Muni-Broadband AlabamaAlabama city's 'super-positive direction' ( old news - 12:08PM Wednesday May 28 2003) tags: business · alternatives Greensboro, a city in the "black belt" portion of Alabama, is the latest community to roll out their own broadband network. "The revolution begins today," announced Mayor John E. Owens in this AL.com story. "Our City of Greensboro and our region now have the technology needed to create jobs and abound in prosperity. Greensboro, the new generation, is definitely moving in a super-positive direction." With a population of 3,500, and an unemployment rate of 10.8 percent as of March, city officials hope the planned $5 million fiber network will create jobs and help bring some much needed money into the city's dusty coffers.
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ib50MbSoon
Formerly TwoKDialup
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Coloma, MI
| Adios telcos "We have $7.5 million leaving our community each year in telephone and cable bills. All we're getting back now is a $5,000-a-year cable franchise fee."
All that money and the greedy cable/telcos can't install a DSLAM for their customers. Sheesh! I'm glad to see that Greensboro is fighting back!
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Earthlink/DirecWay SRS | SatMex 5-990 | |
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frankenfeet
Premium
join:2001-10-14
Smiths Grove, KY
 ·Insight VOIP
 ·Insight Communicat..
| Re: Adios telcos I think its awesome to see communities taking a stand for themselves. Cable and telco's don't have a chance unless they lower prices and guarantee their service. Go Greensboro.
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"Sometimes your ahead, sometimes your behind. The race is long and in the end it's only with yourself." | |
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bistro777
Donuts-Is There Anything They Can't Do?
Premium
join:2002-02-07
Englewood, CO
| Geeeeeeeez - - Don’t they know that municipal broadband doesn’t work, is too costly to deploy, is blatantly unfair to telco/cable operators, and any municipality, by definition, is too incompetent to run/manage a network? (Note: Please contact SBC, Comcast et al for details.) /tongue-in-cheek Go Greensboro!
Failure is not an option: It’s already bundled with the software | |
| | alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
 ·Pacific Bell - SBC
| I'll have to agree with you in part, Telco's are a thing of the past if they don't change. I also think that our perception of Telco's has to change. They offer a solid service, but the way that is delivered has to change in order for everyone to prosper. I keep telling everyone, the Network Concept has to be the main focus.
ALC | |
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roamer1
sticking it out at you
join:2001-03-24
Atlanta, GA
clubs:
| I don't think the impetus for building the muni network is that there's no broadband at all there, especially since the local telco is BellSouth and the cable company is Mediacom (both companies who have widely deployed broadband in rural areas) -- from reading the article, it appears the main focus is to keep money that now goes out of statein the community and use the muni network as an educational tool.
-SC
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Atlanta Apt/Condo Cable & Broadband Info: »www.atlaptcable.info/ | |
| 2farfromCO7
join:2000-10-14
Farmington, MI
| DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! This is more evidence of alized utilities are by far the more efficient and productive than privite monopolies. FAT CAT MONOPOLIES MOVE WAY TO SLOW COMPARED TO SLEEK AND EFFICIENT DEMOCRACIES. If there government officials screw up, guess what, they'll get voted out of office. THERE IS NO ACCOUNTABILITY FOR UNREGULATED MONOPOLIES. The GOPers are 100% wrong on this issue. | |
| | | | | 2farfromCO7
join:2000-10-14
Farmington, MI
| Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! said by aztecnology  :
I think muni-broadband is a good idea, but to say that any government is more efficient than private industry is a bit of a stretch.
I'm afraid you've been brainwashed. Let's first deal with UTOPIA. If run perfectly, government run businesses break even exactly, no profit(profit is money wasted from the consumer's point of view) at all. If run perfectly private monopolies generate huge profits which could be invested into the infrastructure or given back to consumers in lower prices.
Now lets deal with reality. The business is run poorly. Deployments are running behind schedule and the cost is way over budget. In the government run business, somebody gets voted out of office due to voter outrage and replaced with somebody who has a better plan. In the monopoly, prices are raised or deployments are shelved. The only accountability comes from when the people complain to their elected officials who have to try to change regulations and laws, if they feel pressured enough(it's not their fault). You tell me which takes longer.
Efficiency only comes with accountability and responsiblity. Unregulated monopolies have neither.
