Scared of SpywareSome solutions fall short ( old news - 11:25AM Tuesday Jan 06 2004) tags: legal · business · privacyTipped by Karl Bode  Many larger companies haven't been willing to stand up to spyware, out of fear of alienating marketers, creating new support headaches, or because of legal concerns. Some ISP's are now offering technology that identifies, but won't remove, the pesky applications. Both AOL and Earthlink have announced they're planning to increasingly integrate anti-spyware technology. But how effective can companies and ISP's be if they're afraid of the marketing industry? "This is the biggest undiagnosed problem on the Internet," says EarthLink spokesman Jerry Grasso to the Washington Post. AOL says they'll be incorporating software that will run once a week to eliminate and remove nosy applications, and Earthlink has been offering their own protection since October. Earthlink now plans to expand those offerings with "Spyware Audit", a new anti-spyware application that should be available via the company website within weeks. Oddly, according to the Post, Earthlink's Audit software will only inform you that you've got spyware on your system. It won't actually remove it for you. For that, users will need to turn to more common anti-spyware applications such as Spybot-Search and Destroy or Lavasoft's Ad-aware. Earthlink is likely concerned of potential software problems caused by removing spyware, or perhaps of running afoul of the increasingly defensive spyware/adware industry. Gator corporation recently filed a libel suit against the PCPitstop website simply for calling their Gator wallet software 'spyware'. The gator software is bundled with numerous applications, and pitched as a useful service (a fairly feeble claim). In reality its primary purpose is to track users shopping habits, provide them with customized advertisements for products, then kick back fees to the Gator corp. when purchased. The suit was eventually settled, and PCPitstop relaunched a more comprehensive " Gator Information Center". The new website now offers more information on the application than before; it simply avoids the "spyware" label. Still, companies are hesitant to cross the line against these "legit" marketers, fearing legal retribution. They're also concerned that by "fixing" many of the problems, they'll be responsible for repairing applications that may have depended on the spyware to operate - resulting in a technical support nightmare. That's part of the reason Dell recently announced their support technicians would not support the removal of spyware from an infected system, nor direct users to the proper applications to do so; even if it was obvious that spyware was responsible for system instability. The decision was well discussed in our Security forum, and many members of the security and anti-spyware industry sent a letter criticizing Dell for the decision. Dell's response to the criticism (posted to their support forum) was to eventually begin selling an anti-spyware application known as Pest Patrol. Their support technicians were told to refer all inquiries about spyware to the user's ISP (check out this blog halfway down). With ISP's and other companies afraid of retribution from the marketing industries, are we destined for half-hearted solutions to increasingly irritating problems? Should it be their responsibility to resolve these issues to begin with? Related:- Congress 'Grills' NebuAD CEO
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  DHRacer Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10 Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Charter Pipeline
| Just the tip of the iceberg... How about some proactive education to these users of AOL and Dell, who typically (note qualifier) don't know enough to protect themselves in the first place.
If these companies installed the software as part of the computer purchase (Dell), where it ran in the background and prevented spyware in the first place, it would be less hassle down the road. Or for AOL, who knows that users will click on anything (Earthlink users, too, considering the official looking email attacks these days on both company's users).
This playing catch-up will never work. Yes it may decrease the problems slightly, but not as much as being up front about it initially. Maybe letting the user decide, if they are properly informed and educated enough to make a choice when the software is initially set up or the computer is setup.
Like Microsoft, it will not do anything until it gets bad press, then it moves. They are, after all, in business to make money, not spend it when it doesn't need to be (in their opinions). -- The three most dangerous things are a programmer with a soldering iron, a manager who codes, and a user who gets ideas. | |
|  |   garagerock Premium join:2002-06-14 Louisville, KY
·Insight Communicat..
| Re: Just the tip of the iceberg... quote: and Dell
Uh, yeah. With the right removal tools, Spyware is just an annoyance. I've got 50 Dells running nicely without any Spyware, thank you very much. Don't paint everyone with that broad brush... | |
|  |  |   DHRacer Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10 Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Just the tip of the iceberg... I was referring more to home users, not business users since business users are more aware of the dangers...
