A So Cal place name primer in Southern California http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r15352114 en Mon, 01 Dec 2008 12:36:07 EDT Mon, 01 Dec 2008 12:36:07 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19302048 marcelle19 :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

♫♪ See Pearson Ford, they stand alone, at Clairmont and El Cajon ♫♪

ba-dump
...especially the "dump" part - I remember cleaning and supervising custodial crews at the LaVerne Person Ford, and how they brought out a doctored "original" invoice (we had already checked the same truck out at the Ford dealer out by the 71) - it was a scam all the way.
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Some people think they gain through dishonest means, never realizing that in lying, cheating, and other dishonesty, they are losing pieces of themselves, which they can never recover. SPECIAL]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19302048 Mon, 22 Oct 2007 04:45:52 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19301745 MotherNature : ♫♪ See Pearson Ford, they stand alone, at Clairmont and El Cajon ♫♪

ba-dump
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Welcome to sunny Fontana.... birthplace of the Hells Angels MC.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19301745 Mon, 22 Oct 2007 01:51:52 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19285521 marcelle19 :
said by Nutty Hiker See Profile :

I don't know, Bill. Next time I'm at the library I'll look it up. It's spelled Claremont, BTW, not Clairemont.
Oops! :o

Clairemont

Unless you're in San Diego... ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19285521 Fri, 19 Oct 2007 03:30:34 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19277377 Nutty Hiker : I don't know, Bill. Next time I'm at the library I'll look it up. It's spelled Claremont, BTW, not Clairemont.
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Blah, blah, blah...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19277377 Wed, 17 Oct 2007 22:03:02 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19247869 marcelle19 : Did anyone get Montclair?

It used to be the Monte Vista Water District when I first lived there, but I think they took the "Mont," looked at Clairemont, and turned it around, sort of...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19247869 Sat, 13 Oct 2007 04:37:35 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19095569 TwoFrogs : In Latin, silva = "woods" or "forest", mar = "sea." As in Pennsylvania, Penn's woodlands. And Mardi gras, "sea of fat."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19095569 Tue, 18 Sep 2007 00:35:14 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19094100 MotherNature : Sylmar was once the site of the world’s largest olive groves - hence its name, which means “Sea of Trees”.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sylmar,_Lo···lifornia

I don't know how they got "Sea of Trees" out of Sylmar, but oh well, there you go.
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Jack Horkheimer gives me the creeps.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19094100 Mon, 17 Sep 2007 20:58:16 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19092046 machinegunke : How about Sylmar up in the S.F.Valley. How did that name come about? I lived there from 1965 until I moved to Palmdale back in 1985.
On another note, do any of you old timers remember A.F.Wescott and sons chicken ranch on old Reseda Blvd. back in the 40's and 50's? That was my grandfather on my mothers side.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,19092046 Mon, 17 Sep 2007 15:41:57 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18715878 spg : Whirlybirds

Well that goes to show me what happens when you arrive at the party late!

Agoura was named after some shepherds named Aguirre. They misspelled the name.

Moorpark was named after the apricot, not the other way around. Just don't spell it backwards!

Fillmore was named after a SPRR superintendent, not the President.

Henry Mayo Newhall named Saugus after his home town in Massachusetts]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18715878 Fri, 20 Jul 2007 22:20:13 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18512330 PhiloVance : How about this: »www.mydogspot.com/

Not really a place, but lotsa history. Actually I found it a few weeks ago but was reminded of it today.

Does CW still have his many commercials where he wing walks, etc?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18512330 Fri, 15 Jun 2007 14:36:37 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17166658 Bane75 : Placentia = Pleasant Place]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17166658 Fri, 27 Oct 2006 12:35:25 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17070303 MotherNature : Or guano.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17070303 Wed, 11 Oct 2006 20:05:41 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17069743 TwoFrogs :
said by maartena See Profile :

Chapman and Glassell discussed the situation with 2 other civic leaders and decided on a name change. They agreed that the city should be named after the fruit that was grown there, however they could not agree on a name.
Thank God no one was raising dangleberries.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17069743 Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:37:40 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17069618 maartena : A nice tale, supposed to be true... but no one knows for sure.

The city of Orange, California was founded in 1871 by Mr. Chapman and Mr. Glassell and they dubbed it Richland. Soon after the first houses were built and people started receiving their mail, the city officials were contacted by the Post Office. Apperantly, there already was a city named Richland, California which was founded before 1871. This was in a time when there were no zipcodes, so two cities with the same name in the same state could be confusing.

Chapman and Glassell discussed the situation with 2 other civic leaders and decided on a name change. They agreed that the city should be named after the fruit that was grown there, however they could not agree on a name.

One wanted the name Orange, one wanted Lemon, another wanted Almond and the last wanted Olive. To decide on the name, they decided to do it the good-old wild west way: In a poker game.

Obviously we now know that the person who picked Orange won that pokergame. But to please the other three it was decided that the other three names would get a street name. And so there is a Lemon Street, Almond Street and an Olive Street right around the oldest part of the city.
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"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -
Benjamin Franklin, Founding Father.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17069618 Wed, 11 Oct 2006 18:13:31 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16695633 w6bi : Simi Valley; from Wikipedia: "some writers think that the name of Simi Valley came from the Chumash word "Shimiji", meaning little white clouds."

Others say 'simi' in Chumash meant "windy" - which would fit...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16695633 Sat, 12 Aug 2006 21:25:18 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16622373 Bolt Backer : Escondido = Hidden]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16622373 Tue, 01 Aug 2006 15:52:08 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16552883 tannman : Oxnard....Named after of all things a Sugar Beet farmer "Henry T Oxnard"...why couldn't his name be smith or jones or anything but Oxnard]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16552883 Sat, 22 Jul 2006 11:41:07 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16117243 major marco : South Coast Orange County = Stepford]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16117243 Wed, 17 May 2006 17:48:31 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16004205 dwhs : LA - Charley ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16004205 Sun, 30 Apr 2006 20:30:02 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16001143 MotherNature : Quite possibly a first for the So Cal forum.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16001143 Sun, 30 Apr 2006 09:46:55 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15999900 Phil : Anon war! ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15999900 Sun, 30 Apr 2006 00:00:12 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15997709 anon : Talk is so cheap. As a boy myself, my family went from owning a thriving and successful ranch to scrounging for fire wood in the city dump as a result of dealing with Heber Perrett. And we are not the only ones- countless others have lost "the family farm" to good old Mr. Perrett. He seems like such a nice guy, and sounds so believable. You have no idea. You mention research- I suggest you do a little- at almost any California county records division for example. My advice is never get involved with him in matters of money!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15997709 Sat, 29 Apr 2006 16:50:34 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15933086 MotherNature : As an add on to Val's post, how did Redondo Beach come by its name? It was once part of the Avila family holding called the Rancho Sausal Redondo, Sausal meaning willow, Redondo meaning rounded. Ranch of the Rounded Willow.

Which is kind of redundant, as I assume they're meaning the Arroyo Willow, a small riparian tree that tends to grow, uh, redondo. There's nothing like the smell of the Arroyo Willow in the air right around dusk. That heady aroma sure brings back carefree childhood memories.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15933086 Thu, 20 Apr 2006 01:43:49 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668975 bobrk : What? Where's Narbonne? ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668975 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:47:58 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668963 Valkyre : Interesting article in today's Daily Breeze about how some of the local places got their names:

»www.dailybreeze.com/news/article···ll=y&c=y

Founding families left their mark on history

The legacy of the Carson, Del Amo, Dominguez and Sepulveda names extends beyond road maps.

