Search:  

 
 
   All ForumsHot TopicsGallery






how-to block ads


 
Forums » Tech and Talk » OS and Software » All Things Unix » S.M.A.R.T. shows obviously wrong attribute!
Search Topic:
Uniqs:
601
Share Topic:
RSS topic:
toggle:
flat / full
normal / watch
Posting:
Post a:
Post a:
The Rig »
« CIFS mount - files not appearing in trash  
AuthorAll Replies


T0rn
Premium
join:2001-05-11
USA


1 edit
 S.M.A.R.T. shows obviously wrong attribute!

When using GSmartControl (which is a frontend for smartctl), it reads my netbook hard drive of having a "Reallocated Sector Count" of the number of sectors that make up my hard drive. In other words, even though this is a brand new drive, it is saying that every single sector was reallocated, which is obviously impossible. It should be at 0, but for some reason smartctl is reading it at a ridiculously huge number. Is there a tool I can download to reset this attribute? Is smartctl not the most reliable way to get an accurate reading from your hard drive's S.M.A.R.T. attributes?
--
CampaignForLiberty.com Educate yourself.


PetePuma
How many lumps do you want
Premium,MVM
join:2002-06-13
Arlington, VA
What is the exact number? It could be a case where it's incorrectly treating a -1 or something as an unsigned number.
--
Fight fire with water.


koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA


1 edit
reply to T0rn
Can you please provide full output from "smartctl -a {drive}"? Please don't use a front-end for this request -- I'd like to see the full, verbose output. I can help from that point going forward. (Wow, I sound like a CSR or something...)

And no, you cannot reset data stored in SMART. The only data that's possible to reset -- and only on very specific models of specific vendor drives -- is the SMART error log.
--
Making life hard for others since 1977.
I speak for myself and not my employer/affiliates of my employer.


T0rn
Premium
join:2001-05-11
USA


1 edit
said by koitsu See Profile :

Can you please provide full output from "smartctl -a {drive}"? Please don't use a front-end for this request -- I'd like to see the full, verbose output. I can help from that point going forward. (Wow, I sound like a CSR or something...)

And no, you cannot reset data stored in SMART. The only data that's possible to reset -- and only on very specific models of specific vendor drives -- is the SMART error log.
Upon a second look, it appears that the number of sectors that have been reallocated would make up a 4 PB (4,000 TB) hard drive, when my drive is only 160 GB! I just assumed the number would match the sector count of the entire drive, since it was so large, and should technically be at 0.

Here is the entire output of smartclt -a /dev/sda:


I ran all 3 tests, and they all passed. Even the "Reallocated Sector Count" claims to have no issues, which contradicts the raw value of 8589934592000.

GSmartControl says "NOTICE: This drive has a non-zero raw value, but there is no SMART warning yet. This could be an indication of future failures and/or potential data loss in bad sectors."

Here is where another problem lies. If I am to accept that this is just a glitch in the calculation, and that I do not have any bad/reallocated sectors, then what about in the future? How would I ever be able to use smartctl to know when my drive has reallocated some bad sectors? (A sign that the drive is failing.)

--
CampaignForLiberty.com Educate yourself.


koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA


2 edits
reply to T0rn
There are 3 issues here:

1) Your drive isn't in the internal smartctl database (used for handling SMART attribute tweaks):


Please get in contact with Bruce Allen and provide him the output you've provided above, and/or any other details he asks for.

2) It doesn't matter what values are shown in the RAW_VALUE column. You cannot look at SMART stats and assume what's returned is literally what's true. Seagate drives, for example, have exceedingly high numbers for SMART attribute 1 and 195, yet the drives are far from going bad.

What you absolutely need to look at under all circumstances is the VALUE compared to THRESH. These are the adjusted threshold values for what will trip a failed SMART health check -- that is to say, the adjusted values are what represent whether or not your drive is in good/bad condition. If you look at attribute 5, you can see that your current VALUE is 100, and the THRESH is set to 24. The WORST column represents the worst value ever seen on the drive, which is 100.

Thus, you can conclude your drive has very few (more than likely, zero!) reallocated sectors.

What you need to understand is that the specification for SMART does not require vendors to store their raw data in a defined format -- they can store whatever values they want there. Seagate is known for encoding some of their raw SMART data in a way which is only known to them. Bruce has figured out a couple of the encoding methods for some of the attributes, but not all of them.

Additionally, your drive has no indication of it ever seeing read or write failures at specific LBAs, indicating sector r/w failures. These would show up in the SMART log, and your SMART log is empty.

I can point you to an older thread here at DSLR where I posted "how" to read SMART attributes, if you'd like to read it.

3) Fujitsu has a very long history of "abusing" SMART. You can read the smartmontools FAQ page and documentation for further evidence of this.

And for sake of argument: we use Fujitsu SCSI drives (both 37GB and 120GB) at my workplace -- and have, on average, one of them go bad every week. Most of them suffer from two problems: 1) sectors going bad (confirmed using the SCSI card's BIOS), or 2) the drive literally falling off the SCSI bus (no indication of termination problems, controller issues, or otherwise), requiring a complete power-cycle of the drive before it will reappear (a soft reset won't fix it) on the bus. The latter indicates either crummy PCB design, shoddy components, or a major firmware bug.

And remember, people like to state that "SCSI drives are more robust/higher quality than ATA/SATA drives" -- which isn't necessarily true these days, but still: I wouldn't recommend Fujitsu even if they were the last hard drive manufacturer on the planet. That's just my opinion as someone who works with these drives in an enterprise environment 40 hours a week. :-)

--
Making life hard for others since 1977.
I speak for myself and not my employer/affiliates of my employer.


