quientus
So Red Shoes
Premium
join:2000-08-11
San Jose, CA
| reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Deserved arrest
said by TKJunkMail  :This guy deserved to be arrested. He knew he wasn't getting access from a legitimate free hotspot. While his intentions may not be known for sure, he surely wasn't just trying to get free internet access. More than likely he was trying to steal information. Just because the homeowner had an unsecured AP, it doesn't make what this guy did legal. Try him in court, fine him, and confiscate all his computer and network equipment. And then put him on probation where if he gets caught again he goes to jail. You're either kidding me or trolling. |
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stevephl
join:2000-11-27
Colorado Springs, CO
 ·Comcast
| I agree completely time to quit blaming the victim and prosecute the criminals. Anyone knowingly connecting to another persons network and using it, is well guilty and should be punished severely. Time to cut this bleeding heart liberal B.S. that lets so many criminals loose on our streets these days. Go Florida.
Steve in Colorado |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| Yes, lets spend millions having cops crack down on geeks with powerbooks trying to send e-mail via unsecured hotspots, when it would be far more logical and cheaper to simply have hotspot owners use security.
How modern Conservative of you. |
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LinuxJunkie
join:2005-01-19
Cyberspace | reply to stevephl
Yeah, let's spend tons of money on this crap instead of more important things. You apparently haven't met many "criminals" if you classify nerd wardrivers as such. Keep your mouth shut... you're giving us moderate conservatives a bad name. |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| reply to Karl Bode
Love that liberal open door policy there Karl. It's that twisted logic of it's the fault of the AP owner that has crazy judges saying it's the rape victim's fault they got raped.
Stupidity isn't a license to be victimized...even by nerds and powerbooks.
I guess it's too much to expect people to respect other's PROPERTY and they won't understand this simple concept until they're arrested or fined. |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| said by oliphant :Love that liberal open door policy there Karl. It's that twisted logic of it's the fault of the AP owner that has crazy judges saying it's the rape victim's fault they got raped. Stupidity isn't a license to be victimized...even by nerds and powerbooks. I guess it's too much to expect people to respect other's PROPERTY and they won't understand this simple concept until they're arrested or fined. Dude you don't understand the actual concept here.
Rape is physical damage , stealing is physical damage , that stuff is physical. "Stealing" and I use the term loosely here , bandwidth via a unsecured access point is not illegal. It's free and in the clear. There is no reason for this case to go further unless he was doing something illegal behind it.
It is not illegal to receive free to air television signals so why is a internet signal is illegal ? Because it's "owned" by some one ? If that is the case then make an attempt to secure the system. Ignorance is no reason to do something wrong ever. And if they did not lock down the system with at least a minimum security setting then they deserve to have their bandwidth used.
If the person did something wrong behind the AP then they should be prosecuted, but to say that it's privately owned is just stupid, It's not protected by any means and by that standard it is free to use.
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| said by BosstonesOwn :said by oliphant :Love that liberal open door policy there Karl. It's that twisted logic of it's the fault of the AP owner that has crazy judges saying it's the rape victim's fault they got raped. Stupidity isn't a license to be victimized...even by nerds and powerbooks. I guess it's too much to expect people to respect other's PROPERTY and they won't understand this simple concept until they're arrested or fined. Dude you don't understand the actual concept here. Rape is physical damage , stealing is physical damage , that stuff is physical. "Stealing" and I use the term loosely here , bandwidth via a unsecured access point is not illegal. It's free and in the clear. There is no reason for this case to go further unless he was doing something illegal behind it. It is not illegal to receive free to air television signals so why is a internet signal is illegal ? Because it's "owned" by some one ? If that is the case then make an attempt to secure the system. Ignorance is no reason to do something wrong ever. And if they did not lock down the system with at least a minimum security setting then they deserve to have their bandwidth used. If the person did something wrong behind the AP then they should be prosecuted, but to say that it's privately owned is just stupid, It's not protected by any means and by that standard it is free to use. So it's okay to steal if I bring it back and the owner was unaware that I took it? Wow. |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| no your twisting it again. because you want to hang them high like a vigilante.