By Stephanie Walton
Daily Breeze

You see the names of Dominguez, Del Amo, Carson and Sepulveda everywhere in the South Bay -- streets, commercial centers, universities. But who were these South Bay pioneers?

Here's a look at the men and women behind those curious names.

Dominguez: Juan Jose Dominguez received the 75,000-acre Rancho San Pedro land grant in the 1780s in appreciation for many years of military service to the Spanish crown, according to The Rancho San Pedro by Robert Cameron Gillingham. The sweep of the grant extended from western Long Beach to Redondo Beach.

Juan Jose lived on the ranch sporadically for 20 years; he died in 1809. His heir, nephew Cristobal Dominguez, also in the service of the Spanish military, did not live there at all, leading to lingering land disputes and litigation that would occupy Manuel Dominguez, Cristobal's oldest son, for many years after Cristobal's death in 1825.

Manuel Dominguez, also known as Don Manuel, also would have to reaffirm his family's right of ranch ownership to Mexican and U.S. authorities as California's government changed over the years.

In 1869, the patent of the title to Rancho San Pedro -- minus the Palos Verdes Peninsula awarded by Spanish authorities in 1841 to the Sepulveda family -- was recorded in Los Angeles County records.

Don Manuel, the only one of Cristobal's nine children to establish long-term residency at the ranch, also entered Los Angeles and regional politics, at one point serving as mayor of Los Angeles, according to The Rancho San Pedro. He died in 1882.

The ranch was partitioned in 1885 among six of their surviving 10 children. Don Manuel's home would later be donated as a seminary.

Some of the Redondo Beach streets named for Spanish women carry the names of Don Manuel's daughters. Those street names are Catalina, Elena, Francisca, Gertruda, Guadalupe, Helberta, Irena, Juanita, Lucia, Maria, Paulina and Susana avenues.

Del Amo: Dr. Gregorio Del Amo became part of South Bay history when he married Susana Dominguez, whose inheritance included a parcel of land in the heart of present-day Torrance, where Del Amo Fashion Center and Del Amo Financial Center now stand. Oil was later discovered on their land.

The Del Amos also built and lived in a house on the Redondo Beach waterfront just south of present day Veterans Park, according to Old Redondo: A Pictorial History of Redondo Beach by Dennis Shanahan. Del Amo would later give up his medical practice to enter the diplomatic corps for the Spanish government and, through their wills, the Del Amos would provide for a classroom and dormitory building at the seminary, according to The Rancho San Pedro.

Carson: George Henry Carson's influence on the local lexicon also came through marriage to one of Don Manuel's daughters, Maria Victoria.

The Rancho San Pedro says that it was through Carson's public service -- on the Los Angeles City Council and as the public administrator of Los Angeles County -- that he met Don Manuel and his future wife, Maria Victoria, for whom Victoria Regional Park is named.

In 1862, Carson and Maria Victoria moved their family to the Dominguez Rancho, where he became chief assistant to Don Manuel. His shrewd business acumen helped the ranch persevere during a serious drought in the 1860s.

After Don Manuel's death, Carson "supervised management of lands inherited by his wife and was the principal guiding hand in protecting the interest of other Dominguez daughters," according to The History of a City ... Carson, California by Jack E. Jerrills.

The Rancho San Pedro noted that Carson "was the only one who could control the temperamental sisters during the difficult period when the respective shares of the estate were being determined."

The couple would have 15 children. The eldest son, John Victor, would carry on the family tradition in the affairs of the Dominguez Estate Co., Carson Estate Co. and Dominguez Water Corp. Carson died at his home in 1901.

Sepulveda: Juan Jose Dominguez's executor, Manuel Gutierrez, moved onto the ranch after Dominguez's death and allowed the family of Don Jose Sepulveda to graze cattle and build a family home on the Los Palos Verdes portion.

Sepulveda refused to leave although ordered to do so by Spanish authorities in 1822 and died in 1824 during an Indian attack at Mission La Purísima Concepción.

Sepulveda had stopped at the mission north of Santa Barbara on his way home from Monterey, where he had again sought to establish his claim of ownership.

California Historical Landmarks listing No. 383 marks the site of Sepulveda's 1818 adobe home, built near the present day intersection of Madison Street and Courtney Way in Torrance.

In 1841, authorities awarded the Sepulveda family more than 31,000 acres of Rancho San Pedro.
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Homer - "I'm sick of this Tarzan movie!" Lisa - "Dad! It's a documentary on the homeless!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668963 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:45:46 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15662795 anon : I actually do not think you know a damn thing about Heber D. Perrett and his money. Go ask him how he lived as a boy and how he made his money, you will get an honest answer. and a good one, nothing dirty. next time do some research before you go bad mouthing people. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15662795 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 14:56:22 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15596556 TwoFrogs :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

I have no recollection of any copter service or heliport in Riverside.
The heliport Bloominite See Profile mentioned was operational, I am pretty sure, through the 70s. I don't remember when it shut down, but it has been quite a while. An ugly, generic office park has recently arisen in its place.
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Be punctilious in your own lexical fundaments, but overlook others' solecisms.
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You Got to Know When to Fold'em]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15596556 Thu, 02 Mar 2006 14:19:42 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15596052 coxta :
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Men are born ignorant, not stupid. They are made stupid by education.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15596052 Thu, 02 Mar 2006 13:14:53 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15595900 MotherNature :
said by Bloominite See Profile :

Bonus bonus question: What was the name of the TV series about 2 guys who owned a helicopter company and flew Bell 47s?
I remember watching that show. Whirlybirds. What do I win?

I have no recollection of any copter service or heliport in Riverside. They didn't have anything like that down in Capistrano, or my Dad would have jumped on it, seeing as how he was doing the drive from Capistrano to Panorama City every day, at least until he quit the corporate ratrace and bought a local gas station down there. I recall how happy he was when they opened the 405. It shortened his drive time, as back then nobody used that freeway.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15595900 Thu, 02 Mar 2006 12:56:26 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15593221 Valkyre : The show I was thinking of was called Riptide:

»www.rotaryaction.com/pages/riptide.html

quote:
Riptide (1984-86) - TV action series created by Stephen J. Cannell and Frank Lupo, this is about two Vietnam buddies who become private investigators. The show co-starred Joe Penny as Nick, the pilot of "Screaming Mimi," and old Sikorsky S-58T helicopter. Painted pink with a garish mouth on front, it was shabby, unreliable US Army surplus.

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Homer - "I'm sick of this Tarzan movie!" Lisa - "Dad! It's a documentary on the homeless!"
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15593221 Thu, 02 Mar 2006 00:49:22 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15593168 Bloominite :
said by Valkyre See Profile :

Were they pink helicopters?
I don't know, the show was B&W. I kind of doubt it, though, it was the 50s and guys weren't too comfortable with pink back then. But I could be wrong, sfter all they wewre 2 confirmed bachelors and they did seem to be inseparable. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15593168 Thu, 02 Mar 2006 00:38:37 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15592570 Valkyre : Were they pink helicopters?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15592570 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 22:59:21 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15592433 Bloominite : Remember the helicopter commuter service that had scheduled routes back in the early 60s? They built a dedicated heliport on Market St in Riverside alongside the eastbound onramp to the 60 freeway. I was a big helicopter fan and my grandfather snuck me out of school one day when I was 7 or 8 for a roundtrip ride into LA. It was a pretty cool way to play hooky.

