r81984
Fair and Balanced
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| How can you patent something you did not invent???
Why wouldn't these companies just make their own DVRs?
Tivo sucks and likes to pretend they invented the DVR, but everyone knows they did not.
The Echo Star case was about this: "TiVo's patent for "Time Warp" software, which allows users to record one TV program while watching another." (this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims)
I do not see how you can patent such a broad thing like this when computer software and hardware has been doing this before Tivo was invented. Also, I am sure there are 1000 of ways to accomplish this task so if Tivo patented one why not just use one of the other 999 ways?
If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense.
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dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
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| said by r81984  :Why wouldn't these companies just make their own DVRs? Tivo sucks and likes to pretend they invented the DVR, but everyone knows they did not. The Echo Star case was about this: "TiVo's patent for "Time Warp" software, which allows users to record one TV program while watching another." (this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims) I do not see how you can patent such a broad thing like this when computer software and hardware has been doing this before Tivo was invented. Also, I am sure there are 1000 of ways to accomplish this task so if Tivo patented one why not just use one of the other 999 ways? If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense. You can have a DVR. Just not one that lets you record one show while watching another. In other words, you can single tuner your DVR action all you want. Just don't try to watch while recording. 
Many courts have upheld the patent. So just give in an buy a TIVO like everyone else. I did and now I am a very happy person. |
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espaeth
Digital Plumber
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| reply to r81984
said by r81984 :If this patent is continued to be viewed as valid then Tivo owns the rights to all DVRs, even the ones that existed before Tivo got their patent in 2001. It just does not make sense. It's been argued that Tivo's patent is an obvious extension of previous patents. The US Patent Office is currently investigating that:
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···pute.php |
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r81984
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2 edits | reply to dcdeadbeat
I do not see the point of a DVR that you need a monthly subscription for or why you have to pay so much for a cheap computer with a harddrive and dual tv tuners.
Also, why is Tivo ignoring all the computer software that does dual tuners and everything a TIVO does + more. It seems like they are not really enforcing what they like to pretend they invented with a vague patent in 2001 (years after the technology was really invented).
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Neyland
join:2003-02-04
USA
| reply to dcdeadbeat
I have a Tivo and really HATE not having the current tuned channel in a window while I look at settings, recorded content, etc.
And the unit (Tivo HD) menu system is horrendously slow compared to the Dish interface or Comcast's.
Of course I'm sure someone probably holds the patent speedy interface or tuned picture in a window.
Next you'll hear, sir you owe us royalties for the 'Fold the toilet paper in squares before you wipe your butt' method of personal hygiene. We patented that back in 1820. |
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curtis33
join:2007-12-24
Fort Worth, TX | reply to r81984
"this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims"
Lots of misinformation in this thread. TiVo filed the patent in 1998. |
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curtis33
join:2007-12-24
Fort Worth, TX | reply to r81984
"this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims"
Lots of misinformation in this thread. The patent was filed in 1998. |
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curtis33
join:2007-12-24
Fort Worth, TX
| reply to dcdeadbeat
"You can have a DVR. Just not one that lets you record one show while watching another. In other words, you can single tuner your DVR action all you want. Just don't try to watch while recording."
Most DVRs can't display a direct picture. Everything you see comes off the hard drive. That's how you can pause and rewind the live picture. In other words, there is always recording going on even if you are just watching a "live" picture. |
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wierdo
join:2001-02-16
Tulsa, OK
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| reply to Neyland
said by Neyland :I have a Tivo and really HATE not having the current tuned channel in a window while I look at settings, recorded content, etc. Interestingly, I don't like DVRs that have the current channel in a window while I'm in the menu. More than once a TV show or movie has been spoiled for me by that.
If you don't ever watch Live TV, which is the use case TiVo is designed for, there is no good that can come of having that window.
