Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) in Canadian Broadband http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r13677137 en Sat, 28 Nov 2009 22:14:58 EDT Sat, 28 Nov 2009 22:14:58 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14040160 Leathal :
said by iheartcanada See Profile:

Well in Toronto things has gone back to normal for my uplink since the end of the strike. The transition from IStop to Cybersurf has been pretty painful, but I have never been so productive without the net. Lately I started rethinking whether I should be in the business of wasting my time IRCing, MSN chatting, and gaming--or working on my business instead. After some thinking (epiphany?) I decided to try the the latter. You'll see me at Chapters now, pounding away on my laptop (most certainly not connected to some dumb mind-sucking wifi). Now days I do a little BT, I even artificially cap it so that I am not a pig. Besides that I just google and read the news. Am I happy? So far so good. Customers like me are easy to please. I really can't say if Cybersurf is a good company or not, since this is the first month, but I know a lot of ex-IStop'ers are crossing their fingers hoping it will be a pleasant experience. Some of the things I am thinking about are:

* Getting a domain name from GoDaddy or EasyDNS and hooking up with the static ip I am leasing from Cybersurf.

* Getting a website going to share pictures with my family.

* Buy a 1U box to host at 151 Front St (if you know a good company who has a cage in Peer1 let me know) for my home business, which will be an e-store front. (okay this bullet point has nothing to do with Cybersurf.. duh) Getting email serving going on the 1U box and on my residential line too. If Cybersurf is not against it. That way I have some redundancy.

By the way what's a good place to pick up a cheap OEM 1U shell with the mobo already in? I am in downtown Toronto.
1U shells can be had for cheaper prices on Ebay than anywhere in the GTA.

After the first disconnection of IStop I refused to find another ISP were I pay less for my business internet and get less support. So I switched to Bell Business Highspeed with a Static IP, which gives me a solid 4Meg connection which is up 24/7, no caps, no port blocking, and 24/7 support.

The support people are generally easy to deal with, nothing like Symaptico's lame support people, they listen to you, they do understand that you may have server, or firewall (not a mickey mouse cable/dsl router), or cable/dsl router, they never give you attitude; at least I have never gotten any from them. etc. Is it worth the $89.99 per month to me as a business? YES!

Leathal]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14040160 Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:48:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14021356 iheartcanada : Well in Toronto things has gone back to normal for my uplink since the end of the strike. The transition from IStop to Cybersurf has been pretty painful, but I have never been so productive without the net. Lately I started rethinking whether I should be in the business of wasting my time IRCing, MSN chatting, and gaming--or working on my business instead. After some thinking (epiphany?) I decided to try the the latter. You'll see me at Chapters now, pounding away on my laptop (most certainly not connected to some dumb mind-sucking wifi). Now days I do a little BT, I even artificially cap it so that I am not a pig. Besides that I just google and read the news. Am I happy? So far so good. Customers like me are easy to please. I really can't say if Cybersurf is a good company or not, since this is the first month, but I know a lot of ex-IStop'ers are crossing their fingers hoping it will be a pleasant experience. Some of the things I am thinking about are:

* Getting a domain name from GoDaddy or EasyDNS and hooking up with the static ip I am leasing from Cybersurf.

* Getting a website going to share pictures with my family.

* Buy a 1U box to host at 151 Front St (if you know a good company who has a cage in Peer1 let me know) for my home business, which will be an e-store front. (okay this bullet point has nothing to do with Cybersurf.. duh) Getting email serving going on the 1U box and on my residential line too. If Cybersurf is not against it. That way I have some redundancy.

By the way what's a good place to pick up a cheap OEM 1U shell with the mobo already in? I am in downtown Toronto.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14021356 Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:36:59 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13998542 zepperdude : Still getting the same speed issues. IGS claims according to Bell I am in full sync - Getting 3008/800kbps with line capacity 44/81% occupied. But I am still getting 400 to 600 kbps download speed. Reset Linksys - reset my Gnet BB0040. Don't know what to do next - except switch to another provided. If this is a Bell/IGS issue - might even have to go to Rogers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13998542 Wed, 27 Jul 2005 20:55:11 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13991339 jfmezei9 : > however you want to look at it.. saying istop was "very
>reliable" wouldn't be the best choice of words.

Once you remove the Bell induced outages (frequent during last 10 months), it seems to me that ISTOP had greatly improved availability since it added the Cogent link and stopped playing with its routers. Prior to that NAC had noticeable outages, and Ralph's folks were often playng with routers causing problems.

Also, one must look at their status.html not as an edictement on unreliability, but rather a good discipline of reporting all issues. (many of which did not affect all customers).

Now that I have been with Teksavvy for over a year, I have to admit that when I compare my time with Istop and Teksavvy, Teksavvy is far more reliable with very view glitches at the TCPIP/PPPoE level.

But it is quite possible that they have just as many glitches, but I either don't notice or theuyr don't affect me, and the lack fo religious posting of info on status.html means that I don't know about glitches I don't notice.

One difference I really noted: with ISTOP, I had 3 or 4 session resets per day (that pesky pppoe thing). The day I switched to Teksavvy. those resets stopped.

They came back momemtarily for a couple of weeks, and stopped when Teksavvy announced they were switching router. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13991339 Wed, 27 Jul 2005 00:41:06 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13984392 Dave Lewis : Some of us use our internet connections enough that we measure outages in minutes rather than days. And it was no secret that istop had some major routing and network issues in the last 2 years. I konw because I was on their network when they happened.. If you didn't notice it then great, you probably weren't using it that particular hour.. or evening when there was 20% packet loss.. for days...

however you want to look at it.. saying istop was "very reliable" wouldn't be the best choice of words. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13984392 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 23:27:35 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13983025 Kardinal :
said by ISPless Orphan:

In fact, the only time my DSL connection was down longer than one day in the last 3 days, it was due to Bell accidently disconnecting it.
Then I would suppose we differ on our definition of 'reliable' then. :) My connection has only been down a total of four times in what will be seven years in December and the longest one was about 8 hours. This includes the Great August Blackout of 2003 where my connection was back up as soon as the power was back on (mine came back on at about 0130h the following morning, probably due to the fact I live in the heart of downtown Ottawa). I believe IStop was down for a couple of days at that time?
--
"I'd sure look like a fool, dead in a ditch somewhere with a mind full of chemicals like some cheese-eating highschool boy" - TPOH
Join Team Helix]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13983025 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 20:31:34 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980880 anon : IStop was very reliable until the spat with Bell last month. In fact, the only time my DSL connection was down longer than one day in the last 3 days, it was due to Bell accidently disconnecting it. It took them a week to reconnect it. So much for your "reliability" claim.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980880 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:47:28 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980834 Kardinal :
said by ISPless Orphan:

But I guess some people like to throw away their money.
Acutally, some of us don't mind paying for reliability and peace of mind that their provider will be there tomorrow, instead of being an "ISPless orphan". :p
--
"I'd sure look like a fool, dead in a ditch somewhere with a mind full of chemicals like some cheese-eating highschool boy" - TPOH
Join Team Helix]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980834 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:40:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980574 anon :

I pay 30$/month for Bell Sympatico, and that includes modem rental, TRUE unlimited usage, and the best reliability HANDS DOWN


If you're paying $30/month, you must be a Basic DSL subscriber which provides 256kbps download. In such a case, a download cap isn't even an issue, since no one could possibly reach it, even if they were downloading non-stop for the entire month.

»www.bell.ca/shop/en_CA_ON/PrsShp···ing.page

When it comes to TRUE HIGHSPEED (3Mbps), Bell's price is $39/month for the first 12 months and $45/month thereafter. That's 30-50% more than what "mom and pop" ISPs charge. Given that I was an ISTOP subscriber since 2002, I've saved almost $500 over than what Bell could possibly offer.

But I guess some people like to throw away their money. :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13980574 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:08:30 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13979145 anon : I've rarely had performance or reliability problems with Istop prior to their Bell problem. I found a couple of ISP tht are $10 cheaper than Sympatico ADSL cheaper.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13979145 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 11:58:49 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13977503 Dave Lewis : I think you'll find that in most cases the people who don't go with sympatico do so for several key reasons.

1) they may not like bell for whatever reason

2) they want a provider that does not block them from doing things. Bell as a residential customer will not give poeple static ip's, does not like you running servers (although normally doesn't do anything about it) and blocks port 25, which will prevent you from running any sort of mail server (assuming you get a work around to the ip issue)

That being said. I wouldn't really call IGS a mom and pop, They have been around for years, and so has the company that now owns them. They're customer base is rather large (igs/3web/cybersurf)combined. Where do you draw the line of a mom-and-pop vs an isp ?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13977503 Mon, 25 Jul 2005 05:05:30 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13976364 Shakkan : Hilarious, simply hilarious.
I pay 30$/month for Bell Sympatico, and that includes modem rental, TRUE unlimited usage, and the best reliability HANDS DOWN.

I really don't understand people going to mom and pop's unreliable DSL ISPs. I simply CAN'T understand. They're MORE expensive, have caps, and are unreliable.

*scratches his head and sighs*
--
»www.shakkan.net - Now opensores free!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13976364 Sun, 24 Jul 2005 23:25:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950937 anon : I do, but I had it for more than a week now. My local service provider is not Bell - it is Wintel (a part of Primus). My phone nr is: 488 6795 - Toronto area. I'd be very grateful if you can help me with this! Thanks!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950937 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 17:31:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950892 Matt_IGS : Do you have a ticket opened with Bell Ivan??

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950892 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 17:25:30 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950509 anon : According to »entourage.ca/offer.htm, "Beginning Monday, July 25th and over the next two weeks, our technicians will return to work." What makes you think they can fix this shortly?

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950509 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 16:39:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950176 Gabe_IGS : IGS is doing the best they can to transfer the customers from IStop to IGS. A good part of it is due to the Entourage Strike, which is fortunately over as of Today (Hurraaayy!!!). Hopefully your line will be fixed shortly now.