Bonus bonus question: What was the name of the TV series about 2 guys who owned a helicopter company and flew Bell 47s?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15592433 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 22:41:34 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591478 bobrk :
said by TwoFrogs See Profile :

(I'm imagining Sam Yorty is in there.)
Ah yes, the Mayor who couldn't even pronounce the name of the city the incorrect way everyone else pronounces it.
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Iraq Coalition Casualty Count | bobrk | The Blow Kings ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591478 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 20:38:13 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591451 MotherNature : When Darrel Gates watches it I'll bet he's imagining Tom Bradley's in there.

Bob, yes, for really. Once the Bunker Hill area of downtown started to be redeveloped in the early 60's the Fire Code was amended to require helipads on all skyscraper type buildings.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591451 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 20:34:54 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591323 TwoFrogs : That was before helicopters were invented.

I bought the DVD of the original 1953 production of "War of the Worlds" with Gene Barry to show my son how real movies used to be made. It's always cool to see the aliens zap City Hall. (I'm imagining Sam Yorty is in there.)
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Be punctilious in your own lexical fundaments, but overlook others' solecisms.
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You Got to Know When to Fold'em]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591323 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 20:20:20 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591263 bobrk : :D Is it really true?

Now, I'm so old that I remember when City Hall was the tallest building in town, and it's pointy on top. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591263 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 20:10:22 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591186 MotherNature : I see I'll have to come up with someting a BIT more difficult.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591186 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 20:01:37 EDT Re: Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591008 bobrk : Heliports?
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15591008 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 19:41:07 EDT Quiz time http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15590747 MotherNature : For an envelope of cash, or what's behind the door that our lovely Carol Merril is standing in front of, answer this question:

Why are all L.A. skyscrapers topped out with a flat roof?
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15590747 Wed, 01 Mar 2006 19:06:44 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15574343 MotherNature : Great site. Some more place names will appear because of it.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15574343 Mon, 27 Feb 2006 17:39:29 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15571697 PhiloVance : For some really interesting notes on the Valley, see: »www.americassuburb.com/

Cool stuff. Even I remember some of those places. ;)
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My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder." ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15571697 Mon, 27 Feb 2006 11:43:56 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15543012 MotherNature : L and B? I don't recall it. I remember Joe Pyne's TV show on KTTV 11. Do you remember him at all Bill?
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15543012 Thu, 23 Feb 2006 12:00:13 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15541360 marcelle19 :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

Lohman and Barkley, my heros. Al Lohman and Roger Barkley.

Oh, by the way, we were a KLAC (Joe Pyne), then after Joe died, KABC (Ken Minyard & Bob Arthur) family.

They had a great TV show for a while, too.
--
Some people think they gain through dishonest means, never realizing that in lying, cheating, and other dishonesty, they are losing pieces of themselves, which they can never recover. SPECIAL]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15541360 Thu, 23 Feb 2006 05:51:18 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15539867 MotherNature : Lohman and Barkley, my heros. Al Lohman and Roger Barkley.

Oh, by the way, we were a KLAC (Joe Pyne), then after Joe died, KABC (Ken Minyard & Bob Arthur) family.

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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15539867 Wed, 22 Feb 2006 22:59:17 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15537926 bobrk : I went and saw the morning show at KFI back when I was in highschool in the 70s. I think it was a career day thing. I thought it was great. Who was the morning guy back then? We were a KMPC family, so we listened to Dick Whittinghill and Gary Owens ("Beautiful Downtown Burbank") instead.
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Iraq Coalition Casualty Count | bobrk | The Blow Kings ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15537926 Wed, 22 Feb 2006 18:46:43 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15535168 hopeflicker : :D
good one capt!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15535168 Wed, 22 Feb 2006 12:58:37 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15534250 MotherNature : Legend has it that Lake Elsinore came by its name by way of a little problem in translation and the unpronounced "H" in Spanish.

Back in the day an early white settler to the area encountered
a Mexican fishing in the lake. He asked him how the water tasted. The Mexican answered "Like hell, senor".
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15534250 Wed, 22 Feb 2006 10:53:51 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15526557 anon : I know Heber D. Perrett too well, and you would not want his money if you knew how he got it!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15526557 Tue, 21 Feb 2006 11:52:56 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446794 TwoFrogs :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

said by PhiloVance See Profile :

I was born in San Fernando and lived there until I was 11 (1949)...yes I am that old.

Stick around, it'll take the heat off of me.....
You're older than that in curmudgeon years, Jack. :)

To get this post back on-topic, Jack undoubtedly knows that Lake Arrowhead is named after the natural "arrowhead" visible on the side of the San Bernardino Mountains somewhat below the lake area. Over the years it has become somewhat less discernible, due to erosion and vegetation, but on a clear day I can still see it, even from where I work in Riverside.
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Bacon's not the only thing that's cured by hanging from a string.
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You Got to Know When to Fold'em]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446794 Fri, 10 Feb 2006 14:00:37 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446356 MotherNature :
said by PhiloVance See Profile :

I was born in San Fernando and lived there until I was 11 (1949)...yes I am that old.

Stick around, it'll take the heat off of me.....
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446356 Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:54:47 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446315 PhiloVance : Hey, my uncle used to live in Betteravia. God it stunk there. Whew. Never knew sugar could smell so awful. It's somewhere over near Santa Maria.

Does anyone remember when Sun Valley used to be named Roscoe. I was born in San Fernando and lived there until I was 11 (1949)...yes I am that old. ;)

At the time of the name change my mother said it was a good thing. Roscoe was a wierd name anyway. Of course there is still Roscoe Blvd. It was probably some early settler's name. At the time I didn't think much about it, but I actually think Roscoe was the better name, historically speaking. Sun Valley to me is in Idaho. :huh:

I now live in Bakersfield, named after Colonel Thomas Baker, an early settler in the area. It's the county seat of Kern County which was named after Edward Kern, a topographer with one of the John Fremont expeditions.

In my younger years I lived in many places in Southern and Central California including: Pasadena, Costa Mesa (Newport Beach), Santa Ana, Anaheim, Buena Park, Santa Monica, Porterville and Tulare(in Tulare County), Hanford (in Kings County), and Delano (here in Kern).

Here's an interesting link on some historical events in my neck of the woods, the San Joaquin Valley: »kingsnet.kings.k12.ca.us/kcoe/cu···ine.html

I see Kern County was formed from parts of Los Angeles and Tulare counties.
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My mechanic told me, "I couldn't repair your brakes, so I made your horn louder." ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15446315 Fri, 10 Feb 2006 12:47:58 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15439260 Bloominite :
said by tannman See Profile :

Oxnard:Named after Sugar Beet Farmer Brothers
(figures dont it)
The town of Betteravia, near Santa Maria, also got it's name from the beet industry. Betterave is the French name for the sugat beet. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15439260 Thu, 09 Feb 2006 14:04:48 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15438629 tannman : Oxnard:Named after Sugar Beet Farmer Brothers
(figures dont it)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15438629 Thu, 09 Feb 2006 12:41:33 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15420341 MotherNature : Great article. I'm glad they're not razing the old building.
--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15420341 Tue, 07 Feb 2006 02:15:34 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15415950 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

Who remembers when KFI used to station ID with: "This is KFI Los Angeles, an Earl C. Anthony Incorporated station"? Unfortunatly, I do.
Did you see this article about Earle Anthony's Packard Dealership in L.A.?:
»www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me···lifornia]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15415950 Mon, 06 Feb 2006 16:15:04 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15413443 Steve : KFI = K + Farmer's Information
KECA is now KABC, after the NBC Blue network became ABC

Steve -- radio buff]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15413443 Mon, 06 Feb 2006 09:41:53 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15412759 MotherNature : Who remembers when KFI used to station ID with: "This is KFI Los Angeles, an Earl C. Anthony Incorporated station"? Unfortunatly, I do.

