djousma
join:2000-04-18
Hudsonville, MI
clubs: 
1 edit | [ATT CV] Suspended because of no E-911
All,
I just received a letter from ATT stating that they will be suspending my service on 5/21 because they do not offer E-911 for the area I live in. I called and the CSR verified that as fact. What is wierd though is that I can come through the ATTCV front-end website, and put in my address, and it says that I qualify.
I gotta say, I'm really pissed, because I love the service.
With that being said, who is the next best service? Probably should stay away from Vonage right now?
Help!
Thanks, Dave |
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nycityny
Premium
join:2005-08-09
New York, NY | »/gbu |
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Fisamo
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Apex, NC | reply to djousma
I thought that anyone who had service with them prior to the E911 regulation's effective date would be able to keep their service, anyway.  |
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djousma
join:2000-04-18
Hudsonville, MI
clubs: | I've been on ATTCV for 3 years now. They appear to be force cancelling everyone who is not on E911. This is sad since other voip providers in my area provide it..... I just switched to sunrocket. We'll see how that goes.
Dave |
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Lenagainster
join:2005-01-07
Silver Spring, MD
 ·VoicePulse
 ·DIRECTV
·magicjack.com
| said by djousma  :...They appear to be force cancelling everyone who is not on E911. ... It is strange that ATT would kick a customer out, especially that in their terms of service the customer agrees not to hold ATT liable for anything related to the inability to contact 911. But they do have the statement that "LIMITATIONS APPLICABLE TO BOTH ALTERNATIVE 911 AND E-911 SERVICE: AT&T CALLVANTAGE SERVICE IS ONLY AVAILABLE IN LOCATIONS IN WHICH AT&T IS ABLE TO PROVIDE 911 SERVICES. USE OF AT&T CALLVANTAGE SERVICE AT ANY OTHER LOCATION IS PROHIBITED." I guess their lawyers felt it was better to lose a few customers than fight a potential lawsuit relative to 911. |
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christcorp
Premium
join:2001-05-21
Cheyenne, WY
·VOIPo
 ·Bresnan Online
| reply to djousma
said by djousma :..... I just switched to sunrocket. We'll see how that goes. Dave You went from ATT to Sunrocket? Please, pray tell, what made you do such a thing. Totally different types of providers. I can see going from ATT to Vonage, Packet8, VoicePulse, Nuvio, and a host of others. But based on other's experiences, that doesn't seem like the normal transition. Unless of course, the price is what was important to you. Switching between SR, with Viatalk, Zingotel, Lingo, BBTelsys, etc... seems common. Not cutting any of these providers down, nor saying that they aren't a good choice, just that those who normally choose ATT and similar providers, don't consider SunRocket as an equal alternative. Later... Mike... |
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ultravista1
join:2000-08-02
Las Vegas, NV | I'm in Las Vegas Nevada and having my service disconnected also. It appears AT&T doesn't have a E911 provider in the state.
Very irritating ...
I've been a custmer for 3 years also. Now off to Vonage. |
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RockyBB
Premium
join:2005-01-31
Longmont, CO
| reply to christcorp
said by christcorp :said by djousma :..... I just switched to sunrocket. We'll see how that goes. Dave You went from ATT to Sunrocket? Hardcore BBR/VOIP players (like you and me) have a different persepective than others. To maintain a customer base as large as SR's, it's really likely that the vast majority of users just plug it in and it works. The problems come into play when personal contact is required -- and only a subset of those transactions is exposed to our reality of SR. Personally, I would not enter a building where only a far corner is on fire, but we all have different evaluation criteria. Hopefully, Dave will let us know how it goes for him. |
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djousma
join:2000-04-18
Hudsonville, MI
clubs:
| reply to christcorp
You went from ATT to Sunrocket? Please, pray tell, what made you do such a thing. Totally different types of providers. I can see going from ATT to Vonage, Packet8, VoicePulse, Nuvio, and a host of others. But based on other's experiences, that doesn't seem like the normal transition. Unless of course, the price is what was important to you. Switching between SR, with Viatalk, Zingotel, Lingo, BBTelsys, etc... seems common. Not cutting any of these providers down, nor saying that they aren't a good choice, just that those who normally choose ATT and similar providers, don't consider SunRocket as an equal alternative. Later... Mike...