-Gabriel]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13950176 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 16:00:20 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13949804 anon : I still don't have connection. I called istop/igs number of times over the past 3 weeks and was told I'll have it on Tuesday, then on Friday, then by Monday morning... Igs issued a number of tickets regarding this... nothing changed. What is going on !?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13949804 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:13:27 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13947612 anon : Thanx for the offer of help Matt but I have cancel my 3Web/Cybersurf etc account.

Cheers,
Zephra]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13947612 Thu, 21 Jul 2005 10:38:50 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13943283 Matt_IGS : Bell was seriously throttling IGS on the TSW servers. This has now been fixed by Bell so if you are still having problems send me as much info as you can and I will do everything I can to sort out your problems.

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13943283 Wed, 20 Jul 2005 20:09:31 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13928722 anon : Matt,

Why is this a Bell issue? I had a 3Web tech admit that it seems to be a Cybersurf(IGS/3Web) routing issue?

Regardless of the cause, I still do not have acceptable service and from what I am hearing ALOT of former ISTOP customers share the same fate. Cybersurf is not putting the required effort to correct the fault. With this kind of impact on many users it should be identified and fixed days ago. This is not acceptable. If this is not corrected this morning I am canceling my account (with other former ISTOP customers). I have given much information (both in email and phone converstations) but have not had any contact with support for 24 hours.

traceroute to p22.www.dcn.yahoo.com (216.109.117.107), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 192.168.200.1 (192.168.200.1) 14.623 ms 14.414 ms 15.184 ms
2 g0.bbr02.gta.igs.net (216.58.97.1) 15.082 ms 15.296 ms 15.072 ms
3 f0-4.na02.b011027-0.yyz01.atlas.cogentco.com (38.112.103.153) 22.824 ms 24.568 ms 27.577
ms
4 g1-2.core01.yyz02.atlas.cogentco.com (38.112.35.21) 53.964 ms 49.014 ms 48.715 ms
5 p15-2.core01.yyz01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.2.233) 46.893 ms 47.639 ms 50.067 ms
6 p6-0.core01.bos01.atlas.cogentco.com (66.28.4.217) 202.769 ms 195.623 ms 79.982 ms
7 p5-0.core01.jfk02.atlas.cogentco.com (66.28.4.118) 65.860 ms 71.549 ms 58.974 ms
8 p4-0.core02.dca01.atlas.cogentco.com (66.28.4.81) 68.815 ms * *
9 p14-0.core01.iad01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.2.198) 188.455 ms 188.091 ms 222.662 ms
10 * yahoo.iad01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.10.2) 70.583 ms 77.624 ms
11 vlan220-msr2.dcn.yahoo.com (216.115.96.165) 73.393 ms vlan200-msr1.dcn.yahoo.com (216.115.96.161) 70.814 ms ae1.p420.msr2.dcn.yahoo.com (216.115.96.185) 70.083 ms
12 * ge9-3.bas2-m.dcn.yahoo.com (216.109.120.155) 64.653 ms ge10-2.bas2-m.dcn.yahoo.com (216.109.120.249) 72.186 ms
13 p22.www.dcn.yahoo.com (216.109.117.107) 76.319 ms * *]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13928722 Tue, 19 Jul 2005 09:19:42 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13926070 iheartcanada : --- www.yahoo.akadns.net ping statistics ---
100 packets transmitted, 83 packets received, 17% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 188.133/392.291/625.243/79.678 ms

This is from me. 10:30PM EST
I have a thread open "IStop -> IGS, what to do?". Let me know if you want a point of comparison at anytime.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13926070 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 22:23:25 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13925379 jfmezei9 : Are any ex-ISTOP customers without fixed IP seeing bad performance ?

Those who have maintained their 66.11.... IP address still see packets routed back to them via cogent, ISTOP's router and then via TORIX to IGS.

So if the complaints come only from ex ISTOP customers who still have their 66.11 IP, the problem may be out of IGS' jurisdiction, still in Ralph's turf.

And as long as 66.11 addresses are routed to Ralph's routers, your connection depends on Ralph's infrastructure. Should that infratructure's plug be pulled, do you really expect Ralph to warn anyone in advance ?

IGS shoudl quickly clarify its plans with regards to the ISTOP IP block and AS number. Ralph's router and cogent account aren't likely to remain up forever.

And it is also possible that Ralph's router is the target of hackers. And with nobody at the helm, there isn't much that can be done to thwart such hackers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13925379 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 21:05:22 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13923839 Matt_IGS : zepperdude and Zephra

This is like coming from an issue with Bell not from IGS. We are trying to get them to resolve this issue as it is causing our customers problems.... I will keep you posted.

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13923839 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 17:50:47 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13923797 Matt_IGS : How did you make out? Most new orders never make the installation date in fac I don;t think I've seen one since a few weeks after the strike began and ISP's are helpless nothing we can do when there is no one to do the work and we all end up looking bad but hang in there if your line hasn't been placed yet we are constantly on them from AM to PM.

We Appreciate all you former ISTOP customers Patients we're doing everything we can!!

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13923797 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 17:45:46 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13922437 anon : I am seeing HUGE packet loss since the switchover ... I AM NOT HAPPY!!!!!

I have had a ticket open with cybersurf for several days. If its not fixed today thats it .. I am closing my account!!! There tech support is a big hit or miss, some people rock, others are less than desirable.

--- www.yahoo.akadns.net ping statistics ---
100 packets transmitted, 88 received, 12% packet loss, time 99076ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 87.876/112.755/127.851/8.201 ms]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13922437 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 15:05:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13921310 zepperdude : since the switch to IGS - especially in the last couple of days - I find the speed of the DSL service attrocious. I get like 128K up - thats all. Anyone else experience this?

2005-07-18 12:55:30 EST: 142 / 418
Your download speed : 145998 bps, or 142 kbps.
A 17.8 KB/sec transfer rate.
Your upload speed is much faster than down.. have you tweaked?
Your upload speed : 429040 bps, or 418 kbps.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13921310 Mon, 18 Jul 2005 12:53:34 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13900348 jfmezei9 : re: dialup numbers.

All the statement meant was that Cybersurf had enabled the use of its own dialup facilities for ex istop customers. Doesn't represent any issues with regards to Cybersurf buying ISTOP assets or not.

And when you look at the nebulous "we'll automatically switch all istop customers" followed by "we're not quite sure" and "you'll need to fill out a web form to subscribe", as well as the very vague definition of which company ex ISTOP customers are dealing with (Cybersurf, IGS, Cyberus ?), I'd say that there have been many decision changes on the Cybersurf side of things since the debacle began.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13900348 Fri, 15 Jul 2005 14:39:51 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13899363 anon : I switched to start.ca the day istop went down. I had sync for about a week, and then last friday lost sync. Start openend a ticket with bell on Monday. Bell finally sent the ticket to "Dispatch" last night. And I was told that Dispatch will go and check the "remote" to determine why I don't have sync. They will do this on the 19th of July!

So it appears that Bell does not know why I don't have sync. They don't have a trace of what they have done to my line. So they have to go through a whole troubleshooting procedure (check local, check remote, etc... etc...) to figure out why I don't have sync, and then and only then will they be able to determine that my card was pulled, and then they can reconnect me.

So even if I have an ETA of July 19, I don't expect the problem to resolved then. That date is just when Bell will look at it.

So to those of you who don't have an ETA, your wait could be longer.

The sad part is that we are under the mercy of two monopolies. Bell or Rogers. The only other option right now is to switch to cable, but that brings with it a whole other can of worms.

Right now, I'm on dialup. :(]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13899363 Fri, 15 Jul 2005 12:51:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13896718 Leathal :
said by jfmezei9 See Profile:

Seems to me that once Cybersurf started to investigate, it probably realised it was a bad idea to buy any istop assets.
Not sure this statement is 100% true since the last note from Raphie is Cybersurfs dialup number which he posted on July 11, 2005. If Cybersurf was no longer interested in his business assets they would have legal grounds to force him to dissociate there business from his; since that has not happened as of yet I willing to bet is business as usually.

Maybe what's happened is Cybersurf has received a flood of users claiming they were Istop users who lost sync, and aren't sure if it's a scam, so instead of going through all that hassle with Bell and the user they just make them sign up with Cybersurf through the normal channels.

Leathal]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13896718 Fri, 15 Jul 2005 03:50:48 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13896526 jfmezei9 : A few comments/questions on this soap opera:

There has been mention of DCI being under trustee administration/bankrupcy/creditor protection for some time.

Does anyone have a link to confirm this ?

If it had been under trustee administration, the trustees would have advised the customers of impending shutdown.

If it had been under bankrupcyt protection, Bell would not have been allowed to pull the service without a court approval during the time 6042147 (aka DCI) was under bankrupcy protection.

So I find it odd that any bankrupcy/liquidation procedures would have been initiated prior to service being cut.

Another issue is that of istop's torix presence and cogent link. Both are still up and Ralph still has routers and one server at torix.

A liquidation trustee would have quickly made arrangements to allow that infrastructure to be dismantled and sold, and stop paying bills to Cogent and Torix.

To do this would require the transfer/sale/abandonnement of the ISTOP IP block and ASnumber (or preventing Cybersurf from handling any istop IP adresses).

Note that NAC stopped broadcasting routes to istop some time ago, and at the time Cogent had a fight with France Telecom, Ralph's routers didn't automatically fall back to NAC for routes to France Telecom, indicating NAC may have already been disconnected at that time.

My guess is that Ralph saw the downfall coming some time ago. He tried to sell the non-PPPoE customers but failed.

He probably figured that keeping everything silent until Bell pulled the plug was the best way to sell a whole bunch of desperate customers to one ISP. Pre-announcing the death of ISTOP would have resulted in the customers leaving in various directions, thus depriving Ralph of any potential revenu from selling the customers.

As a point of reference, Cybersurf paid $1.2 million for IGS last year. And if there are any big transactions with 6042147/istop, it will appear in its quarterly financial reports since this is a publically traded company. My guess is that in the end, Cybersurf will have paid very little for this and may in fact have received money from ISTOP to handle the customers for the first month.

----

About Bell pulling line cards ASAP. Bell was within its rights to do so. Operationally stupid thing since it adds to Bell's costs of disconnecting and then reconnecting cards.