Who knows what the FI in KFI stands for?

Who used to read the morning farm report every morning at 0500?

Ain't that a pretty art-deco building?

What is station KECA known as today?

--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15412759 Mon, 06 Feb 2006 04:12:46 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15377839 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

Please feel free to add what you know.

Fontana = Fountain in Italian
Fontana was originally christened Rosena when the townsite was laid out in 1887. That area was in what is now the central downtown area along Sierra Av. The area that is now North Fontana was known as Grapeland and you know that old quarry south of you? That anchored Declezville in what is now the Southridge development. The town was renamed Fontana by A.B Miller when he decided to develop much of the town.

Bloomington was supposedly named after the berry blossoms from the berries that were the main crop in town prior to citrus.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15377839 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 13:17:05 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15377654 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

I remember that candy store well. I sure do like SLO. But, I like my high desert better.

EDIT: Is the Suey Ranch still in operation?
The last I heard, it was being sold a few years ago. I don't know if the sale was completed, but I do know they are beginning to develop the extreme southwestern edge that is below the dam and along the Santa Maria River. There was a move afoot to have SLO county relinquish their claim to the area so that SB county could annex it and provide services. SLO just refused that move a few weeks ago.

EDIT: Here's a .pdf with info on the annexation proposal:
»www.co.slo.ca.us/Board_of_Superv···/c-1.pdf
And according to this .pdf, it looks like Newhall sold the entire ranch to a Heber D. Perrett back in 2000. I'd like to have Heber Perrett's cash. Anyone who could buy that ranch is definitely rolling in it (or at least able to put together some pretty impressive financing).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15377654 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 12:52:40 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15376910 Valkyre : Excerpts about the Mountain Meadows Massacre" from Jon Krakauers book "Under the Banner of Heaven - A Story of Violent Faith:

"Our party was just sitting down to a breakfast of quail and cottontail rabbits when a shot rang out from a nearby gully," Sarah Frances Baker Mitchell recalled eighty two years after the event, "and one of the children toppled over, hit by the bullet." That first gunshot was the beginning of a furious surprise assault that would fatally wound seven Arkansans before the day was out. Although Mitchell was only three years old at the time, the horrors of that morning-and the even greater horrors of the weeks to come-were seared into her memory.
The emigrants quickly encircled their wagons into a defensive corral, dug in as best they could, and returned fire, repelling the first wave of assailants. They assumed they were being ambushed by Indians, a conjecture that seemed to be confirmed by glimpses of dark-skinned men in war paint shooting at the. As is happened, most of the attackers on that initial morning of what would become a five-day siege were indeed Paiutes, but others were Mormons from nearby settlements who had simply painted their faces to look like Indians. And commanding the assault was a well-known Latter Day Saint: forty-four-year-old John D. Lee, a battle tested veteran of the troubles in Missouri and Illinois, as devoted to the church and its leaders as any Mormon alive.

The Arkansas emigrants, it seems, were marked as victims from the moment they entered Utah. One of them later claimed that as soon as the arrived in Great Salt Lake City, it was obvious to him that the Saints were looking for "an excuse to slaughter the entire train." One reason the Fancher party may have been singled out was the Arkansans' conspicuous wealth: it was reputed to be "the richest and best equipped train that ever set out across the continent." Among the groups twelve hundred head of stock were prize Texas longhorn and a strikingly beautiful Thoroughbred racehorse that was alone worth $3,000 in the currency of the day. Additionally, it was rumored that the Fancher party was carrying a strongbox filled with thousands of dollars in gold coins. In Utah, where plagues of crickets and an extended drought had left many Saints contemplating starvation, such riches could not have failed to arouse the interest of people who considered it righteous to steal from the godless.

The notorious conference between Brigham Young and the Paiute chiefs took place in Great Salt Lake City on the evening of September 1. It lasted for about an hour, with Brigham's son-in-law Dimick B. Huntington acting as interpreter. According to Huntington's notes of the encounter, Brigham explicitly "gave" the Indians all the emigrant cattle on the Old Spanish Trail-that is, the Fancher's prize herd, which the Paiutes had covetously gazed upon when they camped next to the emigrants one week earlier. The prophet's message to the Indian leaders was clear enough: he wanted them to attack the Fancher wagon train. The morning after the meeting, the Paiutes left the City of the Saints at first light and started riding hard for southern Utah.
According to John D. Lee, on or around the day the Arkansans arrived in Cedar City, he received orders to attack the emigrants from Lieutenant Colonel Isaac Haight, the mayor of Cedar City, president of the LDS Stake, and commander of the local battalion of the Nauvoo Legion. Lee was told to gather Indian chiefs who had met with Brigham three days earlier, arm their warriors, and lead them in an ambush on the Fancher train in the mountains south of Cedar City;Lee reported that Haight had emphasized that this directive was "the will of all in authority."
On September 5, Lee headed for the Mountain Meadow with a large contingent of Saints and Paiutes. They arrived in the hills above the meadow on September 6, where they hid among the stunted trees and watched the Arkansans make camp near the spring below, and the Saints painted their faces so they would look like Indians. The next morning before dawn, while the emigrants were sleeping, these painted Mormons and the genuine Paiutes stole toward the Fancher camps and took cover behind rocks and brush. As the sun crept over the serrated, ten thousand-foot crest of the Pine Valley Mountains, the unsuspecting Arkansans gathered to cook breakfast. Lee's snipers carefully aimed their muskets to inflict maximum casualties, then fired.
Lee had assumed the Arkansans would quickly succumb to the surprise assault. The Saints had been so confident of a quick victory, in fact, that they had promised, in Lee's words, that the Paiutes "could kill the emigrants without danger to themselves." But the Fancher party was disciplined, very brave, and well armed, and their ranks included many expert riflemen. After the initial volley of gunfire, the Arkansans quickly circled their wagons, dug into bunkers, and then immediately initiated a counter assault, utterly confounding their attackers.
At least one Paiute brave was killed that morning, two Paiute chiefs were mortally wounded, and the Indian and Mormon forces were decisively repulsed, dealing a completely unanticipated blow to their resolve. As they regrouped at a safe distance, the Indians expressed their displeasure with the bungled operation in no uncertain terms: they threatened angrily to go home and leave the Mormons to their own devices. "Now we knew that the Indians could not do the work," Lee was forced to acknowledge after their surprise attack failed, "and we were in a sad fix." After ordering his men to keep the emigrants pinned down, Lee rode off to summon Mormon reinforcements, and to seek the counsel of his superiors.

There is much, much more. I could type it up and post it here. I have to get to work though. It's a fascinating story. And, it wasn't just the Paiutes who killed the children.
--
Homer - "I'm sick of this Tarzan movie!" Lisa - "Dad! It's a documentary on the homeless!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15376910 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 10:59:36 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15376596 coxta : Yep, The Fancher Party Massacre, my relatives.


