pvale
Lurk, Lurk, Lurk,They Call Me The Lurker
join:2000-03-29
Washington, MO
clubs:
 ·Charter Pipeline
| reply to DSL4Brains
Re: NAV 2006 no longer supports WinMe & 98 users
I'll have you to know that every thing in the house that has a clock display, including the DVD players, the VCRS, microwave, TV, several radios are showing the right time on their display devices. IPCop runs a NTP server, and all the computers run a client at bootup to get the time. This includes (1) Win95 box(rarely booted), (1) XP machine, (1)WinME machine, and several Linux boxes that serve things internal and external. I can't stand a flashing clock display. Since this PIII-500Mhz laptop is dog slow on even win2K, I guess I'll use WinME until it dies. I've upgraded it to max mem and HD. BTW, there is even an application called VMWARE that will let you run legacy apps in a virtual machine under XP. I have applications at work that won't run on any Op Sys that doesn't have a real DOS mode.
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DSL4Brains
Premium
join:2003-08-26
Portland, OR
| reply to wriley
said by wriley  :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? It's also widely known that those running antiquated O/S's also have at least one VCR in the household that has been flashing 12:00AM non-stop for the last ten years. |
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EGeezer
Summertime -
Premium
join:2002-08-04
Country!
 ·Callcentric
·RoadRunner Cable
·AT&T CallVantage
1 edit | reply to Blackbird
Re:WinMe & 98 users
said by Blackbird :Legacy application compatibility for critical software is one. Operating familiarity and avoidance of costly software learning curves are others. Though it's too often overlooked, there's the whole time/expense fur-ball that almost always results from buying and bringing a new computer "up to speed". That frequently forces the collateral purchase of a whole array of peripheral hardware because some of one's older accessories won't work well with the new box; it almost always forces purchase of an entire complement of updated and costly security software, as well as numerous expensive apps upgrades (since one's old ones all too often won't play with the new OS). All this set-up and futzing around frequently leads to many kinds of fresh interactive quirks, hiccups, and error-messages that never existed with the old, essentially fully-debugged and smoothed-out OS and apps. You must have worked with some of the same manufacturing operations I did 
For example, I know some fabrication systems that are controlled by DOS and WIN9x PCs. The shop guys keep a stock of PCs and parts for them since the updated control software costs major bucks to replace plus having to buy or upgrade presses, saws, shears, conveyors, stackers etc.
The cost of the PC and operating system is a tiny fraction of these guys' upgrade costs if they had to go to XP.
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Every
Good
Electrical
Engineer
Zeroes
Each
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guitarzan
Premium
join:2004-05-04
Skytop, PA
 ·epix
|  reply to Blackbird
Re: NAV 2006 no longer supports WinMe & 98 users
Thank You Blackbird SR for posting that well said.  I can purchase XP pro anytime i want.I do not live in poverty far from it.However I don't feel the need of "blind stupidity" to follow the "dude you gotta upgrade because XP is so cool and 98se is lame" mentality that's so rampant on this forum.I guess if everybody jumped off a bridge, then i will no doubt have to as well.Some body needs to jump in and try to save people. lmao
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Bass....the glue of rhythm and harmony...the heartbeat of the band.! Shaking the earth with deep,sonorous vibrations.The dark ominous thunder of an approching storm. |
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mboy
Premium
join:2001-04-13
Little Falls, NJ
| reply to wriley
said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? Nope, that sums it up! |
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maartena
Stacked.
Premium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | reply to dp
said by dp :said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? For some, especially the elderly on fixed incomes, upgrading is not very easy to pull off. I have a few in my neighborhood that fit that category. They have the PC's primarily to keep in touch with out of state family and they just cannot afford to do it. These people can also still run NAV2004 and get away with simply updating their definitions until they upgrade their hardware.
I think its a logical step. MS abandons support for Windows 9x, and that means Symantec can't get support either. |
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Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to Knnn
said by Knnn : After 6 months my NAV 2005 is finally playing nice with my WIN98SE box. O how mightily I have struggled but alas no more. ... More to the point, can anyone recommend a good, preferably free, AV that will play nice with WIN98SE? AVG, Avast, or another? I'm not sure quite what you mean by the "alas" comment - but I trust you do realize that presumably Symantec will be LiveUpdate-supporting NAV2005 for Win98 and other OSs until NAV2005's 3-year product lifetime officially expires in 2008? It appears that it's the 2006 products and later that will be jettisoning Win98 support/compatibility. 
Unless, of course, you've simply tired of the unparalleled adventure of debugging Symantec's LiveUpdate "events" and such on your W98 computer...
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If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see... |
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sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to Blackbird
Well said Blackbird.
I have a 98SE box sitting out in the living room--unfortunately the last 9x box in the house as my needs seem to be outgrowing 98's capability after all these years--and it does its job admirably.
It's an entertainment center. Movies and music, piped to the stereo and the tv. It also provides internet access to that end of the house. Given the hardware in the box, it couldn't do its job any better with a newer OS, and would probably even suffer.
If a virus somehow did get loose in my lan, I must say the 98 box would be just as well protected as the two Windows 2000 hosts. All rely on commercial AVs and Kerio. I might note now that I never suffered a compromise or infection under 98 and GPFs and BSODs were extremely rare. 98 proved to be quite resilient for me, with a little care.
