VindictiV
Pebkac Error
Premium,VIP
join:2001-11-27
Burlington, ON
clubs:
| Cogeco: A word from the guys who built it..
I'd like to start off with thanking a lot of you who have posted various items about the service; most of it seems to be pretty positive.
I've been following public opinion during our conversion to try to gauge how well it has been accepted by our users, and so far.. it appears to have gone over well.
I am the Manager of Internet Systems within Cogeco.
My group is responsible for the new cogeco.ca/net systems platform. (ie: email, web, ftp, proxy, news, etc..)
I wanted to post a little something.. unofficial of course.. to show that we (well I am) quite interested in hearing our customers opinions on what they've seen so far.
(disclaimer) Anything Ive written here in this post is not to be considered official Cogeco statements,etc.(/disclaimer)
We are not finished with the build yet. Quite a few additions have not been integrated as of this writing, but will be shortly.
In general, most of the systems have been operating pretty well considering the amount of time we had to pull it all together. We were the first @Home MSO to successfully convert their customers in North America.
I was formally the senior systems engineer, and was recently promoted to this position when we formally got word to build the platform for the conversion.
We are very excited here about the new platform. The new system is definitely 'state of the art'.
We are continually tweaking the systems as well to improve performance and reliability and, of course, are still 'shaking down' the new systems to squash all the bugs that may come up; but overall we have had a great deal of success.
I'm interested in hearing your experiences so far on how the service is holding up.
Heres the rules:
1) Dont ask me to raise the cap on your modem
2) Dont ask me for a shell account
3) Dont ask me for my autograph.. j/k 
btw: ftp2.cgocable.net is probably not going to be giving you fantastic transfer rates. It's part of the old legacy Wave platform which we are not doing a lot of work on and will be decommissioning shortly.
Try the tucows server; it shouldn't be too bad.
»tucows.cogeco.ca/adnload/194489_74584.html
for example for a 5MB download.
It is not part of the new platform eithier, but will handle transfers better than ftp2.
I'll try to get some sort of bandwidth testing site up when time permits.
On another note:
We just finished with the implementation of a new screaming caching system for web/ftp/streaming.
I would recommend if you have not already done so to add
proxy:8080 into your web browser if you dont have it already. It really helps with downloads and busy websites.
(In IE, its under - Tools,Internet Options,Connections, LAN settings, proxy, port 8080) |
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72245156
TSWB.org
Premium,ExMod 2000-04
join:2000-07-11
Winnipeg, MB
|  said by VindictiV:
1) Dont ask me to raise the cap on your modem
2) Dont ask me for a shell account
3) Dont ask me for my autograph.. j/k
And keep in mind my sharp, pointy teeth if the rules are broken! Welcome to DSL Reports. 
--
Join Team Starfire SETI@Home. Put your unused clock cycles to work! |
|
MacGyver
Bell Sucks
Premium,ExMod 2003-05
join:2001-10-14
Orleans, ON | reply to VindictiV
VindictiV, your presence here is much appreciated by all. Thanks for listening to and caring about your customers!
--
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Otherwise it WILL need fixing! |
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wheelert$93
T L C
ExMod 2002
join:2000-06-01
Lynden, ON
| reply to VindictiV
Hi ya VindictiV.. A couple of things..
1 - Routing.. Why oh why was Teleglobe selected for routing out of the area? They have some very serious issues with router stability and routing paths. To put it bluntly, it stinks! Putting it nicely.... Ummmmm, there isn't anything nice to say...
2 - User web server.. Weak. Getting a few errors during peak times. It's usually a Bad Gateway Error (Error 502)
3 - ToS/AUP.. When will the new one be posted for the customers?
Overall? Great service! It's a pity the infrastructure doesn't do a 100% coverage in Burlington. Otherwise the wife's business would be using it, too! Keep up the great work. It IS appreciated.
