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 |   tiger72 SexaT duorP Premium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO clubs:
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| Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power said by KrK :Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth? The irony in your stupid comment is that most of the laws limiting free speech in Germany have to do with right-radicals not being able to profess their love for Hitler, and for denying the Holocaust.
The more Governments try to suppress wrong doing, the more sites like Wikileaks are needed! Very, very true.
The only reason I can think of for Governments to be concerned about internet censorship blacklists getting published is because they are censoring things they aren't supposed to or don't want their citizens to know about.
In Germany's case, this mostly applies to right-wing sites that frequently support nazi-like tendencies.
IE Abuse of power and corruption... and if that is the case, then that means all the more reason they SHOULD be published so the citizenry can find out. Governments aren't afraid of that information getting out. A perfect example being the United States. We all know that our government is corrupt and abuses its power constantly, yet good luck finding a single newspaper mention the words "our government" and "corrupt" in the same sentence.
This is a classic example of the Free Press doing exactly what it supposed to do. Thumbs up, Wikileaks! Agreed. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 |  |   KrK Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy Premium join:2000-01-17 Tulsa, OK | Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually. | |
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join:2003-12-01 Franklin, TN
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| Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power said by KrK :Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually. I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things.
Why is the registrar owner being raided again? So now your house is raid just for being the domain owner. Wow, time to register "wikileaks.tv" to Comcast CEO, and I'll go ahead and register "wikileaks.info" to the AT&T CEO.
The two should cancel each other out in a fight for power. -- Fight NebuAD and the like: Click Here to pollute their data | |
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| Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power said by knightmb :said by KrK :Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually. I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things. Let's review:
Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth? Stupid may not be the right word. How about ignorant? Or infantile? Or uninformed? Those are all significantly more accurate since germany has laws on the books (and has had for decades) to the most extreme contrary to what was posited. You are not allowed to in any way support Nazism or criticize the realities of the holocaust.
Germans are constantly critical of their government. Almost to a fault (they really do complain about the most minor things), and most of the things that Germany blocks are sites like the KKK websites in America - right-radical sites.
Now, on a personal level, I deeply disagree with that. I think it's disgusting to censor speech - however depraved - that the majority doesn't like. However, the reason they suppress that speech is because of ignorant people making comments like you made above. If they didn't restrict it, you'd call them all Nazis for allowing Nazis to gather. Now that they suppress it, you call them Nazis. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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1 edit | Re: Amazing.... Abuse of Power This insulting is plain stupid, that's for sure. Your knee-jerk reaction seems misplaced, but in case you didn't get it, I'll explain my "stupid" comment.
Your point that about Germany censoring the far right/nazi political spectrum is valid, but isn't really part of the point of the comment other then that viewpoint is also on the blacklist. The point you apparently missed in the "stupid" comment was that that type of Censorship is just like something the Third Reich WOULD do which is ironic given Germany's hypersensitive efforts to not touch the Nazi past at all. So, in efforts to not appear to tolerate Nazism they are acting exactly like ... Nazis. Ironic, eh?
And it's not just the nazi sites on the blacklist, as has been shown.... really the main point is that this censorship is a bad idea in general, and is being abused, whether they mean well by blocking Child Porn or Nazi related sites, it quickly spreads to other things. | |
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| said by tiger72 :said by knightmb :said by KrK :Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually. I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things. Let's review: Does Germany have laws on the books saying it's illegal to embarrass their Government/mein Führer by publishing the truth? Stupid may not be the right word. How about ignorant? Or infantile? Or uninformed? Those are all significantly more accurate since germany has laws on the books (and has had for decades) to the most extreme contrary to what was posited. You are not allowed to in any way support Nazism or criticize the realities of the holocaust. Germans are constantly critical of their government. Almost to a fault (they really do complain about the most minor things), and most of the things that Germany blocks are sites like the KKK websites in America - right-radical sites. Now, on a personal level, I deeply disagree with that. I think it's disgusting to censor speech - however depraved - that the majority doesn't like. However, the reason they suppress that speech is because of ignorant people making comments like you made above. If they didn't restrict it, you'd call them all Nazis for allowing Nazis to gather. Now that they suppress it, you call them Nazis. There is nothing "conservative" at all about the KKK... Please don't call them radicals on the right... Radicals on the right would submit little to no government (some libertarians / anarchists).. -- They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. | |
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4 edits | said by knightmb :said by KrK :Sorry, it wasn't stupid. It was chosen for just the right feel, actually. I agree, not even sure why he/she even brought up "stupid comment" so in the spirit of things. Also agree, I didn't find anything stupid about Krk's comment.
Many, i included are aware already of Germany's speech laws regarding the holocaust. His question is unrelated in that manner.
His question was obviously rhetorical(possible even sarcastic), and even if it were not I still can't follow your Nazi connection.
Your comment comes off as kind of obsessed with Nazi/holocaust speech laws.