I have 350 Dells and 3,000 users (high school) and I've had to resort to including Adaware and Spybot as part of my images, so it can be one of the first things I run to troubleshoot system problems.
Spyware is a major annoyance when you have a couple thousand kids trying to download anything and everything (and yes we do filter and block but there are ways around that).
Didn't mean to hit you with that brush, I think you missed my intended meaning. I wasn't clear about which demographics I had in mind when I wrote it. Sorry. -- The three most dangerous things are a programmer with a soldering iron, a manager who codes, and a user who gets ideas. | |
|  |  |  |   elboricua El Subestimado Premium join:2001-08-12 Bronx, NY
| Re: Just the tip of the iceberg... said by DHRacer : I was referring more to home users, not business users since business users are more aware of the dangers...
As an IT professional for more than 7 years, I have to disagree with you on that one. Business users are not more aware of the dangers. What they do have over the home user is an IT staff that tries to secure the network from spyware, and a helpdesk/technical support staff to clean the machine if it should get infected. -- Sending script kiddies to /dev/null since 1995! | |
|  |  |  |  |   DHRacer Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10 Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Just the tip of the iceberg... I would have thought that businesses would have their employees sign an internet/computer usage agreement that tells them they are not to install other software or download programs from the internet...
We do that here for all the kids (but they ignore it and we can't expel the entire student body) and we also make sure teachers are aware of the facts to help keep the kids from doing it as well as themselves.
But of course we still get teachers who ask if Kazaa would be ok on their computer...
You are obviously the more professional person than I , so despite my explanation of my position, you are probably more correct. I understand your logic and I accept it. -- The three most dangerous things are a programmer with a soldering iron, a manager who codes, and a user who gets ideas. | |
|  |  |  |   garagerock Premium join:2002-06-14 Louisville, KY
·Insight Communicat..
| No need for apology; upon reflection, I did misunderstand.
As an IT professional for 10 years, I'd have to agree with elboricua that business users are less inclined to care about what ends up on their machines, as they have said IT staff to fix it!
Again, I misinterpreted your post. Sorry. | |
|  |  |  |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: Just the tip of the iceberg... said by garagerock : No need for apology; upon reflection, I did misunderstand.
As an IT professional for 10 years, I'd have to agree with elboricua that business users are less inclined to care about what ends up on their machines, as they have said IT staff to fix it!
Again, I misinterpreted your post. Sorry.
Hehe and the way they going all of them will be doing it remotely from india via there nice fat shiny 56k modems. -- This package does not contain a winner... | |
|  |  jeffbrantley
join:2000-03-24 Ballwin, MO
| But the real problem is the spyware creators, not the computer and OS manufacturers. Yes, someone bigger than spybot or adaware should step up to the plate and make a bigger dent in a quickly growing problem, but it is not their responsibility to prevent people from installing things unexpectedly.
When you make it their responsibility you get mostly unusable software out of the box. Where on previous versions you had to turn ON security features, they're now all coming screwed as tightly as possible because of MS trying to please the less savvy masses. I think some of that is good, but it can be a pain to a savvy user such as myself when I have to reconfigure a computer's security (still all in the same convoluted places) just to use it.
I liken this to the US Government trying to keep terrorists from blowing up another building. Yes, they should protect the citizens of the US, but how far are you willing to let them go to do that? There is only so much room you can give them to act before it starts negatively affecting your lifestyle. Not all government officials want to strangle freedom, but it sure would make their lives easier. The same reasoning that lead MS to lock down XP by default would be akin to US locking its borders, processing ALL people who try to legally enter the country, and imprisoning (or shooting) those who try to enter illegally. While that may effectively squelch terrorists from doing major damage, the fear of terrorist strike would slowly be replaced by a fear of being labeled a terrorist in your own country.
I think AOL, Dell and many other companies try very hard to be proactive on educating people about what they should watch out for. However, with fears of litigation and the amount of computer novices still out there, even a big company like Microsoft can't effectively change the situation overnight.
When I originally installed one of the early versions of Kazaa, I had no idea from reading the EULA and installation pages that I was installing some other crap. They've gotten better with their install package, but I think they and other companies that "give" away software try desparately to hide other programs, whether spyware or not, and it's difficult for even advanced users to know what's being installed. I've recently found that even some mainstream sites are exploiting the Microsoft JVM bug to get there "browser helper" objects installed.
