claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Getting very tired of the run-around from tech support
About once a year, my Verizon DSL service goes haywire. I lose sync or have unacceptably low sync or throughput speeds. Other than these times, my service (in Manhattan) is great. Unfortunately, every time I have to call tech support, I am invariably told that it must be a problem with my computer or modem, and that I had better replace them. Then, after many (many!) wasted hours on the phone and persistence on my part, I get a call from a technician who actually works in my city saying they found a problem in their router and fixed it. I can't help but wonder how many people are less persistent or educated about DSL and computers than I am, and have ended up buying new computers or modems on suggestion of support agents only to have the same problems remain.
I am having DSL problems now and have been posting in the VZ Direct forum. It's less of a time waster than phone support, but I still seem to be getting the run-around. My upstream sync rate is very low (about 400 when it should be 864), and they told me I probably have a virus on my computer. I am 100% sure of having no viruses.
Any advice or commiseration? |
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Smith6612
Premium
join:2008-02-01
united state
 ·Dish Network
 ·Verizon Online DSL
·FrontierNet Intern..
| Can you post up your complete line stats? Also if you have a NID, carbon block or you know where your copper line comes into your home, can you post up the modem stats from that demarcation point as well?
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It's all fun and games in a Team Fortress 2 battle until your sentry gun is sapped by the Spycrab! |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Here are the results of the tests that VZ asked me to do (speed tests, ping, and traceroute). I know that the upload speed is low. How does the rest look to you? Any ideas? Thanks.
SPEED TESTS (speedtest.net)
Down/Up
2855/357 (07/01/09 - 7:48 PM)
2855/359 (07/01/09 - 7:51 PM)
2855/357 (07/01/09 - 7:53 PM)
2852/357 (07/01/09 - 7:55 PM)
PING TESTS (using www.verizon.net)
1. Pinged Verizon.net - 10/10
2. Pinged Verizon.net - 10/10
TRACEROUTE TEST (took almost 15 minutes to complete)
Traceroute has started ...
traceroute to e3002.b.akamaiedge.net (69.192.28.79), 64 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 10.0.1.1 (10.0.1.1) 3.328 ms 1.974 ms 2.009 ms
2 * * *
3 10.32.145.1 (10.32.145.1) 27.829 ms 25.329 ms 23.092 ms
4 P5-1.NYCMNY-LCR-11.verizon-gni.net (130.81.45.18) 29.949 ms 24.942 ms 28.113 ms
5 so-2-1-0-0.NY325-BB-RTR1.verizon-gni.net (130.81.29.12) 63.474 ms 25.797 ms 25.360 ms
6 so-4-0-0-0.NWRK-BB-RTR1.verizon-gni.net (130.81.17.7) 30.777 ms 30.012 ms 30.669 ms
7 so-6-0-0-0.PEER-RTR1.NWK80.verizon-gni.net (130.81.17.157) 33.580 ms 29.694 ms 30.901 ms
8 130.81.14.42 (130.81.14.42) 28.845 ms 33.961 ms 32.313 ms
9 xe-2-3-0.cr1.nyc3.us.nlayer.net (69.31.95.158) 30.428 ms ae0.cr1.ewr1.us.nlayer.net (69.31.95.141) 30.722 ms xe-2-3-0.cr1.nyc3.us.nlayer.net (69.31.95.158) 29.996 ms
10 * ae2-50g.cr1.nyc2.us.nlayer.net (69.31.95.174) 33.486 ms 32.263 ms
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Smith6612
Premium
join:2008-02-01
united state | reply to claygreenber
Everything else looks fine to me. When you can get the line stats for me, post them up. |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY | I'm not quite sure what line stats you mean. Let me know and I'll post them right away. Thanks for your help! |
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Smith6612
Premium
join:2008-02-01
united state | reply to claygreenber
If you have a Westell modem, try this page.
»192.168.1.1/transtat.htm |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Here are the line stats reported in my modem interface:
VPI: 0
VCI: 35
DSL Mode Setting: MMODE
DSL Negotiated Mode: NOT TRAINED
Connection Status: showtime
Speed (down/up): 3355/539
ATM QoS Class: UBR
Near End CRC Errors:0/739078
Far End CRC Errors : 2/0
Near End CRC(Within last 30 mins) : 0/0
Far End CRC(Within last 30 mins) : 0/0
Near End RS FEC : 0/0
Far End RS FEC : 6212/0
Near End FEC(Within last 30 mins) : 0/0
Far End FEC(Within last 30 mins) : 0/0
Discarded Packets(Within last 30 mins): 0
NR Margin (Downstream/Upstream): 12/9
Attenuation (Downstream/Upstream): 32/26 |
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Smith6612
Premium
join:2008-02-01
united state
·Dish Network
·Verizon Online DSL
·FrontierNet Intern..
| I see the problem with your low upload speeds and dropouts. It's shown both by the upstream margin which is low for upstream, and your upstream attenuation is higher than it should be. Plug your modem into your NID (a gray box typically found on the outside of your home, it connects Verizon's copper network to your home's network), carbon block (serves the same function as a NID) or wherever the service enters your home, and post up the stats from there.
