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 | Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
1 edit | Re: :O Amazing? I honestly find this whole Google build to be simply silly. They arent doing anything groundbreaking, they are replicating what Verizon has already done. They have the luxury of deploying newer equipment, that can CURRENTLY offer (unnecessary) faster net speeds than Verizon, thats all. When Google passes 20 million homes, I'll concur, "amazing"
The one significant difference is that Verizon will continue to make money on FiOS, whereas Google will be taking on financial losses. Especially when word gets around that their 7years of FREE 5Mbps option will be adequate for 90% of households.
Nobody get upset now, its simply the hard-core truth.  | |
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| | JTR
join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL Reviews:
 ·Mediacom
| Re: :O Yep, people get all excited about Gfiber, but the reality of this is that it's just a small deployment of cheap gigabit (and they aren't going to be profitable). FiOS is much more impressive, the only issue is the price. FiOS covers way more homes, and they're actually profitable (at least compared to Google). | |
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| | | | | Re: :O said by JTR: FiOS covers way more homes, and they're actually profitable (at least compared to Google).
No question, FiOS covers more home....today.
No question, Verizon is profitable.
But is FiOS itself profitable, and if so what are the margins? | |
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| | | | pandoraPremium
join:2001-06-01
Outland
kudos:1 Reviews:
 ·Google Voice
·Comcast
·ooma
·Future Nine Corp..
|  Re: :O
said by MaynardKrebs:said by JTR: FiOS covers way more homes, and they're actually profitable (at least compared to Google).
No question, FiOS covers more home....today. No question, Verizon is profitable. But is FiOS itself profitable, and if so what are the margins? IIRC Karl was just about wetting his pants over a small area covered by an ISP in Hong Kong. The link to Karl's happy tale of the wonderful world in Hong Kong can be found here - »1 Gbps Symmetrical For $26 Sound Good To You? .
If a few districts in Hong Kong make Karl drool, he should be excited about this experiment in Kansas City.
Apparently selecting your neighborhood, is only a net positive to Karl outside the U.S.
Assuming Google has done some demographic work, and can examine the results of this Kansas City experiment over time, other cities may follow.
The fine print of the Hong Kong service can be found here - »apply.hkbn.net/orp/eng/1000fh.jsp
Lets see what whetted Karl's whistle back in 2010 ... from the site - 24 month contract required, non-refundable deposit of $310, service costs $199 per month, plus a mandatory $890 installation fee.
Out of 43 districts listed, I could only find 3 that had service.
Ohh Karl, they discriminate. Karl they are expensive. Karl they have high upfront fees. But Karl, they aren't in the U.S. so all is wonderful, eh?
Personally I like the idea of Google trying to offer something new, and hope it works for Google and any city that they can justify putting service into.
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"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use." | |
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| | | | | | | Re: :O @pandora
Those are HK dollar prices.
100.00 HKD = 12.8960 USD
or
1 US dollar gets you 7.75437 HKD
Now be a good boy and go do the math......if you know how. | |
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| |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | said by ITALIAN926:Nobody get upset now, its simply the hard-core truth.
I'll put my money on the engineers, mathematicians, statisticians and downright geniuses at Google. Thanks. | |
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| | | JTR
join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL Reviews:
·Mediacom
| Re: :O said by tiger72:said by ITALIAN926:Nobody get upset now, its simply the hard-core truth.
I'll put my money on the engineers, mathematicians, statisticians and downright geniuses at Google. Thanks. There are just as many of those at Verizon. | |
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| | | | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: :O said by JTR:said by tiger72:said by ITALIAN926:Nobody get upset now, its simply the hard-core truth.
I'll put my money on the engineers, mathematicians, statisticians and downright geniuses at Google. Thanks. There are just as many of those at Verizon. HAHAHA
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"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| | | |  skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
1 edit | Those would be purchasing agents at Verizon. | |
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| | | | | | said by JTR:said by tiger72:said by ITALIAN926:Nobody get upset now, its simply the hard-core truth.
I'll put my money on the engineers, mathematicians, statisticians and downright geniuses at Google. Thanks. There are just as many of those at Verizon. HAHA!
Let me know the next time Verizon plans to add more builds to places it doesn't have an outstanding agreement with the municipality.
Actually, I'll do you one better... let me know the next time Verizon plans to finish build-outs to places it does have an outstanding agreement with the municipality. | |
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| | | | | skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2 | Re: :O Can't fault Verizon, they dropped some $21B on FiOS, there comes a time where you rest with capital investment and try to get some returns on that titanic investment.