Mike,
I would have gone to Vonage, but with the current state of their litigation, I thought I would avoid them for now. I have some buddies already on Sunrocket, and spoke highly of the service, so I thought I'd give it a try(and no, the did not get the referral fee). The price is right.... $199 for 15 months, 0 activation, and 0 on equipment. Comes out to about $13.25 / month. I was paying $25/month with ATTCV.
I guess time will tell.
Dave |
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LakeMIGoldCoast
| reply to djousma
Dave, wait a minute, you're in HUDSONVILLE and AT&T says they can't provide E911 service there? That sounds like total BS to me - after all, AT&T is the incumbent phone company in Hudsonville! So if AT&T-CV is claiming they can't get E911 service from AT&T-Michigan, I'd say that something is seriously screwed up at AT&T. Is it possible that AT&T would prefer to see their customers on a higher-priced unlimited plan through their ILEC division as opposed to the lower-price CV division? Is it possible that AT&T is so mired in old-style traditional telco thinking that they can't do VoIP properly?
Anyway, there are several other VoIP companies that would be more than happy to have your business, everyone from your local cable company (Charter Communications) to most of the other companies discussed on this board. ViaTalk has their own forum here, you can go there to get opinions of their service, and VoicePulse also gets excellent reviews, and both of those companies offer excellent service (including E911) throughout Michigan. Personally I'd go with one of them rather than with any service offered by an incumbent cable or phone company. One thing that might be a determining factor for you is whether you make calls to Canada - some companies include Canada in their unlimited plans, while others do not. Another issue might be whether you have an "unlocked" device - some companies let you "bring your own device" while others do not.
Definitely check out VoicePulse and ViaTalk, I know folks who use both in Michigan and are quite happy with them, and I'm 99.99% positive that both would be able to offer you E911 service. I don't know if you're in Kent or Ottawa County but it makes no difference because both E911 centers are easily accessible if a VoIP company wants to get calls into them - which, apparently, AT&T's CV side does not! |
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Fisamo
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Apex, NC
·AT&T CallVantage
·VOIPo
| I hate to burst the conspiracy theory, but CallVantage and the POTS AT&T world are two completely different animals. Same company, yes (now that SBC and AT&T have merged), but they operate under different infrastructure. For example, CallVantage DID numbers are assigned from (or to, in the case of ported #'s) Teleport Communications Group (TCG), a subsidiary of pre-SBC AT&T (and post, of course). I don't know for certain what their E911 setup is like, but I would assume that it is somehow through TCG and not AT&T (e.g. ILEC) facilities.
I don't know what plans, if any, AT&T has to integrate operations between their residential VoIP business (CallVantage) and residential POTS service. One would think it would be a win-win for them to offer service at a lower price point to consumers that also has less overhead for them. With all of the junk fees they collect for POTS lines, the profit margin may still be better for POTS, but the maintenance of that network has to be pretty costly.
In any case, IMO, AT&T is making some short-sighted decisions with respect to CallVantage: how they handle E911 verification seems to limit customers to numbers in their rate center (unless they pay extra for a virtual number that would also ring into their 'main' line). Cutting off legacy customers who can't be made E911 compliant does nothing for good will with said customers, as at least two people in this thread have posted.
But in the end, it's their business, and if they keep approaching it with some of these attitudes, it won't last too long. |
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djousma
join:2000-04-18
Hudsonville, MI
clubs:
| I guess the handwriting is on the wall. If you go to their website as a new customer, you can no longer get a new number through ATTCV in my area, you can only transfer an existing number. Secondly, going through the new customer front-end, and put in my home address, the do not disqualify me for E911. Not sure why, but they must not want my business. At this point, I will leave anyway. I've already signed up for SunRocket after talking with a co-worker that has it. And it ends up(if the quality is good) much cheaper than ATTCV anyway. I was on the unlimited local/long distance plan for $24.95(was paying #29.95, until I accidentally found they had lowered the price, thanks for not telling me, btw), and the same plan on SR is $199 for 15 months(or about $13.25 a month).
We'll see how things work I guess.
Dave |
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epickles
join:2005-02-18
Morrow, OH
| reply to djousma
I'm a little late to jump into this conversation, but I may be able to add a little insight to this... Unfortunately I may be getting my pink slip also soon.
