Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| Hiding unsecured wireless networks
Is there a way in WinXP to hide unsecured wireless networks and prevent automatic connection to same?
I have set up my wireless router to put time restrictions on Internet connection to prevent my kids from staying up until 2:30 am playing NeoPets. However, my ever-resourceful kids have discovered that they can just log onto my neighbour's unsecured wireless networks when ours goes off at 10:00 pm.
I want to block selected networks from the available networks list on their computer.
Suggestions appreciated. |
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SoonerAl
Old Enough To Know Better
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-23
Norman, OK
edit:
June 3rd, @01:55PM
|  Why not use software that restricts the hours your kids can logon to their/the family/your XP PC? Software like Netnanny, etc does that.
»www.netnanny.com/products/net_na···res.html
If your kids are limited users then that should solve the problem...
Since I don't use that type of software perhaps others can comment further...
Good luck...
--
"When all else fails, read the instructions..." |
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GadgetsRme
Premium
join:2002-01-30
Canon City, CO
 ·Champion Broadband..
| reply to Glen T
1. Do what SoonerAl said plus ask your neighbor to secure his wireless.
2. If necessary take away wireless devices and or power cords at the appropriate time.
3. If that is defied it is time for a meeting with the "board of education" and their bottoms and take away all computer privileges
--
Gadgets |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| said by GadgetsRme  :1. Do what SoonerAl said plus ask your neighbor to secure his wireless. 2. If necessary take away wireless devices and or power cords at the appropriate time. 3. If that is defied it is time for a meeting with the "board of education" and their bottoms and take away all computer privileges Not so simple:
1. I have three daughters who are high-school age. I have to allow them access to their computer (they share it) for actual school work. They can stay up as late as they want writing an essay, but Internet access is just a distraction. They know that they have to finish their online chatting and research by 10:00 pm.
2. They need access to the wireless network for printing, etc. I cannot disable all my computers too (I work from home). But I can shut down Internet access across all of them.
3. I'd have to go door-to-door to find out who owns what wireless access point. I actually went as far as to log on to one of them (of course they haven't changed the default password) and I changed the default SSID to "SecureMePlease". Didn't help.
I could just lock them out of their own routers by setting up security "for them" but that's a bit too nasty. |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| reply to GadgetsRme
By the way, this problem may be more common than you think. My nephew, who is 3rd year university, has been running up the limit on my Brother-in-law's ISP account by downloading music and movies 24/7. Since B-in-L works out of a home office, this wasn't good. He tried restricting access, and now the 'kid' just logs onto his neighbor's wireless.
Be nice if manufacturers of consumer WAPs would amend their getting started wizards to included setting up security and encryption, instead of defaulting to nothing at all. |
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GadgetsRme
Premium
join:2002-01-30
Canon City, CO
·Champion Broadband..
edit:
June 3rd, @05:17PM
| reply to Glen T
I had some friends who had a similar problem and they fix it by moving the computer to a corner of the living room, where they could see it at all times. They also restricted the use of it to homework only for 2 weeks, allowed other uses if the kids could show proof homework was finished after that. It stayed that way until the end of the school year. Then was put back with the warning that the restrictions would be worse if it happened again. The next year they had no trouble at all. Show your daughters this little scenario and ask them which they prefer to behave and act maturely, or be watched like little children. And then follow through if you have to. The other thing to do is buy an inexpensive printer and hardwire it for them and kill all access for a period of time.
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Gadgets |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| My solution has been to restrict Internet access. With more responsible Internet usage, the restriction is removed or reduced. With irresponsible usage, access becomes more limited.
With all due respect, I don't really need parenting advice. This was a technical question. |
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javaMan
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-15
San Luis Obispo, CA
| said by Glen T :. . . With all due respect, I don't really need parenting advice. This was a technical question. I think your best bet is going to be locating the neighbor, explaining your situation, and see if he can secure his network. I don't think there's much you can do on your end other than trying some of the suggestions others have offered, social solutions though they may be.
--
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness. . . Isa. 5:20 |
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Nerdtalker
Working Hard, Or Hardly Working?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-02-18
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
·Comcast
| reply to Glen T
There isn't much you can do about your neighbors to make them "hide" their AP.
As far as I know, there isn't any way to create a "no connect" rule that prohibits you from connecting to a specific AP.