Let me know when Google spends $21B on anything. | |
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| | | | Reviews:
·Callcentric
| said by JTR:said by tiger72:I'll put my money on the engineers, mathematicians, statisticians and downright geniuses at Google. Thanks.
There are just as many of those at Verizon. What they have are bean counters and MBA types, figuring out ever more innovative ways to nickel and dime people and kill off any competition that they cannot collude with. | |
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| | | | | Re: :O "One more city with lit fiber. Who can complain about that?"
The posters on this site. | |
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| | | mogamer
join:2011-04-20
Royal Oak, MI | said by LightS: Who can complain about that?
People who work for the established cabelco/telcos. | |
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| | | | skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Cox HSI
 ·Clear Wireless
| Re: :O ...Or those that see this for what it is, an experiment that won't likely see any real expansion. It'll soon be added to the ever growing list of abandoned Google projects: iGoogle, Google Wave, Google Knol, Google Bookmarks List, Google Gears, Google Buzz, Google Health, Google Notebooks, Google Answers...
In other words, people are foaming for no reason. | |
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| | | | |  LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 | Re: :O said by skeechan:...Or those that see this for what it is, an experiment that won't likely see any real expansion. It'll soon be added to the ever growing list of abandoned Google projects: iGoogle, Google Wave, Google Knol, Google Bookmarks List, Google Gears, Google Buzz, Google Health, Google Notebooks, Google Answers...
In other words, people are foaming for no reason.
That is the main issue. Will Google follow thru on a project that is marginally profitable and has a high cost structure for support? Past history suggests Google will get all the PR benefit they can on this and a couple years down the road they will cut their losses and sell the infrastructure to someone else that will want to charge fees that can make a profit w/o subsidization from a huge ad network.
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»www.mittromney.com/s/repeal-and-···bamacare
»www.mittromney.com/issues/health-care | |
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| | | | | | JTR
join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL Reviews:
·Mediacom
| Re: :O said by Linklist:said by skeechan:...Or those that see this for what it is, an experiment that won't likely see any real expansion. It'll soon be added to the ever growing list of abandoned Google projects: iGoogle, Google Wave, Google Knol, Google Bookmarks List, Google Gears, Google Buzz, Google Health, Google Notebooks, Google Answers...
In other words, people are foaming for no reason.
That is the main issue. Will Google follow thru on a project that is marginally profitable and has a high cost structure for support? Past history suggests Google will get all the PR benefit they can on this and a couple years down the road they will cut their losses and sell the infrastructure to someone else that will want to charge fees that can make a profit w/o subsidization from a huge ad network. Yeah, and there's that line in their contract stating that they can cancel in two years (or is it within two years?). Either way, they can ditch the project without any repercussions. | |
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| | | | | | | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: :O said by JTR:said by Linklist:said by skeechan:...Or those that see this for what it is, an experiment that won't likely see any real expansion. It'll soon be added to the ever growing list of abandoned Google projects: iGoogle, Google Wave, Google Knol, Google Bookmarks List, Google Gears, Google Buzz, Google Health, Google Notebooks, Google Answers...
In other words, people are foaming for no reason.
That is the main issue. Will Google follow thru on a project that is marginally profitable and has a high cost structure for support? Past history suggests Google will get all the PR benefit they can on this and a couple years down the road they will cut their losses and sell the infrastructure to someone else that will want to charge fees that can make a profit w/o subsidization from a huge ad network. Yeah, and there's that line in their contract stating that they can cancel in two years (or is it within two years?). Either way, they can ditch the project without any repercussions. You have a link to that contract?
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| | | | | | | | | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: :O said by Linklist:said by tiger72:You have a link to that contract?
Follow the link in this BBR story: » Google Can Ditch Kansas City After Two YearsHere is the 2 yr walk away info: » www.lightreading.com/document.as···d=223899"Google will have the right to terminate the Agreement for convenience at any time up to two (2) years after actual construction commences on the fiber network," the franchise agreement states.
If the deal is terminated after services are launched, Google and the city can create a new operating agreement "for the continued use of the existing fiber network, which could involve operation of the network by a third party." That's great. Do you have a link to the actual contract?
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| | | | | | | | | LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 | Re: :O said by tiger72:said by Linklist:said by tiger72:You have a link to that contract?
