53059959
Temp banned from BBR more then anyone
join:2002-10-02
PwnZone
| cant be that expensive
like they do now with dish and directv, they install it for you and provide you with a few recievers. I doubt it really costs that much to wire a home since they do thousands everyday, besides they make it up by signing the customer to a yearly contract. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Seems like making everything wireless makes the most sense to me.....put that MIMO gear to some actual work... |
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clickwir
join:2001-06-21
Dickson City, PA | security, bandwidth, lag, security, there are like 500 diffrent types of wireless, security, interferance, security.... hmmm. Looks like there are still way too many problems with wireless. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Security? Does my Discovery Duck special in HD really need more than WPA2?
Run an ethernet line to your desktop.... |
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Smokey
Even drunk on a bet ya make it to Canada
Premium
join:2003-05-20
Va Beach
clubs: | But think of the QOS issues Im sure that will bring.
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Plvres crapvlas qvam gladivs |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | The bottleneck is going to be the pipe coming into the home if companies insist on using ADSL2+ and compression to serve multiple HD feeds.... |
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Smokey
Even drunk on a bet ya make it to Canada
Premium
join:2003-05-20
Va Beach
clubs:
 ·Cox HSI
| True, but I'm thinking more of what happens when I move my lappy from the room with the ap, to backyard and the like. I can only imagine that a strong signal will be needed to feed TV over wireless, and what happens when all your neighbors have the same setup? I'm sure solutions can be found, but why not just come up with a way to interface the IPtv with coax at side of the home?
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Plvres crapvlas qvam gladivs |
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imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI | reply to 53059959
I agree. If it takes the idiot installing the IPTV service 8 hours to run a total of 3 outlets he should be fired. It's not rocket science. |
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ib50MbSoon
Formerly TwoKDialup
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Coloma, MI
| reply to 53059959
Everything from a telco is expensive. They are experts at running the bill up. Cha-ching!
For example, CallerID w/name is ~$9/mo and Call Forwarding runs ~$5/mo. I was quoted over $200/mo for Ameritech's 128kb ISDN. Before VoIP over cable came along, I remember paying 28 cents per minute for long distance to a town 15 miles away. No thanks, I'll pass on telco IPTV.
Comcast is the bargain of the century! |
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jazzy112
join:2003-12-05
Fargo, ND
| reply to Karl Bode
I install wireless internet based on 802.11b, and I would be the first one to tell you thast wireless is worthless for streaming HD, packet loss when you turn on the microwave or your new Whirlpool HT Dryer or your 2.4ghz phone. At $.06/foot and $.23/connector I would run Cat 5 and be done with it. Even a traditional 100mb network would stress streaming 3 full HD streams. Let alone the 6 that would be required for my home, you better bring me a 1gbps connection if you want to deliver me HD over IP. I don't want that compressed crapo either, I would just watch SD if that were the case. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| That's just it, in cases like with SBC, to fit HD streams under the 24Mbps roof they'll be all compressed anyway....
Not saying wireless is a good answer (I think coax and sat service already own the niche), but just an answer...
Fiber is the future. |
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P2PPirate2
join:2005-02-02
New York, NY | reply to imrf
Wow, 8hrs service for $50. per hour thats comes to 400 bucks. Hey I can do it for half price;) |
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SteveCon
IBEW 2222 Boston, MA
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Burlington, MA
 ·Verizon FIOS
| reply to imrf
said by imrf  :I agree. If it takes the idiot installing the IPTV service 8 hours to run a total of 3 outlets he should be fired. It's not rocket science. Sheesh - you remind me of people that started telling me how I could fix/install what they wanted by saying "All you have to do is ..."
Any idiot with a staple gun can install three jacks by stapling along a baseboard in an hour, but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Its not rocket science, but its not easy and rarely goes as planned, either. That's why an "hourly rate" is often quoted instead of a "price for the whole job". I don't know anyone who can see through walls and can determine every obstacle to be encountered. |
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Topmounter
Sent By Grocery Clerks
join:2001-02-20
Evergreen, CO | reply to Karl Bode
The bottleneck is going to be the pipe coming into the home if companies insist on using ADSL2+ and compression to serve multiple HD feeds....
BINGO!!!! |
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djrobx
join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA
 ·PHONE POWER
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T CallVantage
·Time Warner VOIP
·RoadRunner Cable
2 edits | The problem is video needs a very consistent connection, even if it's not particularly fast. 802.11b/g barely gets out of a room before it succumbs to fluctuating speeds and packet loss. I've tried streaming 8mbps DVD quality MPEG-2 on my 54mbps G network just one room away and it was totaly unacceptable.