--
Heaven doesn't want me and Hell is afraid I'm going to take over. |
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VindictiV
Pebkac Error
Premium,VIP
join:2001-11-27
Burlington, ON
clubs:
| 1) Well unfortunately I dont take care of the routing side of the house. However, I do know we still are not done with the conversion on the network side. We are truly multi-homed, but will take time to change all the routers to fully take advantage of it.
2) Web server gateway errors. Yes, I am well aware of the problem. We did identify why it was happening, and it should be corrected as of this writing; but I still need to better be able to detect when its happening since it only happens under certain circumstances.
I should have this particular issue recticifed today/tomorrow depending on which component is causing the issue.
We are scheduling an upgrade to the next version right now because of some other minor issues as well; which this would probably fix out of the box.
3)TOS/AUP is being rewritten as we speak. I'm hiring another body specifically for abuse and security which I should have in place shortly.
The AUP is up; but you'll probably have to hunt for it.
We actually are going to be targeting network abusers much more stringently now. We find 1% of the users consume 90% of the bandwidth.. and obviously this doesnt bode well for other users on their nodes.
We've found simply adding more bandwidth just means these same people eat it up with the same result. So; we're approaching it from the other perspective.
You will probably see us billing for extreme overages coming very soon. I see some users using Gig's of traffic in days. They are obviously not using the service as intended; and some are using their modems for commercial purposes. Yes, we know.. and we're coming for you.
On another note we suspended the lockdown of the modems on the network since we didnt want any more interuptions during the conversion, but that will be starting up again as well.
Lockdown means if you are not using DHCP( you entered your IP address in your PC instead of having it served to you) you will no longer be able to use the service.
The reason is because that IP address you stole.. ok.. borrowed.. just caused someone else's PC to get knocked offline until they reboot again.
It just poses an administrative nightmare... and it is not necessary. The DHCP server will always try to give you the same IP address if it is available every time you fire up your PC. If it doesnt give you the same one, there is a reason why.. usually a node split or some other issue.
In any case; like I mentioned we still have some way to go before I'd certify the network and systems as truly production environments. We are currently still in the implementation stage for sure.. and due to the scope of what we are doing I still forsee months of work yet to go to improve and build on what we already have.
Thats it for now.
|
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wheelert$93
T L C
ExMod 2002
join:2000-06-01
Lynden, ON
| Heh.. That's good news. Any word on when connections will be based on the MAC address of the modem rather than the computer name? I understand the Windsor area is already doing this. Just curious as to when the Burlington area will convert?
With the change in ToS/AUP, is there going to be a written limit for uploads and downloads now? Gigs of traffic probably means different things to different folks. I can go for weeks without downloading or uploading anything other than page requests. Then there are days where I do spend some time downloading updates/programs/data. I suspect the overall history/use for the user will be taken into account, but can you give us a hint or two on how this crack down is going to be implemented?
--
Heaven doesn't want me and Hell is afraid I'm going to take over. |
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gordon21
Flash---
join:2000-12-11
Canada
| reply to VindictiV
Boy, I wish Sympatico would have the same atitude you have. They have fluffed me off when so many of us went through over 2 months of atrocious (50-100 kbits/sec) evening speeds.
I hope you plan to implement Cogeco internet in the Pembroke area soon.........you'll have me as a customer 1st day.......
Thanks for posting here....... |
|
MacGyver
Bell Sucks
Premium,ExMod 2003-05
join:2001-10-14
Orleans, ON
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Bell Sympatico
| Sympatico is watching us?
said by gordon21:
Boy, I wish Sympatico would have the same atitude you have.
Let me digress for a moment
At one time, they did. The now defunct site »www.sympaticousers.org was founded on that premise. Bell provided a server to run the site, and the site would be used to liason with customers. That worked for a while, but one day all contact was cut off by Bell management. After that happened, the whole mission of the site was dead and the site eventually died, too. The server is still there (try it and see), but there is currently no active site. However it was no secret that the number 1 visitor to the site was from some office at Bell (from the IP logs we could tell) so even though they weren't actively participating, they were watching. I wouldn't doubt they watch these forums, too......
