swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
 ·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·VoicePulse
 ·RoadRunner Cable
|  [Help] Excessive Play In Cluth Pedal - Goes Away During Drive
My S-10 truck has close to 100,000 miles on it. Original clutch. Been a great truck all of these years.
Throughout the course of this past spring and summer, I have noticed there has been excessive play in the clutch pedal...in other words, I can freely move it up and down anywhere from 1-4 inches.
As my drive continues on, the amount I can move it up and down diminishes and it becomes as normal..nice and tight; solid...no play at all.
A quick Google search says something about a part "sticking". My mind has a hard time grasping how a simple clutch system works so i am hoping someone could explain what is going on with this excessive play?
There is no noise to be heard, no gears grinding or anything...but the amount of play that is felt in the pedal is a bit more than it was say, at the start of this summer.
Do I have reason to be worried? Is a trip to the mechanic in order for a *gulp* new clutch? Winter is on our door steps very soon and i would like to get whatever is going on taken care of so I am not stuck in a blizzard. Thanks for any advice!
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
Dime
The Original X
Premium
join:2002-05-14
Findlay, OH | Re: [Help] Excessive Play In Cluth Pedal - Goes Away During Driv
Year, V6 or I4? |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by Dime  :Year, V6 or I4? 1998, 4 cyclinder, 2.2 liter.
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
mr_slick
join:2003-05-22
Lynnwood, WA | reply to swintec
just a guess- a hydraulic issue. seals in master or slave cylinder may be failing? |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
1 edit | reply to swintec
Have you checked the fluid level in the Clutch MC? It normally uses DOT 3 Brake Fluid in the Clutch Master Cylinder, but read the fill cap to be sure and wipe it off before opening. Do not leave it open long and only use fresh fluid to refill it to full if low.
Either there is air in the system, or there is a leak and the fluid is low or there is an internal leak in the clutch master cylinder and by using it and/or by the temps rising that allows the seal to get temporarily better at building up pressure.
More info here:
»answers.yahoo.com/question/index···2AAdWkwK
1998 : CHEVROLET : S10 PICKUP : 2.2L 134 cubic inch L4 MFI (4) : Clutch
»www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,carco···e,Clutch
This is the Clutch Master Cylinder
This is the Clutch Slave Cylinder w/o bearing:
This is the Clutch Slave Cylinder w/ bearing:
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | I usually check the master cylinder fluid level every other oil change, but I just checked it this morning and it is full (where it has always been at).
So that leaves me with air in the system? I would assume that there would have to be a leak somewhere in order to pull air into the system, but apparently, not where any fluid can leak out.
It wouldnt be the fingers of the pressure plate sticking would it?
EDIT-- Also read that Yahoo Answers link...So I guess I need to bleed the lines, but if the master or slave cylinder is bad, it may just come back.
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| Don't confuse the CMC with the Brake Master Cylinder as the Clutch Master is separate and to the left of the BMC.
If the system is low, there may be a leak, but if the system is full there is very little chance that it has air in the system unless it was repaired without you knowing about it and they didn't properly bleed the system.
If the system is full the CMC could have an internal leak (internal leaks let fluid past the seal as the seal is worn out, but no air gets in so that is why an internally leaking system is seen full or nearly full) and it would only be fixed by replacing the Clutch Master Cylinder or rebuilding it if a kit were available.
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by Doctor Olds :Don't confuse the CMC with the Brake Master Cylinder as the Clutch Master is separate and to the left of the BMC. If the system is low, there may be a leak, but if the system is full there is very little chance that it has air in the system unless it was repaired without you knowing about it and they didn't properly bleed the system. Roger that. I have had the truck for the past 8 years or so so there was nothing done to the clutch system since I have had it. I also have one of those haynes repair manuals that I have used over the years and it showed me where the clutch master cylinder was years ago, so I am reasonably sure I am not mixing it up.
I guess at least now I have something to tell my mechanic.
On a side note, being that it is an original clutch, with coming up to 100,000 miles....can I expect a clutch replacement soon? What is the typical life like on these?
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
1 edit | The clutch itself has no set change or wear out interval. I have seen a clutch worn to the rivets in 7 days and I have seen clutches still going strong at 200K Miles. It depends on the driver's habits. If it is not slipping under load at highway speeds, then I personally would just repair or replace the Clutch Master if that is the problem and drive it.  Now if the slave has to be replaced, then of course I would have a new clutch put in (all parts) and have the flywheel ground flat again on a flywheel grinding table. That is because replacing the slave cylinder requires pulling the transmission out anyway, so while you are right at the clutch it would be the time to replace it.
HTH
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME | Thanks for the help! |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs: | Glad to help when I can.  |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
| Oh yes, before I forget...The Haynes repair manual says as regular maintenance, it is good to change the transmission fluid...every so many miles (I forget how much they say)...Being that it is a manual transmission, it isnt very easy to drain the fluid...you have to unscrew some little side mounted plug and use one of those cheap little hand pumps to pump the fluid out. The new fluid comes in a squirt bottles.