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Learn about Real ID and why it's so horrible. |
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SnowyOne
Premium
join:2003-04-05
Kailua, HI | reply to Knnn
AVG with DOS & email scanning not installed during setup is the finest AV today for a W98, IMHO. |
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Knnn
join:2003-01-27
North Vancouver, BC
| reply to Blackbird
Blackbird SR, I couldn't agree with you more.....
After 6 months my NAV 2005 is finally playing nice with my WIN98SE box .... O how mightily I have struggled ...but alas no more.
More to the point, can anyone recommend a good, preferably free, AV that will play nice with WIN98SE? AVG, Avast, or another? |
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Blackbird
Built for Speed
Premium
join:2005-01-14
Fort Wayne, IN
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to wriley
said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? Sigh...!  It seems this argument comes up just about every time somebody mentions they're still using Win98. First off, there are a LOT of reasons besides simple poverty or stubborness or blind stupidity that cause many users to persist in using an older OS. Legacy application compatibility for critical software is one. Operating familiarity and avoidance of costly software learning curves are others. Though it's too often overlooked, there's the whole time/expense fur-ball that almost always results from buying and bringing a new computer "up to speed". That frequently forces the collateral purchase of a whole array of peripheral hardware because some of one's older accessories won't work well with the new box; it almost always forces purchase of an entire complement of updated and costly security software, as well as numerous expensive apps upgrades (since one's old ones all too often won't play with the new OS). All this set-up and futzing around frequently leads to many kinds of fresh interactive quirks, hiccups, and error-messages that never existed with the old, essentially fully-debugged and smoothed-out OS and apps.
And while some folks do indeed get their 'jollies' out of playing Mr.ComputerGuru all day, there are others of us out here who lived through that phase of our lives some years ago and found out that much of it's greatly over-rated as a source of fun and enjoyment. We simply want our computers to be useful tools, and our focus is on actually doing meaningful work with those tools - not on constantly striving to have the latest techno-whiz-bang devices and software. To do meaningful work means to be familiar with and expert at applying necessary tools, and I submit that in some situations, the learning curves and stumble-around fiascos of bringing up new systems full of new software simply detracts from what some folks need to accomplish.
And, yes, the day will come for most of us 'dinosaurs' when perhaps hardware failure or gross obsolesence issues will ultimately force us to vault forward into the current genre of computers and OSs... then we'll pay the necessary price to renew our knowledge and methods. But in the meantime, we're satisfied with the tradeoff choices we have made - just as "modernists" are satisfied with theirs. Do we really have to bash each other's choices, especially when so little may REALLY be understood about what is going into them? 
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If God wanted us to work with electrons, He'd make them big enough to see... |
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wriley
I'M Sick Of Fixing Your Computer.
Premium
join:2001-08-30
Edmonton, AB
clubs:
1 edit | reply to Anonynona
said by Anonynona :said by dp :said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? For some, especially the elderly on fixed incomes, upgrading is not very easy to pull off. I have a few in my neighborhood that fit that category. They have the PC's primarily to keep in touch with out of state family and they just cannot afford to do it. Yet, those same elderly that "can't" afford to purchase even an OEM version (cheap and legal; some people who seem to love that route), but they do have Internet access, cable/satellite service, telephone service with maybe a "few" of the useless features (and they keep paying $60-$80/yr for inside maintenance, while the wires and connectors simply sit and never wear out, no matter how much you use them)...yeah, right... If that's a valid argument, then why don't they really save some money and get rid of the computer and Internet service. I know pens and paper are still used by those who are educated, plus a phone call is cheeeaap nowadays and you can actually use your vocal cords. Most elderly still prefer that way of life and really don't give a hoot about computers, the Internet, or email.  Not to mention the ones who say they cant afford high speed so they have aol and a second phone line which adds up to more then double the cost of cable.
Plus they are paying phone support, and computer reapir bills that cost much more then a new system. Iv seen elderly people who have spent thousands on there win98 machine when they can call dell and have an xp machine with flat panel for 399 or less |
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Anonynona
join:2003-02-11
Lawrenceville, GA
| reply to dp
said by dp :said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? For some, especially the elderly on fixed incomes, upgrading is not very easy to pull off. I have a few in my neighborhood that fit that category. They have the PC's primarily to keep in touch with out of state family and they just cannot afford to do it. Yet, those same elderly that "can't" afford to purchase even an OEM version (cheap and legal; some people who seem to love that route), but they do have Internet access, cable/satellite service, telephone service with maybe a "few" of the useless features (and they keep paying $60-$80/yr for inside maintenance, while the wires and connectors simply sit and never wear out, no matter how much you use them)...yeah, right... If that's a valid argument, then why don't they really save some money and get rid of the computer and Internet service. I know pens and paper are still used by those who are educated, plus a phone call is cheeeaap nowadays and you can actually use your vocal cords. Most elderly still prefer that way of life and really don't give a hoot about computers, the Internet, or email. |
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dp
Go Steelers
Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-08
Greensburg, PA
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to wriley
said by wriley :WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? For some, especially the elderly on fixed incomes, upgrading is not very easy to pull off. I have a few in my neighborhood that fit that category. They have the PC's primarily to keep in touch with out of state family and they just cannot afford to do it.
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Write your questions down on the back of a $20 dollar bill and send them to me |
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wriley
I'M Sick Of Fixing Your Computer.
Premium
join:2001-08-30
Edmonton, AB
clubs: | reply to DSL_Steve
WHy is anyone still running pre xp and 2k os's? Is there any reasons besides being cheap? |
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