T0rn
Premium
join:2001-05-11
USA

 
said by koitsu See Profile :

There are 3 issues here:

1) Your drive isn't in the internal smartctl database (used for handling SMART attribute tweaks):


Please get in contact with Bruce Allen and provide him the output you've provided above, and/or any other details he asks for.

2) It doesn't matter what values are shown in the RAW_VALUE column. You cannot look at SMART stats and assume what's returned is literally what's true. Seagate drives, for example, have exceedingly high numbers for SMART attribute 1 and 195, yet the drives are far from going bad.

What you absolutely need to look at under all circumstances is the VALUE compared to THRESH. These are the adjusted threshold values for what will trip a failed SMART health check -- that is to say, the adjusted values are what represent whether or not your drive is in good/bad condition. If you look at attribute 5, you can see that your current VALUE is 100, and the THRESH is set to 24. The WORST column represents the worst value ever seen on the drive, which is 100.

Thus, you can conclude your drive has very few (more than likely, zero!) reallocated sectors.

What you need to understand is that the specification for SMART does not require vendors to store their raw data in a defined format -- they can store whatever values they want there. Seagate is known for encoding some of their raw SMART data in a way which is only known to them. Bruce has figured out a couple of the encoding methods for some of the attributes, but not all of them.

Additionally, your drive has no indication of it ever seeing read or write failures at specific LBAs, indicating sector r/w failures. These would show up in the SMART log, and your SMART log is empty.

I can point you to an older thread here at DSLR where I posted "how" to read SMART attributes, if you'd like to read it.

3) Fujitsu has a very long history of "abusing" SMART. You can read the smartmontools FAQ page and documentation for further evidence of this.

And for sake of argument: we use Fujitsu SCSI drives (both 37GB and 120GB) at my workplace -- and have, on average, one of them go bad every week. Most of them suffer from two problems: 1) sectors going bad (confirmed using the SCSI card's BIOS), or 2) the drive literally falling off the SCSI bus (no indication of termination problems, controller issues, or otherwise), requiring a complete power-cycle of the drive before it will reappear (a soft reset won't fix it) on the bus. The latter indicates either crummy PCB design, shoddy components, or a major firmware bug.

And remember, people like to state that "SCSI drives are more robust/higher quality than ATA/SATA drives" -- which isn't necessarily true these days, but still: I wouldn't recommend Fujitsu even if they were the last hard drive manufacturer on the planet. That's just my opinion as someone who works with these drives in an enterprise environment 40 hours a week. :-)

Thanks for the in-depth reply, koitsu. It has really given me a lot of insight. I will buzz Bruce Allen with an email about this, and provide whatever information he needs. Not sure if it will help much, but it is worth a try. I suppose I was looking too deep into this SMART reading, that I overlooked some basic hints about my drive's health. I may, in fact, just replace this drive with an SSD in the future, once the prices drop some more. It seems that in theory, an SSD drive gives you less headaches, and aside from the maximum times a memory cell can be rewritten, there are very few things that can cause an SSD to go bad. Plus, the additional battery life is a welcoming perk.

--
CampaignForLiberty.com Educate yourself.


koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA

No problem. Knowing how to read SMART stats -- specifically, when to and when not to trust RAW_VALUE -- is incredibly important. Sadly there's no "global standard" for interpreting the results, which is why smartctl has a drive database.

Also, if you plan on using an SSD, you will run into headaches. I document what my experience was like with XP, but the same applies to *IX operating systems. To me, the pain of setting it up (at least on Windows XP -- it's less of a pain on *IX given the low-level nature of partitioning/fs utilities) wasn't worth it. If I ran an *IX OS on my desktop, I'd probably have reinstalled the OS + repartitioned at the proper block boundary and been thrilled. But without a 2nd PC around, this isn't easy to do on XP.
--
Making life hard for others since 1977.
I speak for myself and not my employer/affiliates of my employer.

KodiacZiller

join:2008-09-04
73368
Another reason to use Western Digital, not that the OP had any choice in the matter here.
-
Forums » Tech and Talk » OS and Software » All Things UnixThe Rig »
« CIFS mount - files not appearing in trash  


Saturday, 28-Nov 10:45:39 Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Hosting by www.nac.net - DSL,Hosting & Co-lo | feedback | contact
over 10 years online! © 1999-2009 dslreports.com.
page compression OFF
Most commented news this week
· [122] Time Warner Cable Fires Broadside At Broadcasters
· [112] New AT&T Ad Campaign Hits Back At Verizon
· [96] Apple Joins AT&T Verizon Snark Fest
· [87] New Bill Takes Aim At Higher Verizon ETFs
· [72] TiVo Sees Record Customer Losses
· [69] In-Flight Internet Headed For Bumpy Landing?
· [69] Verizon CEO: Hulu Will Be Dead Soon
· [62] Thanksgiving Open Thread
· [54] Weekend Open Thread
· [40] EFF Wages War On Fine Print
Most people now reading
· Using AirMax to provide triple play services? [Wireless Service Providers]
· Once infected, Impossible to detect [Security]
· Windows 7 boot manager editing questions [Microsoft Help]
· Hosts file attributes set to system and hidden [Security]
· Why would I want an e reader? [General Questions]
· Motion Sickness Solutions? [General Questions]
· Why does it take so long? Mail question [General Questions]
· Is Gear Score now the new requirement to get pug invite? [World of Warcraft]
· What to use while demonoid is down? [Filesharing Software]
· [ PVP] 3.2 DK PvP D/W Spec... [World of Warcraft]