Anyways, people always look at me funny when I mention it, because it is a manual transmission...is changing this fluid a good idea? If the mechanic is under there and has that area apart, should I have him do this?
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| Yes, the gear oil in the manual transmission and the gear oil in the rear differential (and if a 4X4 the transfer case and front differential too) should be changed at the interval seen in your Owners Manual or Service Maintenance Guide.
It is usually something you request during an oil change when the vehicle is up in the air. Shops have a barrel with a pump to refill the lube so they don't have to bother with individual quart bottles like someone doing it at home. They just drain the fluid, then pump in fresh fluid with their hand cranked or air powered pump.
There is a little pump kit for quart bottles that makes the job much easier/cleaner for doing it yourself.
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
RonnieB223
join:2002-12-26
U.S.A
1 edit | reply to swintec
I just had my Clutch slave cylinder fail on my 02 Pontiac Grand Am. It has the I4 2.2 Ecotec (70,000 miles) also. I had a similar issue then one day the slave just died and blew out all over.
$1600 ($650 of which was for labor)later it drives like it's brand new because of the new master cylinder, slave cylinder, throw out bearing, clutch pack, and flywheel resurface.
I am not very happy that GM designed certain transmissions with the slave located on the inside of the transmission bell housing otherwise I would have fixed it myself and bought some more time out of my clutch(which had about a year or so left on it anyways).
It's probably only a matter of time before you have no clutch pressure and can't get into a gear without syncing or pop starting it in gear(not fun). |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | said by RonnieB223 :$1600 ($650 of which was for labor)later it drives like it's brand new because of the new master cylinder, slave cylinder, throw out bearing, clutch pack, and flywheel resurface. You are not making me feel to great when you say $1600! 
EDIT- I googled and googled som emore, this looks to be the going rate for this type of clutch? NAPA has the clutch set for my truck for $260....Is the labor really that much?
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| said by swintec :You are not making me feel to great when you say $1600! EDIT- I googled and googled som emore, this looks to be the going rate for this type of clutch? NAPA has the clutch set for my truck for $260....Is the labor really that much? RonnieB223 has a FWD vehicle [Grand Am] which is most always more Labor to replace the Clutch than a RWD vehicle. Sometimes even Double the Labor Time.
As to parts price, this is Rock Auto showing $125, $175, $180 and up for the clutch kit. Plus you get 5% off for knowing the code:
»5% Discount Code for RockAuto
»www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,carco···ype,1993
SACHS Part # K190409
Slave Cylinder w/o Bearing; OD: 9 1/8; Size ID: 1 1/8; TEETH: 26T
$124.79
BRUTE POWER Part # 90198
Diaphragm; 9 1/8x26Tx1 1/8
$175.79
ACDELCO Part # 381210 {replaces 88989242 #19182441, 88989242}
$180.79
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| reply to RonnieB223
said by RonnieB223 :It's probably only a matter of time before you have no clutch pressure and can't get into a gear without syncing or pop starting it in gear(not fun). Possibly true, but the OP so far has not stated his slave cylinder is leaking or that the Clutch Master Cylinder is empty (a sign of a leak).
If it is only the CMC bypassing/leaking internally due to bad seals on the piston then he can simply replace it, bleed the system and be good to go as there is no set interval for a clutch to last. I had 134,000 Miles on my last clutch (had some towing with that one) and 150,000 Miles on the previous one.
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
THUD300
Part Of A Complete Breakfast
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Decatur, IL
1 edit | reply to swintec
What the OP describes is a hydraulic issue; the system is "pumping up" with use and returning the feel to normal.
Trouble here is, is it the chicken or the egg... probably best to replace both the master and slave cylinders and be done with it. While the trans is out, have the clutch disc inspected and you may find that the clutch components are okay and have plenty of material left... but almost any shop will try to steer you into replacing the disc and plate and surfacing the flywheel while it is apart.
--
Illinois: where the governors make the license plates! |
|
Doctor Olds
I Need A Remedy For What's Ailing Me.
Premium,VIP
join:2001-04-19
1970 442 W30
clubs:
| I'd only put a CMC on the vehicle based on the symptoms (especially if the system shows no leaks from the CSC or line) and simply drive it until either the clutch is finally worn out/starting to slip under load or until the CSC or line fails to hold pressure internally or starts to leak. Then I'd pull the trans and replace the whole clutch kit, resurface the flywheel and replace the CSC or line plus the line if needed going inside the bell housing.
--
What’s the point of owning a supercar if you can’t scare yourself stupid from time to time? |
|
swintec
Premium
join:2003-12-19
Alfred, ME
·RapidVPS
·surpasshosting
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·VoicePulse
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by Doctor Olds :I'd only put a CMC on the vehicle based on the symptoms... Looking at the prices (about 40 bucks or so) for the master cylinder, it would seem to be a fairly cheap thing to install to see if it works, before having a mechanic tear things apart. I will read up on it in my repair manual to see if it is something I feel comfortable doing myself / with someone else. If so, I will probably do that.
--
Block Accounts | UseNet Now |
|