On my personal computer, I no longer even attempt to keep information on their that I would consider painful to lose. And as a result, a couple of times that I've had to completely start over from the restore CD, other than a little time lost, I haven't had any pain. This isn't the case for a lot of people, though.
In short, there is more to it than just getting it done. | |
|  |  dannysdailys
join:2000-09-29 Lockport, NY
| "it would be less hassle down the road. Or for AOL, who knows that users will click on anything (Earthlink users, too, considering the official looking email attacks these days on both company's users)."
Isn't it time to stop talking this nonsense? It's totally unproductive and I have seen some of these sites. They're very easy to fall for. They even fake the URL now. Even Pay Pal, with security second to none has been affected with this. AOL has matured and so have it's users. Obviously you haven't seen a copy of AOL 9. Far from simple, it's probably one of the most complex pieces of ISP software I've ever seen, and I've seen a lot. You can spend days just setting it up. And AOL9 is not unique, see my article on AOL8+ for broadband. »www.dannysdailys.com/tips/dan41.html
Quite the contrary, I find offices to be the largest harborers of spyware and virus's anywhere. People that work in offices don't worry near as much about security at work, as they do at home. They have "staff" to fix it. Small companies that don't have unlimited resources to spend on staff, really get caught in the cross hairs. They don't even understand the issues, let alone the solutions and that has nothing to do with AOL. sheesh...
Anyone who surfs the net, I mean really surfs the net! Knows how easy it is to catch malware these days. It's everywhere. I applaud AOL for going after it. They, at least, want to take care of their people. The anti virus system they set up is second to none. They took a lot of heat over shutting down Microsoft's Windows Messenger, in these very forums. Now Microsoft has followed suit. It's pretty bad when it takes AOL to get Microsoft to act.
Never forget, not one AOL user's computer has ever automatically sent a virus infected email. No one else can say that. AOL, it seems, has become a haven for security. That's nothing to laugh or scoff at.
The Internet has become a very dark place. We should applaud any and everyone who fights these battles. Go AOL! Who knows, others shamed, the way Microsoft was, may just follow suit.
I hope so, AOL can't do it alone... -- Madness Takes Its Toll, Please Have Exact ChangeDan DailyOwner/Webmasterhttp://www.dannysdailys.com | |
|   elboricua El Subestimado Premium join:2001-08-12 Bronx, NY
| It is the Users Responsibility
Not the Manufacturer or ISP. It is the user that chose to install kazaa or whatever freeware program is out there. Not the ISP. If Dell were installing apps that included spyware then it would be their responsibility to support its removal. This is passing the buck. It is the user who was dumb enough to click on a link in a junk email. It is the user who chose to insall xyz. With websites all over the place dedicated to security, even Microsoft has a site touting how to protect your PC from worms and virii, users have no excuse. -- Sending script kiddies to /dev/null since 1995! | |
|  |   C4
@nuria.telefonica
| Re: It is the Users Responsibility Completamente de acuerdo. Si dejamos que los ISP nos digan que cosa es o no es SPAM/P0RN/BUENO/MALO para nuestra navegacion, acabaremos teniendo una internet con programas (malos) de television.
Que los ISP no nos molesten, que ya nos encargaremos nosotros de bloquear lo que NO necesitemos.
Saludos desde Espa~a. Y feliz 2004! | |
|  |   sherman10594
join:2000-10-15 Thornwood, NY
·Verizon FIOS
| I agree, it is the responsibility of the user to audit there own activity. In reality, however, this is easier said than done. Manufacturers and ISP's are taking the heat for these problems because customers bitch when their computer don't work. When someone has installed New.net (DNS hijacker / new DNS top level domains), they usually first call Dell and bitch they can't get on the 'net. Dell will spend 10 minutes showing them the computer is OK for everything else, and pass the buck onto the ISP. The ISP then gets the grief, because the customer says these problems didn't start happening until they started using the ISP's service.
So, at the end of the day, the customer believes the Dell machine and ISP are crap. And next time, they will avoid these companies at all costs. Manufacturers and ISP's recognize that spyware/adware/crapware is costing them their reputations, even though it's not even remotely their fault.