But anyway, let's back on topic...
--
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Otherwise it WILL need fixing!
[text was edited by author 2001-11-27 13:37:34] |
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chrishch7
join:2001-07-05
Toronto, ON
| reply to VindictiV
Nicely done.
This is really a breath of fresh air. Too bad I can't get Cogeco as my broadband provider. People from Rogers wouldn't dare to show up at any user forums.
I am using Rogers. As many might have heard, Rogers is partly breaking free from @home. The email transition experience was okay for some, but horrifying for most. The Rogers transition site lacks information and their support phone lines have been tied up, despite adding 500 more agents (according to newspaper reports) to anticipate the phone calls.
First, the transition was delayed three times. When it did finally start, their web servers could not handle the load. Once you did get into the site, if the pages were able to be loaded, the instructions given to customers were unclear. They only gave screen shots for Microsoft products. Netscape users were left to rot on their own.
Many users are left to help ourselves by going to the Residential Broadband Users' Association »www.rbua.org/. If you go to the forums there, there hasn't been one good thing said about the transition. Email servers have been up and down, personal web space have been rejecting connections, news servers have zero percent completion, and you can't send any e-mail without a non-Rogers.com email address.
Rogers insist the transition is a move to improve service. However, if they call this service improvement, I don't want to picture what "your service will remain unchanged" would mean.
Too bad I don't have a choice. DSL isn't available in my area. If it were, I would have switched a long time ago.
[text was edited by author 2001-11-27 12:13:19] |
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wheelert$93
T L C
ExMod 2002
join:2000-06-01
Lynden, ON
| I have always found Cogeco to be responsive to their customer's needs. It's a rare occasion that I have to call tech support, and when I do, the staff has been very professional and up to speed on any issue that I may have. It's one of the things that has kept me a happy, satisfied customer for over 2 years now.
--
Heaven doesn't want me and Hell is afraid I'm going to take over. |
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72245156
TSWB.org
Premium,ExMod 2000-04
join:2000-07-11
Winnipeg, MB
| reply to gordon21
Re: Cogeco: A word from the guys who built it..
Let's add another rule to this thread - this is about Cogeco only. Keep it on the Cogeco subject. This isn't about Bell or Rogers.
--
Join Team Starfire SETI@Home. Put your unused clock cycles to work! |
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VindictiV
Pebkac Error
Premium,VIP
join:2001-11-27
Burlington, ON
clubs:
| reply to wheelert$93
In actuality our transition from @Home started last year when we took back DHCP from @home. (meaning, at that time we took DNS, IP address assignments, modem QOS profiles and configs back from @home).
We were also the first cable co in the world to deploy DOCSIS. As far as I know we are still the largest deployment of DOCSIS as well.
DOCSIS made the job easier of taking back DHCP because the modems.. whether Com21, samsung, ericson.. whatever, all adhere to the same standards. There are no exceptions.
We are usually on the bleeding edge of technology here as well in most arenas. Makes for exciting work in any case.
Last year, there was a very severe outage of @home's DHCP platform which caused our customers to drop. We were a couple of days into it when we decided to take it back and do it ourselves.
3-4 hours after that decision was made, we had our network and DHCP back under our control and our customers back online.
The only item left was Internet services. (proxy, web, news, email, etc.)
The transition is complete now. We have officially cut ties with @Home.
On your inquiry about computer name vs MAC address; that is already the case and has been since that transition last year. The computer name is completely irrelevant to us. All the tools we developed for checking connections and services are based on MAC.
The AUP/TOS will enforce a limit of bandwidth based on 1 months usage. However, we get alarmed immediately when excessive amounts are used real-time to detect abusers.
Keep in mind the reason for this is to catch abusers.
We are pretty generous with what we would term abuser, trust me. The users we see abusing may use GIG's of upstream and downstream traffic a day.
We'll be working towards the happy medium so everyone is happy.