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It's all fun and games in a Team Fortress 2 battle until your sentry gun is sapped by the Spycrab! |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Hi.
I live in an apartment building. There is an NID in one of the closets in my apartment, but when I try to hook into it, I don't get any connectivity. I just get a blinking DSL light. There are three lines to hook into and I tried all of them. How strange. Maybe this is not actually the active NID? In any case, I wouldn't have access to an NID that was located outside the building or in the basement.
Any other ideas on how to resolve my problem? |
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Smith6612
Premium
join:2008-02-01
united state
·Dish Network
·Verizon Online DSL
·FrontierNet Intern..
| In this case, if you couldn't connect anywhere at a Demarcation point in the building, it's probably best to get a tech out to come clean up the lines for you (let him know about high upstream attenuation, low SNR and lower speeds, despite your line being good enough to hold the package if the upstream is cleaned. Should be a 2:1 ratio of downstream/upstream), or at least show you where your NID is (which your building manager might know which is yours as well).
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It's all fun and games in a Team Fortress 2 battle until your sentry gun is sapped by the Spycrab! |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Thanks so much for all of your help. I only wish that Verizon, who I am paying for service, cared as much as you do about helping me or fixing my issue. In the past, getting them to send a technician has been like pulling teeth....many teeth, and sometimes they cancel the trouble ticket without sending anyone or telling you. I guess it's time to suck it up and start the process of VZ tech support hell by making a call. |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Update...I finally got a Verizon tech at my apartment. He ran some tests through the CO and found that the SN margin was not great. After casing my setup, he decided to test another modem (Colt 450) he had brought with him, and he got a slightly better margin. So, his solution was that I need a new modem. I ordered one and it should arrive soon. What are the chances that the modem could have been causing my poor margin? |
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Bytebender
Bytebender
Premium
join:2008-02-12
Canada | I want to say "slim to none", but please do let us know.
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reboot, reset, reconfigure, then recycle. |
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Telcoguru
Premium
join:2005-08-22
Fresh Meadows, NY | reply to claygreenber
I agree the trouble does not appear to be your modem. The trouble is either in your wiring somewhere or you are too far away from the C.O. for the speed you are provisioned at. |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY | I should clarify though that I have always had great throughput in the past and nothing has changed in terms of wiring or distance from CO. |
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Arcturus
join:2008-04-18
London, ON
| reply to claygreenber
I have heard of and witnessed a lot of modem start to go bad slowly on their own....so its possible.
With that said, your description of the problems tells me that it is not the modem.
I still don't see an indication with your readings why there are so many near end CRC errors on the upstream. This does indicate a possible modem or cabling issue. *note this could also mean an LT card issue in the CO.
Looks like you can tell us when you get your new modem!
If the problem persists see if you can get a CO tech to test the stats and errors for the other customers on the same card as you are on. It could be as simple as needing the LT card to be reset, or replaced. |
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claygreenber
Premium
join:2007-08-02
New York, NY
| Thanks so much! Your response is very helpful. I got the new modem yesterday and have connected it. It's hard to tell if there is any improvement, since my speeds, margins, etc were changing so much. It seems so far to be a bit better: SNR margin is 10.3/9
Is that good? |
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Packeteers
Premium
join:2005-06-18
Forest Hills, NY
| reply to claygreenber
Clay - I could have written your post word for word. I also suffer about once a year from some Verizon employee stepping on my wires and screwing up an ordinarily perfect connection. all I can tell you is to grin, bare it, and be polite but persistent. in my case the duration of quality connection between failures keeps growing longer, so hopefully that will be an incentive for you to hang in there. I don't know if it matters, but ever since I had them change me over to FastPath (Dry Loop) from Interleave (POTS), my dry spells of bad connectivity have also decreased in frequency. |
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twbartender
join:2007-03-21
East Northport, NY
| reply to claygreenber
Have you tried either of the 2 phone numbers I instant messaged you, on July 4th, for help?
Bellow is my latest run around story, and how it was resolved.