But strategically, the minute news came of ISTOP customers losing sync, it made any "sale of customers" much harder, depriving Ralph of revenus for his pension.

Remember that in the december episode of "as Bell pulls the plug on Ralph", Ralph was able to secure alternate logins fairly quickly and all istop customers were able to establish internet connectivity fairly fast, reducing the impact of the Bell outage.

This time around, Bell made sure it was fatal to istop with no way for istop to alleviate the situation. Just the news that Bell had begun to pull line cards was enough to derail any plans from Ralph to salvage anything.

Also of note was a slight change in one of Ralph's announcements. Initially, Cybersurf was to buy istop's main assets as well as transfer customers. The assets portion was silently removed. And now it seems cutsomers really have to actively signup to Cybersurf/IGS/whatever, otherwise they will just send a disconnect order to Bell (logical sicne Cybersurf doesn't want to have to pay the linecards for non customers).

Seems to me that once Cybersurf started to investigate, it probably realised it was a bad idea to buy any istop assets.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13896526 Fri, 15 Jul 2005 02:32:40 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871926 anon : Breezehill:

1-866-833-4164 is the number I called. I don't know of any other number that can give ex-iStop users better service. From the times I've called, I did notice that some techs give you better service than others. I guess the best thing to do is to call before noon. I've called after work a couple of times and got nothing but bad service. Hopefully I will get my sync back soon. I was unable to get any kind of definite ETA on when it will come back. I don't know how you guys were able to get a specific date for re-connection.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871926 Tue, 12 Jul 2005 11:58:52 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871560 anon : Just talked to the support staff from cybersurf, using 1-866-833-4164, and was told that my account was scheduled to be re-connected today(July 12). Will wait and see.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871560 Tue, 12 Jul 2005 11:11:57 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871085 anon : Hey Bob2542:

What was the cybersurf number you have called?
Thanks rex0 I tried what you have mentioned but wasn't lucky enough to get someone to answer. I had to let go after I had enough of the elevator music. Will try again. Bob if you can give me the number I would appreciate it.

My problem was that I did get some (pretty fast) internet connection once or twice a day but that would only last about half an hour. Then the connection went dead. This happened in the last few days. Just wanted to phone these people to find out what is going on.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13871085 Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:50:16 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13870980 anon : Sounds like my problem. Called CyberSurf on the 4th to request the account to be transfered, which they did go through the motions to get this done and said that sync would come back in 3-5 days. Called on the 7th again, because my friend who called 2 minutes before me got sync on the 6th. They told me that I just have to wait it out and that my phone number is on list be be reactivated. Called yesterday (11th) and they checked the Bell site and said that they don't have anything on file for my phone number! They had to re-submit my ticket and I have to wait another 3-5 days. What a freaking headache!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13870980 Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:33:31 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13870936 anon : I was an ISTOP user and it's been a week and a half since my last connection (man, this sounds like an AA speech)

After losing sync last weekend, I decided to wait it out a couple of days. The posted FAQ from Ralph suggested that the switchover to Cybersurf (aka IGS, aka 3Web) would be automatic and take no more than 5 business days.

A second update (a couple days later) suggested that one *could* sign up with Cybersurf at any point over the next month and get the second month of service free. I decided to do this pretty much right away, as I didn't trust the fact that the transfer of accounts would be automatic. I filled out a form online to get connected.

When 5 business days passed and no line sync, I called the number Ralph suggested, which gets you 3Web tech support. I only waited 2 hours on the phone! They told me my account was active and that I should see a solid ADSL light when I got home (I called from work).

No such luck. This time I called IGS and they were more than perplexed. I had no account with them on record and there was no indication that I was in the queue to get connected. They had no idea where 3Web got their info that I had an account with them. The support tech suggested I could sign up again and it would likely be another 5 business days.

I did confirm that Ralph was quite wrong in suggesting that Cybersurf would automatically connect you. I wonder how many former ISTOP folks are checking their dsl modems each day expecting it to magically connect?

btw, he's posted on his web site that former ISTOP users can now dial in to Cybersurf using a modified ISTOP account userid and password. Didn't work for me. Imagine the surprise!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13870936 Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:27:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867613 rex0 : I have(had) one of my accounts with istop and called to see what was going on, if you just wait until the message is over it will connect you to a person (the man I spoke to answered the phone "istop.com")]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867613 Mon, 11 Jul 2005 21:03:25 EDT Re: cybersurf tel http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867537 Steve :
said by breezehill:

... take up to five working days to get things done. Now that five days have passed already.
How do you know they've been working all those days?

:-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867537 Mon, 11 Jul 2005 20:56:47 EDT Re: cybersurf tel http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867381 anon : Thanks Matt. I have tried numerous times, all I got was an recorded message saying it would take up to five working days to get things done. Now that five days have passed already. I just needed to speak with someone to ask a couple of questions. I have filled the account transfer form to switch to cybersurf (as an old istop user) but don't have any contact info from that company. Their website doesn't really tell the tech support number although there is a number for 3web.

Any suggestions?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13867381 Mon, 11 Jul 2005 20:42:23 EDT Re: ISTOP webmail TWIG, etc. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13863765 Matt_IGS : Hey breezehill the number for Cybersurf is 1-866-833-4164

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13863765 Mon, 11 Jul 2005 13:28:58 EDT ISTOP webmail TWIG, etc. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13863574 anon : Couldn't access to the webmail TWIG. Any one had the luck?

Also, anyone able to speak to a human from Cybersurf and don't mind sharing the number?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13863574 Mon, 11 Jul 2005 13:05:18 EDT Re: More on the Naked DSL battle.. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13852394 Confuzzled7 : perhaps this is best for another forum, But that wont hold water if a CRTC complaint is filed. that is monopoly muscle being flexed]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13852394 Sat, 09 Jul 2005 19:25:49 EDT More on the Naked DSL battle.. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13836324 luccrook9 : Thats great that we will be able to get Naked DSL but in their terms and condition section it states the following:

HS Users shall only be permitted to use approved brands, configurations and types of network devices, appliances, modems or other equipment brands. HS Users shall not be permitted to utilize any type of telephone service over the said HS Service including, without limiting the generality of the foregoing, Voice Over Internet Protocol ("VOIP").

Ok so now we can get naked DSL but we can't use it with VOIP? sigh...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13836324 Thu, 07 Jul 2005 17:45:23 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13822175 mlerner : I think he was being sarcastic -- at least I hope so.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13822175 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 23:53:20 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13821313 HiVolt :
said by vif user:

Kudos to you, Mr. Ralph!!! Congradulations on a job well done - you've earned your well deserved break. If only all businesses can be upstanding and credible as yours. You restore my faith in the human race. Best of luck in your future endeavors.
Lmao. Maybe if he starts another ISP you can join him.
--
}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13821313 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 22:10:01 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13820609 anon : Kudos to you, Mr. Ralph!!! Congradulations on a job well done - you've earned your well deserved break. If only all businesses can be upstanding and credible as yours. You restore my faith in the human race. Best of luck in your future endeavors. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13820609 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 20:42:01 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13819422 andyb :
said by zepperdude See Profile:



Since Sprint has colocated in dozens of Bell COs, Cybersurf will be able to offer naked DSL service at speeds faster than the 4mbps maximum speed available through Bell.
believe that when i see it]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13819422 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 17:26:38 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13818925 zepperdude : On the evening of June 28, 2005, Cybersurf Corp. initiated an eleventh hour referral program to aid all IStop.com Internet Services customers.
Cybersurf will attempt to provide and restore connectivity by July 8 to all IStop.com ADSL users affected.

What happened to my DSL connection?
On the evening of June 27, 2005, Bell Canada began disconnecting all IStop.com DSL servers. As such IStop.com is no longer able to provide any DSL connections to users.

Cybersurf Corp. understands that your time is valuable and as such would like to offer you the following as part of the referral program:
First month is paid at the regular rate ($29.95) Any unused prepaid services will be refunded from IStop.com Second month (when billing is switched to Cybersurf) is FREE Future modem rental charges from IStop.com are cancelled Static IP charge of $4 per month

When will everything be back to normal?
Bell has expedited the cut-off of DSL services to IStop.com customers.
Cybersurf network engineers will be working tirelessly to restore your connection by July 8. Many DSL users have already regained full connectivity on the Cybersurf network and we are confident that the process should continue smoothly. Your IStop.com email and pppoe account will continue to work.

To complete the transfer of your account to Cybersurf, fill out this form. You can also call the Cybersurf-IStop.com hotline at 1-866-833-4164. If you do not transfer your account, Cybersurf will eventually disconnect your ADSL service. Cybersurf will be contacting IStop.com customers that do not transfer before disconnecting the ADSL service.

Why Cybersurf?
Cybersurf is one of only a few ISPs with the resources to take over the customer base of IStop.com. I believe Cybersurf is the only ISP of its size offering customers the choice of cable and ADSL high-speed internet access.

In the fall of 2004, the CRTC finally set the regulatory rules that allow ISPs to purchase high-speed cable access on a wholesale basis. To remain competitive, ISPs need to offer both cable and DSL internet access. I was not interested in undertaking the work to add high-speed cable access to the services offered by IStop.com.

Sprint Canada (Call-Net) owns a significant portion of Cybersurf. Call-Net shareholders recently agreed to a takeover offer by Rogers. Together this will give Cybersurf access to telephone and cable networks on a level that cannot be duplicated by other ISPs.

Since Sprint has colocated in dozens of Bell COs, Cybersurf will be able to offer naked DSL service at speeds faster than the 4mbps maximum speed available through Bell. The cost of ADSL service using unbundled loops and colocated DSLAMs is less than half of the cost of naked DSL purchased wholesale from Bell. As stated in the filings I made with the CRTC regarding naked DSL, it is impossible for ISPs that purchase naked DSL from Bell to sell the service at a competitive price (under $35/mth) and still make a profit. Cybersurf however will be in a position to offer naked DSL service at a lower price than Bell Sympatico.