Doing things like leaving morpheus on all day while you aren't home are good examples. You dont get any benefit, and you've congested the node to everyone else.
Im sure we have a few people running warez transfer points as well. We'll identify them and take action once we clearly identify our internal process.
In reality, there is plenty of bandwidth available. Only in some areas we see this problem and usually it is directly related to abuse.
Thats it for now.
On another note, the web gateway issue should be resolved now. |
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smoki
join:2000-10-19
Oakville, ON
| reply to VindictiV
Hey VindictiV, do you think can setup Network Updates/Network Info pages such as these ones »www.speakeasy.net/main.php?page=···workinfo
»www.speakeasy.net/main.php?page=···ysstatus
Also I remember back when I first got cable(when it was the Wave back in 97-98) they had a couple of newsgroups setup for Cogeco users where we could talk other users, and sometimes a Cogeco tech support would drop by to see if we have some problems or tell us about upcoming downtime/upgrades. Would you guys be able to set that up again??
PS. What do you think of upping the download speed to 3/2.5 Mbps;) |
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smoki
join:2000-10-19
Oakville, ON | reply to VindictiV
BTW, How can i find out how many people i have on my Node?? Can you setup something where I could enter my IP/MAC address and it would tell me the number of people on my node and the network traffic/status for my area?? |
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VindictiV
Pebkac Error
Premium,VIP
join:2001-11-27
Burlington, ON
clubs:
| reply to VindictiV
I dont think we will make that information public(number of customers per node) since really; there is no need.
The average user wouldn't understand what the numbers mean anyway. Can you tell me how many users on a node would be considered excessive? Probably not. Do you understand 256Q vs 64Q? Probably not.
The information isnt relevent to the average user; end performance is. There is such a thing as too much information. We dont provide that information outside of operations and engineering even within the company because it isnt relevent to the end user.
ie: I could tell you there are 3424 users on one upstream node.
Is that alot? What number are you expecting?
So heres the scenario.. you see that there are 8734 people on one node.. you think your connection is slow.. then you feel in your infinite wisdom that the number 8734 seems high so you call in to tech support and fill them in on your infinite wisdom about how the node is congested.
Meanwhile; what you dont know is that the node can support 50000 users and the slowness has nothing to do this number.
This number could also be different depending on the implementation and area.
Like I said; there is such a thing as too much information.
The news group idea is one Im already addressing. The problem is I dont want to set it up if I cant get a committment on the business level for a body to be there to answer questions. Nothing worse than creating a community based newsgroup and the moderator doesnt show his face. I'd rather not build it until I can get that commitment. Chances are I'll get someone to volunteer for it.. but my guess is I'll have something in place shortly.
In other news.. well we're busy here so even one day means things move fast..
The interim news server is being replaced tomorrow morning with the permanent news reading cluster.
You dont have to change anything; but their will be a significant change in news performance, groups available, the robustness of the feeds and the length of time we store articles. Postings should also show up much faster.
We're beta'ing it now and will have it in production tomorrow morning if all goes well.
The service updates pages Ive discussed before with other dept's within the company. Suffice is to say, if I could build it without external intervention I would have done it already. However, like most things in a company this size it requires a very large amount of coordination and cooperation, a project plan and development team.. and budget. All those magical items = final product.
Fortunately, we seem to have very good working relationships with other departments and the respective parties are all looking towards implementing this.
You will probably see it early next year integrated into the self care website. (Which is already available).
If you havent already seen it:
»selfcare1.cogeco.net/webcommerce/an2.html
Basically this is along the line of member services from @home.
Thanks for the support everyone. Have a good evening I'll check in tomorrow. |
|
Chromac
join:2001-08-29
L'Orignal, ON
 ·Cogeco Cable
| Welcome VindictiV,
Good to see someone from the company in this forum. Give Andre S. a nudge at your next meeting and whisper that Hawkesbury is still waiting for Inet service. Hopefully he won't laugh too loudly. Ha! Ha!
