mesmerMAN
join:2006-01-18
Miami, FL | This is the start of a series of headaches for Big Business
whether that's a good thing or not depends on your commitement to big business and how they prove themselves to the little man  |
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DaBavarian
Premium
join:2006-02-22
Saginaw, MI
|  Followed by high taxes. You would think with San Fran Values applied Democrats would be more involved in promoting broadband and deployment. Deployment is only going to happen by the means of big business to make it happen with private investment. Maybe there will be a welfare system established broadband now and free computers for all the public funded wifi. |
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KoolMoe
Aw Man
Premium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD
clubs:
 ·Verizon FIOS
 ·Speakeasy
| said by DaBavarian  : Deployment is only going to happen by the means of big business to make it happen with private investment. What does that even mean?
Are you suggesting the only way for consumers to have broadband available is to depend on private enterprise?
If so, doesn't that completely ignore (and thus become invalid) the multiple muni efforts currently established or under development?
KM
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Don't Lie - Be Kind - Realize your Potential |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
·Embarq
| reply to DaBavarian
said by DaBavarian :Deployment is only going to happen by the means of big business to make it happen with private investment. Broadband deployment will happen as companies think it is profitable. If they think deploying technology X at location Y will be profitable they will do it. With the way things have been going competition will be nil and there will be little incentive for ISPs to expand as they won't be in a race with anyone else. They'll do it at their own leisure with minimal risk. If we can get real competition companies will be climbing over each other to offer services and not be left behind.
I'm for deregulation, to a point, but at some point you have to say enough is enough, monopolies are getting too big, and the US is suffering from it.
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Blackened
Your Freedom Fries Are Stale
join:2003-09-29 | reply to mesmerMAN
It's definitely a good thing.
Now all they need to do is start instituting muni broadband nationwide and we'll truly see how competitive AT&T really is. |
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DaBavarian
Premium
join:2006-02-22
Saginaw, MI
| reply to KoolMoe
Personally, I just don't see public funded Internet access being an adequate answer or much of anything else that government provides/runs. If broadband access is considered a "right" as some communities call it then those same communities should also be willing to pay for computers for its residence to access the wifi network. |
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DaBavarian
Premium
join:2006-02-22
Saginaw, MI | residents....(sp) |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
·Embarq
| reply to DaBavarian
said by DaBavarian :Personally, I just don't see public funded Internet access being an adequate answer or much of anything else that government provides/runs. A municipal running a service is not within and of itself a bad thing. Some local governments do a good job, others a bad. Many cities and counties run their own garbage collection/recycling, electricity, water, and other services just fine. There is no reason a locally owned ISP can't do a good job. In fact, many are doing good. If the locals vote to approve having their tax money spent on a muni-ISP then they should have every right to give it a shot. If it fails then it's their own money down the drain.
--
"Padre, nobody said war was fun now bowl!" - Sherman T Potter
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here | reply to Blackened
It's not competition if you can use the force of gov't and limitless cash flow to run the other guys outof town.
How about we have some gov't run stores, auto dealers, etc and see how well thatgoes over. |
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Blackened
Your Freedom Fries Are Stale
join:2003-09-29
| said by bogey780 :It's not competition if you can use the force of gov't and limitless cash flow to run the other guys outof town. How about we have some gov't run stores, auto dealers, etc and see how well thatgoes over. The people have spoken, and in nearly every vote that's come up for muni broadband it's passed. Considering the corporations can't get broadband to every person in a state or city they service, and don't care to, it needs to be done in some other fashion.
You gave a very presumptuous analogy, since broadband is not a consumer good, but a vital information service. It is why many cities are deciding to go with muni, and much more to come. Heck, I'd sure like the surrounding cities here to go muni too. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
·Embarq
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :It's not competition if you can use the force of gov't and limitless cash flow to run the other guys outof town. How about we have some gov't run stores, auto dealers, etc and see how well thatgoes over. If there was no other stores, auto dealers, etc. in the area then why shouldn't the community be allowed to band together to provide one?
--
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| reply to Blackened
'You gave a very presumptuous analogy, since broadband is not a consumer good, but a vital information service.'
Food and housing isn't vital?
