saillaw
Premium
join:2007-05-08
Dubai
1 edit | Locks steal gold from healers.... little thieves!
This post has strayed from the New Mount and Vanity Pet Storage topic so I decided to start a new thread.
said by Digital  :said by Melleen :Am I the only lock to have NEVER used a mana pot? And yes, I did raid. Only time I will use mana pots is in BGs and low on health. Otherwise, just life tap FTW. I just want to clarify that in reality, in a raiding environment, when a lock life-taps, what they are really doing is taking mana from their healers. Why? Because any healer worth his or her salt is going to do their best to keep the entire raid topped-up, not just the tanks. So when you life tap and loose health, we throw you a heal or two. Thats mana we could have saved or a heal that could have gone on a hunter's pet... cute little ravenger....
Since you are forcing us to heal you when you could have used a mana-pot yourself, you are wasting our mana for yours. We can't life-tap, like you selfish locks, so in long boss-fights, we healers have to use mana pots and continue to top-you-off for free.
I've never bothered to do the math on it... I don't know how much mana the locks are getting, but I hope its at least a good trade... a flash of light from my pally will average about a 2200 health at a cost of 180 mana. How much mana are you getting from the life-tap and how many heals do I have to use to top you off?
I'm going to start billing the locks in my guild for mana pot refunds 
Gas, Cash or Ass -- no one rides for free!
--
Hanging with my Gnomies |
|
KCP
join:2008-06-21
Pearl River, LA
2 edits | Having a 70 Holy Priestess, I would have to agree and disagree. I have had a lot of locks that I have healed because they expected it. I leveled from 10-70 as Holy (practically). I have had a LOT of instances to deal with locks.
My 2nd highest level'd toon is a lock...he just dinged level 44 last night. I have actually learned a lot on how to heal a lock just by playing them...here's the simple way to do it: DON'T. They have siphon life and drain life. They can heal themselves as far as I am concerned. When I did maintenance heals (while still in Japan) for Kara during ?Maiden?, over vent, the two locks we had told me to stop healing them. So now, when I group with a lock, I tell them that they are SOL when they need healing during a fight UNLESS they have aggro. (TY XPerl.)
And I don't use pots. Mana Tapx3, Arcane Torrent, Shadowfiend and Inner Focus. Plus my various mana-reducing skills.
Edit 1: Removed bold print.
Edit 2: Specified level of my lock.
--
"To trudge: the slow, weary, depressing yet determined walk of a man who has nothing left in life except the impulse to simply soldier on."
-Geoffrey Chaucer, A Knight's Tale, 2001 |
|
JIGA
Its A Bird, Its A Plane, Its..
Premium
join:2002-02-02
Azle, TX
clubs: | reply to saillaw
I played a 70 lock as well. When I tapped, I didn't expect heals. The only time I expected healing was when I had a mob on me and that's it. Otherwise I was bandaging or using Drain Life or Siphon Life (if you are specced for it). |
|
chaud
Serious Business
join:2004-07-09
Anderson, SC | reply to saillaw
If you care about mana pots during raiding, you are doing something wrong. |
|
KCP
join:2008-06-21
Pearl River, LA
| said by chaud :If you care about mana pots during raiding, you are doing something wrong. I truthfully don't think (s)he cares about the mana pots, I think this one is more about the principal. But that's an opinion. |
|
DownLow
Nope...I Got Nothing
Premium
join:2001-04-25
Long Island
| reply to chaud
said by chaud :If you care about mana pots during raiding, you are doing something wrong. Agreed. As a healer, I will always heal my target/group - yes, if I recognize its a lock tapping, I of course will not focus too much attention on them. Funny thing, I often tell the locks in my group to tap if they need and I will heal them.
--
Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult! |
|
pp03
join:2002-06-13
Minneapolis, MN
1 edit | Life Tap Rank 7 (580 Health, 580 mana) before talents and spell damage.
Flash of light: 180 mana, 1.5-2.2k health depending on +heal.
Lifebloom: 226 mana, 1 cast, over upwards of 2k heal.
Renew: 450 mana, upwards of 3k heal
Healing Wave: 720 mana, resto spam rank 1, easyily heal over 5k.
