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After site publishes Internet censhorship blacklists...
(old news - 02:25PM Wednesday Mar 25 2009)
tags: legal · business · world · content
Tipped by fatness See Profile
Document sharing website Wikileaks is hated by governments and corporations worldwide for hosting all manner of documentation on issues that would otherwise remain in shadow. Recently, the website has been publishing the blacklists being used in countries like Germany and Australia, where government efforts to censor the Internet have been heating up.

The leaked lists have shown governments going beyond their purported mandate of cleaning up the most nefarious of Internet content (like child porn). Interestingly, Wikileaks yesterday reported that German police raided the home of the owner of the "wikileaks.de" domain, the German name for wikileaks.org:
Shortly after 9pm on Tuesday the 24th of March 2009, seven police officers in Dresden and four in Jena searched the homes of Theodor Reppe, who holds the domain registration for "wikileaks.de", the German name for wikileaks.org. According to police documentation, the reason for the search was "distribution of pornographic material" and "discovery of evidence".
According to Wikileaks, German officials are engaged in a broader campaign against those discussing the lists:
The raid appears to be related to a recent German social hysteria around child pornography and the controversial battle for a national censorship system by the German family minister Ursula von der Leyen. It comes just a few weeks after a member of parliament, SPD minister Joerg Tauss had his office and private house searched by police. German bloggers discussing the subject were similarly raided.
Wikileaks had previously published the blacklists for Thailand, Denmark and Norway, but only just published the Australian blacklist last week. While the list does include a lot of nasty child-related fare, it also includes regular pornography, some anti-abortion websites, a few anti-government blogs, as well as euthanasia and poker websites.

Related:
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  2. Malaysia Orders ISPs To Block Critical Blogs
  3. Brit Censors Back Off Wikipedia Ban
  4. 'Three Strikes' Debate A Global Affair
  5. French ISPs: Playing Copyright Cop Is Expensive
  6. Music Industry Wants ISPs To Adhere To Nonexistent Laws
  7. Bits Of ACTA Agreement Leaking Out
  8. Senators Want ACTA Made Public
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KrK
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2 edits

Amazing.... Abuse of Power

Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth?

The more Governments try to suppress wrong doing, the more sites like Wikileaks are needed!

The only reason I can think of for Governments to be concerned about internet censorship blacklists getting published is because they are censoring things they aren't supposed to or don't want their citizens to know about.

IE Abuse of power and corruption... and if that is the case, then that means all the more reason they SHOULD be published so the citizenry can find out.

This is a classic example of the Free Press doing exactly what it supposed to do. Thumbs up, Wikileaks!
--
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Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power

said by KrK See Profile :

Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth?
The irony in your stupid comment is that most of the laws limiting free speech in Germany have to do with right-radicals not being able to profess their love for Hitler, and for denying the Holocaust.
The more Governments try to suppress wrong doing, the more sites like Wikileaks are needed!
Very, very true.
The only reason I can think of for Governments to be concerned about internet censorship blacklists getting published is because they are censoring things they aren't supposed to or don't want their citizens to know about.
In Germany's case, this mostly applies to right-wing sites that frequently support nazi-like tendencies.
IE Abuse of power and corruption... and if that is the case, then that means all the more reason they SHOULD be published so the citizenry can find out.
Governments aren't afraid of that information getting out. A perfect example being the United States. We all know that our government is corrupt and abuses its power constantly, yet good luck finding a single newspaper mention the words "our government" and "corrupt" in the same sentence.
This is a classic example of the Free Press doing exactly what it supposed to do. Thumbs up, Wikileaks!
Agreed.
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara

KrK
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Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power

Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually.

knightmb
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Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power

said by KrK See Profile :

Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually.
I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things.

Why is the registrar owner being raided again? So now your house is raid just for being the domain owner. Wow, time to register "wikileaks.tv" to Comcast CEO, and I'll go ahead and register "wikileaks.info" to the AT&T CEO.

