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Slaped
join:2009-10-17
2 edits | France Telecom Line Stats Wrong.
Hi All.
Came to this forum via this old thread:
»France Telecom ADSL instability - Help Please!
My problem, also with Teleconnect as it happens, is that because the FT stats on my line are wrong I have been wrongly downgraded from 2mb to 512k so I was interested to hear about the 'dual expertise' procedure.
If you're sitting comfortably I'll tell you the story:
When I signed up with TC in early 2007 »www.Degrouptest.com showed my line as 4838m with 50dB attenuation and a possible ADSL2+ rate of 2665kbps, consequently TC gave me a 2mb service and all in the garden was rosy. I got a rock solid stable 2mb and my router indeed showed 49/50dB attenuation with an SNR in the mid 20's.
In April this year TC changed their own provider which necessitated a router firmware upgrade subsequent to which my connection went haywire. It would drop for no obvious reason, my VoIp would refuse to work, my router would randomly reboot, etc. etc. Many other customers suffered similar or worse and TC admitted that there had been an almighty cock up with the router upgrade process. When I was able to get online though my speed and attenuation were exactly as they always had been, 2mb/50dB.
Finally I reached the point where I decided I had no option but to change ISP however when I checked Degrouptest again I discovered that at some time my line had mysteriously grown longer by 98m and in the process added a massive 10dB of attenuation so now stood at 4936m with 59.9dB attenuation as a consequence of which no ISP would offer me better than 512kb. Not willing to trade a flakey 2mb for 512kb I was more or less forced to stick with Teleconnect and hope for the best.
The router problems persisted and barely a few days would pass between calls to tech support and each time they said they'd done something so 'see how it goes'. Eventually though, following yet another call about 10 days ago, the TC tech looked at Degrouptest (or another similar site), saw my new line stats, came to the conclusion that being on a 2mb package was the problem, and took it upon took it upon himself to order FT to downgrade my line to 512kbs. Naturally of course, based on the erroneous stats, FT now refuse to put me back up to 2m because they say that my line will not support it which we know full well that it did, does, and can be proven, because I have screenshots of the earlier Degrouptest stats plus my router, and 3 others I have tried, all still show 50dB attenuation. As if the downgrade were not bad enough it hasn't actually made a blind bit of difference to the litany of problems !!!!
So my real problem is getting FT to properly check my line and correct their numbers which I can only see being possible by having TC invoke the 'dual expertise' procedure.
I reckon my line is in fact actually around 3.9km. This is based on an educated guess on the route it takes plus the stats from 2 other subscribers who are directly along the way to me and both of whom show a line length of 1943m and 29dB. I am 1800m further away and in a virtually straight line, and as the road runs, and it's hard to see where else my line could possibly go which would not add at least 2 or 3km to it from that 1943m point that which then of course would put me well into the 60's in attenuation in which case I would never have had 2mb and 50dB in the first place.
Now I have learnt about the procedure I will be on the phone to TC all day long until they do something, then when they have I'll dump them ! | |
LilYoda
Feline with squirel personality disorder
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Mountains
| There are providers like FT which err on the safe side of the DSL specs, and others that use Re-ADSL, and let the modem sync at any spec it can.
The good thing with FT would be that you'd have a rock solid 512Kbps. The bad thing is that it's 512Kbps.
It's possible that your line attenuation would increase. For exemple if you had an old line with a thick copper wire, and it got replaced by a new one with a thinner cable, then that's enough to tack on the additional db to make most providers dump your speed to the next safe setting, which is 512Kbps
Regarding the dual expertise test, it can only be initiated by your CLEC, and not the ILEC. This means you'd have to demand that TC sends a tech on site to actually measure the attenuation and SNR on your line. Based on the output, then they have the authority to call on FT
If TC doesn't have techs available, I honestly suggest you switch to a local provider (Neuf/SFR, Free, or FT if you want a solid 512Kbps)
PS: Free uses ReADSL+ on its boxes and also on the DSLAMs. They tend to give the best speed on long links. But they are an ISP for geeks. Meaning they only have roaming techs, no offices, and a sometimes flaky tech support on the phone. Just letting you know in case you want to try them.
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I can't put him in an insane asylum. He's not crazy, he's an idiot!
We'd have to build idiot asylums. But can you imagine the size of the buildings?
B. Dussolier in "Tais-Toi!" | |
Slaped
join:2009-10-17
| 
As was at sign up in 2007 | 
As is currently | 
Typical 2mb DL | 
Router when on 2mb |
If you'll forgive me I do think however that you have missed the point slightly, that being that throughout, and currently, my router(s) have ALWAYS consistently shown 49/50dB and until the forced downgrade I have ALWAYS had a solid 2mb on downloads so whatever has changed it is clearly NOT the actual capability of my line.
I have attached a few screen shots to illustrate. | |
LilYoda
Feline with squirel personality disorder
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Mountains
| Well, I see on the latest graph that it shows 59db instead of the original 49db.
The distance hasn't changed. However, the line type could have changed due to maintenance. You have 4/10 line on 2km and 6/10 on 3km. It could have been 4/10 all the way or even better.
What I'm saying is that it's not necessarily a change in router that may have caused this, and you might actually have an attenuation that gained 10db overnight (for exemple if FT re-routed your phone line, etc...)
In any case, if you want an expertise launched, I am almost sure it needs to be initiated by the CLEC.
--
I can't put him in an insane asylum. He's not crazy, he's an idiot!
We'd have to build idiot asylums. But can you imagine the size of the buildings?
B. Dussolier in "Tais-Toi!" | |
Slaped
join:2009-10-17
| 
My router at this moment |
MY ATTENUATION WAS 50dB BEFORE TC DOWNGRADED ME AND STILL IS AFTERWARDS. IT IS NOT AND NEVER HAS BEEN 59dB AND UNTIL THE DOWNGRADE 10 DAYS OR SO AGO I WAS STILL GETTING 2MB
I am not blaming my router, I never said that.
Nothing has been done to my line at all, I am 100% certain of that, all that has happened is that to try and solve their own problems TC told FT to downgrade me to 512kbs - that's it !
Do you have any links to the dual expertise procedure ? | |
LilYoda
Feline with squirel personality disorder
Premium
join:2004-09-02
Mountains
1 edit | Your second capture shows 59 db as theoretical attenuation, with a longer length, which is why I'm thinking something happened on the line itself.
TC wouldn't be aware of what happened on the line, since FT doesn't inform the CLECs
I don't have any links on the dual expertise of the line. I have juste experienced it myself.
EDIT looking at your NRA here »www.degroupnews.com/carte-nra-ad···PRA.html it looks like TC is just reselling FT's services, since there is no local loop unbundling (called degroupage in France)
This means that TC resells a form of ATM cell or IP backhaul, but your service is fully built on FT. Sadly, FT has only a 512Kbps, 1 Mbps and 8 Mbps package. Unless TC really grabs the bull by the horn to actually challenge FT, there's not a lot you can do 
--
I can't put him in an insane asylum. He's not crazy, he's an idiot!
We'd have to build idiot asylums. But can you imagine the size of the buildings?
B. Dussolier in "Tais-Toi!" | |
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