For the remainder of the year, I plan to work on a part-time basis with Cybersurf to assist with the integration of the IStop.com network and assist in their future growth. I believe IStop.com customers will have more options and better service with Cybersurf. And more than 5 years after starting IStop.com, I am ready to step back and slow down for a while.

Ralph Doncaster, IStop.com president]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13818925 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 16:29:28 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13817211 anon : Yep server moved homes, new ip.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13817211 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 12:49:03 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816984 anon : WTF??

I just called cybersurf and you apparently need to activate an account with them? I thought everything would be done automatically! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816984 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 12:22:15 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816863 anon : My connection is back online.

Interesting.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816863 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 12:04:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816618 anon : I wonder if the server is mobile right now and being relocated.

Much like what happened with the mail server.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816618 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 11:29:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Down hard http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816579 anon : i had sync this whole time and could make a 'connection' using either the istop login or the igs one. they both appeared to connect. i am currently using my istop login as it is the only one of the two that will resolve to my static ip. if i use the igs login, i get a different ip.

but what i found last night (still banging my head that i didn't both to check sooner) that even tho i had what appeared to be a connection this whole time i did not have any 'outside' access nor could i retrieve mail. i had to fully reset my router as it would not allow me to edit the DNS entries in it (populated with 3 entries provided to me by istop over one year ago). once i reset and established all of my rules again, i was good to go.

wife & kids are happy to have interweb again. and i will pay more attention to the simple things in the future.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816579 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 11:24:26 EDT Re: ISTOP Down hard http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816489 anon : Yep, however smtp.istop.com still works, so does mail.istop.com

I lost connection with my house this morning around 915.
Not sure if I still have sync, I will try the new log in info when I get home.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816489 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 11:10:28 EDT ISTOP Down hard http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816353 anon : As of this morning there's no connection with the new temporary PPPOE login supplied by igs - but I still have sync.

Trying from my office at work, www.istop.com is not responding. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13816353 Tue, 05 Jul 2005 10:51:22 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13804432 HiVolt : I hope they got parachutes and an inflatable raft! ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13804432 Sun, 03 Jul 2005 13:08:27 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13800228 dirtyjeffer :
said by Doci See Profile:

I saw somebody near my old place get thrown out of their house for not paying their mortgage payments, they were kicked out of the house by the bank and ETF was there.
and the thing is, the bank will only do this as a last resort, and ONLY after they have tried everything else with the client...the last thing a bank wants to do is repo a house...not only do they lose the huge amount of money that a mortgage can generate in interest revenue, but with a quick sale, they usually don't even get enough to cover the legal costs and outstanding balance (depending on the mortgage value).
--
"The only thing more greedy than a corporation, are its customers."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13800228 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 19:13:19 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13798718 Doci : I saw somebody near my old place get thrown out of their house for not paying their mortgage payments, they were kicked out of the house by the bank and ETF was there.
--
My freedom is a debt to Hitler.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13798718 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:43:47 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797535 dirtyjeffer :
said by shampoo See Profile:

Another example of Bell being a good corporate citizen.
perhaps read some information about BCE from their own website, if you want to know about being a "good corporate citizen" is...do you think IStop gives hundreds of millions of dollars per year to charitable organizations?? NO!, he can't even pay his own bills, AGAIN!

Bell isn't "flexing its monopolistic muscle", they are simply demanding payment for services rendered, AGAIN!

if you don't pay your home phone line bill, they will disconnect it after a couple of months of non-payment...this is no different.
--
"The only thing more greedy than a corporation, are its customers."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797535 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 11:07:37 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797248 anon : I had a second phone line installed in my house a few weeks ago and put Magma on it. This line was to compliment and backup my Istop line in the case of an Istop emergency. The Istop emergency happened and I moved all my stuff onto the Magma line.

Magma offeres great customer service 24/7. You can phone in and talk to a live person that is actually knowlegeble and eager to assist. This is a huge difference from Rogers, Bell and Istop. At Istop you could actually talk to someone knowlegable but only during working hours. With Bell and Rogers, you will be lost in their company processes and their phone systems.

I have to decide on a replacement for the Istop line now, but for those Istop users looking for good service, Magma is top-notch so far.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797248 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 10:22:07 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797084 anon : It has not been 3-weeks from a customer standpoint, it has been only a few days since the problem became aparent. This is the fault of IStop as you pointed out. Why the heck would a customer make alterernate arrangements when there is no problem with the line. My istop still works fine, if I was a regular consumer, I would still be happily using the service waiting for my next invoice from IStop. 3-weeks is not a lot of time. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13797084 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 09:55:15 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13796569 shampoo :

well if you have no business with Bell... and Bell has no business with you then how could they have any responsibility to you to provide sync?


I'm not going to debate this issue anymore because we are arguing from different levels. I'm arguing from what Bell should have done to be a good corporate citizen instead of a company that flexes its monopolistic muscle. Everyone on the other size, is arguing from what Bell can do from a legal standpoint.

What would fix this issue is to cut the middleman out. Let the customer buy their line card directly from Bell. ISP's can order the cards for you, but the customer pays Bell directly. That would end this issue once and for all.

My card, for the record, was never pulled because I switched very early after IStop lost connection.

But lots of people lost sync and others lost a dial tone because the tech ripped a wire or two. Bell is now informing those that the dialtone will not be back until July 6th.. Probably because their techs are busing pulling IStop line cards..

Another example of Bell being a good corporate citizen.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13796569 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 07:24:06 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13796554 shampoo :

You certainly may, including those who don't pay their bills and get their pipes turned off. "Ability to keep their pipes turned on" is a quality attribute that people other than you seem to think is important


You seem to have me mistaken for IStop. My bills were paid.


The thing that makes a company a good corporate citizen is executing well in the area of competence; achieving broader social goals is not in that competence and shouldn't be on their agenda.


Then it's clear you and I have nothing left to discuss. We are on different planets as to what kind of world we wish to live in.

J
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13796554 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 07:17:14 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13795760 Confuzzled7 : The thing is Istop has been Insolvent for 3 weeks from the indications I'm seeing.

3 weeks is a proper amount of time for the "evil empire" to push the paper around for an order

3 weeks would have been plenty of time for Istop to notify its customers

3 weeks would have been plenty of time for the customers to switch their billing without ever having the line card pulled.

Had Istop had the slightest care about their customers they would have given notice and not had their customers wait till bell waited the reasonable amount of time to pull the plug.

Once again though the big losers here are Istops subscribers]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13795760 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 01:45:54 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13795720 anon : Agreed. My experience with Bell has been: an accidental disconnection of my landline for 3 days, an increase in my Expressvu bill with no warning, a change in channel presentation with only 24 hours warning, a promise that my line card would be installed for my new home landline the day I moved in was broken and it took them 2 weeks and 6 calls to get it right, ...and now they spitefuly pull line cards ON A HOLIDAY no less?! So I'm sure I'm probably in for another 2 weeks and several phone calls before I get that link back.

I'm not that concerned though. Bell can take my landline and jump in the lake as I'll be moving to cable. It will be a very cold day in hell before I do business with Bell directly or indirectly again.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13795720 Sat, 02 Jul 2005 01:31:17 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794944 anon : They are a paying customer with no service. Bell could get them hooked up quickly and retain their revenue stream. You have to realize that there are many hungry customers that really don't give a shit about Bell, Doncaster, You or me... they just want service. Leave the line sync there provide a login and continue making your millions. There is no need to inconvenience the customer further, 99% are returning to DSL within days. I agree that in the long term the sync has to go. In the short-term the customers can be easily brought back on line. This is not a case of a customer switching ISPs, it is a case of an ISP leaving ??? numbers of customers in the lurch. A unique situation that requires a unique approach as opposed to following the company handbook.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794944 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 23:26:40 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794763 anon : The problem is when the new supplier of the PPoE login has no obligation to remit to Bell because Doncaster Consulting holds the DSL contract and is not paying (and is dead)... Bell cannot go after the PPOE login provider UNLESS they place an order for DSL... so for example someone could have used the IGS free trial id as a login. IGS has no obligation to pay Bell since it is not leasing the DSL lines.. ISTOP who knows who the customer is, is not paying anybody... so unless you cut sync you are giving away free service.

This reminds me of some people who in the analog cable world would tap into the signal box (because the basic cable signal was there) and moralize that they were not stealing cable. It still was signal theft pure and simple. So if the cable company stopped the carrier signal on that tap until they had a homeowner who is willing to pay is that wrong??? They could leave the signal there... and in an honest world that would make sense. But the world is not all honest and everyone has to protect their property. If your property is photon and electrons and that's how you earn a living you stop the flow of photons and electrons.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794763 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:57:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794746 Doci : This has never worked like that in the past. They always disconnected you when you switched ISPs, the only exception was if you were moving from Sympatico, then you could provide them with the cancellation # and then they would not drop your sync, provided your new ISP gets through with them before the disconnection date. Why should they make ISTOP an exception when they have no idea who's going to stay and who is not. If you think PPPoE connectivity was the only big issue with ADSL service, think again. Your being there using the port and not paying means you remove Bell's ability to get another paying customer; retail or wholesale. If this were the case, they would've already hooked everybody up with ADSL as part of their pots line, that would really save them money but the fact is, their port capacity is very finite, especially when it is a remote in a crowded area like mine. They had to build many huts in my area to cover us, and it is often full. So you tell me, does it make sense for them to have $0 revenue generating customers on their equipment when they have other paying customers waiting in a line to be hooked up.
--
My freedom is a debt to Hitler.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794746 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:54:42 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794514 anon : Absolutely there is no need to remove the line cards. They cut off serivce to all IStop subscribers at the ISP. PPPoE still works, so they are way better off to give the Istop customers the option to continue using DSL by getting a new PPPoE login from another ISP perhaps even Sympatico. Bell may as well continue to make money from Istop's customers instead of risking that they move to a competing technology. It costs them nothing to leave the sync, if they did actually remove the line cards, they did it out of spite to Doncaster.