The two should cancel each other out in a fight for power.
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Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power

said by knightmb See Profile :

said by KrK See Profile :

Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually.
I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things.
Let's review:
Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth?
Stupid may not be the right word. How about ignorant? Or infantile? Or uninformed? Those are all significantly more accurate since germany has laws on the books (and has had for decades) to the most extreme contrary to what was posited. You are not allowed to in any way support Nazism or criticize the realities of the holocaust.

Germans are constantly critical of their government. Almost to a fault (they really do complain about the most minor things), and most of the things that Germany blocks are sites like the KKK websites in America - right-radical sites.

Now, on a personal level, I deeply disagree with that. I think it's disgusting to censor speech - however depraved - that the majority doesn't like. However, the reason they suppress that speech is because of ignorant people making comments like you made above. If they didn't restrict it, you'd call them all Nazis for allowing Nazis to gather. Now that they suppress it, you call them Nazis.
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara

KrK
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1 edit

Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power

This insulting is plain stupid, that's for sure. Your knee-jerk reaction seems misplaced, but in case you didn't get it, I'll explain my "stupid" comment.

Your point that about Germany censoring the far right/nazi political spectrum is valid, but isn't really part of the point of the comment other then that viewpoint is also on the blacklist. The point you apparently missed in the "stupid" comment was that that type of Censorship is just like something the Third Reich WOULD do which is ironic given Germany's hypersensitive efforts to not touch the Nazi past at all. So, in efforts to not appear to tolerate Nazism they are acting exactly like ... Nazis. Ironic, eh?

And it's not just the nazi sites on the blacklist, as has been shown.... really the main point is that this censorship is a bad idea in general, and is being abused, whether they mean well by blocking Child Porn or Nazi related sites, it quickly spreads to other things.

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said by tiger72 See Profile :

said by knightmb See Profile :

said by KrK See Profile :

Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually.
I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things.
Let's review:
Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth?
Stupid may not be the right word. How about ignorant? Or infantile? Or uninformed? Those are all significantly more accurate since germany has laws on the books (and has had for decades) to the most extreme contrary to what was posited. You are not allowed to in any way support Nazism or criticize the realities of the holocaust.

Germans are constantly critical of their government. Almost to a fault (they really do complain about the most minor things), and most of the things that Germany blocks are sites like the KKK websites in America - right-radical sites.

Now, on a personal level, I deeply disagree with that. I think it's disgusting to censor speech - however depraved - that the majority doesn't like. However, the reason they suppress that speech is because of ignorant people making comments like you made above. If they didn't restrict it, you'd call them all Nazis for allowing Nazis to gather. Now that they suppress it, you call them Nazis.
There is nothing "conservative" at all about the KKK... Please don't call them radicals on the right... Radicals on the right would submit little to no government (some libertarians / anarchists)..
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4 edits
said by knightmb See Profile :

said by KrK See Profile :

Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually.
I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things.

Also agree, I didn't find anything stupid about Krk's comment.

Many, i included are aware already of Germany's speech laws regarding the holocaust. His question is unrelated in that manner.

His question was obviously rhetorical(possible even sarcastic), and even if it were not I still can't follow your Nazi connection.

Your comment comes off as kind of obsessed with Nazi/holocaust speech laws.

Way to go Wikileaks, hopefully this will embarrass the German government enough to stop this practice.

KrK
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said by tiger72 See Profile :

A perfect example being the United States. We all know that our government is corrupt and abuses its power constantly, yet good luck finding a single newspaper mention the words "our government" and "corrupt" in the same sentence.
Well, I'd say often, yes that is the case... and often it is because much of the Newspapers in this country are owned by corporations who have vested interests in some of that corruption, unfortunately.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

Nazipal

@plus.pl
LOL this is whistleblower ?! Accepting donations by Paypal - company that gladly will spend thousands to investigate your $5 sent to old classmate. Who are they kidding

anonii

@ca.us

DAMN

Wow $uk that. Hope they had backups and were smart about it.

anony101

@comcast.net

Re: DAMN

Once information is on the internet there is no way to control it. By now many many people all over the world have a copy of those documents.
lordofwhee

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Re: DAMN

I keep copies of stuff like this on my HDD for that very reason, realistic or not.
me1212

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W00T for wikileaks!