Follow the link in this BBR story: » Google Can Ditch Kansas City After Two YearsHere is the 2 yr walk away info: » www.lightreading.com/document.as···d=223899"Google will have the right to terminate the Agreement for convenience at any time up to two (2) years after actual construction commences on the fiber network," the franchise agreement states.
If the deal is terminated after services are launched, Google and the city can create a new operating agreement "for the continued use of the existing fiber network, which could involve operation of the network by a third party." That's great. Do you have a link to the actual contract? »cityclerk.kcmo.org/liveweb/Docum···2fPqQ8hd
The agreement found at above link. Click on Agreement.pdf
 agreement.pdf 183200 bytes
KC Google franchise agreement
Using the find feature of Adobe Reader or other PDF reading tool, find "(2) years" to see the get out of dodge 2 yr clause.
Of course feel free to peruse the whole document if you want.
The above agreement was with Kansas City, MO. If you want Kansas City, Kansas you will have to look for yourself. I wasted enough time finding the above document and have no desire to see if the Kansas City, Kansas agreement is different.
--
»www.mittromney.com/s/repeal-and-···bamacare
»www.mittromney.com/issues/health-care | |
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| | | | | | | | | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: :O said by Linklist:http://cityclerk.kcmo.org/liveweb/Documents/Document.aspx?q=8OhiEnh5QRUzYmhhPBOauwHL5G24qmBK654IOIXXPkZ2eiYVOgmvkavN7%2fPqQ8hd
The agreement found at above link. Click on Agreement.pdf
[att=1]
Using the find feature of Adobe Reader or other PDF reading tool, find "(2) years" to see the get out of dodge 2 yr clause.
Of course feel free to peruse the whole document if you want.
The above agreement was with Kansas City, MO. If you want Kansas City, Kansas you will have to look for yourself. I wasted enough time finding the above document and have no desire to see if the Kansas City, Kansas agreement is different.
Thank you.
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| | | | | | | | skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2 | »fiber.google.com/legal/terms.html
I didn't read it closely but I didn't see any 2 year thing.
Edit - NM, it apparently is in the franchise agreement. | |
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| | | | | | | | | LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5
1 edit | Re: :O said by skeechan:https://fiber.google.com/legal/terms.html
I didn't read it closely but I didn't see any 2 year thing.
That is between Google and the customer and NOT between Google and the city franchise authorities.
Here is the agreement with KC:
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···d=223899
"Google will have the right to terminate the Agreement for convenience at any time up to two (2) years after actual construction commences on the fiber network," the franchise agreement states.
If the deal is terminated after services are launched, Google and the city can create a new operating agreement "for the continued use of the existing fiber network, which could involve operation of the network by a third party."
»www.mittromney.com/s/repeal-and-···bamacare
»www.mittromney.com/issues/health-care | |
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| | | |  LightSPremium
join:2005-12-17
Greenville, TX | I'm wouldn't be surprised if he's a shill anyways. Of course he'll deny it, but any time caps, or any innovative thing regarding improving bandwidth speed comes around, he suddenly says it's "not practical" etc etc.. | |
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| | | | | JTR
join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL Reviews:
·Mediacom
| Re: :O said by LightS:I'm wouldn't be surprised if he's a shill anyways. Of course he'll deny it, but any time caps, or any innovative thing regarding improving bandwidth speed comes around, he suddenly says it's "not practical" etc etc..
Ah, the shill arguement. I'm so very sorry that my views don't happen to align with yours.
For the record, I am affiliated with nobody but myself. I speak my mind, not someone else's. I wouldn't have thousands of posts on multiple forums (almost all on topics unrelated to ISPs) if I was a paid corporate shill. | |
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| | | | | | LightSPremium
join:2005-12-17
Greenville, TX | Re: :O Sorry man - my comment wasn't directed at you!
It's actually directed at ITALIAN926. | |
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| | | | | | | Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: :O Directed at either of us, we're saying the SAME sensible thing. You people, I swear. Wow, my grandpa cant wait to get Gbps internet. LMAO.
As Alpha Beta's Ogre once said.. NEEEEEEEEEEERDS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  | |
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| | | | | said by LightS:So? Who cares, they're doing more than your precious Verizon FiOS is. And they're doing it for cheap. One more city with lit fiber. Who can complain about that?
If they were doing it without government subsidies, it might be impressive that it's so cheap. | |
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| | | | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: :O said by skuv :said by LightS:So? Who cares, they're doing more than your precious Verizon FiOS is. And they're doing it for cheap. One more city with lit fiber. Who can complain about that?