--
I used to have an open mind but my brains kept falling out]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15376596 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 10:14:17 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375359 Bloominite :
said by ghostpainter See Profile :

Excellent find there...You know how many of those people are related to me...Hamilton, Smith. It is quite an interesting period in our history, and rivals with the Indian wars as also the most tragic era of the US.
I've always been fascinated by the relationship between the Mormons and the early days of California. The Mormons were involved in most of the early milestones leading up to and following the admission of California. The 2 guys who discovered gold at Sutter's Mill were Mormons, the first crossing from Yuma to San Diego was a Mormon batallion rushing to aid John Fremont when it looked like he was going to war with Mexico. They were everywhere it seems.

The Mormons had a unique relationship with the Indians. They believed the Red Man had been sent by God to North America to wait for them and then be their helpers in achieving whatever it was they were destined to do when the time arrived. It was their belief the Indians were almost human and in God's grace, but not quite human enough to be worthy of full responsibilty for their actions or God's full blessing. If I understand it correctly, this prevented them from entering either the Celestial Kingdom (the highest level of Mormon Heaven) or Hell when they died. I think I got that part right, the Mormon concept of Heaven and Hell is a little more complicated than the Baptist version I grew up with.

The Indian allies of the Mormons were able to perform the dirty deeds for the Mormons that would condemn a Mormon to Hell (or at leat one of the lesser levels of Heaven). It sounds bad to us now, but it was actually a more enlightend feeling toward the Indians than was prevalent among most whites at the time.

The Mountain Meadows Massacre was an excellent example of the Mormon/Indian relationship. After the Mormons had tricked the emigrants into turning over their weapons in exchange for safe passage through Utah, the Mormons slaughterd all of the men in the party and the Indians killed all of the women and children old enough to bear witness against the Mormons. A:though the estimates vary, the total number of dead is believed to be between 120 and 140 people of all ages except for the very young infants spared by the Mormons. The Mormons believed it was OK to kill the men, but their souls would be in jeopardy if they were to kill the women and children. It was for just this type of duty that God had given them their almost-human red man helpers as they weren't responsible in the afterlife for their actions on Earth in service of the Mormons.

I hope I got the religious beliefs correct and certainly don't mean to offend any Mormons, but I'm working solely off memories of what was related to me by Mormon friends years ago. Any corrections would be welcome.

As for the massacre itself: It sounds barbaric by itself, but the Mormons had endured great persecution and were justified in fearing a takeover by Gentiles of the land they had settled in Utah. Their actions that day were based on real fears.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375359 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 02:13:52 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375273 MotherNature : Yes he was. The office was on Chorro near Higuera, or on Higuera near Chorro. Before that he managed the BofA branch at Melrose and Irving in Hollywood, and the branch at Crenshaw and Stocker near Inglewood.

I remember that candy store well. I sure do like SLO. But, I like my high desert better.

EDIT: Is the Suey Ranch still in operation?

--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375273 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 01:39:43 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375134 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

I don't know. My dad was all over that area as he was the manager of the Security Title and Insurance Co office in SLO.
I recall Pea Soup Anderson coming by the house for supper a number of times, toting a few cases of pea soup each time. Also Karl Birkholm, the owner of Birkholm Bakery in Solvang, and the producer of those famous Danish cookies. We used to spend weekends at his ranch. He'd always bring tubs of those cookies for us, man no wonder I'm a sweetaholic nowadays.

We maintained dual residences in SLO and Capistrano. I'd go to school part time up there, then another part of the year down here.
No shit, your dad worked for Security Title? My stepdad worked for Security Title in their San Bernardino office when he and my mom got married, then quit to go into business for himself in early 1962 just before we moved to Shell beach and then Santa Maria. His brother was an attorney with offices in Santa Maria and SLO and they were partners in lots of real estate investments all over Santa Barbara and SLO counties. His brother's practice dealt mainly with real estate so there's a good chance he and/or my stepdad knew your dad.

I remember Birkholm's well and used to make pastry runs from Bloomington to Solvang several times a year when they still ran the bakery. Did you ever make it to the candy shop in SLO's Chinatown where they made the roadapple candy?

You know what was my favorite place in that area back then? The Suey Ranch. That place was amazing and huge. It was owned by the Newhall Land and Farming Co and my stepdad was some kind of descendant of Henry Newhall. His mom made some calls and arranged for him to have access to most of the 40,000 acres of the ranch that straddled the 166. It was pretty cool, we'd stop by the ranch house and get a pass that allowed us to roam all over some of the most beautiful unspoiled coastal mountain land in the entire state. I'd give anything to be able to explore that ranch now. The last time I was on the ranch was the summer of '69, just before I moved back down here. There had been lots of rain that year that filled up the Twitchell Resevoir and made the ranch prettier than I'd ever seen it before or since. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15375134 Wed, 01 Feb 2006 01:05:00 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374587 ghostpainter : Excellent find there...You know how many of those people are related to me...Hamilton, Smith. It is quite an interesting period in our history, and rivals with the Indian wars as also the most tragic era of the US.
--
»Weather International weather and RSS feeds »EARTHLOGII.COM »Vietnam Affairs]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374587 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 23:32:46 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374478 MotherNature : I don't know. My dad was all over that area as he was the manager of the Security Title and Insurance Co office in SLO.
I recall Pea Soup Anderson coming by the house for supper a number of times, toting a few cases of pea soup each time. Also Karl Birkholm, the owner of Birkholm Bakery in Solvang, and the producer of those famous Danish cookies. We used to spend weekends at his ranch. He'd always bring tubs of those cookies for us, man no wonder I'm a sweetaholic nowadays.

We maintained dual residences in SLO and Capistrano. I'd go to school part time up there, then another part of the year down here.
--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374478 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 23:17:57 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374454 Bloominite :
said by ghostpainter See Profile :

I have heard both stories, yours from my uncle who is a Mormon Elder and my dad. Both said that the massacre occured in the southern Calif desserts near Bartstow, present day New Berry Springs.

And they both said that the Mormons were recalled because the leadership felt they were getting too rich and not sending enough tidings back to the main Temple. But as i wrote my uncle also told me the other version as well. As to which history is right, I don't know.
There were several factors involved in the recall, not the least of wqhich was concern over the San Bernardino groups safety amongst all the hostility the Mountain Meadows Massacre stirred up in the Gentile population of California toward the Mormons.Here's an excerpt from: »www.empirenet.com/rdthompson/lane4.html
(Begin quote)
In late 1857, the year Aaron Lane came to San Bernardino, a series of incidents occurred in Utah, some quite tragic, which were to have an impact on the development of the desert and all of San Bernardino County. Non-Mormon federal appointees in Utah had reported to Washington that their orders were being ignored and that the Mormons were in a state of rebellion against the laws and authority of the United States.

These reports were given credence, and Alfred Cummings was appointed to replace Mormon leader Brigham Young as governor. Cummings was to proceed to Utah accompanied by an army under the command of Colonel Albert Sidney Johnston. Word reached the Mormons in late July, 1857, that an army had been ordered to Utah to put down the rebellion.

The immediate response of the Mormons was to call on their militia, the Nauvoo Legion, to prepare for battle. Word went out in August that not one kernel of grain was to be sold to any non-Mormon merchant or "sojourner" in Utah; trading with emigrants traveling through the area was considered tantamount to aiding the enemy. Speeches became increasingly inflammatory as preparations were made to repel the oncoming government troops.