Thanks for the tip on "ftp2" I wasn't aware of that, which would explain the slow dl speeds I was getting right off the COPI UBR.
Later
Paul |
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TilhasBB
Formally Goden99
Premium
join:2000-08-05
canada
| reply to VindictiV
>We actually are going to be targeting network abusers >much more stringently now. We find 1% of the users >consume 90% of the bandwidth.. and obviously this doesnt >bode well for other users on their nodes.
>We've found simply adding more bandwidth just means these >same people eat it up with the same result. So; we're >approaching it from the other perspective.
Well what do you consider an abuser ? 6G down and 1G up is simple not enough. I personally do 12G down a month and under 1G upload.
How do I download so much you ask your self ? Simple go to morpheus and download a movie for example.. Most of the time a movie for example is 650 megs, I must download it 4-5 times before it WORKS. either its missing a part, bad quality, doesn't work, etc...
is that abuse ? I think not.
if I do 50G down 10G up then yes that's abuse but do you call me an abuser ? Obviously because you can only do a Huge upload by being a server.
>You will probably see us billing for extreme overages >coming very soon. I see some users using Gig's of traffic >in days. They are obviously not using the service as >intended; and some are using their modems for commercial >purposes. Yes, we know.. and we're coming for you.
I am a Videotron user (Cogeco not available in my area) but I believe that Cogeco also has a problem with there script, that you can't check how much you download. So we must run programs like Du-meter to track our selves or your going to fix this script problem first ?
>The AUP/TOS will enforce a limit of bandwidth based on 1 >months usage. However, we get alarmed immediately when >excessive amounts are used real-time to detect abusers.
Yes but would you give a warning? my friend was once hacked (he was in university) and was used because of his fast connection (almost a T3 he downloades a good 500k a second and upload around 500k as well) and was used a server without him knowing, till he got a call telling him he's abusing and when he told the he didn't know what there talking about they thought he was Lying till they came to him the next day and saw like 3 Trojans on his computer.
>Keep in mind the reason for this is to catch abusers.
>We are pretty generous with what we would term abuser, >trust me. The users we see abusing may use GIG's of >upstream and downstream traffic a day.
What do you consider an Abuser (a question asked repeatedly I know)
>Doing things like leaving morpheus on all day while you >aren't home are good examples. You dont get any benefit, >and you've congested the node to everyone else.
>Im sure we have a few people running warez transfer >points as well. We'll identify them and take action once >we clearly identify our internal process.
But why would that matter if you forget morpheus on all day ? You cap us at 15k Upload i am sure that doesn't take much bandwidth.
and i would just like to ask after the abusers have been stopped are you going to increase the upload cap from 15k to 30k so we can do Videoconferencing ? Because if I try doing it now it's not possible you only see stuttering from my side because 15k is simple not fast enough 25k would be perfect thou.
nb: yes I can conference at 15k but quality is really pathetic, compare to the quality I get from someone at Rogers for example who has the same camera but can upload at 45k |
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VindictiV
Pebkac Error
Premium,VIP
join:2001-11-27
Burlington, ON
clubs:
|
Well to be clear I should mention I take care of the systems side for Ontario and not Quebec; and we do not use the same network or systems at all.
This may change someday, but they were built seperately and have totally different architectures.
Unfortunately I cant answer for the PQ side since I'm not involved in their operations.
I'll fill you in on where we are sitting at the moment in Ontario however.
Q: What do you consider an Abuser (a question asked repeatedly I know)
A: Im not mentioning what is going to be considered abuse because we are still defining it.
However, upload caps here are set for 384k not 15k, so yes, you can do some damage. Typically downloads are not where you see problems, you see them in the uploads. (upstream vs downstream)
Typically your downstream is always higher than the upstream is, and upstream traffic is usually the culprit on congested systems.
I don't need to hear about movie downloads; I get copyright infringement notices all the time about people making that kind of material available through their computers. Since the DMCA doesnt apply in Canada yet you can get away with it.. sort of.. ; but that may not be for long.