I'm sure some people will chime in with their successes doing this, but it would need to work more definitively before SBC could begin selling it as an option. Maybe MIMO will make video distribution over wireless more of a reality, but I'm afraid it's not something that the IPTV companies can bank on at this time.
As far as hardwired IPTV goes, IPTV pretty much on par with satellite. Satellite also requires a STB for every TV, and generally requires a new RG6 run unless the house is new enough to have RG6 in the walls.
Also, the $50-per-install "windshield cost" is absurdly high. Do they only plan on servicing one customer 100 miles away from dispatch per day? And eight hours to install a CAT5 drop? If they do it like cable and satellite, they will just jam the wire through an exterior wall. It's up to the subscriber if they want to do it more neatly.
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\\ROB - a part of the SCB local network |
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imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI
·WOW Internet and C..
1 edit | reply to SteveCon
said by SteveCon : but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Yes, if you don't know what you are doing, sure. I have worked with installation companies for many years. I have seen a 7500sq. ft. homes wired with 6 outlets or more in less than 4 hours fishing 4 stories up, with two guy each working by themselves. Don't tell me 3 outlets in a average run of the mill home will take 8 hours. |
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SteveCon
IBEW 2222 Boston, MA
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Burlington, MA
·Verizon FIOS
| said by imrf :said by SteveCon : but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Yes, if you don't know what you are doing, sure. I have worked with installation companies for many years. I have seen a 7500sq. ft. homes wired with 6 outlets or more in less than 4 hours fishing 4 stories up, with two guy each working by themselves. Don't tell me 3 outlets in a average run of the mill home will take 8 hours. C'mon now. *1* person.. 4 story pulls.. 3 outlets.. all in 4 hours? I'm a licensed electrician with 30 years experience who has fished more tel, data, catv and power cables than I care remember; I bet a wiring inspector would have a field day citing code violations on *that* job.
Sure, you might get a "bunny" 1st floor install of 3 jacks in 4 hours once in a while - but that certainly is not going to be the rule. Working safely and doing a quality install in a neat and workmanship-like manner is going to take longer. More often, the install will be required in the upper levels of a multi-floor or worse yet, multi-family dwelling.
Sending one person to fish walls and ceilings alone is a waste of time and money for a company - it can be done, but it's not cost effective. 8 man hours is a more realistic expectation. |
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thatsokwithme
@verizon.n
| reply to 53059959
That's right, lets piss all over vdsl, dsl2+gsuperduper obsolete equipment in favor of FIBER! we need bandwidth and we need it NOW! If verizon can push out hundreds of line miles of fiber per day, so can others! Once docsis 3.0 gets underway, sbc will be in a far more precarious situation if their set-top boxes have to be changed and add costs of fiber node expansion to the home, plus a new standard based on fiber delivered broadband. It would be interesting if states without fiber rollouts fall behind economically because of this, but i'm no expert on such things, |
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imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI
·WOW Internet and C..
| reply to SteveCon
said by SteveCon :C'mon now. *1* person.. 4 story pulls.. 3 outlets.. all in 4 hours? I'm a licensed electrician with 30 years experience who has fished more tel, data, catv and power cables than I care remember; I bet a wiring inspector would have a field day citing code violations on *that* job. I bet that you are 100% wrong. There were absolutely no code violations. Why do you find it hard to pull 3 lines in 4 hours. With the proper tools and not constantly taking breaks it can easily be done, and it has been done many times. Telecom workers always claim this can't be done because they just listen to what their union tells them.
Working safely and doing a quality install in a neat and workmanship-like manner is going to take longer. Sure quality work takes time, but not an entire shift. That's just plain laziness.
Sending one person to fish walls and ceilings alone is a waste of time and money for a company - it can be done, but it's not cost effective. No, a waste of money is sending in multiple techs that still complete the job in the same amount of time. I have rarely seen telephone techs work any faster with multiple techs then it would have taken if they were by themselves.
8 man hours is a more realistic expectation. Not really. That's a ridiculous amount of time to do 3 outlets. It's just as sad as the time it takes to do a FIOS install. It shouldn't take 6 hours to do it. It really sounds like Verizon needs better training for their techs if they all think this is reasonable. |
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mustang03282
join:2003-01-10
Bridgeton, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon FIOS
| reply to imrf
wow i didnt know any companys still ran wires behinds walls bith comcast and direct tv rather just staple wires along the side of your houe then drill a hole in the wall I dont think i';d mind paying more for a nice clean install |
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