We had a big rain storm here on Long Island, on Monday the 8th. After that my margins were all over the place, plus I was getting intermittent noise on the phone line. On Wednesday I called phone repair and told them about the problem. I was told it would be repaired Friday by 6pm. Thursday morning a repairman was knocking at my door at 8am. An hour and a half later he said it was repaired. An hour later the noise was back. I called repair again. I was told I had an appointment the following day. She was surprised when I told her the tech had come & gone, and I still had noise. She said she would have the dispatch supervisor call me right back. After 3 hours I was still waiting for a call, so I called repair again. I was told the ticket had been closed. The rep wanted to know if I wanted to report the noise again. She opened a new ticket, and said someone would be there the next day between 8 & 6. An hour and a half later there was a knock on my door. It was the original tech... He verified the noise and went back out to the poll. When he came back, he said the problem would have to be turned over to maintenance, because there weren't anymore clean pairs. He said that a splicer should be at my house the following morning. Lo and behold the splicer showed up at 9am. At first he said the line was clean, but all of a sudden he started hearing the noise. He put some sort of a meter on the line that told him the problem was 143' away. That was the distance to the pole across the street. An hour later he informed me had found & repaired 3 problems. When I tested the phone it was noise free, plus my DSL line margins went from an average, 17.0 Down / 23.0 Up, to 31.0/ 23. After he left, the line stayed trouble free for the better part of an hour. Now when I picked up the phone my downside margins went from 31, to 15. Plus the intermittent noise was back on the phone. I called repair again, and informed the rep that a splicer had just left. She tested and confirmed the noise, and said she'd keep the ticket open, and the tech would be back by the end of the day. At around 3:00 I checked the status of the ticket on line and found it had been closed almost an hour before. I called repair again! The rep confirmed the ticket was closed, and opened a new one. She said I had a Monday appointment now. After arguing over why I had to wait until Monday and the frustration of the canceled tickets, she said she would contact dispatch to see if someone could come that day. After 5 minute on hold I was informed no one could come because the splicers went home at 3:30. When I asked about a Saturday appointment, I was informed they didn't work on Saturdays. At that point I asked to speak to a manager. I was put on hold again, and then asked for a contact number. She wanted to hang up, and a manager would call me back. I refused, and was put on hold for 10 minutes. The rep came back on the line and told me to hang up and the manager would call me right back. Again I refused to hang up and gave her a different number to call. A few minutes later I received a call from a woman named Lori. She wanted to know how she could help me. After telling her the whole story, She informed me I was scheduled for a Saturday 8am appointment. I asked for her contact number in case they didn't show up. She assured me they would be there, and said that she didn't have a phone number. After I got off the phone, I went on line and saw that the ticket was for Monday, not Saturday. At that point I decided to call Customer Relations. The person I spoke with filed a report and said someone would get back to me on Monday, as there weren't any manger around. No one showed up at my house by 9am on Saturday, so I called repair again and told my story. The rep contacted dispatch, and said someone would be there on Saturday, but couldn't say when. Around 12:30 I went on line to check the ticket. It had been closed at 9:06, indicating the problem was repaired. Needles to say I was livid! I called repair again, and asked to speak to a manager. I got to speak with a manager named Dina Coulter. After going over the entire story again, and conveying my frustrations, she contacted dispatch to see why the ticket was closed. She told me that it was closed because the DSL section was scheduled to send a wire crew to my house on Monday. She said she would monitor the situation, and said I should contact the Albany center and ask to speak to her if there was a problem. That was all the information she had. Ater I got off the phone with her I called DSL tech support in Canada. They informed me that a tech was scheduled to be at my house that day, and I was his next appointment. Talk about being confused.... An hour after I got off the phone with them, I received a phone call from the Verizon maintenance department. They wanted to know if the splicer that was at my house on Friday fixed the problem. All I could do was laugh. When I started to tell her the story, she stopped me, and said she had the tech on the line, and set up a conference call. After telling the story, neither of them were aware of what had been going on. The tech took my number and said he would call me back after he spoke to his supervisor. Twenty minutes later he called back ans said his supervisor told him to check out the problem, thinking all I had was a bad filter on one of my phones. He showed up a 3:00. He tested the line, and at first said it was clean. Then all of a sudden his sidekick meter showed the line was 50% degraded. He worked on the line for over 4 hours, going from splice box to splice box making repairs. He left my house at 7:30pm. The line has been perfect since he finished, and all my DSL Stats improved. The margins are a steady 31.0/ 23.0, and the Line Attenuation dropped from 49.0/ 27.5 to 43.0/23.0.
The bottom line is... It took 4 technicians 3 days, and who knows how many wasted hours to get my problem resolved.
I received a call from an Antoinette, from the Customer Relations team on Tuesday. I got to tell my story one more time. After all the expected apologizes, she gave me her personal number and told me to contact her directly it I had any further problem. She also gave me a one month credit on my phone line. She admitted that Verizon dropped the ball big time. I have to believe that if it wasn't for my persistence, I'd still have the problem. |
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