The way things are going they may start making the ISP accountable for their customers content. It will be a sad day when that happens. I dont look forward to that at all.
Billing for overages will probably be in the neighborhood of 2 bucks per 100MB. Not sure yet.
You are right though in that I forgot to mention that we fully intend to contact the user before we take any action. So yes, they will get a warning. The fact is a lot of people are not aware there is a problem in many cases.
I am not sure yet what the PQ division is doing or what they are enforcing, however I anticipate we will have more direct contact when we peer our networks at some point.
We do have discussions with our PQ division quite often, but more to the point of sharing info on each others experiences in design or evaluations of new products, etc. I have not followed up with them on their abuse procedures yet.
Some other points of interest:
On the virus note; we are pretty active in attempting to stop a lot of email virus propagation. I drop well over 500,000 virus infected emails a day right now on our systems based on custom filters we have developed. That is not even being filtered through an actual virus scanner yet; which will probably be coming soon as well.
On a spam note we subscribe to MAPS RBL+ to help reduce spam. Over all there are a lot of value added services we do that are not advertised or known; but what you did not see is what the service is about.
I'll try to post some of the new initiatives we'll be taking on as we move toward the approval/implementation stages of the projects. |
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zedsdead
Premium,VIP
join:2000-08-24
Burlington, ON
·Cogeco Cable
| Uh Oh
Looks like a routing problem from Windsor to the new mail server. Just reported this to tech support but maybe you can get faster action. Just to be clear, all other services work fine, ie. browsing etc. Also setting it to mail.cogeco.ca results in the same loop.
traceroute to pop.cogeco.ca (216.221.81.110), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
1 ubr1.wite1.on.cogeco.ca (10.71.80.1) 12.334 ms 9.453 ms 8.389 ms
2 d226-4-1.home.cgocable.net (24.226.4.1) 10.019 ms 10.026 ms 10.585 ms
3 r1.wido1.on.home.net (24.226.4.2) 11.025 ms 37.245 ms 13.104 ms
4 HalaCore1-P1-1.cgocable.net (24.226.0.210) 15.884 ms 14.197 ms 16.678 ms
5 cgowave-0-50.cgocable.net (24.226.0.50) 16.054 ms 18.933 ms 18.069 ms
6 cgowave-0-49.cgocable.net (24.226.0.49) 17.167 ms 16.643 ms 14.820 ms
7 cgowave-0-50.cgocable.net (24.226.0.50) 16.816 ms 17.559 ms 28.840 ms
8 cgowave-0-49.cgocable.net (24.226.0.49) 15.943 ms 20.996 ms 16.405 ms
9 cgowave-0-50.cgocable.net (24.226.0.50) 42.440 ms 16.998 ms 25.968 ms
10 cgowave-0-49.cgocable.net (24.226.0.49) 17.002 ms 17.325 ms 14.607 ms
11 cgowave-0-50.cgocable.net (24.226.0.50) 19.738 ms 16.330 ms 20.758 ms
12 cgowave-0-49.cgocable.net (24.226.0.49) 40.399 ms 17.373 ms 25.420 ms
13 cgowave-0-50.cgocable.net (24.226.0.50) 35.098 ms
[text was edited by author 2001-11-28 13:08:38] |
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TilhasBB
Formally Goden99
Premium
join:2000-08-05
canada
| reply to VindictiV
Re: Cogeco: A word from the guys who built it..
Thanks a lot.
you seem to be one of the good guyz. just hope there were more people like you running the show.
just one other thing thou, all the news about ISPs wanting to get users to bann NAT and use »www.cedmagazine.com/ced/2001/1101/11d.htm so they can't share there connection. Is this TRUE ?
I personally Share my connection with my dad's pc but all he does is once every day or two he checks his email and sends emails (not even 10Megs both ways a month). I think it's crazy to actually pay 19.95$ for an Extra ip for him. how do you treat situations like this ? |
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