It's not physical property they are using its a damn signal. Any one and their mother can view and intercept, it is not even encrypted to a small degree. That is like saying oh yeah I broadcast video of my kids room and then get mad when some one intercepts and views it, well encrypt it and no one would do it except people who want to do harm.
Once it is encrypted and even the smallest attempt was made to secure the AP then it should be illegal , this guy did none of that.
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
1 edit | It's not physical property...it's just some fire (BBQ) and water (pool). I'm just using it. So it's cool if I go across the street and take their hose to wash my car and put it back when I'm done? You don't see the problem with 'borrowing' in that way? How about if I 'borrow' their car? Even if I top the tank when I'm done? What if they left the key in it? Hey, no body is harmed. They don't lose the use of it.
I don't want to hang them high...I want them to have RESPECT for other people's PROPERTY. It's not their calculator. It's not their AP. It's not their ISP bill. It's not their stuff to use without permission. |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| Your still talking physical property.
fire needs wood or charcoals physical material missing
hose needs water physical material missing
car physical material is missing it,s not borrowing if they don't allow it it's stealing and involves a personal loss even if for 1 second.
Electricity ? the AP still uses power no matter what to broadcast and that is even moot. Bandwidth ? side affect of energy and it's not metered so no physical loss.
It is akin to downloading a mp3. There is no physical loss. Only monetary loss for the isp or riaa and that is even questionable. Why must you equate it with physical products when it not a physical product. Come up with a better equal product.
Radio , TV thinks like that equate to it.
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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oliphant
I Have 8 Boobies
Premium
join:2004-11-26
Corona, CA
| Nothing is missing. I put the hose back, the pool water is still there...I bring my own charcoal...
I equate it with physical goods to get it through some people's thick heads that personal property is personal property whether you can see it when you use it or not.
And of course it's personal loss. In my case I pay for a 3Mb connection...if someone else is using my service while I am I lose that portion of my 3Mb service...they are stealing a portion of the service I pay for.
And if I'm not around...it's no different than 'borrowing' the neighbors hose or swimming in their pool. Just because there is no loss of use or harm doesn't make it right or legal. |
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rodoke
join:2003-10-28
Carbondale, IL
2 edits | reply to oliphant
said by oliphant :Love that partisan closed-mind policy there Karl? It's that twisted logic of everything being the fault of the "liberals" or the "conservatives" that has crazy activist judges saying it's the rape victims' fault they got raped because they voted wrong in the last election. Stupidity is asking to be victimized...especially by nerds and powerbooks. It's too much to expect people to <cartman>respect others' PROPERTY</cartman>. I won't understand this simple concept until I'm defrauded or framed. There. I fixed it for you. |
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Sodium
Premium
join:2003-12-02
Rice Lake, WI
|  reply to BosstonesOwn
said by BosstonesOwn :Radio , TV thinks like that equate to it. Not quite. Radio and TV signals are "passive", meaning they require no response from you to deliver the product. When you listen to your radio or watch TV, you are analyzing radio waves that are passing through the Rx antenna. I.e. you don't need to send a signal to the TV station to let them know you want to change channels, you just hop to the next frequency band that corresponds to the next channel to want to view.
WiFi is an "active" signal, meaning it needs a response from the user to deliver its intended product. You need to send packets to the AP to tell it to route you to google.com or to the proper drive on the home media server on your LAN, for examples.
Therefore, your argument of just using what's already passing through the air is null. In order to use the connection, you would have to knowingly respond to the AP to make the proper requests, and therefore knowingly be making access to the user's network without their permission (which is illegal).
I don't understand your comment about bandwidth being "not metered", either. My connection bogs down with just 3 people using it at once (only 512kbps  ). I call it illegal if someone uses my connection without my permission because it is a service that I am paying for, just like phone service, cable/satellite TV, electricity, etc. It's called "theft of service". I see you are a Comcast cable user. Try uncapping your modem to get 50mbps for a day and you will find out what I'm talking about.  |
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