If they were doing it without government subsidies, it might be impressive that it's so cheap. Oh? Verizon, Comcast, Time Warner, and ATT don't get subsidies from local governments?
Well that must be a very new development.
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| |  Oh_NoTrogglus normalus
join:2011-05-21
Chicago, IL | How do you know it is not profitable?? | |
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| | | | They can stomach the losses, considering they have a market cap that is greater than almost the entire value of Verizon. | |
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| | | I checked out your ISP's website. $700 for 100/5 connection is crazy. | |
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| | dra6o0n
join:2011-08-15
Mississauga, ON Reviews:
·ITalkBB
| Re: :O I would be fine if they gave me more upload rates here in Canada... 1Mbps upstream sucks.
I don't mind if it's 25~50Mbps average, in terms of downstream there isn't many real need as video games and file downloads are used easily with that.
But upstream is the most important aspect of the network, for people to host or upload things efficiently.
Also, the biggest changes to this is that if Google's Fiber network can be wholesaled, Google will make a bigger cut from many smaller ISP businesses who wants to turn to their network instead!
This in effect will cause many cable and dsl internet users to switch thus a absolute threat to other larger isp companies. | |
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| | | | His ISP must not have found the magical $1/mb bandwidth fountain yet. | |
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| | Reviews:
·tricom
| said by Network Guy:I checked out your ISP's website. $700 for 100/5 connection is crazy.
Yeah here in dominican republic ISPs have very crappy speeds for adsl AND ftth/cable too, anything above 5-6mbit is too expensive. I pay usd$44 for 3/768, 2.6/0.6 after overhead, so $70 for 1gbps up/down sounds very nice to me. | |
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| | | | | Re: :O Exactly usd$725 WITHOUT tax for the 100/5, jumps to $928 with tax. Claro's 100/5 is slightly "cheaper", ($623+$175)but still extremely overpriced. | |
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| | | | | | Re: :O I'm I reading that correct? Your country imposes 28% TAX on your Internet connection?  | |
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JTR
join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL Reviews:
·Mediacom
| Interesting... I wonder what TWC and AT&T will come up with to counter Gfiber... And how many people opt to go with the 5/1 plan.
It'll be amusing to see the result of all these people having gigabit connections. Botnet operators are probably very excited right now... Of course, once consumers realize that their gigabit connection only downloads at a fraction of that speed from the majority of sites/servers out there, the result of that will be interesting to see. | |
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 tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3
·Comcast
| It's too bad... they didn't choose a more sensible critieria like "the backhaul is installed in area 23 and the poles are ready, so it's a good time to start HERE and work down the street.
This method is more a promotional "DO it NOW!"
I do understan it makes sense to flash build a whole neighborhood at once, and then not come back for a year (or until everyone else is done) but this reeks of redlining which is not legit give the level of subsidy the cities has provided Google on this | |
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 ARGONAUTgot android?Premium
join:2006-01-24
New Albany, IN
kudos:1 | (F)oogle Lucky ducks.
It would be nice to have that fiber speed. | |
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 DrDrewSo that others may surf.
join:2009-01-28
SoCal
kudos:9 | Where are the actual customer reviews of the service? When will DSLR get a Google Fiber forum and actual customer reviews?
So far it's vaporware...
After that I wonder how it'll perform with a few hundred, then thousand, then a few thousand customers.
How scalable and costly is Google's last mile fiber infrastructure? Is it really going to a viable and expandable product or just a one off test with no future?
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If it's important, back it up... twice. Even 99.999% availability isn't enough sometimes. | |
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Reviews:
 ·AT&T Southeast
| Don't get it I don't get why some people want this to fail, when it means more possible competition which is good for everybody.
I, for one, hope that google fiber comes to miami, i am sick and tired of living in this duopoly, lack of competition means caps and higher prices. | |
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| | | Re: Don't get it Because those who want it to fail work for the competition. | |
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| | tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1 | Re: Don't get it or own stock in the competition.
And they care more about their stock not going down a point than an entire metropolitan area having increased access and competition. | |
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| | Hoping and praying that Google will be successful.
I also don't know why people want Google to fail.
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Be brave even if you're not. Pretend to be. No one can tell the difference. | |
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| | Me too Call me selfish, but I still want this to succeed. I want google's fiber in my state. | |
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