap.
That being said, they can charge what ever they want. We are under no obligation to buy. | |
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LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA
| why would they not stick with $600 for T-1? Simple, lower price=higer demand. Why does Costco do good business? To say that the eeevil company doesn't want to have cheaper goods is just nuts. Market segmentation (which is what different prices are) ensures that the eeevil company can get even more customers.
Go back to the drawing board on your eeevil corporate plot.
--
"Lunches don't get free just because you don't see the prices on the menu. And economists don't get popular by reminding people of that." --Thomas Sowell | |
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| moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| said by FLECOM :
quote:
because Industry wants us to be
no! lies! big business is always does what is in the interest of the consumer!!! anyone who sais anything else is telling lies!!!
and in the real world we are all at the mercy of evil companies that feel that 1.5/256 is worth $50 a month...
if it wasnt for other companies deploying DSL the bells would have never done it, i mean why? why would they sell you 1.5mbits of bandwith for $50 a month when they can twist your nipples and make you pay like $600 for a T1? back in the day you didnt have a choice
which is why im not suprised that USAToday has "discovered" that broadband sucks here in the US
How many people here would pay $600/month for a T1? Not many.
How mnay would pay $50/month for broadband? A lot more.
It is all about selling something for the highest amount of profit. In this case, volume over straight profit. Look at no haggle pricing at car dealerships. They make less money per vehicle BUT have more volume. Finding the balance between volume and profit is the tricky part. | |
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LegoPower77
Abecedarian
Premium
join:2002-08-03
Arlington, VA
| Re: Anyone Suprised? said by moonpuppy :
Finding the balance between volume and profit is the tricky part.
Yeah, that's what they hire me for
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"Lunches don't get free just because you don't see the prices on the menu. And economists don't get popular by reminding people of that." --Thomas Sowell | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA | If you could work for $50.00 an hour, why would you work for $10.00?
....just curious. | |
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scr33d
@mindspring.co
from:
PliotronX
| In other news: Sky blue, water wet Sheesh! Tragically all the rungs of that ladder (telecomm, FCC, Congress) are fat and happy with the status quo and the bottom rung (us) has no place voice our... um, displeasure.
And to those that say, "I've got 3Mbps for a good price..." well remember there are other countries getting 15, 40 or 100 Mbps for similar rates.
Scr33d's Quick Capsule review: US Telecomm sucks! | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA
| Re: In other news: Sky blue, water wet Yes, the other folks are living in apartments the size of my bathroom, sharing 100MB government funded ethernet with their neighbors. Sorry, I'll take my nice house and garden (that I own) and suffer with 128kbps ISDN.
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LordBritish
join:2003-08-02
Marina Del Rey, CA
edit:
January 19th, @04:58PM
| $50 at lot, how about $90 !! I pay $94/month (including taxes) for 1500/768 ADSL service from Speakeasy.net.
Yep, it is too much even with real static IPs - I do NOT use PPoE at all. | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA | Re: $50 at lot, how about $90 !! WOW! Is that unlimited? I wouldn't sell that service for much less then $200.00 month (including the loop charge) here in Seattle. But then again, you are stuck with Speakeasy. That much be why you got the good deal. | |
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garagerock
Premium
join:2002-06-14
Louisville, KY
·Insight Communicat..
| Well, I'm waiting... For the folks who'll point out the glaringly obvious...South Korea is smaller, has much more population density, etc.
To which I say-HORSESHIT. So what? We can on about going back to the moon, again, and to Mars...billions of dollars later, and we're in 11th place. So much for being the best at everything.
Only when broadband is considered a utility will we ever get past this nonsensical, last-mile intensive Who-hash.
And before the flaming starts with "it's a luxury!", isn't telephone, electricity, WATER service all luxuries? Go somewhere outside of your cul de sac (like Central America, for instance) and you'll see what I mean. | |
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See 12 replies to this post |
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Spore Cloud
I H8 Computers
join:2001-09-09
Burleson, TX
| AOL to blame? I wonder, if AOL never came into excistance, if there would be more broadband users.. Just think about all the people on AOL for a second, if these people had started with some sort of local dial-up ISP I think they would understand more about what broadband has to offer them instead by being out there on the public internet instead of being spoon fed what AOL shows the average AOL consumer. | |
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| | sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA | nct I'm having too much fun now!
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AuroraJock
join:2003-04-02
Chicago, IL
| USA today also reported... that South Korea was costing the US motion picture agency millions per year in lost revenue.