Mormon George A. Smith was sent to the southern towns in Utah to deliver military orders and instruct the populace. His preaching was so fiery that it raised the emotions of the citizens to a fever pitch.

In the meantime, Brigham Young met with twelve Indian chiefs from the southern region of the state, presumably to coordinate their support in the upcoming war. Into this climate came a wagon train of California-bound emigrants, which was later identified as the Fancher train, named after one of its leaders.

In mid-September, near a place called Mountain Meadows, all of the adults and older children of the Fancher train, numbering 118 in all, were killed by Mormons from the Cedar City area with the aid of their Indian allies. Only infants considered too young to testify against the murderers were spared.

Word of the massacre reached the Mormon Colony in San Bernardino on October 1st with the arrival of two Mormon freighters, Sidney Tanner and William Mathews, who had passed near the site the day the tragedy occurred. The news first appeared in the Los Angeles Star in the October 3, 1857, issue. Star editor Henry Hamilton, an admirer of the qualities of the San Bernardino Mormons with whom he was familiar, at first refused to believe that Mormons had anything to do with it.

However, when the truth of the atrocity became known, he joined with the rest of the community in calling for justice, although he still distinguished between the vast majority of decent, industrious people he had come to know and the perpetrators of a horrible mass murder. This incident, which became known as the Mountain Meadows Massacre, inflamed the citizens of California, and adversely affected the attitude of the military towards the Mormon community as a whole for years to come.

MORMONS RECALLED TO UTAH

Late in November of 1857 it was reported that there was a "general movement" of Mormons out of San Bernardino, departing for Salt Lake City. Henry Hamilton professed that he did not know why they were leaving, but knew "them to be a peaceable, industrious, and law-abiding community." Hamilton shortly learned they had been called back to Utah.

In a letter dated October 11th and received in San Bernardino on the 30th, Brigham Young thanked local leader William J. Cox for sending animals, teams, arms and ammunition, and then advised him that, in light of the situation, it would be best if the faithful returned to Utah immediately:

...the time appears to be near at hand when you will either have to abandon your faith or your present locality and escape to Utah....San Bernardino has a warm climate and it is highly probable that it may soon become altogether too warm for the residence of Saints, for this reason it is certainly advisable and my counsel that all in your place and region who desire to live as becometh Saints should use all diligence to make their way into Utah....

Mormon historians state that Young actually had planned for some time to recall the faithful from the San Bernardino colony because of dissension among the growing factions in the community, and the events of the fall simply sped things along.

On December 26th the Star reported that approximately 1200 people had heeded the call; 250 wagons had already departed town, and another 30 to 50 families were preparing to do the same. The bitterness of at least one departing Mormon is expressed in a letter he posted from Cajon Pass, in which he said that in his six and one-half years in the state, he had met friends, but "comparatively few, compared with the...hosts of bigoted, selfish, ignorant, and blood-thirsty wretches," and he wished sudden destruction on the state, condemning it "to the curses of Almighty God¾to famine, drought, war, and earthquakes."

There was a large number of Mormons in the colony who were not nearly as anxious to leave the state, and many of them determined not to return to Utah. Not only was the town split in two, but also many families were unable to agree amongst themselves on whether or not to stay, and some of them were divided permanently.

The Mormons said of those who stayed behind that they had abandoned the Church. But to those Latter-day Saints who had remained in San Bernardino, many of whom had followed their leaders all around the country -- some of them for decades -- it must have seemed that the Church instead had abandoned them.

MORMON EXODUS STALLS ON THE MOJAVE

By the middle of January there was a large encampment along the Mojave River consisting of 100 wagons. The pace of the departure had been deliberately slowed because of the "great destitution" in Salt Lake City due to the lack of supplies. The emigrants on the Mojave unselfishly sent their own supplies to Utah to relieve the suffering of their brethren there.

Amasa Lyman, previously a co-leader of the Mormon Colony, was at the river encampment buying supplies, through intermediaries, from his former townsmen. Meanwhile, camp life on the river was taking on the aspects of a settlement, what with the large number of marriages and births occurring as the Mormons patiently waited to continue their exodus.

Johnston's army had reached Utah in November 1857, rather late in the year to begin a campaign in a country known for its frigid weather. As the Army neared Salt Lake City, Colonel Johnston decided to encamp for the winter, a decision that allowed time for cooler heads to prevail and attempt to defuse the situation through peaceful means. Skillful negotiations between the Mormons and the U. S. Government prevented a continuation of hostilities, and by June 1858, the threat of war had ended.
(End quote)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374454 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 23:14:27 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374363 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

said by Bloominite See Profile :

When did you live in SLO?
60 - 65.
Remember the dinosaur in Shell Beach? Did your family ever go down to Santa MAria to shop at a big White Front style store called AFCO? My stepdad and his brother owned that store and its sister stores in Visalia and Fresno. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374363 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 23:02:39 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374334 Valkyre : I've been reading Jon Krakauer's Under the Banner of Heaven - A Story of Violent Faith. He devotes several chapters to the Mountain Meadows Massacre.
--
Homer - "I'm sick of this Tarzan movie!" Lisa - "Dad! It's a documentary on the homeless!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374334 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:56:57 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374280 MotherNature :
said by Bloominite See Profile :

When did you live in SLO?
60 - 65.
--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374280 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:51:03 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374275 MotherNature : No, the Mormon led and manned Mountain Meadows Massacre occurred in Washington County, Utah.

"The Mountain Meadows Massacre stands without a parallel amongst the crimes that stain the pages of American history. It was a crime committed without cause or justification of any kind to relieve it of its fearful character... When nearly exhausted from fatigue and thirst, [the men of the caravan] were approached by white men, with a flag of truce, and induced to surrender their arms, under the most solemn promises of protection. They were then murdered in cold blood."

-William Bishop, Attorney to John D. Lee
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374275 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:50:14 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374161 ghostpainter : I have heard both stories, yours from my uncle who is a Mormon Elder and my dad. Both said that the massacre occured in the southern Calif desserts near Bartstow, present day New Berry Springs.

And they both said that the Mormons were recalled because the leadership felt they were getting too rich and not sending enough tidings back to the main Temple. But as i wrote my uncle also told me the other version as well. As to which history is right, I don't know.
--
»Weather

International weather and RSS feeds

»EARTHLOGII.COM

»Vietnam Affairs]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374161 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:37:28 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374130 Valkyre : El Segundo - Lastly, this new site needed a name. Richard Hanna's wife, Virginia, deemed this expanse as "El Segundo", (Spanish for "the second one,") because the site was to be Standard Oil's second oil refinery in California (The Point Richmond refinery was already christened as "El Primero"). Sometime later, a group of proud but unknown citizens had nicknamed it "El Segundo a nada" (Spanish for 'second to none')

»www.elsegundo.org/business/history/
--
Homer - "I'm sick of this Tarzan movie!" Lisa - "Dad! It's a documentary on the homeless!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374130 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:33:04 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374103 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

I've been waiting for you to pop in. Figured you'd have some history of the I.E., as I'm merely a transplant from South OC.