What you could do is get them a wireless NIC that doesn't have enough range or signal sensitivity to connect to your neighbor's AP. I'd look into one of those small little USB dongle Wireless Adapters, and simply remove their default MiniPCI or PC-Card adapters. There simply isn't any way they can connect to your neighbor's AP if they can't see it in WZC.
This might be suitable: »www.linksys.com/products/product···prid=669 Just rip-off the antenna.
--
"Some people never see the light till it shines thru bullet holes." -Bruce Cockburn
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| reply to javaMan
I appreciate that you have taken the time to respond. However, I am not getting a clear indication from any posting so far that what I am asking is either impossible, or that the posters don't know the answer.
I kind of assumed that this would be something that a network administrator in a downtown office would have run into. Scenario: admin places restrictions on company access to Internet via wireless connection and enterprising employees find ways to circumvent by logging onto unsecured wireless network of John Doe, accountant, on the next floor.
I guess I figured that there would be some registry tweak that would simply hide all non-secured networks in the XP Wireless Network Connection viewer.
As to canvassing the neighbourhood, how would you take it if a complete stranger banged on your door and asked if you had a wireless network in your home? I'd tell the guy to get lost. This is not a practical solution. However, I *could* disable both of them. Maybe that's the best solution -- caveat emptor... |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| reply to Nerdtalker
****
What you could do is get them a wireless NIC that doesn't have enough range or signal sensitivity to connect to your neighbor's AP. I'd look into one of those small little USB dongle Wireless Adapters, and simply remove their default MiniPCI or PC-Card adapters.
****
The ironic part is that, that's what we are using -- a USB54G Linksys dongle. It has a much better range than most PCI cards. I chose it because the PCI card was giving a lousy connection to our own WRT54G router.
These unsecured networks don't show up on my own Compaq laptop with built in 802.11g. |
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Nerdtalker
Working Hard, Or Hardly Working?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-02-18
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
·Comcast
| said by Glen T :The ironic part is that, that's what we are using -- a USB54G Linksys dongle. It has a much better range than most PCI cards. I chose it because the PCI card was giving a lousy connection to our own WRT54G router. These unsecured networks don't show up on my own Compaq laptop with built in 802.11g. Ouch, that is pretty ironic!  Although the WUSB54G does appear to have a nice antenna: »www.linksys.com/products/product···prid=665
Well, I guess you could try this NETGEAR USB adapter: »www.netgear.com/products/details/MA111.php it's only 13dBm.
Or this micro Linksys USB adapter: »www.linksys.com/products/product···prid=519 I can pretty much guarantee that it isn't going to have much range just by looking at it.
Better yet, swap out your wireless NIC with theirs.
--
"Some people never see the light till it shines thru bullet holes." -Bruce Cockburn
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javaMan
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-15
San Luis Obispo, CA
| reply to Glen T
said by Glen T :. . . As to canvassing the neighbourhood, how would you take it if a complete stranger banged on your door and asked if you had a wireless network in your home? I'd tell the guy to get lost. This is not a practical solution. However, I *could* disable both of them. Maybe that's the best solution -- caveat emptor... Personally? I wouldn't mind at all if someone were to explain the situation. In fact, I would be thankful that it was brought it to my attention that someone was sucking my bandwidth. But I do understand your point of view. I have no clue what your situation is, especially if you live in the city. I live in a more rural area and tend to think in different terms I guess. 
--
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness. . . Isa. 5:20 |
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Nerdtalker
Working Hard, Or Hardly Working?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-02-18
Tucson, AZ
clubs:
·Comcast
| reply to Glen T
said by Glen T :However, I *could* disable both of them. Maybe that's the best solution -- caveat emptor... There are a few wireless APs/routers that'll allow you to decrease signal power through their web-based configuration interface.
A bunch of D-Link APs will let you do it without cracked firmware, and you definitely can with any WRT54G(S) alongside some 3rd party firmware.
While I'm not encouraging or condoning the practice of logging into the administrative pages of your neighbor's AP, it might work without you having to shut it down completely.
--
"Some people never see the light till it shines thru bullet holes." -Bruce Cockburn
iPod Shuffle=iPos
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| One is a Dlink. The other is Linksys. At any given time I can 5 or 6 WAPs from this machine. The rest are secured.
