40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE What stops you from using a USB based customer client device most?
Length from PC limitations
Low Power
Drivers needed in most cases
Distance from tower
This can be a low cost choice for many deployments and is simple enough they can be mailed out or dropped off to a new client.
We have been testing since last fall an 800mW USBMAXX client / AP device I designed for an RV Partner and it's working great there. The 20dB of receive gain the booster adds is what it took to get the weak RF signal a lot of these RF parks provide to work inside these Million Dollar RF filters. I shouldn't call them that, but that's what your trying to get RF into and on top of it they solar tint their windows with the metal particulate solar tints.
I figure since this is what it took to crack this nut, why won't this work for residential construction within a mile from the tower?
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
 ·CenturyLink
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE said by 40883644  :I shouldn't call them that, but that's what your trying to get RF into and on top of it they solar tint their windows with the metal particulate solar tints. I wonder when the RV manufacturers will start factory-installing wifi antennas on top of the units?
They finally got the sat antenna on top...!
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40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE When you guys start visiting RV manufacturers and start offering the service 
If you live in Indiana or where any of the other large manufacturers are I would be in there asking to offer the service now.
If you don't live near a large manufacturer, visit the large RV sales companies and offer to install a sweet built in WiFi client. Keep in mind it will need to be PNP (Plug and Play) and very easy to setup the SSID so when they move from park to park they have an easy time changing the radio.
I have a call I need to return as soon as I finish typing this to help an RV'r setup for a new park they moved to. No matter how easy the setup is, keep in mind most of your clients are senior citizens.
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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Seaboogers
join:2004-11-01
Sarasota, FL | Million Dollar Rolling Faraday Cages? | |
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| LLigetfa
join:2006-05-15
Fort Frances, ON
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE It would probaly help the truckers too as in this thread:
»Horizontally Polarized Laptop
Is there a link for this USB device? I tried googling for it but no joy. Is this a weatherized external unit or internal? For internal use, I could see a lot of non-WISP uses for such a device. Reaching from that back bedroom or the garage or neighbor come to mind.
I would think cable run length and lightning would be the big issues if external except for a few situations. | |
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40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE LLigetfa
It's not available for sale at this time so you won't find it on our site or anywhere else for that matter since I designed it. We have it being tested by an RV partner and haven't thought of offering it elsewhere until this weekend.
It's an indoor device at this time due to USB length limitations, but at 800mW that allows you to add a length of coax and mount an external antenna. We haven't found that necessary for any of the RV's it's been installed in yet.
I'd like to get back to my original question because I think I may have my bases covered...
What stops you from using a USB based customer client device most?
Length from PC limitations
Low Power
Drivers needed in most cases
Distance from tower
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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| | | LLigetfa
join:2006-05-15
Fort Frances, ON
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE OK, getting back on topic... I am a customer of a WISP and partnering with WISP to bring services to my customers, so put whatever stock you want in my opinion. I am not a WISP.
Since pretty well all PCs these days ship with wired NICs, that is the most flexible way to go and the drivers would have already been installed. Many customers may not express their intent up front or may evolve their home network later so CAT5 would also be more flexible. A lot easier to throw in a DSL router/AP and not be tethered with wires.
My experience with PnP USB is that it is more Pray than Play. Unplug a USB device and plug it into a different USB port and the praying begins. Then you have potential issues of speed if old USB is around.
I would think most WISPs would like a clean demark like the grounding point/PoE injector where one could get the customer to plug in any PC with nothing more than the PPPoE dialer and be able to rule out DSL routers or other customer gear. I would think most installers would prefer not venturing beyond the demark. I don't know how many would cable through a house.
I can see USB having a place in a few applications like motorhomes, house trailers, 18 wheel truckers, mobile industrial applications, or bungalows in flatland close to tower.