»www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techp···cy_x.htm
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see a correlation between excessive bandwidth at cheap prices and high piracy rates among users. There are 2 sides to every coin - as the internet gets faster, people use it more. Online shopping gets more convenient, and brick and mortar stores suffer.
Every fiber advocates dream seems to be having a 100megabit fiber pipe to the home for $15 so they don't ever have to get out of bed anymore... | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: USA today also reported... said by AuroraJock :
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see a correlation between excessive bandwidth at cheap prices and high piracy rates among users.
Shows you right there that if the *AA's wanted to they could deploy decent services if we had the infrastructure to support it.
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
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tigers
join:2001-01-14
Irmo, SC | Another of these articles? The sky is falling.
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6 November | |
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jdir
join:2001-05-04
Santa Clara, CA | And I can not get broadband Ugh - too far to get DSL | |
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tidal
Tidal
Premium
join:2001-01-18
Madison, AL | Re: And I can not get broadband i'm not surprised we're behind | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA | Yes you can.
You can get Satellite or Frame Relay.
You cannot get Cheap broadband. | |
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bonnyman
join:2003-04-16
Rome, GA | But none of these other countries is building ... ... their own moon base! | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Re: But none of these other countries is building ... Or almost single-handedly funding, occupying and attempting to re-shape a middle-eastern country I suppose. | |
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| jdir
join:2001-05-04
Santa Clara, CA | We don't have a moon-base yet. Congress still need to vote on it, beside, Pres Bush only giving NASA another $1 billions over 5 years for that project compare that to $100 or so Billions stuck in Iraq | |
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WillHaeck
join:2002-01-20
Monroe, WA
| Profitability As said before, its all about money. If it was profitable for any of the companies to give every person in the country BB it would be done, the fact is its only profitable to put it in the cities and towns, the places with the highest population density. Something like 90% of our people live in like 30% of the land, so everyone in the other 70% of the land get shafted with everything. That's how it was that's how it is that's how it will be. I live 1 mile out of my town and even that's to far for Verizon or Comcast to provide service. | |
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| jdir
join:2001-05-04
Santa Clara, CA | Re: Profitability My area is really dense - it's a big apt complex with over 200 or 300 apartments. So where's my DSL? | |
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Mr Peabody
join:2001-01-05
Ingleside, IL
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| It will not be profitable to the telecoms until the public demand goes up. Everyone here at BBR is more or less a techie, and we all LOVE our broadband, obviously. But the average person I know couldn't give a rat's a*@ about the speed of their connection. I know maybe 35 close friends and family, and every single one of them has a computer that is online. Of those, three have DSL, three want it but can't, and the other 29 are chugging along on dialup, absolutely, positively content with 56k.
I have actually tried to get some of the dialup holdouts onto the SBC/Yahoo DSL that's available around here, but they think it's crazy to pay even $5 more a month for 768k when they're perfectly happy with the internet as they've seen it.
Unfortunately, I find it almost impossible to describe to someone what exactly they're missing on dialup. It's not until they spend a few days at my house on the 1.5/384 that they begin to realize that using dialup is like beating yourself in the head with a hammer because it feels good when you stop. They start to understand that it's not only speed you get, but the sheer convenience of an always-on connection. It's something most people really need to experience to comprehend.
Sadly, many people get all the information they want from the local and national papers, and the 'warm, glowing, warming glow' of the horrible, omnipresent television and its 200+ channels of mind-numbing garbage. They are either too stupid or just don't care about the multitude of alternative information sources available online.
Just my 2 cents.
Todd | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| 2....... Two words.
1- Corporate
2- Greed
add 1+2 and you get the reason why we're(the usa) behind. while others are enjoying 26mbps dsl for equivelent of $30USD or 100mbit fibre for the equivelent of $22USD. We're being told 1.5mbps is enough.
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
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| sherpaboy
join:2001-07-06
Seattle, WA | Re: 2....... quote:
You can never be too rich, or to thin or have to much broadband
I guess it's bad for Corporations to be Greedy, but not the individual? | |
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koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA
| Unfair comparisons. What I want to know is why broadband addicts continually compare North America (that means the US AND Canada, for those wondering exactly what I'm referring) to South Korea, Japan, New Zealand, and other geographically small regions.
North America (as a region) is *huge*. Our population is outrageous, and our political segregation (plus the ongoing deregulation movement) makes it literally impossible to agree upon anything. Am I the only one who sees this? I hope not. I cannot imagine trying to deploy something nation-wide in this region -- it must be |
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USA: Broadband Losers?
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