These companies are not really "scared" of spyware, they want to kill it as much as we do. The problem is that in the United States distributing information that can clean up bullsh!t is sometimes illegal. What a country...
- Sherman | |
|  |  |  bigbearr
join:2003-11-16 Saint Louis, MO | Re: It is the Users Responsibility can we say nail on head?
hehe, exactly what is going on. | |
|  |  |  |  |  George Kidd
join:2001-08-09 Vancouver, BC
| Another Method I am involved with an Educational Institution as well. What we do for "Student" machines in our labs is to Reimage the contents overnight. That can be driven automatically from a Server. So at the End of the Day any student additions are just Gone....Cheers. | |
|  |   ChrisDAT Google Keyword Compsysnyc
join:2002-02-26 Hollis, NY | Re: Another Method Isn't "flashing" a whole PC over the wire just plain fun Long live the Ghost !!!! | |
|  |  |   DHRacer Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10 Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Verizon west (ex G..
·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Another Method There's another nice little program called Deep Freeze. You set up the computer the way you want it, install & configure deep freeze, and then you image it, and you're done.
If anyone makes any changes to the system (deletes files, adds unapproved applications, etc.), a simple reboot restores the system to it's original setup that you did.
Fantastic! Kids can screw with the computers all they want. Next reboot and all their damage is gone.
At least that's what its supposed to do. We are going to get it and try it out, but it sounds good on paper. -- The three most dangerous things are a programmer with a soldering iron, a manager who codes, and a user who gets ideas. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  hivemind1
join:2002-02-19 Rome, NY | Re: Another Method No, but for institutional use it does a fine job at what it's supposed to. Hell, it's a lifesaver AND a timesaver here at a Community College with 1000 machines and 5000 lusers. | |
|   ChrisDAT Google Keyword Compsysnyc
join:2002-02-26 Hollis, NY
| This is Serious... The implications here are much more insidious than simply spam that clogs up your email inbox...
Many sites enter into an agreement with spyware distributors and hijackers for financial reasons, what happens unfortunately, by you, the user entering into a membership agreement with the site, you also unwittingly opt-in to their advertisers' "schemes." This in turn allows them to send monitoring software to your machine for marketing puropses.
As an example, when you sign up for DSLR, you cannot tell the site that you do not want to see the ads that grace every page, thus you/we have opted-into the ad stream that DSLR promotes... There's nothing inherently bad about this, and I'd rather get targeted ads, than non-targeted ones.
If you really dont't want to see the ads, you have to take it upon yourself to prevent that access... or otherwise prevent your specific information from reaching the advertisers (see above)....
It's the behavior of some that compromise your computer with their virus-like behavior that's almost criminal. | |
|  |  dave Premium,MVM join:2000-05-04 not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: This is Serious... said by ChrisDAT : As an example, when you sign up for DSLR, you cannot tell the site that you do not want to see the ads that grace every page, thus you/we have opted-into the ad stream that DSLR promotes...
Sure you can. Become a premium member.
The 'pay or see ads' solution seems like a fair enough approach to me. It's the same one that's used elsewhere: I donate to public radio so I don't have to listen to advert-laden radio stations, I pay for HBO so I don't have to watch adverts every few minutes, ... | |
|  |  |   ChrisDAT Google Keyword Compsysnyc
join:2002-02-26 Hollis, NY
| Re: This is Serious... It's true dave, it is fair game for the web, but spam, adware, parasites, are unsolicited... DSLR would not be very happy and probably quite poor, if all of their (non paying) clients did not return because of ads.