How many customers did Istop have? Anybody have an idea?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794514 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:23:59 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794383 anon : "and by the sounds of things if the earlier poster is right about his information which i would not call impossible and which could be verified as court proceedings are public and there should be a publicly available record indicating the court sessions between DCI and Bell and the Bankruptcy filings (though i don't think that's how the poster earlier knew about the warnings and the amount of time that the company has been in the hands of their trustee)"

Various court documents have been filed by Bell on 2 court motions by ISTOP to stop disconnect by DCI... details in there tell the story including multiple warnings of disconnects as early as February. ... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794383 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:09:27 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794308 anon : Absolutely there was justification to remove cards...

if you leave an extension cord with power outside your house and somebody taps into each night without paying you would you pull that extension cord outside your house or would you prevent further loss by disabling access until somebody who agreed to pay you for it made an agreement with you???? Better yet, what if that "night-tapper" was selling your power to someone else and pcoketing money... does that give you more or less impetous to safeguard your assets/service?

The pulling of line cards, 2 weeks after a compny has been declared insolvent... with the trustee declaring closure and well over 4 months from the first time notices of disconnects were sent out does not seem overzealous... the real question is what took them soo long!!!!\\]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794308 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:01:45 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794256 anon : well if you have no business with Bell... and Bell has no business with you then how could they have any responsibility to you to provide sync?

Not every home is automatically equipped with a card... if nobody is paying Bell for that service there is no god given right to sync... from the bankruptcy of DCI a(and before) when Bell was not receiving money, and the DSL contracts are with DCI (not you) why does Bell have to keep providing service... if Bell asked you to pay for synch going to your house you would have told them to take a hike.

what remedy would Bell have... while you enjoyed your service on their card and their capital.. they were not paid... If you signed an agreement with Bell directly that's different.

You said it originally... you owe Bell nothing and Bell owes yu nothing including synch.... Once you or an ISP on you behalf enters an agreement to agree to pay for DSL you will get service. Bell is not obligated to have thousands of line cards on standby for every house in case they decide to get DSL.

By the way.. in the end... DCI the bankkrupt company.. who had a trustee and the contract with Bell terminated the service due to non-payment from ISTOP. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13794256 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 21:55:23 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793802 anon : Must throw in my $.02. Bell is just a huge coproration with absolutely no morality. They will never lose a nickel over this debacle becasue every ISP has to pay them about $25 per month per line. No matter who is selling DSL service, Bell is making $25 of the dollars you are paying your ISP and they are making even more on the other end by providing the ISP an uplink to the Internet.

If Bell had good business sense, rather then removing line cards, they would leave them and have all the other DSL providers reconnect the pissed off IStop customers so that they don't move over to another technology such as cable. No matter the DSL ISP, Bell wins. They are a monopoly, thier technology works great, but they are an evil empire.

PS, My Istop login still works for some reason.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793802 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 21:00:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793782 Confuzzled7 :
said by shampoo See Profile:



My business with an ISP is not Bell. It's ISTOP. I paid my dues to ISTOP. Bell's problem is not with me, but with ISTOP. It should fight it's battles with ISTOP and leave me out of it.

J
People seem to miss a Key point here

YOU DO NOT OWN YOUR PHONE NUMBER NOR YOUR LINECARD

Bell Doesn't even own your phone number but thats a discussion for another time and forum.

your linecard belongs to bell canada and was used to provide service to Doncaster Consulting Inc. They don't know anything about the customer/subscriber. That could be Ralphs home dsl connection and bell would never know. From Bells Perspective YOU are Istop based out of Queensview drive, Every one of the hundreds of you. They left You alone and disconnected DCI/Istop's telecom services.

Because all customer information is the property of DCI bell is more than not allowed to see that that would be Illegal fo them to know anything about you as a client all they have is address phone number that the line is riding on and DSL config.

Even bell to bell they aren't allowed to share info. Ok with the bell "One bill" they share some but those who signed up for it like I did might remember they needed you to clearly state that you authorized the sharing of your customer information across separate BCE companies.

The company is in receivership so i remove my services with them.

and by the sounds of things if the earlier poster is right about his information which i would not call impossible and which could be verified as court proceedings are public and there should be a publicly available record indicating the court sessions between DCI and Bell and the Bankruptcy filings (though i don't think that's how the poster earlier knew about the warnings and the amount of time that the company has been in the hands of their trustee)

If they have been Bankrupt and in the care of their trustee for 3 weeks then that is INEXCUSABLE ON DCI's Part for not advising its clients sooner that it was sunk.

Every user complaining of a pulled linecard would have never had this issue had your isp done its job at the end of its life. Don't Blame the bell business office for issuing disconnect orders when they get a call saying "the company is bankrupt disconnect everything" and don't blame the bell Central office guy for working the orders he had in a day.

Blame Istop/DCI for not telling you in early to mid June they would be ending their business operations at the end of the month.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793782 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 20:57:25 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793613 Steve :
said by shampoo See Profile:

I may do business with whomever I please.
You certainly may, including those who don't pay their bills and get their pipes turned off. "Ability to keep their pipes turned on" is a quality attribute that people other than you seem to think is important
So you admit then that Bell's practices are not that of a good corporate citizen.
The thing that makes a company a good corporate citizen is executing well in the area of competence; achieving broader social goals is not in that competence and shouldn't be on their agenda.

But you're suggesting that Bell should make their own customers pay more so that customers of deadbeats could stay connected; that's not only foolish, but it hurts the market. If you think that maintaining line cards for non-revenue users "costs them nothing", you probably need to learn something about capital allocation.

Steve
--
Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793613 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 20:31:53 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793584 Savant :
said by observer11:
So despite conspiracy theories, Bell would not unilaterally cut off a customer who was paying even close to what they owed until exhausting every possibility for repayment
While I still think that Bell didn't have to pull the plug on iStop, I do recognize that Bell has the right to do so given the circumstances of their failure to pay their bill. This wasn't my key beef with Bell's actions though.

Bell cut off iStop's backbone connections and leased lines etc... Fair enough, they have that right. However, what peeved me was that Bell went ahead and fast-tracked a removal order to have all the line cards pulled for iStop customers. THAT was crossing the line.

I talked with a manager there, a nice guy too. He told me that because of the order that came down the pipe to yank all the iStop customer line cards, they had a massive backlog of work. There were 200 pending work orders that were waiting to be completed, not forgetting the impact of the technician strike. They had technicians working on Canada Day because of all the work that had backed up while Bell was busy 'sticking it' to past iStop customers, meanwihle new customers were delayed.

Does it sound very smart to you that Bell would fast track removal of line cards when you have 200 people waiting for work to be done? Not only does this inconvenience those ex-iStop customers that changed to other companies, but it also inconvenienced people that should have been unaffected by this.

There was absolutely no justification to rush through an order to yank all the line cards. None whatsoever. That's like Bell yanking out the copper wires to your house if you don't pay your bill.

You don't have to remove the infrastructure to deprive the customer of that service. Bell did just that, and it was this act that I considered malicious and callous.

Regards,

Savant
--
"Never attack the individual. We can be in total disagreement with someone without denigrating them as a consequence."
-- Pierre Elliott Trudeau [1919-2000]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793584 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 20:25:52 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793393 shampoo :


If you want Bell to treat you like a customer, maybe you ought to actually be one: get your service from them directly, and you won't have this problem.



That's a non-sequitar. I may do business with whomever I please.



I don't think so; by pulling those cards, they've put a whole raft of people back in the "shopping for service" market, many of whom will start to give Bell money one way or the other by this time next week.



So you admit then that Bell's practices are not that of a good corporate citizen. By using its monopoly on the 'last mile' it flexes it's monopolistic muscle on me, as a non customer of Bell, in hopes that I may switch to Sympatico.

With that, yes, I agree.

J]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793393 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 19:52:19 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793360 shampoo : The analogy is fair. I have no business with Bell. Bell is completely transparent in this to me. Same with Toyota. I bought the car and Toyota was supposedly paid by the financing company. I longer have a contractual obligation to Bell.

Your analogy with utilities is faulty. To get electricty, I pay Hydro Quebec. My business is with Hydro Quebec. I therefore have a contract with Hydro Quebec.

My business with an ISP is not Bell. It's ISTOP. I paid my dues to ISTOP. Bell's problem is not with me, but with ISTOP. It should fight it's battles with ISTOP and leave me out of it.

J]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13793360 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 19:48:46 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792687 Steve :
said by shampoo See Profile:

What exactly is Bell giving away? A free line card? It costs them nothing to keep that card in there.
If you want Bell to treat you like a customer, maybe you ought to actually be one: get your service from them directly, and you won't have this problem.
Furthermore, Bell gains nothing financially by pulling line cards. Quite the contrary, it cost Bell money.
I don't think so; by pulling those cards, they've put a whole raft of people back in the "shopping for service" market, many of whom will start to give Bell money one way or the other by this time next week.

No business ought to make it easier for customers to not pay their bills.

Steve
--
Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792687 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 18:06:27 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792581 anon : Wrong analogy... Toyota sells the car and gets its money from the security company... toyota begins and ends the transaction... but what if Toyota's finance division was your creditor...try not paying and see if toyota or an division does not repossess.....

Same with any service,,, electricty.... you use it each month like DSL... try not paying the bill...

Bell is not the government... it forgoes money from selling retail to whoelsale when it goes to ISTOP (Unlike cable comapnies who barely do this... it just has started in a limited way with SHAW).

Why should Bell month after month give a free service to you, while you pay ISTOP and he does not meet his obligation... in fact even sells the business with no intent of paying his debts... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792581 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 17:53:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792528 shampoo :

Being a "decent corporate citizen" seems to be a double-edged sword: if you are Bell, you should give stuff away because your customer was a bad bad boy; if you are an ISP, you can treat your customers how ever you want as long as you scream and point the finger elsewhere and hope nobody notices what a jerk you are being.


What exactly is Bell giving away? A free line card? It costs them nothing to keep that card in there.

I think you and I have a very different idea as to what being a "decent corporate citizen" is.

I paid my bills to IStop. Bell's problem is with IStop not their customers. Yet Bell feels it's OK to pull their line cards.