Can you get enough power from the USB port or is there a wall wart involved? When it comes to drawing power from the USB, not all are created equal. | |
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| | | | TWireless
Premium
join:2006-04-03
Round Rock, TX
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE I agree that "Driver-less" is the way to go. We love and only use ethernet connections. Like other have mentioned, if the customer wants wireless, they are free to buy a Linksys router with wireless and they can install the NIC themselves.
We have looked at USB and have played with the Senao 200mW B/G Atheros devices. They are very nice and work very well, as well as powered from the USB interface, so it keeps it clean. They even have a detachable antenna model if a little more gain is needed. Not bad for $70 or less.
RF spectrum cleanliness should be everyone's responsibility 
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Tasos Alexiou
www.titanwirelessonline.com | |
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dongato17
VIP
join:2000-07-28
Atlanta, GA
| Speaking strictly from a service provider's perspective, the biggest issue is drivers. As soon as you touch the customer's computer, anything that ever happens to the thing (and I mean EVER), is your fault. We have learned from experience to never touch the person's computer if you can at all avoid it. If they don't have an ethernet card, while rare these days, we will send them to the CompUSA or similar. It is frankly just too much liability.
That's been our experience at least.
-Hal
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Harold Bledsoe
Deliberant Wireless
»www.deliberant.com | |
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40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE Hal
That base is covered, It's PNP. You don't have to load anything unless you want to play with the fancy GUI which the WISP will surely do to set them up before shipping or installing.
This is why I'm asking for input, I think I may have the USB pitfalls taken care of on this device.
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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Chele
join:2003-07-23
| What Hal said. We do not install drivers in customers' computers, we will tell them how to do it and tell them about the risks involved. Also, one of the biggest issues we(everyone in the forum) are having is the amount of RF pollution, and your unit will be 800mw? | |
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pcard
join:2005-09-22
| What would the impact be having a 800 mW radio plus antenna gain, so close to your head? I know there is all kinds of regulations for RF power to proximity to time exposure.
I think that this would be great product as long as it is 20 feet away from me through a wall or two. What is the distance limitation for an USB device anyways? | |
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jarosoup
join:2003-01-14
·Qwest.net
| Having to install drivers is our biggest problem - and the fact that sometimes they need to be unglugged and plugged back in to start working again (even after a system reboot). A $50 (or less) driver-less USB client with a somewhat directional antenna (like the old ASUS or Hawking USB cpes) would do well I'd think. | |
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PersComp
Premium
join:2005-08-17
Cayce, SC
| I have used several of the Hawking USB devices and think highly of them for what they are. They do not match the quality of a real CPE, but I have 2 current customers on them that are close neighbors that have LOS. I use one on my 5 yr old sons old W98 PC as well. They work without problems.
But Hal has very valid concerns as some people will call you the first time their PC hiccups after you have touched it!
If it is a true PnP, has a directional antenna, and is not "ugly", then I am all for trying them in certain circumstances. I believe the standard USB recommendation is to limit at 5 meters. That should be ample amount of distance to get it in the best possible indoor location and away from the people using it. | |
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superdog
I Need A Drink
Premium,MVM
join:2001-07-13
Lebanon, PA
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE At one point in 2002, the only radios I had to install were USB. At first we thought this was great, until the driver issues started. Not only did it hose peoples machines, but anything that went wrong with that PC was somehow our fault. The second issue was having to use ICS(internet connection sharing) to setup any home network, as the main PC had to be on in order for all the others to work, and we had quite a few "thick" customers that didn't get this idea. The amount of service calls just got to be way to much. We finally went around and replaced every single USB adapter with an ethernet solution and never looked back. To this point, we will NEVER install another USB adapter again. I have one PCI radio up and working, and that is only because of economics, and even that has caused me quite a few issues. And also, to be quite honest, I am praying to God that You never sell an 800mW radio to anyone for anything, as I can just see the nightmares before I even go to bed.
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»www.wavecrazy.net Join WISPA today! »www.wispa.org/ | |
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superdog
I Need A Drink
Premium,MVM
join:2001-07-13
Lebanon, PA
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE said by superdog : I am praying to God that You never sell an 800mW radio to anyone for anything, as I can just see the nightmares before I even go to bed. I guess I should clarify this statement a little?. Maybe I should have said, "I hope You only sell them to true professionals".