If the Gov does wrong the people should know!

I Use Dial

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Vive le Wikileaks!

I love that site.

Shamayim
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Bears repeating

"Wikileaks needs YOU to help us fight the good fight. Keep us independent and strong!"
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SLD
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Nazis?

Wow...that Nazis are back in control already???

tiger72
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Re: Nazis?

said by SLD See Profile :

Wow...that Nazis are back in control already???
Maybe you should read up on the #1 topic that the German government censors:
Nazi and racist organizations.

...And they say Americans aren't informed about the rest of the modern world...
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara

KrK
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Re: Nazis?

They are hyper-sensitive on that subject, for example they went after ebay for allowing collectible memorabilia from WWII that has Nazi/SS logos, imagery, propaganda, etc
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

SLD
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Ironic, isn't it? Acting like Nazis about Nazis...

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Re: Nazis?

said by SLD See Profile :

Ironic, isn't it? Acting like Nazis about Nazis...
Not really - look at the incoming ultra-nationalist parties in Israel... acting exactly like Nazis...

SLD
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Re: Nazis?

I'd say that makes it even more ironic.

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said by kamm See Profile :

said by SLD See Profile :

Ironic, isn't it? Acting like Nazis about Nazis...
Not really - look at the incoming ultra-nationalist parties in Israel... acting exactly like Nazis...
who?

SLD
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2 edits
said by tiger72 See Profile :

Maybe you should read up on the #1 topic that the German government censors:
Nazi and racist organizations.

...And they say Americans aren't informed about the rest of the modern world...
Do you even read posts before ranting-off something stupid like this?
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said by SLD See Profile :

Wow...that Nazis are back in control already???
When were they ever not in control? Except they claim they're AGAINST Nazis now, and fighting them using Nazi tactics...

Hitler would've been proud of these laws.

P Ness
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Nuff said

on one of the list

-partypoker.com

so the list are not just child porn

found

- adult porn sites
- teen model sites
- poker sites
- anti govt blogs

sigh.
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www.stopfcc.comI do not think the government needs to restrict free speech especially on a device that has an off knob.

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Re: Nuff said

They tell people it's to stop Child Porn or Terrorists.

Then they just can't help adding "Anti Government" sites, IE free speech. Once they have the system in place, it seems like they just can't resist abusing it....
--
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russotto

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Re: Nuff said

said by KrK See Profile :

Once they have the system in place, it seems like they just can't resist abusing it....
You have it backwards. The "abuse' was the system's PURPOSE. The child porn/terrorist stuff was just an excuse.

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Re: Nuff said

said by russotto See Profile :

said by KrK See Profile :

Once they have the system in place, it seems like they just can't resist abusing it....
You have it backwards. The "abuse' was the system's PURPOSE. The child porn/terrorist stuff was just an excuse.
Actually.... I think you're right.
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said by P Ness See Profile :

on one of the list

-partypoker.com

so the list are not just child porn

Everyone knows that poker is the gateway to child pornography.

tangojoker
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I am all for Wikileaks, but have concern with the list

what happens if some one clicks on the links and visits Child P site ? will he/she be trouble with law ?

isnt this inviting someone to browse around and explore ?

Cheers
shadow700

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Re: Nuff said

To be honest, that list is an eye-opener.

I've been an Internet user since '93 and have never "stumbled" upon child porn nor gone looking for it.

As such, my assumption was that sites that had such content didn't exist at a particular location long enough for a blacklist to be effective.

I was curious to see what was on the list. I didn't think that there would be anything truly disturbing. "Probably some government twit that got his puritan panties in a bunch", I figured.