I know the forest you refer to up north. Used to live in SLO and took the 101 route between there and LA many times.
I haven't been north of Santa Maria on the 101 since about 1991, but would be very surprised if much of that grove is still intact and free of development. When did you live in SLO?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374103 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:29:28 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374082 Bloominite :
said by ghostpainter See Profile :



The Sycamore Inn was built in 1849 as a over night stage stop for travelers on the way from then Mormon Town (San Bernardino) to LA. After the Indian raids the Mormons recalled everyone back To Salt Lake. The leaders felt they were getting to rich.
IIRC, the San Bernardino Mormons were recalled to Salt Lake to help defend the Utah Mormons against what they feared was an imminent punitive invasion by the US Army to evict the Mormons and guarantee free access to the Oregon Trail after many emigrants encountered problems getting through Utah. After the massacre at Mountain Meadows, that seemed to be a real possibility:
»www.archaeology.org/online/featu···ows.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15374082 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 22:26:57 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15373617 MotherNature : I've been waiting for you to pop in. Figured you'd have some history of the I.E., as I'm merely a transplant from South OC.

I know the forest you refer to up north. Used to live in SLO and took the 101 route between there and LA many times.
--
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15373617 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 21:33:19 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15373464 Bloominite :
said by MotherNature See Profile :

Eucalyptus: Not native. Were brought here from Australia in the 19th century in hopes of being able to use the extremely fast growing tree for railroad tie wood. Problem was, they massively split after a certain amount of time under the sun. The trees in the community of Lake Forest in South Orange County are the remnants of the sprawling forests planted by the entrepreneur responsible for this wooden boondoggle. Hence the name we long time locals call the place: Fake Forest.
The euc was widely considered to be Nature's ultimate gift to mankind and promoted heavily by the California Dept of Forestry during the 1870s-1880s and into the early 19th century as a cash crop. It was rumoured to do everything from curing malaria and vinescale on grape vines to making a great base for perfume. It was a great source of potash for industry and believed to both prevent and remove scale from boilers (an important consderation in the era when steam was king).

Have you ever been up the 101 to San Luis Obispo? The largest euc grove I ever saw was on the Nipomo Mesa. stretching from Santa MAria to Arroyo Grande and must've been home to tens of thousands of the trees. I can't vouch for the truth of the following, but it was said to have been planted by a disgraced member of the Polish royal family who had been banished to the US after some affair that stood to embarrass his family. The way the local story went, he planned on making hardwood furniture with the cut wood. And as someone else mentioned, euc splits when it dries. When I lived up there during the 60s , the Mesa was home to every kind of shady and illegal activity you can imagine from cockfights to murder and everything in-between thanks to the cloak of invisibilty provide by the huge, dense grove. I loved exploring it when I was a kid as it offered a blank slate to a kid's overactive imagination. It was definitely not a place to be after the sun set as it became blacker than any other place I've ever been outside of a cave.

»wwwlibrary.csustan.edu/bsantos/section1.htm
»wwwlibrary.csustan.edu/bsantos/section2.htm
»www.sandiegohistory.org/journal/···ptus.htm ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15373464 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 21:15:17 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15372091 MotherNature : "Ana" from the Santa Ana River, "heim" German for home = Home by the Santa Ana River.
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Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15372091 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 18:15:01 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15371513 DrewCapu : The Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim = The The Angels Angels of Anaheim.

Is there a story to Anaheim? Sounds like "Ana's home" to me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15371513 Tue, 31 Jan 2006 17:03:38 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15357802 ghostpainter :
Cucamonga was a settlement named Cucamag-na and might mean "sandy place"
I have also heard it referred to as sandy water, or moving sand. All would fit with the known past history of the Cucamonga river plain and the Santa Ana winds.

Bear Gulch where the Magic Lamb and Sycamore In. are located on Foothill was a camping area for the local Indians. They actually attacked a Mormon Wagon train as it was on its way into then St. Angelous, Now our present day LA.

The Sycamore Inn was built in 1849 as a over night stage stop for travelers on the way from then Mormon Town (San Bernardino) to LA. After the Indian raids the Mormons recalled everyone back To Salt Lake. The leaders felt they were getting to rich. Whats funny or sad depending on how you look at history, the wagon train carrying over $5 million in gold was attacked by either Indians or white men dressed as Indians and destroyed. But the gold was never recovered and believed to be still buried somewhere out by New Berry Springs.
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»Weather International weather and RSS feeds »EARTHLOGII.COM »Vietnam Affairs]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15357802 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 21:05:06 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15356312 hopeflicker : La Mirada: The view (possibily because of the small rolling hills this city has)

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Anaheim: Anna's house

I think i heard this on the radio. Not sure it this is true.
I beleive this is a german word.
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Signal Hill (aka Shell hill):

Early Indians lit fires on this hill to create smoke signals as a form of communication.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15356312 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 16:51:08 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15356309 americanada : Covina = something about an engineer who noticed how the SGV mountains formed a COve around the VINeyArds that were plentiful back in the day?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15356309 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 16:50:21 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355488 MotherNature : Olvera Street = After the first county judge, Augustin Olvera.

Wilcox = For Harvey Wilcox, founder of Hollywood, so named after his wife Daeida meets a woman on the train who tells her of her summer home named Hollywood.

Loa Angeles = Short version of the name chosen by settlers in 1781: El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora la Reina de los Ángeles del Río de Porciúncula (The Village of Our Lady the Queen of the Angels of the Porciuncula River).

Culver City = Harry Culver, property owner and founder of Culver City.

Blair Hills, Blairstone St = Named after Blair Stone, grandson of the Stone family, Culver City developers.

Malibu = Bastardization of the Chumash word Humaliwo "where the surf sounds loudly".

Mugu = Bastardization of the Chumash word muwu "beach".

Ventura = Fortune, shortened from Mision San Buenaventura "Mission of the Saint of Good Fortune'

Serra, Junipero Serra = Father Jumipero Serra, missions founder.

Doheny = Edward L. Doheny, early L.A. oil tycoon

Dana Point = Richard Henry Dana, author of Two Years Before The Mast, mentioned the little inlet and headlands of present day Dana Point in his book.

Mission Viejo = Incorrect Spanish for "Old Mission", should be Mision Vieja, as missions are considered feminine.

Cahuenga, Topanga, Tujunga, Cucamonga, Pacoima and Azusa = Tongva place names. The Tongva were the aboriginal peoples of the L.A. basin and western I.E. and south to Aliso Canyon in South Laguna. The Tongva name for Los Angeles before the white man was Yang-na. The San Gabriel area was Sibag-na, and the settlement near the pass to the huge valley was Cahueg-na. Topag-na might translate to "the place above". Present day Azuza was a small Tongva settlement called Asuksag-na. Cucamonga was a settlement named Cucamag-na and might mean "sandy place".