What's particularly bad about spyware is that it amounts to putting a camera in your house... What if junk [snail]mail could do that? The software that sometimes is loaded (at startup via HKLM/Software/Mictosoft/Windows/Run) could very well turn on your webcam a perform a webcast without your knowledge, sending pictures of your crib to whomever while you sleep. The kicker is that they are justified as a market research tool by "reputable" web marketers -- trafficsyndicate.com is on my list because they got me several times with that "Tools for Microsoft Windows," and Some crazy "Weather" app that totally jacked my system, adding a BHO (browser helper object) disguised as a toolbar, a ranmdom pop-up thrower, and who knows what else... I only realized it when it f**ked up and threw a popup on a page from my internal local httpd. Virus is the word. | |
|  |  |  |  dave Premium,MVM join:2000-05-04 not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: This is Serious... Sure. I'm not disagreeing with your comments about spam in general, merely with your specific claim that you can't tell DSLR that you don't want to see adverts. I have never (and I mean that literally) seen an advert on the DSLR web site - and that's not because I have any filtering software installed, it's because I checked the box saying "never show me adverts". These days, it appears you only get that choice if you're a 'premium' member, but I believe you have the choice. | |
|   calvoiper
join:2003-03-31 Belvedere Tiburon, CA
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Damn Wimp-Ass Lawyers This is the perfect example of tech companies getting bad advice from chicken-s**t lawyers who don't understand what's going on.
Any idiot who understands what spyware is and how it works can create a perfectly acceptable approach to dealing with it. It involves educating the user who is infected and giving them alternatives--so it's the user's choice, not the ISP's or computer supplier's.
Unfortunately, it appears the lawyers for some companies are incapable of producing that approach.
Either that, or Michael Dell is more interested in server revenue from spyware companies than he is in his company's good name....
Calvoiper -- VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
|  |   Karl Bode News Guy join:2000-03-02
Host: Road Runner PC gaming GAMES PC gaming Tech
| Re: Damn Wimp-Ass Lawyers Agree.
Cheaper to say "Not our problem". So much for customer service.
Plus, many companies and ISP's have relationships with these marketers, so you run into the idea of "we tagged X product as spyware" suits....or "you ruined X application by removing an important spyware tied product" problems....
Another instance where greed overules good service. | |
|  |  moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21 Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by calvoiper :
Either that, or Michael Dell is more interested in server revenue from spyware companies than he is in his company's good name....
Calvoiper
DING DING DING!
Finally, someone gets it. This is all about Dell, and possibly other OEM's, opening the door to install spyware on shipped machines to get even more cash. You will opt-in when you buy a system from Dell or anyone else. And just try to get out of it.
It sickens me to no end to hear this CEO's trying to make a buck that my not be illegal but extremely deceptive. I think Michael Dell has made a deal with the devil and soon it will cost him. | |
|   WallyThacker The Central Scrutinizer
join:2002-02-12 Canada | MS embeds 3rd party spyware in Windoze I'll bet:
MS starts embedding 3rd party spyware code in Windoze. Does "You can't remove it without crippling the OS" sound familiar? | |
|  TrustedZero
join:2001-08-25 Claremont, CA | spyware here is one more reason to sign up with AOL...yet there are millions of other reasons that beg to differ. | |
|  |   mymegabyte Mmm Glue
join:2001-12-09 Plano, TX clubs: | Pc-Cillin I consider PC-Cillin the only way to go for computer security these days. The new version (2004) even scans for and removes most spyware during the normal real time scan. One couldn't ask for more. | |
|  Yail Bloor
join:2004-01-07 Richfield, OH
| Spyware is not the user's fault After reading this thread I'm a little surprised to see the opinions expressed by so many educated users. The whole issue of Spyware is one of PRIVACY. Web users who have not expressly consented to having tracking software loaded on their systems should not be made to feel that their actions have somehow justified the sites' irresponsible behavior. What began as a trend to install cookies into the cache files of visitors to a site has escaladed out of control and the cause of this is unscrupulous and greedy web marketers, software vendors, and OEM's. And while users do have a responsibility to educate themselves about their own PC's and the workings of the Web, the blame should be placed squarely on the heads of those who create this crap in the first place. Blaming users for Spyware on their computer is a bit like blaming someone with an email account for the existence of SPAM. | |
|  |   ChrisDAT Google Keyword Compsysnyc
join:2002-02-26 Hollis, NY
| Re: Spyware is not the user's fault
I don't think anyone is blaming the end user -- I'm sure we all will agreee that the people who create this stuff with the intention of decieving the user, also do so to fool the advertising agency, google, dell, and anyone else who will accept their dollaz to test their sneaky warez.