For the first few that I tried, that is exactly what I got. Hard-core, but nothing that seemed illegal. Then I clicked a link that lead to a page that was so obviously depraved and illegal that it was sickening.

I no longer have that arrogant curiosity.
Pv8man

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First rule...

Apparently the first rule about censorship is that you do NOT talk about censorship...

It's time for everyone to realize how important whistle blower sites like wikileaks are and it's time for other people to start branches of Wikileaks in case they get shut down, they can't shut down EVERY whistle blower site.

Down with corruption

All hail exposure.

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Re: First rule...

Agreed 100 %

BabyBear
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said by Pv8man See Profile :

Apparently the first rule about censorship is that you do NOT talk about censorship...
Thought that was Fight Club?

said by Pv8man See Profile :

It's time for everyone to realize how important whistle blower sites like wikileaks are and it's time for other people to start branches of Wikileaks in case they get shut down, they can't shut down EVERY whistle blower site.
That's for sure. Hopefully they take a page from Pirate Bay's server locating book.
Endgame
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Global oppression heats up

The world police state is here so beware! »www.prisonplanet.com/

stymied2forreal

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Re: Global oppression heats up

great website most people just dont realize that this is global conspired meant to bring down all opposition to one world govt. ACTA is nothing less than bringing down anti govt. soon enough the goose stompers will be stomping, throughout the world. trust me all they want is a Nazi regime (UN control)only this time against the peasants and middle class not the Jews. slaves and masters folks wake up

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Re: Global oppression heats up

said by stymied2forreal :

ACTA is nothing less than bringing down anti govt. soon enough the goose stompers will be stomping, throughout the world.
Those bastards need to be stomped.



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axus

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Backwards thinking, .de

These raids are giving more ammunition to the argument that child pornography censorship is a slippery slope towards losing other forms of speech.
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Treat Citizens like mushrooms

Tyrants want treat their citizens like mushrooms. Keeping them in the dark and feed them B.S. Repressive governments believe that it would be dangerous for citizens to be aware of violation of their rights.

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Re: Treat Citizens like mushrooms

said by Mr Matt See Profile :

Tyrants want treat their citizens like mushrooms. Keeping them in the dark and feed them B.S.
You treat mushrooms like that!? YOU'RE A HORRIBLE PERSON!

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If Only..........

Maybe SOMEDAY all newspapers/news-sites/newscasts, etc. will be more like Wikileaks and less like Entertainment Tonight....

Real News reporting - what a concept!
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1 edit

Re: If Only..........

nm

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Germany Is Getting Access To Our Secret Labs

And we are allowing these creepy Germans access to our secret files?

I say let's cut them off until they behave.

»www.spiegel.de/international/wor···,00.html

quote:
HOMELAND SECURITY COOPERATION
Obama Opens Secret Laboratories to Germany

By Christian Schw„gerl

The Americans have always kept their research into anti-terrorism technologies top secret -- until now. A new treaty between Germany and the US will give German scientists access to highly restricted laboratories.

It was a productive start to the week for US Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano and German Research Minister Annette Schavan. The two women met at 7:15 a.m. on Monday for breakfast at a five-star hotel in Berlin to discuss one of the most explosive issues in the era of international terrorism: How can the population and infrastructure be protected against catastrophic attacks without Western democracies being turned into Orwellian regimes?
--
OBAMA, THE NEW "RAILSPLITTER"?

OBAMA, CHANGE?

LOYAL TO LIBERTY


Michael Pyshnov

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Documented censorship in journal Nature

Censorship is a cowardly fraud. It prevents public disclosure of various crime more than it prevents anything else. The worst is self-censorship. And the worst in it is that public never knows what was censored. I decided to make one such case known to public. See »ca.geocities.com/uoftfraud/nature.html
Honest reporters risk their lives to bring the truth to the world. Where does censorship stand in the world?
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