Point, shaman are the only ones that it really affects in more than a blink of the eye, but if they just wait until sub 20%, they have probably the most efficient push.
So 12k Health lock, can generate ~3k mana in ~15 seconds (BEFORE SPELL DAMAGE), and have their healer cast one of the above for in some cases 1/30 the value of a mana potion. Get with it. Just to clarify, I'll add this edit.
Assuming you pot for 3k, the trade off for them life tapping is ~1/30 the value of a pot for the healer, for a full 30/30 pot for the warlock. Add in spell damage and talents and you get the same affect in under ~6 seconds, barely phasing raid dps.
--
The History Channel rocks! ... you know it! |
|
KCP
join:2008-06-21
Pearl River, LA
| reply to DownLow
said by DownLow :said by chaud :If you care about mana pots during raiding, you are doing something wrong. Agreed. As a healer, I will always heal my target/group - yes, if I recognize its a lock tapping, I of course will not focus too much attention on them. Funny thing, I often tell the locks in my group to tap if they need and I will heal them. I only do that during the down time. |
|
DownLow
Nope...I Got Nothing
Premium
join:2001-04-25
Long Island
1 edit | said by KCP :said by DownLow :said by chaud :If you care about mana pots during raiding, you are doing something wrong. Agreed. As a healer, I will always heal my target/group - yes, if I recognize its a lock tapping, I of course will not focus too much attention on them. Funny thing, I often tell the locks in my group to tap if they need and I will heal them. I only do that during the down time. Yes, especially when out of combat.
Oddly enough, as a healer, I have been pre-programed to immediately react to two sounds - Decursive (to clense, even before the target says..."Holy fire on me" or "I'm asleep") and a lock's tap. |
|
thrillhaus
Premium
join:2003-12-26
Tucson, AZ
clubs: | reply to saillaw
I still stand by my original statement that using a mana potion will improve the warlock's DPS because he can continue to shadowbolt spam without using a GCD. All those GCD's from lifetapping add up and significantly impact their DPS. |
|
belialli
join:2001-03-31
Brooklyn, NY | reply to saillaw
A destruction pot would improve his dps more than a mana pot. For fights like Brutallus, we actually tried a shadow priest in the warlock group and with destro pots and no lifetapping, they just wrecked the meters. |
|
Omega
Displaced Ohioan
Premium
join:2002-07-30
Cheyenne, WY
clubs:
 ·Bresnan Online
 ·Verizon Wireless B..
·Comcast
 ·AT&T Midwest
1 edit | said by belialli :A destruction pot would improve his dps more than a mana pot. For fights like Brutallus, we actually tried a shadow priest in the warlock group and with destro pots and no lifetapping, they just wrecked the meters. Wrong. Sans shadow priests, mana pots are more DPS than destro pots.
As a raiding warlock, I use mana pots, not out of concern for the healer's mana but for concern of trying to wtfpwn the damage meters.
And you better believe I expect heals when I lifetap. It's the way my class was designed - horrible mana efficiency. The amount of DPS locks bring to fights gives us more than enough reason to be able to expect heals atfer a lifetap.
And to close, if you are bitching about mana pots, stop raiding. |
|
KCP
join:2008-06-21
Pearl River, LA
| said by Omega :said by belialli :A destruction pot would improve his dps more than a mana pot. For fights like Brutallus, we actually tried a shadow priest in the warlock group and with destro pots and no lifetapping, they just wrecked the meters. Wrong. Sans shadow priests, mana pots are more DPS than destro pots. As a raiding warlock, I use mana pots, not out of concern for the healer's mana but for concern of trying to wtfpwn the damage meters. And you better believe I expect heals when I lifetap. It's the way my class was designed - horrible mana efficiency. The amount of DPS locks bring to fights gives us more than enough reason to be able to expect heals atfer a lifetap. And to close, if you are bitching about mana pots, stop raiding. You won't receive any heals from me unless you have aggro. You may have horrible mana efficiency, but you have two ways to get your own life back. Only one if you are destro or demon spec. You can get it yourself with just Life Drain and it still adds to the DPS. |
|
Dissembled
join:2008-01-23
Indianapolis, IN | Ditto. Locks are on their own unless they have heavy aggro and are going down. I'll top them off after the fight when I'm going to drink anyway, but otherwise they will have to manage. |
|
Digital
As-Salamu Alaykum
Premium
join:2000-07-24
Mentor, OH
| reply to KCP
You know, it's funny that a priest won't heal a life tapping lock because they really don't need the healing. What I stated before didn't mean that I expected a heal. What I meant was that I can heal myself. I am an affliction lock, siphon life pretty much keeps me topped off through the entire fight. (even though I hate raiding, but I will do a heroic now and again.)