Way to go Wikileaks, hopefully this will embarrass the German government enough to stop this practice. | |
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 |   Nazipal
@plus.pl | LOL this is whistleblower ?! Accepting donations by Paypal - company that gladly will spend thousands to investigate your $5 sent to old classmate. Who are they kidding | |
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  anonii
@ca.us | DAMN Wow $uk that. Hope they had backups and were smart about it. | |
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 |   anony101
@comcast.net | Re: DAMN Once information is on the internet there is no way to control it. By now many many people all over the world have a copy of those documents. | |
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join:2007-10-21 Everett, WA | Re: DAMN I keep copies of stuff like this on my HDD for that very reason, realistic or not. | |
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 me1212
join:2008-11-20 Pleasant Hill, MO | W00T for wikileaks! If the Gov does wrong the people should know! | |
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  I Use Dial
join:2004-01-04 Morgan Hill, CA clubs: | Vive le Wikileaks! I love that site. | |
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  SLD Premium join:2002-04-17 | Nazis? Wow...that Nazis are back in control already??? | |
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 |  |   SLD Premium join:2002-04-17 | Ironic, isn't it? Acting like Nazis about Nazis... | |
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join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
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| Re: Nazis? said by SLD :Ironic, isn't it? Acting like Nazis about Nazis... Not really - look at the incoming ultra-nationalist parties in Israel... acting exactly like Nazis... | |
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2 edits | said by tiger72 :Maybe you should read up on the #1 topic that the German government censors: Nazi and racist organizations. ...And they say Americans aren't informed about the rest of the modern world... Do you even read posts before ranting-off something stupid like this? | |
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 |  dentman42
join:2001-10-02 Columbus, OH
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| said by SLD :Wow...that Nazis are back in control already??? When were they ever not in control? Except they claim they're AGAINST Nazis now, and fighting them using Nazi tactics...
Hitler would've been proud of these laws. | |
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  P Ness You'Ve Forgotten 9-11 Already Premium join:2001-08-29 Mineola, NY clubs: 
| Nuff said on one of the list
-partypoker.com
so the list are not just child porn
found
- adult porn sites - teen model sites - poker sites - anti govt blogs
sigh. -- www.stopfcc.comI do not think the government needs to restrict free speech especially on a device that has an off knob. | |
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join:2000-10-05 Collegeville, PA
| Re: Nuff said said by KrK :Once they have the system in place, it seems like they just can't resist abusing it.... You have it backwards. The "abuse' was the system's PURPOSE. The child porn/terrorist stuff was just an excuse. | |
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| said by P Ness :on one of the list -partypoker.com so the list are not just child porn Everyone knows that poker is the gateway to child pornography.  | |
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 |   tangojoker Peace
join:2004-01-25 Beaverton, OR | I am all for Wikileaks, but have concern with the list
what happens if some one clicks on the links and visits Child P site ? will he/she be trouble with law ?
isnt this inviting someone to browse around and explore ?
Cheers | |
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join:2004-08-05 Collegeville, PA
| Re: Nuff said To be honest, that list is an eye-opener.
I've been an Internet user since '93 and have never "stumbled" upon child porn nor gone looking for it.
As such, my assumption was that sites that had such content didn't exist at a particular location long enough for a blacklist to be effective.
I was curious to see what was on the list. I didn't think that there would be anything truly disturbing. "Probably some government twit that got his puritan panties in a bunch", I figured.
For the first few that I tried, that is exactly what I got. Hard-core, but nothing that seemed illegal. Then I clicked a link that lead to a page that was so obviously depraved and illegal that it was sickening.
I no longer have that arrogant curiosity. | |
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 Pv8man
join:2008-07-24 Hammond, IN
| First rule... Apparently the first rule about censorship is that you do NOT talk about censorship...
It's time for everyone to realize how important whistle blower sites like wikileaks are and it's time for other people to start branches of Wikileaks in case they get shut down, they can't shut down EVERY whistle blower site.
Down with corruption
All hail exposure. | |
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 |   DataRiker Premium join:2002-05-19 Metairie, LA clubs: | Re: First rule... Agreed 100 % | |
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 |   BabyBear Keep wise ...with Night-Owl
join:2007-01-11
| said by Pv8man :Apparently the first rule about censorship is that you do NOT talk about censorship... Thought that was Fight Club?
said by Pv8man :It's time for everyone to realize how important whistle blower sites like wikileaks are and it's time for other people to start branches of Wikileaks in case they get shut down, they can't shut down EVERY whistle blower site. That's for sure. Hopefully they take a page from Pirate Bay's server locating book. | |
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 Endgame Your member at work Premium join:2005-07-07 USA | Global oppression heats up The world police state is here so beware! »www.prisonplanet.com/ | |
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 |   stymied2forreal
@verizon.net
| Re: Global oppression heats up great website most people just dont realize that this is global conspired meant to bring down all opposition to one world govt. ACTA is nothing less than bringing down anti govt. soon enough the goose stompers will be stomping, throughout the world. trust me all they want is a Nazi regime (UN control)only this time against the peasants and middle class not the Jews. slaves and masters folks wake up | |
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 axus
join:2001-06-18 Washington, DC | Backwards thinking, .de These raids are giving more ammunition to the argument that child pornography censorship is a slippery slope towards losing other forms of speech. | |
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join:2001-02-26 antarctica
| Re: Treat Citizens like mushrooms said by Mr Matt :  Tyrants want treat their citizens like mushrooms. Keeping them in the dark and feed them B.S. You treat mushrooms like that!? YOU'RE A HORRIBLE PERSON! | |
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  COMMAN Plug Me In
join:2000-07-17 Mount Juliet, TN
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| If Only.......... Maybe SOMEDAY all newspapers/news-sites/newscasts, etc. will be more like Wikileaks and less like Entertainment Tonight....
Real News reporting - what a concept! -- Broadcasting TO the people, FOR the people, BY the people - INTERNET RADIO! | |
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 |   Shamayim I already have a Messiah. Premium join:2002-09-23 1 edit | Re: If Only.......... nm | |
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  Michael Pyshnov
@telus.com
| Documented censorship in journal Nature Censorship is a cowardly fraud. It prevents public disclosure of various crime more than it prevents anything else. The worst is self-censorship. And the worst in it is that public never knows what was censored. I decided to make one such case known to public. See »ca.geocities.com/uoftfraud/nature.html Honest reporters risk their lives to bring the truth to the world. Where does censorship stand in the world? | |
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