jakkwb
join:2009-04-27
USA
| Timeouts on pinging my upstream providers router
Hello all,
I am a WISP using Motorola Canopy. I currently have a single T1, which is close to maxed out.
Here is my question - my upstream provider is ATT. I have a Cisco 2600 for my gateway router. I also have a Mikrotik PC based router handling my wireless private IPs. When I ping the ATT router that is next hop away from my Mikrotik router, I do get some timeouts. Mikrotik reports 17% packet loss out of about 4000 packets. Now like I said, it is close to maxed out - I average 1300-1450 kbps. It very rarely goes over 1500kbps.
Most of my users are experiencing some lag and "page cannot be displayed" errors, even when it's not prime time on my network.
Can someone explain to me why I'm getting so much packet loss? |
|
rcm
join:2004-02-16
Pulaski, TN
| Sounds like your connection is maxed out, thus packet loss is occuring. If you want to make sure that is the case, then stop all traffic through your internet connection and then ping your upstream provider. If you see your ping times lower and no packet loss occurs, then you know the answer. If it stays the same then there is something wrong with your router/upstream provider. |
|
battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000 | reply to jakkwb
Not to be a smart ass but....
"I am a WISP using Motorola Canopy. I currently have a single T1, which is close to maxed out." |
|
jakkwb
join:2009-04-27
USA | reply to jakkwb
So, what is it exactly you are maybe being a smart a** about? The fact that I am using Canopy, or the fact that I just have a single T1? |
|
rcm
join:2004-02-16
Pulaski, TN | he's talking about you admitting what you problem is, or maybe answering your own question |
|
jakkwb
join:2009-04-27
USA | reply to jakkwb
OK, I understand. I thought a T1 had 1540kbps on it. I know I'm close, but not exactly 100%.
Is there a small percentage used for timing, error correction, etc...or should I be getting 1540 when it is maxed out? |
|
prairiesky
join:2008-12-08
Springstein, MB | reply to jakkwb
you're maxing out. |
|
jakkwb
join:2009-04-27
USA | reply to jakkwb
OK. Thanks for all the answers. I thought that was the case, just wanted to make sure with other people that have been there already. |
|
petecarlson
join:2004-11-06
Baltimore, MD |
Patch it with a Monowall bridge, or similar device, doing traffic shaping until you can get more capacity in. You will see a world of difference. |
|
battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000
| reply to jakkwb
At a T1 level I would consider a T1 maxed out when you are peaking at 80%, when your sustaining 50 to 60% it's time to start looking for more bandwidth. If you are waiting until you are running at over 90% you are not managing your network very well. |
|
viperm
Carpe Diem
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Winchester, CA
| reply to jakkwb
Almost all bandwidth comes with some sort of overhead T-1, ds-3 whatever.
We figure in 10-15% of that bandwith will have this overhead etc.
So for example a T-1 1540 Kbps take worst case 15% that leaves you with about 1309 Kbps to spread among your flock! If you are not doing bandwidth control with that then it will be gobbled up real quick!
--
ComTrain Certified Tower Climber. American Tower Certified approved contractor. Wireless consultants. |
|
gunther_01work
@mchsi.com
| reply to jakkwb
We used to have the same (exact) set-up except Star for our edge box instead of MT.. You shouldn't see packet loss from MT to Cisco.. You would see it however on the next router away from your Cisco upstream. The speed is limited across the T-1, not on your LAN ports.
Packet loss will happen once you max out your T though. That means it's time for another one  |
|
Jerm
join:2000-04-10
Richland, WA
| reply to jakkwb
The 1300-1450 kbps "average" is really over 5 minutes most likely. This means that sometimes you are above and sometimes you are below, but you can guarantee that you are hitting the maximum quite regularly. Thus the packet loss.
I had a friend with this same T1 scenario that used a pFsense box in transparent mode to shape his traffic until more bandwidth could be brought in. Although I think Mikrotik should be able to do the same type of functionality. |
|
viperm
Carpe Diem
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Winchester, CA
| reply to jakkwb
You can follow the instructions at the end of this page to share the 1.5 megs you have equally between all users if you dont want to create seprate queues for each user.
»www.mikrotik.com/testdocs/ros/3.···ueue.php
We did this on a campus till we got more bandwidth in and it seemed to work really well..
/ip firewall mangle add chain=forward src-address=192.168.0.0/24 \
action=mark-connection new-connection-mark=users-con
/ip firewall mangle add connection-mark=users-con action=mark-packet \
new-packet-mark=users chain=forward
/queue type add name=pcq-download kind=pcq pcq-classifier=dst-address
/queue type add name=pcq-upload kind=pcq pcq-classifier=src-address
/queue tree add name=Download parent=Local max-limit=1540000
/queue tree add parent=Download queue=pcq-download packet-mark=users
/queue tree add name=Upload parent=Public max-limit=1540000
/queue tree add parent=Upload queue=pcq-upload packet-mark=users
--
ComTrain Certified Tower Climber. American Tower Certified approved contractor. Wireless consultants. |
|
gunther_01
Premium
join:2004-03-29
Saybrook, IL
| reply to jakkwb
It's 1.544 "M"bps, but who's counting for the bean counters out there
He still should not see packet loss to his Cisco on the LAN side. Unless he is already trying to shape on the MT with a max que. |
|
superdog
I Need A Drink
Premium,MVM
join:2001-07-13
Lebanon, PA
| reply to Jerm
said by Jerm  :The 1300-1450 kbps "average" is really over 5 minutes most likely. This means that sometimes you are above and sometimes you are below, but you can guarantee that you are hitting the maximum quite regularly. Thus the packet loss. After chatting with the guys at Neteq a long while back, I remember them asking me how many users were on the T1 I wanted to shape. I was told that at some point, no matter what appliance you put on there, it may not help a lot, especially if you are already jamming the pipe with a million users.
Sometimes, only more bandwidth is the answer, hands down. A cheap way to go would be for you to throw a DSL line into the mix until another T1 or Metro Ethernet drop can be made (Make SURE you can resell it!). I have done this in the past as a stop gap measure, as in most cases,you can get a DSL line provisioned a lot faster than a T1. I tried Covad at your location (That is who I use and they are great), but they do not service your area. I tried using the address of the Pizza Hut on highway 67 at numerous pre-qual. sites for DSL but it appears you are in some kind of a black hole for broadband. 
Forget that, it does appear that New Edge networks can service your location and I think they allow you to resell?
--
»www.wavecrazy.net
|
|
viperm
Carpe Diem
Premium
join:2002-07-09
Winchester, CA
| reply to gunther_01
I was tired hahahah so sue me hahahahah I wa trying to load an linux and free radius on another server and take customer support calls at the same time.
--
ComTrain Certified Tower Climber. American Tower Certified approved contractor. Wireless consultants. |
|