I think most of you need to get off of your high horses and just have fun with the game.
--
Cædite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius. |
|
SkellBasher
Yes Sorto, I'll take my Prozac
join:2000-10-22
North Tonawanda, NY
| reply to saillaw
I'm sorry, but if you're a priest or resto druid who can't take the quick second to toss a HoT up on a warlock to allow them to tap, you're not doing your job.
But on the other hand, evaluate things based on the situation. If you're not overly busy, a renew / lifebloom isn't a big deal. You should also communicate with your locks. I can't tell you how many times that I'm using my pez, potting, or life draining to fill back up, and I get 4 flash heals out of nowhere. When you do that, you're wasting MY shards, MY mana for DL, MY money for the pots.
I know healing locks isn't the easiest thing in the world to do, but sometimes people need to get off their high horse and realize that if you work together, things are significantly easier. |
|
KCP
join:2008-06-21
Pearl River, LA
1 edit | @Digital:
I never said I wouldn't heal a life tapping lock. I just said that you would have to have aggro. (I think I am the only Priest that's here. I think everyone else is a Pally.)
@Skell:
IMO: As stated, I have a 44 lock and a 70 priest. I have a little bit of experience with both. I soon found out that siphon life and drain life are my best friends. I'll be damned if I ask for a healing. The Pez's and the life tap go hand in hand with the two life stealing skills.
I have no problems giving a lock a HoT after a fight before I drink if I have the mana to spare. And you are right...its all in the situation. If you have aggro, then for sure, you are getting a bubble, followed by a renew and topped with at least one flash heal.
Lastly, Shards are easy to come by...esp raiding.
Edit:
For reference, here's the two toons I am talking about:
»www.armory-light.com/us/Anub'arak/Sintar/
»www.armory-light.com/us/Anub'arak/Yoporri/ |
|
SkellBasher
Yes Sorto, I'll take my Prozac
join:2000-10-22
North Tonawanda, NY
| SL and DL are great for grinding, and situationally good in 5 mans, but these days, if you're raiding, and trying to do any significant amount of damage, you're 0/21/40, so SL isn't available.
The thing that burns me up is the healer argument that heals are 'wasted' on a lock. That's just crap. I know there are locks out there that will tap until they get all the way down and expect a greater heal RIGHT NOW. Those locks should be allowed to die, and ridiculed publicly.
I used to be TOLD to life tap in Kara just before the skellies on Nightbane. I'd tap down to 30%, one of our pallies would drop a couple big heals on me, and he'd have instant aggro once the skellies dropped. It's a great paladin trick, makes that phase ez-mode. |
|
ender7074
join:2006-11-21
Saint Louis, MO
·AT&T Southeast
1 edit | reply to saillaw
I'm a healer and I dont have a single problem healing locks in an instance. If you do, then you shouldnt be a healer. Locks crank out quite a bit of DPS and if you're going to complain about healing them so they can continue cranking out the DPS then you are not someone I'd want in my raid. Also, mana regen isnt really a huge issue if you have decent gear and do the basics like mana oil. I have no issues healing anyone and if that costs me a mana pot (rarely) then so be it. How many health pots/bandaids do people use waiting for a heal from the healers?
Also, you do realize that most locks have a smaller mana pool than mages or other DPS mana classes. They have to tap or just stand there and wand. I'm going to take the simple effort of healing a lock to keep the raid DPS up instead of having a class standing there with their thumb up their rear doing nothing. |
|
Dissembled
join:2008-01-23
Indianapolis, IN | You don't want me in your raid because I'm making sure the MT is still standing instead of getting distracted by a guy who's sackin his own life bar?
Pft |
|