Say the financing company I choose to use to purchase a car does not pay Toyota for the car I purchased from them. The financing company goes bust and Toyota visits me and repossesses my car.

Toyota cannot do that. Toyota's beef is with the financing company, not me.

Being a "decent corporate citizen" means acting in the spirit of the rules, not always by the strictest definition. Bell is penalizing IStop's customers for something IStop's customers had nothing to do with.

Furthermore, Bell gains nothing financially by pulling line cards. Quite the contrary, it cost Bell money.

J]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792528 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 17:46:24 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792502 shampoo : Fixed below..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792502 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 17:41:38 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792294 anon : Savant...

some facts to consider...

ISTOP is not the company that had services contract with Bell... DCI was... DCI went into protection creditor protection 2 months ago and has been formally declared bankrupt and run by a trustee for the last 3 weeks.

DCI owed millions to Bell over a period of time that extended months/year

Doncaster has filed at least 2 Part VIIs and two court motions before bell disconnected anyone... and even though Bell could haved disconnected early they waited for the all the regulatory and legal cases to be heard

No fewer than 3 , 30 day notices and 2 final 48 hour notices were sent DCI advising of disconnect.... Bell has no visibility on the end-customers of ISTOP. Remember bell sells to DCI who sells to ISTOP who sells to end customer. Bell has no visibility on who has paid ISTOp, who has'nt or indeed if their is even a contract for DSL where the loop ends... That's what an independent ISP does.

ISTOP was giving out alternative IDs even after ISP disconnected so customer can take advantageof cards not being pulled .... all the while noboday is paying Bell for this (forget about the millions of past due)

All the while SILENCE from the service provider ISTOP.. who failed in the duty to the customer..... If proper money was flowing the courts and the CRTC would have had to prevent Bell from disconnecting... at least 4 formal legal venues since January all agreed that Bell was within its rights.

So despite conspiracy theories, Bell would not unilaterally cut off a customer who was paying even close to what they owed until exhausting every possibility for repayment

Facts are a funny thing... people like to make judgements without facts.... all public record stuff.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13792294 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 17:14:43 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790829 Savant :
said by Deadpool See Profile:
Since when is it in any company's best interest to keep giving their customers any type of service if they refuse to pay for that service? Try this out: Stop paying your credit card payments. Then, when they threaten to cancel your card, pay whatever amount you feel is the right amount to keep your card going. Then be apalled and disgusted when they have the audacity to cancel your card despite what you felt was a satisfactory amount of money to keep it going.
That's a pretty crappy analogy if you ask me. Credit card companies are third parties, they don't make money solely from having you as a customer. You have to make purchases from a merchant, then keep a balance before they make any money from interest.

A better analogy would be a subscription based service like your regular telephone line. Most people can go three months without paying before Bell will start sending out letters asking you what is up and threatening disconnection. If you call in to Bell and make a payment plan, then Bell will not disconnect you. (this is part of the tariff too I believe)

Considering Bell's monopoly status, they have to give customers extra leeway when behind on their bills since Bell is the only game in town. It's not like you can shop around for a better deal. The bottom line is that Bell will not make money off a disconnected customer. Those accounts are typically written off for pennies on the dollar because these people no longer have the ability to pay.

I was GM for a national firm that did millions in sales a year, and I can tell you what it's like getting a bill from Bell that is an inch thick. I can tell you that I have sat down, gone through these bill 'novels' and found LOADS of extra charges! Honestly, until I forced Bell to get their act together, I was finding $10K a month is extra (bad) charges that I would have to get reversed. When your bill is only $75K a month, that's significant. Bell can and does load the bills with as much crap as they can and hope that it sticks. I have had many dealings with Bell VPs over this issue after I refused to pay, and they grudgingly removed the extra fees from my bills.

It shouldn't be this way. People shouldn't have to fight with Bell to get a fair deal. If Bell is overcharging then they shouldn't get paid and I'll tell you why... It's a heck of a lot harder to get a credit on your bill after the fact, than it is to have them simply agree to adjust the amount owing.

When I try and describe the way Bell works, I often remember Douglas Adams and the Hitchhikers Gide to the Galaxy. His description of the Vogons fits Bell to a tee...

quote:
They are one of the most unpleasant races in the Galaxy - not actually evil, but bad tempered, bureaucratic, officious and callous. They wouldn't even lift a finger to save their own grandmothers from the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal without orders signed in triplicate, sent in, sent back, queried, lost, found, subjected to public enquiry, lost again, and finally buried in soft peat for three months and recycled as firelighters.


That's what getting a credit is like from Bell, and that's why you should never just "pay them everything and sort it out later." If you do, you'll never see that money again, and they'll expect you to pay these inflated bills in future.

Regards,

Savant
--
"Never attack the individual. We can be in total disagreement with someone without denigrating them as a consequence."
-- Pierre Elliott Trudeau [1919-2000]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790829 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 13:50:00 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790691 HeadSpinning : Exactly. We can co-locate in a host central office, and access the copper loop from there, but we are not allowed to access a sub-section of the loop (sub-loop) at a point closer to the customer's location.

Typically, a loop is made up of a few sections:

-F1 - from the CO to the OPI
-F2 - from the OPI to the Pedestal/Aerial Closure
-Drop - from the Pedestal/Aerial Closure to the customer's location.

What we want is the ability to access the loop at the F2 level, or right at remotes, which typically have cables feeding various OPI's nearby.

Right now, even if we build our own hut near one of Bell's they won't connect us to the loop at that point - all connections must be in the CO.

So much for encouraging facilities based competition instead of wholesale.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790691 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 13:32:49 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790197 Doci : Took me a while to get that through my head. So you're saying, you can't put a your own device near Bell's equipment if it is a hut in the boonies.
--
My freedom is a debt to Hitler.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13790197 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 12:37:04 EDT Correction regarding Cronomagic http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789685 jrhay : I should have made it clear in my last post that I'm referring to »www.cronomagic.com and their ADSL service.

Jim.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789685 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 11:41:49 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789653 Deadpool :
said by Savant See Profile:

If Ralph had (as he said) sent Bell $300,000 - then that should have been sufficient to keep things going for a while regardless of what they said he owed.
Assuming Bell said: Yeah, okay, we'll take that - for now. But if Bell said: Pay us $600,000, and all he paid was half, then he's still short, isn't he? :uhh:

said by Savant See Profile:

Remember, if Ralph owes Bell a lot of money, it's in Bell's interest to keep him connected since Ralph's ability to pay the bill drops to nil if Bell shuts down his business. Does anyone think that Bell has a better chance of getting paid now? Of course not! That's why I said this was more than about the money, if it WAS about the money Bell would have kept him connected so he could keep pumping money into Bell. A dead business will not provide Bell with any income.
Since when is it in any company's best interest to keep giving their customers any type of service if they refuse to pay for that service?

Try this out: Stop paying your credit card payments. Then, when they threaten to cancel your card, pay whatever amount you feel is the right amount to keep your card going. Then be apalled and disgusted when they have the audacity to cancel your card despite what you felt was a satisfactory amount of money to keep it going. :uhh::uhh::uhh:

Let me know how it goes...
--
F*ckin' NHLPA - wrecking the game for all of us...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789653 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 11:39:11 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789650 jrhay : Evidently the page never got updated:( There is no activation fee and its $29.95 per month with $8 per month for a static IP - less than IGS is charging:) They also have no cap.

So, have another look at their website and I think you'll like the rates better. Their tech support is also good.

Jim.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13789650 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 11:39:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788975 HeadSpinning :
said by Hitman:
I am on a remote living in the boonies, and I can get service from Bell or other mom 'n pop providers.


Right, but your service is always from a DSLAM owned by Bell. When we (MNSi) provide service to someone on a "remote in the boonies" its through wholesale service from Bell (just like all the other ISP's), not on our own gear. We can only provide service on our own DSLAM's for people who are fed from a host CO where we have our own co-located DSLAM's.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788975 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 10:07:00 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788928 Doci : I am on a remote living in the boonies, and I can get service from Bell or other mom 'n pop providers.
--
My freedom is a debt to Hitler.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788928 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 09:58:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788864 HeadSpinning : TN6862 had to do with providing wholesale DSL service (PPPoE Gateway Access Service) on dry loops.

He was requesting the commission require Bell to provide it on the Unbundled ADSL port (GT5400), and on HSA service (GT5420), which only makes sense. There should be no prohibition on which network elements can be combined.

The second paragraph refers to the fact that Bell is making "subloops" available for its own DSL, but not for competitors using their own DSLAM equipment. The idea is that competitors should be able to locate outside plant enclosures next to Bell remotes or OPI's (they would need to negotiate municipal access arrangements separately of course), and then have Bell provision short or subloops from that point to the customer's location, rather than forcing competitors to access unbundled loops ONLY at the CO.

The CISC working group on on subloops fell apart a few years ago due to lack of interest (all the players were fighting for survival, not the right to spend even more money building huts next to every Bell remote!). Now that Bell owns GT/360 in Canada, Allstream is owned by MTS, and Rogers owns Call Net (Sprint Canada), none of the big guys are very interested in accessing subloops, as they all have their own agendas (Allstream is afraid of Bell asking them to do the same thing in MTS territory, and Rogers prefers their HFC architecture anyways).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788864 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 09:49:46 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788794 Confuzzled7 : All that stuff is saying with naked dsl is that bell is selling customers the Exactly same thing they sell Sprint or AT&T and connecting it to ADSL

From Bells Perspective its a great idea and form many users perspectives to, Naked DSL if you want to call it that plus VOIP service and you don't need dialtone.

the thing is Bell is not creating a new DSL service this way, they are putting DSL onto a service the offer.

If someone in forum orders it odds are they will get a circuit number instead of a phone number.