I'm suprised that more Americans aren't concerned that the gov't is trying to run Fortune 500 companies out of busines. |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| reply to Maxo
Because if the gov't does it for below cost no one ever will come along to do it.
It's the same thing with food aid. Why should North Korea spend money on farming when America will feed them? Same with any gov't expenditure to "meet people's needs". It doesn't amke the problem go away; it just makes the gov't bigger. |
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Blackened
Your Freedom Fries Are Stale
join:2003-09-29
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :'You gave a very presumptuous analogy, since broadband is not a consumer good, but a vital information service.' Food and housing isn't vital? Section 8? Food stamps? Welfare? D'oh!
quote:
I'm suprised that more Americans aren't concerned that the gov't is trying to run Fortune 500 companies out of busines.
Peace is war? Freedom is slavery?
»money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/···ll/1995/
»money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/···ll/2000/
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Fortune_500 (2006)
Looks like since 2000, the top 500 (minus GM) corporate revenue and profits have doubled, whereas the growth from 1995 to 2000 was slow and steady. So I get 2 things from this:
• #1, the corporations aren't in any trouble at all. It shows by how much more they're bringing in.
• #2, I'm not going to feel bad for the rich, considering the play in interest groups and dwindling medical coverage despite record profits.
I think you got your priorities twisted, homie. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
·Embarq
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :Because if the gov't does it for below cost no one ever will come along to do it. It's the same thing with food aid. Why should North Korea spend money on farming when America will feed them? Same with any gov't expenditure to "meet people's needs". It doesn't amke the problem go away; it just makes the gov't bigger. First, muni's do make the problem go away. Second, I'm a big supporter of states, and localities, rights. I would love for there to be a huge shift in power away from the federal government and moved towards the local governments. Local governments should be empowered to meet the needs of the people that are not otherwise being met. The government should be of, for, and by the people. If the collective people want to run a local ISP I don't see a problem in that. I don't like to see people's will to help themselves squashed by a so-called right to profit. Your right to profit ends when it becomes to the detriment of the community.
--
"Padre, nobody said war was fun now bowl!" - Sherman T Potter
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Duck Duck Goose
@ameritech.net
| reply to Blackened
Wow. I guess those retired on a fixed income who more or less depend on the dividends and income from investments (mutual funds, retirement plans, etc.) are "the rich". Do you know what funds those plans? Investments. Do you know what those investments are? Stocks and bonds. Do you know who issues those stocks and bonds? Your evil corporations.
I sincerely hope you are never in a position to depend on income from your own labor because if you are you'd never make it. Homie. |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| reply to Maxo
'If the collective people want to run a local ISP I don't see a problem in that.'
Well then don't ever expect to see competition. No one else will come in unless they they can somehow make it in an environment that they can not compete in.
'Your right to profit ends when it becomes to the detriment of the community.'
If that's the basis of your economic theory then capitalism will not thrive. |
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bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| reply to Blackened
'Section 8? Food stamps? Welfare? D'oh! '
Good thing you mentioned that. That's the gov't giving subsidies to the consumer to spend at private enterprises. Section 8 doesn't destroy renters (outside of the unsavory element) nor does food stamps destroy food stores.
Corporate accounting is a neat field. If you think corporations making more money are a bad thing then well....no way to win with you. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
·Embarq
| reply to bogey780
said by bogey780 :If that's the basis of your economic theory then capitalism will not thrive. I consider it my social theory. People come first, always. There is no room in the bible for putting money before people. Money is not necessarily bad, but when it trumps communities and people it is. |
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karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
iraq
·Fairpoint Communic..
| reply to bogey780
"Your right to profit ends when it becomes to the detriment of the community."
I absolutely agree with that statement. If the local power plant is gouging the consumer, then YES, the government SHOULD step in, and fix it. Corporations exist because we decided to allow them. However, we do NOT exist to service the corporation, as you so soundly put it. There is no intrisic right for ANY company to make money. The companies only make money if they sell a product at a reasonable price. When the company gets too big/greedy, that's when the problems arise.
Muni broadband is the CURE for the megacorp greed. Muni services provide an outlet for local communities to control their own destinies. Muni services are a GOOD thing.
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