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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355488 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 14:18:39 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355360 Fat City : The Bay Area winter freeze of '90-'91 was the worst I'd ever seen. Temps were in the mid-teens for nearly a week---very unusual for the SF Bay. It wiped out most of the eucalyptus in the hills, but they've recovered since then. After the thaw, people discovered all the water pipes that had burst; the plumbers had a helluva year, I think more than a few of 'em retired in '91 on their windfall. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355360 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:55:22 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355270 seagreen : I was thinking it was the '91 fire because you mentioned the freeze before. The "freeze" I was thinking of was the '98 Winter Solstice Freeze so I was completely off in my dates. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355270 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:41:32 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355110 TwoFrogs :
said by seagreen See Profile :

The fire was in '91 and you're correct about the eucalyptus being a major contributor to the severity of the fire.
I was actually thinking of an earlier fire, pretty severe but not nearly as devastating as the '91 fire. The 1970 (or '71) fire was intentionally set off of Fish Ranch Road on the east side of the Berkeley hills. I meant to differentiate the earlier fire from the more recent catastrophe but forgot. Your point about the later fire is well-taken; as far as I am concerned all of the eucalyptus, living or dead, should have been cut to the ground after the earlier fire.
--
Great Movie Posters:
When You're Six Tons -- And They Call You Killer -- It's Hard To Make Friends...
-- "Namu, the Killer Whale" (1966)
You Got to Know When to Fold'em]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355110 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:17:07 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355047 MotherNature : Pasadena is Chippewa for "Crown of the Valley". Chippewa because the founders were from the mid-west.
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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15355047 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:06:11 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354933 seagreen :
said by TwoFrogs See Profile :

Extensive old, dense growth of eucalyptus in Oakland contributed to the rapid spread of a devastating fire in the hills in 1970 (or '71, I disremember the exact year), when many of the trees had been killed during a freeze the previous winter.
The fire was in '91 and you're correct about the eucalyptus being a major contributor to the severity of the fire. The other major contributor was the Santa Ana winds blowing at the time. If it had been a nice foggy, fall day there would have been little damage. In northern California the eucalyptus seem to have been planted as windbreaks. :huh:

coxta See Profile brought up Pasadena. Does Pasadena mean something in Spanish?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354933 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:42:55 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354849 TwoFrogs : Redlands = Deadlands

Hometown for this NoCal transplant for the last 25 years. Redlands, named for the local very reddish clay soil, was regarded as the "Palm Springs" of the L.A. aristocracy in the 20s and 30s. "Deadlands" has been the common teen name for the place for, like, forever. :)

Interesting point about eucalyptus, Jack.
said by MotherNature See Profile :

Eucalyptus: Not native. Were brought here from Australia in the 19th century in hopes of being able to use the extremely fast growing tree for railroad tie wood. Problem was, they massively split after a certain amount of time under the sun.
The tree was also planted extensively in Northern California, to the extent that many really considered it a weed. Extensive old, dense growth of eucalyptus in Oakland contributed to the rapid spread of a devastating fire in the hills in 1970 (or '71, I disremember the exact year), when many of the trees had been killed during a freeze the previous winter.

We're going to have to designate you the official BBR SoCal historian, Cap'n. :)
--
Great Movie Posters:
When You're Six Tons -- And They Call You Killer -- It's Hard To Make Friends...
-- "Namu, the Killer Whale" (1966)
You Got to Know When to Fold'em]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354849 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:27:06 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354520 bskuared : Fountain Valley = Once was known as Gospel Swamp, where cattle grazed and itinerant preachers set up tents on small islands. But a severe drought in the late 1870's turned the marsh - fed by the Santa Ana River - into rich farmland, blessed with natural springs and artesian wells.
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2b or not 2b
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none of this really matters :) ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15354520 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:27:12 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15353160 coxta : South Pasadena = South Pasadena]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15353160 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 02:02:26 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352708 Stiofan : Hey Jack, finally got around to reading that world almanac you got for X-mas I see. :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352708 Sun, 29 Jan 2006 00:18:54 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352533 MotherNature : Google "Wilshire Fullerton Amerige" no quotes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352533 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:47:18 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352486 cactuscool : History of Fullerton
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My tummy feels funny...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352486 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:36:45 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352484 Steve : Tustin = Named for Columbus Tustin
Corona = Crown
Corona del Mar = Crown of the Sea
Jamboree Road = Several national Boy Scout jamborees were held on the Irvine Ranch in the fifties
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Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352484 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:36:16 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352450 MotherNature : That reminds me. Costa Mesa (Coastal Tableland) has been known by a number of names over the years:

Paularino
Harper
Fairview
Goat Hill

Costa Mesa is home to an old adobe (Diego Sepulveda Adobe - 1900 W. Adams Blvd). It was built in the 18-teens as a way station for Fathers traveling between the Mission San Juan Capistrano and Mission San Gabriel. It's well worth a visit, although I haven't been there in 25 years.
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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352450 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:29:55 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352425 MotherNature : Yes. The Segerstroms had been farming in the area since 1898, mainly lima beans. SCP is built over some of their former beanfirlds. It was their project.
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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352425 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:24:50 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352404 aztecnology : How 'bout the Segerstrom's? South Coast Plaza, yes?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352404 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:20:34 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352270 MotherNature : Here's a couple of quick So Cal plant facts:

Eucalyptus: Not native. Were brought here from Australia in the 19th century in hopes of being able to use the extremely fast growing tree for railroad tie wood. Problem was, they massively split after a certain amount of time under the sun. The trees in the community of Lake Forest in South Orange County are the remnants of the sprawling forests planted by the entrepreneur responsible for this wooden boondoggle. Hence the name we long time locals call the place: Fake Forest.

Mustard Plants: Not native. The seas of springtime yellow that cover our hills and fields were originally sown Johnny Appleseed style by the first Spanish Catholic Fathers, such as Junipero Serra, as they trekked their way up the state founding missions. The swaths of brilliant yellow that marked their path, now known as El Camino Real, were the forerunner of today's ubiquitous mustard growths.
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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352270 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:00:51 EDT Re: A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352201 HappyBunny : This is very interesting--as a transplant, I've often wondered about some of these names.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352201 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 22:51:31 EDT A So Cal place name primer http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352114 MotherNature : Please feel free to add what you know.

La Tijera = The Scissors
Palos Verdes = Green Sticks
Wilshire Blvd = H. Gaylord Wilshire (1861-1927)Co-founded Fullerton
La Cienega = The Swamp
Los Alamitos = The Little Cottonwoods
Aliso Viejo = Old Alder
Sepulveda = Jose Sepulveda, Spanish ranchero and Mayor of L.A.
El Alisal = The Sycamore
Coto de Caza = Hunt Preserve
Los Robles = The Oaks
Pico = Pio de Jesus Pico (1801-1894), last governor of Mexican California
Slauson Ave = Jonathan Slauson (1829-1905) Founded Azuza
La Brea = The Tar
Van Nuys Blvd = Isaac N. Van Nuys (1835-1923), SFV farmer and son-in-law of Issac Lankershim
Cajon Pass = Box Pass
Calabasas = Misspelled calabazas: Pumpkins
Centinela = Sentinel, ref the hill now called Signal Hill
Trabuco Canyon = Blunderbus Canyon
Modjeska Canyon = Former home of Madame Helene Modjeska, Polish opera star
Fontana = Fountain in Italian
Mulholland = William Mulholland (1855-1935) Built the LA Aqueduct and the deadly San Francisquito Dam
Chino = Chinese or Chinaman
Sherman Way = Moses Hazeltine Sherman (1853-1932), land developer in the SFV
Lomita = Little hill
Point Loma = Hill Point
Alta Loma - High Hill or Tall Hill
Ortega: Spanish soldier and land grant recipient
Lankershim = Isaac Lankershim (1819-1882), SFV agriculturalist
Irvine = ref James Irvine, first Anglo owner of the lands comprising the Irvine Ranch
Culver = His son
Myford = His other son
Olympic Blvd = Formerly 10th St, renamed Olympic in the scramble to secure LA as the site of the 28 Olympiad. Amsterdam was chosen.

That's enough for now. More later.
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Wir U-Bootfahrer sagen: "Nein! So war das nicht!"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15352114 Sat, 28 Jan 2006 22:34:46 EDT