But the point being that any other telco can order an unbundled loop and hook DSL to it but putting DSLAMS into the Bell CO and hooking them to the raw copper they buy (Other telco's putting equipment into bell CO's is nothing new its called a colocate)

I honestly doubt that Ralph could get his plug pulled over a tariff application or tariff wrangling, Bell loses almost all these decisions so having some little isp gripe in tariff stuff is no concern Same with small CLEC phone companies. There Is way more to the plug being pulled than meets the eye and I'm sure though that the 300 000 was put down in january and it might have been to buy 6 months for istop to clean up its act and show itself able to pay

we noticed how disconnect 1 was early December and disconnect two was 6 months plus some VP/Presidential negotiation time apart. Say bell and istop were shelling it out for 2 weeks the plug got pulled 6 months and 3 weeks later]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788794 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 09:38:36 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788688 Steve : These were Ralph's brief comments files to TN6862:
said by IStop.com's comments on TN6862:

From: Ralph Doncaster [ralph@istop.com]
Sent: April 5, 2005 10:44 AM
To: Procedure
Subject: TN6862 comments
IStop.com has reviewed TN6862 and has the following comments.

1. The proposed amendments affect GT Item 5410. The Commission should require Bell to file amendments for ALL wholesale DSL tariffs, namely GT Item 5400, 5410, and 5420.

2. Bell provisions ADSL from a CO or a remote. Bell has made public statements indicating ADSL will soon be provisioned from outside plant locations. This means that an increasingly large portion of ADSL installations use sub-loops instead of a full unbundled loop. Bell has not filed a tariff for sub-loops and is therefore in violation of s. 25 of the Act by providing ADSL on sub-loops. Therefore Bell must immediately file a competitor tariff for sub-loops at Category I rates.

Ralph Doncaster, IStop.com president
6042147 Canada Inc.
I have no idea what to make of it; just posting to save time.

Steve
--
Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788688 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 09:19:28 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788537 HeadSpinning : Bell has a history of doing whatever they want until they're told not to. They often get away with it, as the CRTC will just tell them to stop in the future, and give them a slap on the wrist.

If for example, Bell sells something that violates the rules, the commission will tell them to not sell it in the future, but existing customers can keep the service. In other words, the commission won't try to "unscramble the egg" so to speak.

If you think of it though, Bell feels they are owed money, and they see that iStop might be getting some money for the sale of their customer base. They're going to work as quickly as possible to see that iStop can't realize any value out of this deal. Then again, sale of customers could be considered a "bulk sale" under Ontario law, and the proceeds of that sale could be awarded in court to Bell as a creditor.

There are always at least 2 sides to a story. iStop claims they were paying Bell 50% above tariff for their services, plus a $300,000 deposit. I somehow doubt that is the entire story. I'm sure there are facts on Bell's side as well, although we will likely never know what they are. I suspect iStop was keeping current, but had some previous outstanding charges that were in dispute. Technically, Bell should not cut off a customer for failure to pay for non-tariffed services, and I suspect any dispute iStop has with Bell is about charges incurred prior to DSL becoming a tariffed service in January. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788537 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 08:49:46 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788519 Savant :
said by Leathal See Profile:
Are you Ralph from Istop or someone who works closely with him?
No, I am not Ralph, (nor do I work with him) and my location should have been a dead giveaway that that was the case.

My experience comes from having dealt with Bell at the 'upper level', IE. the Vice-President level. It also comes from having advised some Canadian ISPs on how to launch a CRTC complaint. Things are handled quite differently at that level, and money won't get you disconnected so long as money is flowing to Bell. If Ralph had (as he said) sent Bell $300,000 - then that should have been sufficient to keep things going for a while regardless of what they said he owed.

Remember, if Ralph owes Bell a lot of money, it's in Bell's interest to keep him connected since Ralph's ability to pay the bill drops to nil if Bell shuts down his business. Does anyone think that Bell has a better chance of getting paid now? Of course not! That's why I said this was more than about the money, if it WAS about the money Bell would have kept him connected so he could keep pumping money into Bell. A dead business will not provide Bell with any income.

Again, I firmly believe that there was more going on than just a 'non-payment disconnect', especially given how fast they started disconnecting line cards when they are backlogged with other work orders.

Regards,

Savant
--
"Never attack the individual. We can be in total disagreement with someone without denigrating them as a consequence."
-- Pierre Elliott Trudeau [1919-2000]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788519 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 08:46:47 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788457 Kardinal :
said by ANONASS:

If Bell can disconnect line cards in 1 business day...why does it take 5+ business days to reconnect. THIS IS WHAT MAKES BELL A BAD CORPORATE CITIZEN!
Wow...an appropriately named anonymous troll.

I believe it takes 4 days for a connection to be made, and it seems that people have been losing sync at varying times over several days, not all on the same day. Besides, do we know when Bell started the disconnection process, or is this just wild guesses by Bell haters? Furthermore, which takes longer: building something, or taking something apart? When a connection is being installed, it has to be figured out where the connection will be (CO vs remote location), which port will be used, is a truck roll needed for a cross-connection, etc. When a disconnection is done, it's a matter of 'take this extra connection off this line' and that's really about it. Different amounts of work = different lengths of time to do it.

I'm always amused how people hold some companies to different levels of responsibility simply because they have a bone to pick with them. The company that failed their paying customers here is IStop, pure and simple. If people want uninterrupted service, they should have seen the writing on the wall after the last interruption and make plans accordingly. Is saving $5 a month more important than your connection? One has to wonder, given the gnashing of teeth in this thread.
--
"I'd sure look like a fool, dead in a ditch somewhere with a mind full of chemicals like some cheese-eating highschool boy" - TPOH
Join Team Helix]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788457 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 08:32:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788303 anon : If Bell can disconnect line cards in 1 business day...why does it take 5+ business days to reconnect. THIS IS WHAT MAKES BELL A BAD CORPORATE CITIZEN!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788303 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 07:46:40 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788259 Leathal :
said by Savant See Profile:

said by davisx See Profile:
Ya THAT's why iSTOP is dead. I'm sure Ralph was close to winning a key victory...
Laugh if you want, but I wouldn't expect too many people to understand the situation with Bell and the CRTC. Bell has been hauled before the CRTC on a number of issues brought forward by iStop. A search of the CRTC records resulted in over 60 hits.

In particular, I think Bell was particularly peeved by this application, and that may have been what pushed Bell into forcing him out of business. Ralph has always been a thorn in Bell's side, and this was one of many issues brought before the CRTC. You'd be surprised at the goings on...

So don't judge this based on the outcome, look deeper and see what precipitated the outcome. There was more to this than money... trust me.

Regards,

Savant
Are you Ralph from Istop or someone who works closely with him?

Leathal]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788259 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 07:26:08 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788233 Kardinal :
said by Savant See Profile:

In particular, I think Bell was particularly peeved by this application, and that may have been what pushed Bell into forcing him out of business.
A bit of extra research reveals these results:

1) Bell had already filed an application for tariff for naked DSL (filed on March 31st, 2005)
2) Ralph filed his frivilous Part VII April 11th
3) Other ISPs and CLECs had also filed comments around this time
4) CRTC gave interim approval to TN6862 April 15th, 2005.

Link to info on 6862 (scroll down)
Link to comments from interested parties on TN6862 (includes comments filed by Ralph on April 5th, before his Part VII, as well as from IMCAIP, Quebec ISPs represented by AEI, AOL and MTSAllstream)

Does anyone actually believe that Ralph's Part VII was anything more than spite and yet another play for time in what has turned out to be a waiting and dodging game (at least, that's how it looks from the information posted here)?

As for Bell being 'culpable':

If an end-user's service is with IStop and Istop is being disconnected for not paying their bills, then why should Bell leave the connection in for the end user to go to someone else, start paying for it and maybe Bell gets paid by the 2nd ISP? For example, SecureNet offers a "secondary" connection but I doubt they tell Bell about it. If you went to someone like that, Bell wouldn't get a dime yet you get sync for free.

If Sprint Canada was disconnected for non-payment, would you expect Bell to give you dialtone until you found a new provider for phone service?

Being a "decent corporate citizen" seems to be a double-edged sword: if you are Bell, you should give stuff away because your customer was a bad bad boy; if you are an ISP, you can treat your customers how ever you want as long as you scream and point the finger elsewhere and hope nobody notices what a jerk you are being.

Lastly, you had an ID from Sympatico within the time you make your call and you had connectivity back -- that's exactly how PPPoE is supposed to work: you get an ID, you get access. However, do you really believe that the results of your call to change providers would have filtered down through the entire ordering system of the company as an update to a disconnection request for your DSLAM port between when you called Sympatico in the evening and the following morning? Keep in mind: the order to modify your service is only one among thousands that happen every day. If you are thinking "well, I'm with Sympatico, they should have been able to do something!!!!, then you are advocating the special treatment for Sympatico subscribers that all the ISPs allege happen. You are proof positive that it doesn't. :)
--
"I'd sure look like a fool, dead in a ditch somewhere with a mind full of chemicals like some cheese-eating highschool boy" - TPOH
Join Team Helix]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13788233 Fri, 01 Jul 2005 07:19:21 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13786758 Confuzzled7 : Last i checked the CRTC decisions (In the brief period before legalese put me to sleep) The CRTC had agreed WITH bell about Istop being 2 things

1. A proven customer with questionable Payment habits
2. A risk of repeating similar habits.

The decision i read was in January and it was about Bell requiring Doncaster Consulting to pay a deposit for WAN services.

Last i checked when the repo men come to clean out an office they don't leave a fold up chair and the phone for the president to make an effort to rebuild the company they cart all the stuff up and leave an empty office.

Bell is repossessing the telecom assets of an insolvent company. if you feel like tracking the CRTC website great otherwise I'm SURE that charges will be filed in civil court over this.

Doncaster has Nothing to lose and a lot to win. If he can prove that Bell Canada wrongfully destroyed his company through repeated deliberate disconnections he can win enough punitive damages to retire or start another ISP.

Bell might be a lot of things but stupid is not something i would associate with them. They cannot forcibly pull the plug on an ISP without enough documentation to show that the company would never make its bills.

Bell lost money, yes, big deal they aren't the losers in this. Istop closed, are they the losers, no. I've worked in a doomed telecom company before. The writing would have been on the wall of all of the company Or at the Very least when you Compare the Accounts Payable (What Istop owes as bills) figures to the Accounts Receivable (What Istop is getting as income) for a month the figures would have spoken millions of words.