It also seems like many of us don't think legislation is the answer -- I don't -- Privacy is the issue, I don't like to give anyone (or any tool) access to my private email, because in order to detect spam, the mail must be READ by the detector. I wouldn't want the post office to read my mail before sending it to me, anymore than I would want my ISP, or downstream mail server to do it.
Sometimes we get so frustrated, that we wanna bring a smart bomb to a fist fight -- Let the people who allow this to happen know, tell Dell that you won't buy their computer with that junk on it... but please, don't make a "federal case" out of it. | |
|  |  |  bigbearr
join:2003-11-16 Saint Louis, MO
| Re: Spyware is not the user's fault Oh yah, spyware doesnt exactly announce itself to you, except for the slow cpu speeds and pop-up ads, but not many people are educated on the source of this.
As an ISP tech support person, I get multiple calls a day on this issue. Alot of people blame the ISP, thinking that they do it.
The ironic part is, that, those of us whom had dial up before, and got an occasional pop-up, will now get alot of pop ups because of broadband. Not only that, but pop-ups will come up while doing things like writing in a word document.
I have had to educate many people on this fact and recommend that they look up spyware on the internet.
One person straight canceled his service because he did not believe me!
But all we can do, as an ISP, is educate and inform. Hopefully ISPs will not resort to this run-around game that DELL has proposed, althougth I wouldnt put it past them, as most ISPs have spyware on their install CDs (broadjump anyone?) | |
|   qdemn7 Smurf in My Loop Premium join:2003-09-16 Fort Worth, TX | Spybot Rules!! Anyone who doesn't run Spybot (and donate a few $ to the creator since it's free) and Adaware, in this day and age is an idiot. It's like not using a condom during sex. | |
|   John Q Public
| "From the clueless majority" WOW!!....I came to DSLR to check my cpu's performance at the suggestion of my ISP's support personnel. I was having a problem with the turtle like speed at which my new system was navigating the net. I dare say that I am grateful for the education provided by this thread and shamefully admit that I am a prime example of the cluelessness that exists among the vast majority of users that are out there. The real story here is that we are a "Plug & Play" society. All we want to do is plug it in and play it and have no real concern for the potential consequences. We do not want to have to worry about it not working, about being taken advantage of or having to spend as much time and money on fixing it as we do using it! Remember we used to laugh at seeing how many people we can get into a phone booth or a volkswagon? Well the reality is that we attempt that same feat in every aspect of our lives. The "more with less" frame of mind of todays society is what results in this kind of behavior both on the part of the provider and the consumer. The other reality is that "We The People" have created this monster!! Realizing that I could probably go on for quite some time on this topic I will say only that I believe that as a result of this visit I will transcend to the next plane....and it's all your fault....Thank You:D | |
|   Esunshine
@optonline.net | Active X has TOOOO MUCH CONTROl What happened to the concept of inside the sandbox with Java. Microsoft has allowed ActiveX too much control!!! | |
|   CatchyName
| Use Linux or Mac OSX Based Computers Wow.
Try using a Linux box, or a Mac -- either is *mostly* free of ALL of the above spyware problems and complaints.
Use Mozilla, or Opera, or Safari (Mac) as your browser client. STOP using MS IE and Outlook/Entourage (Mac).
Worst problem you will likely experience will be the occasional pop-up -- easy to fix, of course, with either Mozilla or Opera -- no need for any third-party pop-up-stoppers. Spyware is unable to install or function on Linux/Mac OS.
Really.
WHY give your hard-earned money to Dell/MS juggernaut? What does a Wintel PC do that a Linux and/or Mac PC cannot do equally well?
Games? Buy an X-Box or other game system. Business software? Which ones?
Corporate and educational America could save VERY significant amounts of money by eradicating their premises of any system running the MS Windows OS -- would likely put many, possibly most of the current support/tech staff out of work, since properly configured Linux/Mac OSX machines need VERY little attention once running.
Go ahead, wring your hands in worry and complaint -- it is collectively your own fault -- yours & corporate/educational institutions for buying Windows OS JUNK.
ALL truth -- above is not meant as an insult. The spyware problem exists BECAUSE the industry enables it to do so -- STOP the enabling, and you will stop the problem. | |
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