In the wrong hands, radios with that kind of output could really wreak havoc on someone Else's network if used by an inexperienced person.
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»www.wavecrazy.net Join WISPA today! »www.wispa.org/ | |
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| | | | lutful
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE IMHO, even 250mW is an overkill for most CPE sites but so many Linksys hackers are doing that with rubber duckies to connect to 32mW APs.
We actually deployed a few dozen 800mW amplified APs in deep rural applications since 2004. We used 3dBi omni at AP and 80mW Abocom CPEs with 8-12dBi antennas in heavy foliage.
Assembly photo shows back of aluminum plate with rflinx OEM amp (800mW TX from 32mW input; 20dB RX gain) and home-made dual-output 48V PoE for radio (5V/2A) and amp (12V/1.5A).
I am truly amazed that a radio and 800mW RF amp can now be powered by 5V/0.5A (2.5W) maximum allowed by USB. | |
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40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE Said by Lutful
"I am truly amazed that a radio and 800mW RF amp can now be powered by 5V/0.5A (2.5W) maximum allowed by USB."
Radio is powered via USB; amp is powered via 12v switching power supply. Based on the feedback I have received, we will keep this item as an OEM for RV park WISP's. The USB Plug & Play simplicity is what senior citizens need. Although some have very impressive computer skills others have difficulty turning on their computer.
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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| | | | | | jarosoup
join:2003-01-14
·Qwest.net
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE said by 40883644 :Based on the feedback I have received, we will keep this item as an OEM for RV park WISP's. The USB Plug & Play simplicity is what senior citizens need. Although some have very impressive computer skills others have difficulty turning on their computer. When will these be available? We still have a bunch of your older 2400 outdoor APs/CPEs that have been cooking in the sun for years now without issue | |
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| | | | | | | jdmarti1
Jack
join:2004-06-15
Oilton, OK
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE Why the qwest for so much power? I know that an amplified radio has it's place - but I am concerned with the influx of high powered radios. 800mW is an awful lot of RF.
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»magicwisp.com | |
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40883644
Premium
join:2003-06-05
Parker, CO
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE Jack
Most RV parks are wooded or have foliage planted there for shade as in the high class Arizona parks. Not only does that make it difficult to get RF where you want, your trying to get it into As Seaboogers said "Million Dollar Rolling Faraday Cages".
To answer your question, "Why the qwest for so much power?" The high power is only being demanded by Hotel and RV Park WISP's and it's not just high power, it the extra 20dB of receive gain that makes this product cook. You have experienced this first hand.
We are working with our booster manufacturer to have the booster independently adjustable so the TX can be shut down but the RX stays at its peak. That's really what I want but that costs more to do.
The demand is there and sensible WISP's are treating this responsibly. We do not sell to anyone other then WISP's so our products should not be finding their way onto your neighbor’s roof.
Rich
»www.highgainantennas.com | |
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| | | | | | | | | mrbueno
join:2002-08-03
US
| Re: Low Cost USB Customer Client CPE Down here the city council has decided oak trees are king and if you try to build a new home, business, building, parking lot, you better be ready to design them around the trees.
Higher receive gain without higher transmit is indeed often a great answer. I know with the RV Parks down here we have to use SR2's to really see signal completely across the park. It's crazy. | |
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lutful
Premium
join:2005-06-16
Ottawa, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| 1. Superpass is selling 80ft "extended" USB CPEs since 2004. »www.superpass.com/Superusb.html
2. I know one WISP in South Asia with ~300 Senao high power USB CPEs. They package them locally and send cheap labour to configure customer PC. I heard of a few WISPs in US/Canada who have tested them too. | |
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uscomputing
join:2005-01-26
Buffalo, NY | If USB devices are cheaper then I can think of a few small PoPs where I could use them. | |
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