About 2 months ago I referred my neighbor to ATTCV... They called, went through the sign-up process, and was rejected by ATT. They told them that the E911 wasn't available. They then countered and said that "our next-door neighbor has it!". The ATT rep stated that "your neighbor wouldn't have it much longer."
I called ATT because it sounded rediculous, but they did tell me that they "fired" a bunch of customers because of this. However, the rep said that I may have slipped through the cracks. They stated that they fired a bunch of them back in December.
Evidently there is another wave coming... hopefully I won't be part of this wave because of all the VOIP providers I've tried (and used), I've been with ATTCV for around 3 years... it's the only one that is wife approved (and liked!) and I cringe at the thought of having to switch.
What happened to the first 75 years of phone service where you had to call the police/fire/ems using their FULL phone number??? What's it take to dial an extra 4 digits.. certainly not life or death. Clearly post the emergency phone number on or near the telephone... But then again there are a lot of idiots in the world today who like to sue.
Ed. |
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RockyBB
Premium
join:2005-01-31
Longmont, CO
| one thing about AT&T that cannot be disputed is they have a very aggressive internal legal department. with all the assets of that company at risk with every transaction, they will ensure that they will not be on the losing end of a lawsuit charging negligence. smaller companies, and privately owned companies, and companies that don't have government contracts can play fast and loose if they wish. but AT&T will not do that, at least not for very long. they will provide service and lose money on a customer, but they won't provide service in conflict with some regulation somewhere. My guess is that the legacy TCG found a limited market for business services in that area, and is closing down their operations in that rate center because residential CLEC services (especially when all the revenue is internal) don't have the same margins. |
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NY Tel
Premium
join:2004-04-09
Smithtown, NY
·VOIPo
1 edit | reply to epickles
Ok this is little out of the ordinary but if you really don't care about 911 service, just select an address where your phone rate center is located. I have a friend in the Middle of Massachusetts who could not get it so we listed his address as his work cubicle right smack in the middle of downtown Boston. He got to keep his CV service because he selected a rate center where they DO provide e911 service.
It is a workaround but it can be done.
Libraries and gas stations are good targets in the middle of a big city.
Just remember that when you DO dial 911 for help, you will be out of luck because the police will show up at Arby's where the TA is registered....lol |
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epickles
join:2005-02-18
Morrow, OH | reply to djousma
You sound a little smarter than the average bear... Not sure why I didn't think about that 
Ed. |
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NY Tel
Premium
join:2004-04-09
Smithtown, NY
·VOIPo
| said by epickles :You sound a little smarter than the average bear... Not sure why I didn't think about that Ed. It's the New York Mentality, coupled with a few years working in product development for Verizon. Gives you a fresh perspective on how to do anything and get paid for it. |
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egcarter
join:2004-10-10
Keaau, HI
| reply to djousma
Same here in Hawaii. All AT&T Callvantage customers will be suspended on 5/21 (incoming and 911, 800 or 411 outgoing calls), then totally dumped a month later.
I've been with Callvantage since soon after they introduced the service, and am P.O.'ed, but understand their position.
They are dismantling their "A911" infrastructure (probably to save money) and I'm sure their legal department doesn't want to get into a Vonage-type 911 situation.
I supposed one could "move" to an E911 area and keep the service... |
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NY Tel
Premium
join:2004-04-09
Smithtown, NY
·VOIPo
| said by egcarter :I supposed one could "move" to an E911 area and keep the service...  Yup. |
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Lenagainster
join:2005-01-07
Silver Spring, MD
·VoicePulse
·DIRECTV
·magicjack.com
| reply to djousma
I was wondering if anything was mentioned on the CallVantage website about terminating A911 customers. I found a statement that read "If you are an existing customer it is possible you may have Alternative 911 instead of E-911. To read information about your 911 Service as an existing customer, click here". When I clicked that link, it required me to sign in. Since I am no longer an ATTCV customer, couldn't do it. I wonder what it says. Could a CV customer go there and tell us what it says?
It is still hard for me to comprehend the amount of corporate greed that went in to the decision to screw all these CV customers because of the fear of a lawsuit from an unanswered 911 call when the TOS specifically releases ATT from any liability. It is a stupid decision that will backfire in the PR arena. |
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