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It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word.  |
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r81984
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| reply to curtis33
said by curtis33 :"this patent was from 2001, way after people have already been doing what the patent claims" Lots of misinformation in this thread. The patent was filed in 1998. Even if their patent was filed in 1998 people were still using computers as DVRs. Tivo did not invent anything.
Also replay TV had a DVR out before Tivo. Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's.
I do not see Tivo going after all DVRs they seem to be picking and choosing who they go after while ignoring the many many other DVRs out there that were created with no technology or knowledge stolen from Tivo. If Tivo can have a broad patent of technology not invented by them then why can't I just go and broadly patent whatever I want.
Hmmm.... A box that outputs calculations from inputs through a hand operated device. I'll be waiting for my royalties.
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jmn1207
Premium
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Reston, VA
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| reply to curtis33
said by curtis33 :"You can have a DVR. Just not one that lets you record one show while watching another. In other words, you can single tuner your DVR action all you want. Just don't try to watch while recording." Most DVRs can't display a direct picture. Everything you see comes off the hard drive. That's how you can pause and rewind the live picture. In other words, there is always recording going on even if you are just watching a "live" picture. I'd be surprised if this were true. I've had a hard drive completely crash and I was still able to watch live TV until the DVR was replaced. There aren't really that many different types of DVR's out there, this was a Scientific Atlanta with Comcast. |
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curtis33
join:2007-12-24
Fort Worth, TX
| reply to r81984
TiVo's patent has been reexamined by the USPTO upon the request of Echostar and subsequently validated without a single word being changed. If their high priced lawyers couldn't uncover prior art I'm guessing the readers of this board haven't either. |
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wierdo
join:2001-02-16
Tulsa, OK
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1 edit | reply to r81984
said by r81984 : Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's. If by that you mean "ReplayTV cost a lot more up front because the cost of the subscription was built into the price of the box," you are correct.
And if I might ask, what software were people using to record TV to their PC in 1998 that had trick play features? I first got a PCI TV tuner that had software to record in about 2000.
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It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. |
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r81984
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| said by wierdo :said by r81984 : Replay TVs version worked without a subscription fee meaning their technology was much better than Tivo's. If by that you mean "ReplayTV cost a lot more up front because the cost of the subscription was built into the price of the box," you are correct. It is a DVR there is no reason for a subscription.
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wierdo
join:2001-02-16
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| said by r81984 :It is a DVR there is no reason for a subscription. Tell that to TiVo, Replay, the cable companies, and the satellite companies. The guide data doesn't magically appear, you know.
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It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. |
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r81984
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join:2001-11-14
St John'S, NL | It does on my Media Center PC. |
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Neyland
join:2003-02-04
USA | reply to wierdo
If the 'use case' is to never watch live TV on a Tivo, why offer the ability?
I feel this is your opinion more so than anything else. |
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wierdo
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1 edit | reply to r81984
said by r81984 :It does on my Media Center PC. And someone is paying for the data itself and the cost of distributing it to you. That Microsoft or whoever hides that cost from you does not make it nonexistent, only hidden from view. I don't know what they charge for Media Center, so they could be building it into the price of the OS for all I know.
(Somehow I expect a TiVo HD+Lifetime would have been cheaper, anyhow)
Neyland, they offer the ability because people want to occasionally do so (and the folks who use it solely for trick play on sporting events want to view live), but the device is designed to primarily be used for watching time-shifted content.
There are a lot of things I disagree with TiVo on (no free space indicator, for one!), but they adamantly stick to their idea of how the device should be used and develop for that. Much like Apple in that respect, actually.
Edited to correct punctuation error
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It's wierdo, not weirdo. Yes, I know that's not the 'proper' spelling of the similar english language word. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC | reply to r81984
Even if you had the capability to do this on a computer pre-1998, it wasn't widespread enough to deny the patent. |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| If Paris Hilton can patent the phrases "That's Hot" and "That's Huge", I wouldn't be surprised if we all don't end up paying for a patent on breathing air. Every time we take a breath, we owe another nickel. Yikes!  |
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