I'm not looking to take drastic measures, here. If I was, I'd just drill some holes, string a bunch of Cat6 cable and hardwire the thing to the router... |
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H1244
@pacbell.n
| reply to Glen T
"As far as I know, there isn't any way to create a "no connect" rule that prohibits you from connecting to a specific AP."
Not true. For example, with Intel wireless card and Intel ProSet software tools, you can create profiles that connect to specific APs only.
In the meantime, you need to create limited user account (with Windows XP Pro, not sure about XP Home) that only has limited capability, only admin can change the profile. Now you are in control. |
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SoonerAl
Old Enough To Know Better
Premium,MVM
join:2002-07-23
Norman, OK
edit:
June 4th, @10:32AM
| reply to Glen T
Child web controls | 
Child allowable surfing hours |
This thread got me thinking about my grandkids visiting this summer for two weeks, so I installed a free parental control package from my ISP, Cox HSI, and started experimenting with it. My scheme so far is to...
1. Setup an individual limited account for each grandchild on both of my XP Pro boxes.
2. Use the parental control software to limit the hours each child can access the internet. In each of their cases I limit them to internet surfing 2 hours (120 minutes) per day during their six hours total of allowable time on the PC. During the remaining four hours they can play computer games, etc, but not surf the internet.
3. I use the Windows net user command to limit the actual times during the day they can log onto the computer. For example:
net user dallas /time:M-Su,9am-12pm,5pm-8pm
...allows my grandson Dallas to be able to log into his account only between the hours of 9 AM to 12 PM (noon) and between 5 PM and 8 PM daily.
4. I also setup each childs account so the windows screen saver activates after 15 minutes of idle time and kicks the display back to the Windows Login screen. That way idle sessions are forced to log back on, if they can...See item 3 above. Along with this I setup group policies that disable the screen saver tab for users. Go to User Configuration -> Administrative Templates -> Control Panel -> Display and look at the Hide Screen Saver tab, Screen Saver, Screen Saver Executable Name, etc. policies. That makes it impossible for anyone, except an Administrator, to disable this feature. Now with XP Home you can't use group policies, but you can use a small Windows XP Security Console utility created by Doug Knox, MS-MVP to also disable the screen saver tab.
»www.dougknox.com/xp/utils/xp_sec···sole.htm
I have attached a few example screen shots from the parental control software I am using. It may be of interest...
The nice thing about all of this is that everything is setup on a per user basis, so I can control the kids and still let the adults have access to the PC and public internet at anytime. Of course the adult Visitors account is a limited account and all accounts are password protected...
This is also configured so only the administrator can configure all of this...
--
"When all else fails, read the instructions..." |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
edit:
June 4th, @12:31PM
| I really wanted to avoid setting up limited accounts. On my computers at home, there is only a single user account with no login or password and max. admin. privleges.
The reasons for this are many. Each user profile has its own desktop etc. And this just adds to administrative headaches.
For example, a client asked me to look at his kid's computer because one of his three kids could not print to the their networked printer. When I arrived, the child was not home, and no one knew her password, so we could not test the printing problem.
Files end up on different desktops in different profiles. Games and applications work in one profile -- not installed in another. Backup is a nighmare. Etc. etc.
I'm just looking for a *simple* solution here. My system is built largely on trust. The single kid computer is in the corner of the family room where everyone can see and use it.
I just need to make sure that the kids are getting enough sleep on a school night -- usually, I'm the first one in bed -- I'm not waiting around to police this.
I can't outright terminate Internet access as a punishment. The kids work on computers at school and then e-mail work home to themselves to finish, then e-mail back in the morning. One daughter is studying journalism. She is working on articles all the time for school publications.
I should also mention that there are plenty of parental controls in place. We have one TV in the house. There is a long-standing ban on TV viewing during the week -- for all family members. MSN messaging and instant messaging have always been banned (and removed -- I shot the messenger) on my computers. |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC
| reply to H1244
****
Not true. For example, with Intel wireless card and Intel ProSet software tools, you can create profiles that connect to specific APs only.
****
I take it that in order to set this up, you would disable "Use Windows to configure my wireless network settings" and then use some proprietary software that came with the NIC? |
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Glen T
join:2003-11-03
BC | Tried using the latest software connection monitor that came with the WUSB54G. It does replace (turn off) the Windows wireless connection manager, but it is largely the same. No way to block/hide non-preferred networks. |
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