This is the difference between DEMs and GOPers. Dems can see the difference between monopolies and competitive companies; GOPers can't.
quote:
Private industry(read 'bells') won't go there simply because of ROI. As well, I think this town is too small to make muni-broadband work and will probably sink them into debt that they could never get out of.
This may be true, but there are FAR TOO MANY examples of areas where they should've been economical 3-4 years ago. An organization with accountability would've made it happen sooner. | |
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aztecnology
O Rly?
Premium
join:2003-02-12
Murrieta, CA
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! said by 2farfromCO7 :
I'm afraid you've been brainwashed. Let's first deal with UTOPIA.
If we were dealing with UTOPIA then you wouldn't be 2farfromCO(maybe you still would in my UTOPIA), gasoline would be $.50/gallon, and there would be peace in the middle east
quote:
If run perfectly, government run businesses break even exactly, no profit(profit is money wasted from the consumer's point of view) at all. If run perfectly private monopolies generate huge profits which could be invested into the infrastructure or given back to consumers in lower prices.
In UTOPIA governments would not exist - and if they did they would be run perfectly, it's UTOPIA
quote:
Now lets deal with reality. The business is run poorly. Deployments are running behind schedule and the cost is way over budget.
Which business are you referring to? Which deployments, the one that stopped just shy of your house? Budgets change, you can only plan for the knowns, and guess for the unknowns, and the unknown unknowns
quote:
In the government run business, somebody gets voted out of office due to voter outrage and replaced with somebody who has a better plan.
Like what's going to happen to CA Gov Gray Dufus for taking CA from a 15 Billion dollar surplus to a 40 Billion dollar deficit in less than two years(Read:What just happened to 65 Billion Dollars?) And you idiot Dem's re-elected him - I can't wait for the recall vote in September!
quote:
In the monopoly, prices are raised or deployments are shelved. The only accountability comes from when the people complain to their elected officials who have to try to change regulations and laws, if they feel pressured enough(it's not their fault). You tell me which takes longer.
This just sounds like dribble
quote:
Efficiency only comes with accountability and responsiblity. Unregulated monopolies have neither.
Efficiency and accountability comes when you let the market forces play out, but that's were good 'ol government likes to stick it's nose and control everything
quote:
This is the difference between DEMs and GOPers. Dems can see the difference between monopolies and competitive companies; GOPers can't.
Right, raise taxes spend more - it takes a village to provide broadband. The only thing you need to know about democrats - Look what they've done to CA
Capitalism = GOOD - Socialism = BAD
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Starband 360 ~ W2KAS ~ DLINK DI-714P+ ~ XPro ~ XPro
[text was edited by author 2003-05-28 19:38:20]
[text was edited by author 2003-05-28 19:44:30] | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA | Hmm. A system where all business is run by the government with no "profit", where have I heard of that before.
Any people here who used to live in East Germany?
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Infogrames != Atari | |
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Rob Froelich
join:2000-03-26
Saint Charles, IL
clubs: | Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! I don't think anyone suggested all businesses being run by the government. You should change your handle to "Mr. Straw Man".
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Help! Help! I'm being oppressed!! | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! Well government run entities can always undercut private business, so if it's good for broadband why not everything else.
People only look at the price and quality of the service they have now. They are totally unaware or don't care about the damage such government run schemes do to the economy (and their QOS) that show up 5 or 10 years later.
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Infogrames != Atari | |
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Rob Froelich
join:2000-03-26
Saint Charles, IL
clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!! Well then I guess you were opposed to the commie fresh water and sewer systems funded by public money, and commie electrification projects, and commie telephone systems built with public funds (most of the original ones), and the commie interstate highway system.
Oh well, I guess we should have given the market economy a chance to build these things so we hadn't screwed them up so bad.
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Help! Help! I'm being oppressed!! | |
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aztecnology
O Rly?
Premium
join:2003-02-12
Murrieta, CA |  Re: DIE MONOPLIES DIE!!!!!
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| said by 2farfromCO7 :
If there government officials screw up, guess what, they'll get voted out of office.
To me, that's the most hilarious argument for commie broadband. You think that problems cause by elected officials magically go away if they are thrown out of office? The next person in usually ends up having to clean the mess up, and when it comes to inefficient government run ventures, that money always comes from someone's pocket.
Of course, those people who don't pay taxes, which I assume the original poster is one, don't care because it never costs them anything anyway... I always was for a flat tax rate for this reason, but that's a whole separate argument.
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Saying that Microsoft has a monopoly in Operating Systems because one is too lazy to learn a different OS is like saying that Ford has a monopoly in cars because one is too lazy to find a Honda dealership. | |
| markopoleo
join:2003-04-02
Bonne Terre, MO
·Charter Pipeline
| Its great for them..but.. I think communities are taking the wrong route when considering running there own networks. Sure its great in terms of cost savings, doing something yourself is always cheaper int he long run. But its not a sound statement to say "to bring back jobs".
Now if they announced it, and then said they had a deal with some college miles and miles away to provide classes online. That would be something worth it to the average user.
But to say it will bring money back in the coffers is a, well, a pipedream.
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If PLC goes mainstream, every other broadband provider will be considered what dialup is today...not broadband. | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| Re: Its great for them..but.. Well I agree with Muni broadband in instances where they get inferior or no service from local competitors.
But I agree to some degree with you that I don't like hearing it painted by community leaders as some kind of economic boom machine that will suddenly bring prosperity to small blue collar towns otherwise devoid of much else.... | |
| 
bamadude
@fuse.net
| who would have thought Who would have thought Greensboro would have this idea. Some parts of Alabama can be likened to a third world country and Greensboro is small indeed. Nevertheless, I am glad to see this happening, not only to stand up in the face of the "fat-cats" and be reckoned with, but to give those jobs to folks who really do need them. Perhaps the mayor of Birmingham and Mr.Owens would like to have lunch to discuss a plan for Birmingham. Just dont use any of sigleman's contractors for the job and it should cost less than $1 million per foot  | |
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FROSTY
Premium,MVM
join:2000-08-10
Pinson, AL
clubs:
| Re: who would have thought Forget B'ham....
The mayor of B'ham could care less unless there's a fat check stuffed into his pocket. Which is just as bad or worse, so he's no better...
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"When you set yourself on fire and aim for the sky, you hope to leave behind some sparks of heat and light ... Like a vapor trail." - Neil Peart 2002 | |
| averagedude
join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ
·Cox HSI
| Population of 3,500 "With a population of 3,500, and an unemployment rate of 10.8 percent as of March..."
I am not trying to be a smart ass in any way.
I think the problem is bigger than internet and phone service. The smallest loss of jobs is overly represented in job losses. In my opinion, you can't keep a town small and complain about job losses. This is a classic case of text book economics. Do I have the answers, NO. I have a feeling if the residents took a really good look in the mirror and asked themselves some long hard questions like, why are the kids not staying, what is the life style of our residents (retire'ies, agro, high tech, risk takers), do we really want our quiet small town to really change, do we make fun of the "city folk", what is it that we really are griping about?
That is my 2 cents, getting of soap box now. | |
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dogmabast
@206.169.x.x
| Re: Population of 3,500 Third World Country? ...well, pretty much. Isn't Greensboro doing pretty much the same thing that "Third World country" India did 20 years ago??
Develop high-tech infrastructure (i.e. mega-broadband to everyone in the community and at $5 Million, each resident and business should have single-mode fiber to the prem), AND train as many residents as possible and at the end of the day, it's Greensboro that gets Microsoft, IBM, Cisco, etc. outsourced customer service/support contracts, NOT India.
IMHO, This quote: "Microsoft and Cisco certification training will be offered..." is the most striking. It is a major piece of the "economic puzzle" they are putting together down there. If they can make that fly, I think they have a major winner. It may take some time, but in a few years, those jobs that are going offshore now could be coming back to the good 'ol US-of-A.
Go Greensboro!! | |
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Dogmabast
@206.169.x.x
| Re: Population of 3,500 Well no, not literally. But they did invest heavily in infrastructure and training with the goal of becoming a global technology resource. I think you get the drift here. This approach has paid off for India as we all know.
It is also important to point out (as did another poster)that $5 Million for 3,500 residents should provide at least GigE connectivity to every household and business. If the local politicians play their cards right, in a few years "Third World" Greensboro should be able to buy the "Second World" and put a firm down payment on the First one. | |
| nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD | gee... that's too bad this got publicized. You can expect the local ILEC to begin lobbying the state legislature to have their network outlawed. | |
| | hescominsoon
join:2003-02-18
Brunswick, MD | Re: gee... are the local telcos/cable companies pushin any anti-muni stuff in Md?
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God Blesshttp://www.faithwalk.org | |
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Re: Population of 3,500