The losers here are Istops Subscribers, Hands down no doubt you got the shaft but not by Bell bell is disconnecting the business lines of a business that didn't pay its bills. It knows nothing about you has no info or anything about your DSL. your line is no different that a branch office of a company or a bank machine from bells side because they have NONE of your DSL customer info. Just DSL service to this address at this sync rate and bridged or PPPOE but all they see is doncaster consulting at queensview as the client and as the billing address.

Istop could have folded out gracefully and given everyone tons of time to jump ship. They gracefully let their Statics go they COULD have done the same for PPPOE.

I refuse to believe that they didn't know that they were running a loss and that it has no signs of reversing.

A company Dropping services is not a company in expansion its a company in the process of going tits up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13786758 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:48:45 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13786047 Savant :
said by davisx See Profile:
Ya THAT's why iSTOP is dead. I'm sure Ralph was close to winning a key victory...
Laugh if you want, but I wouldn't expect too many people to understand the situation with Bell and the CRTC. Bell has been hauled before the CRTC on a number of issues brought forward by iStop. A search of the CRTC records resulted in over 60 hits.

In particular, I think Bell was particularly peeved by this application, and that may have been what pushed Bell into forcing him out of business. Ralph has always been a thorn in Bell's side, and this was one of many issues brought before the CRTC. You'd be surprised at the goings on...

So don't judge this based on the outcome, look deeper and see what precipitated the outcome. There was more to this than money... trust me.

Regards,

Savant
--
"Never attack the individual. We can be in total disagreement with someone without denigrating them as a consequence."
-- Pierre Elliott Trudeau [1919-2000]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13786047 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:16:57 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784702 davisx : Sorry I didn't mean to be so derisive in my last post but the bottom line is this. If I was a customer and I pay an ISP for service, it should not be disconnected because the ISP is not paying its bills (regardless of disputes, etc). If Ralph was actually trying to provide quality service, he would have done whatever it takes to ensure that Bell did not cut off service and then deal with them appropriately to recoup any losses he might have.

Ultimately he is disrespecting his customers; his lifeline. That is why ISTOP is dead.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784702 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:35:19 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784657 davisx : "I actually have a lot of respect for Ralph since he is not afraid to go up against a big company like Bell that can spend millions on lawyers and such. It's probably likely that Ralph was close to winning a key victory and so they wanted to shut him down."

LOL!!! Ya THAT's why iSTOP is dead. I'm sure Ralph was close to winning a key victory... (still laughing).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784657 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:27:03 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784164 igsjake : Why would anyone go to an ISP with bandwidth caps?

And why are people claiming that 3Web has bandwidth caps.

I've been told point blank by upper management that nobody has received any form of over usage bill from 3Web any time recently.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784164 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:15:17 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784144 Savant :
said by Dave Lewis See Profile:
The people here that are flaming bell for this have really got me steamed... Where you are coming from I'll never know..
Although I wasn't one of those who 'flamed Bell', I still consider Bell culpable in this situation.

Why? The bottom line comes down to a few points...

Whether or not iStop was behind in its bill should have no impact on the local loop aspects. Sure, terminate iStop's leased lines and such, but terminating the sync of all the iStop customers would be akin to Bell ripping out the copper lines to your house should you be with another local telephone provider and they fail to pay. All Bell had to do was terminate the DSL clients connection to iStop, they didn't have to start pulling line cards and/or terminating their local loop access.

Secondly, if Bell was at all a decent corporate citizen, they would have left the local loops in place so that customers could easily change to other providers. There is no real 'cost' to having the loops left in place, since the cost is usually realized during installation. It actually costs more to have a technician pull the line cards than it would to leave them in place for a couple weeks.

Lastly, the act by Bell seemed to be deliberate, if not malicious in nature. Why do I make this statement? I base it on my experience as an iStop customer, and information from Bell. When the link to iStop went down, like many others, I went ahead and secured alternate access. In my case, I signed up for a 'no contract' Sympatico account on Tuesday evening. As soon as I signed up, I had my userID and was able to get connectivity back. At that point my service was with Sympatico, but I was *still* disconnected by Bell the following day! Bell had put in to have all iStop customers disconnected as soon as possible, even though there is a massive backlog of work to be done because of the technician strike. Logic would dictate that Bell should worry more about PAYING customers to get them the service they need, and not about disconnecting customers that provide them no revenue. When you are backlogged, you should put disconnections on the back burner until you catch up. Additionally, since I was technically a Sympatico customer when they killed my loop, this means that the technicians were not even looking to see whether these accounts had secured alternative arrangements. It was a strict 'stick it to the iStop customers' move by Bell.

I had to push upper management VERY hard to get this rectified, given that there are so many people affected and that we are heading into a long weekend. So the anger people have at Bell over this is quite justified.

Furthermore, iStop has the law on their side in this matter. CRTC regulations state that if a person/company brings a dispute against a 'Bell' telco, the claims made by the person/company against 'Bell' are accepted as fact and it is up to 'Bell' to disprove the claim. Yes, you read that right, given their monopoly status, 'Bell' firms across Canada are considered guilty until they prove themselves innocent. The only exception is in the case of frivolous claims, as determined by the CRTC at the time of an dispute application. If the CRTC accepts an dispue application, then at that moment 'Bell' has been found guilty, and they must prove themselves to be innocent during the dispute process.

iStop has brought many actions against Bell over unfair billing practises, and so it is up to Bell to disprove the allegations. (If anyone disbelieves me, I can get a CTRC act reference, but it may take a day or so since I'm swamped with work because of my internet outage)

I actually have a lot of respect for Ralph since he is not afraid to go up against a big company like Bell that can spend millions on lawyers and such. It's probably likely that Ralph was close to winning a key victory and so they wanted to shut him down. Even if Bell is found to be at fault for their actions, the damage is done and iStop's business has been decimated.

They call this 'corporate warfare', and Bell is quite good at it.

Regards,

Savant
--
"Never attack the individual. We can be in total disagreement with someone
without denigrating them as a consequence."

-- Pierre Elliott Trudeau [1919-2000]]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13784144 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:11:55 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783951 anon :
I've been considering what to do now that ISTOP is D-E-A-D and so far I've found the following candidates (not in any particular order):

TekSavvy Solutions
�teksavvy.com/web/prices_DSL.htm
PROS: Good prices
CONS: 20G cap


-- We just transferred to them from Istop and was told caps for both residential and business accounts have been upped to 100 GB/month. Phone service seemed knowledgeable and professional... and they called backed later to pass on some information.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783951 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:49:59 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783885 stark2 :
said by Dave Lewis See Profile:

1) your dsl connection with istop goes like this.. You pay istop.. they pay bell. If they don't pay bell it's no different than if you don't pay your phone bill. It gets cut of.
No, business contracts are not like residential contracts. They have clauses for arbitration and so on and protect both parties against arbitrary actions of the other. Residential users have considerably less leverage and also less to lose. They are often at the mercy of their vendor, but businesses can't put their whole business at the mercy of their vendors.

said by Dave Lewis See Profile:

2) IF your a company and are having billing issues with another company..It is customary to pay what you think should be paid, and dispute the rest. Not not pay all together.. and complain.
Ralph claims he paid Bell what he believed he owed. Of course he believed the entire ISP business was governed by a completely different set of rules than what Bell believed. So he believed he owed millions less than what Bell believed he owed.

said by Dave Lewis See Profile:

3) If you were in bells shoes and you had a customer that owed you in excess of 1.5million dollars and was literally being rude to your VP's over it and this continued for 3 years what would you do ?
Well their contract says they invoke arbitration and the arbitrator rules on who's right and then IStop presumably has some number of days to pay. Apparently last time what happened is that Ralph managed to needle his account manager enough that he took things personally and acted rashly in violation of their contract. When their lawyers found out what happened they yelled to get Istop back up. If that story is true then that account manager opened Bell up to a shitload of liability.

Presumably at this point Bell has their bases covered, checked with their lawyers, and scoured their contracts to see what they could and couldn't do safely.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783885 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:41:30 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783519 rrgeekdev : Well when I called Cybersurf, I was told I had to sign up with 3Web and need software to do it. I warn all of you Istop users who have a brain... Turn if off when dealing with Cybersurf. At least IGS techs know what they are talking about. 3Web has caps too.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783519 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:49:23 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783516 Dave Lewis : The people here that are flaming bell for this have really got me steamed... Where you are coming from I'll never know..

You need to understand a few things..

1) your dsl connection with istop goes like this.. You pay istop.. they pay bell. If they don't pay bell it's no different than if you don't pay your phone bill. It gets cut of.

2) IF your a company and are having billing issues with another company..It is customary to pay what you think should be paid, and dispute the rest. Not not pay all together.. and complain.

3) If you were in bells shoes and you had a customer that owed you in excess of 1.5million dollars and was literally being rude to your VP's over it and this continued for 3 years what would you do ?

It is unfortunate that end users get caught in the middle of disputes with other parties, but it does happen, there's nothing you can do about it. If you look at the whole picture, in reality bell could have cut him off years ago, but they didn't they tried to work with him. Ralph is someone who you can't work with. There is a reason why his staff rotated so much. Most all the ones that I talked to when I was a customer, admitted they didn't like the way he ran the company and delt with customers.. but it was a job.. as soon as they got something better or got fed up the left.. never a good sign.

What it comes down to is, this is ralphs fault, and if you lose sync, it is also ralphs fault because he did not pay your dsl sync bill with bell. This can happen anywhere anytime with any multi tier situation. if you don't like the possibility of it, then go to sympatico directly, then your dealing with the company that owns the equipment directly, or rogers. But don't blame bell, they did try for a long time to work with him, otherwise sync would have been gone long ago.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783516 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:48:49 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783025 anon : I have been lucky so far with sync but finlly I have just lost connectivity.

I have heard that bell has been "staying late" to disconnect people.

I will NEVER deal with BELL in any way ever.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13783025 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:49:49 EDT Re: ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782945 HeadSpinning : Shameless Plug:

MNSi Internet »www.mnsi.net

$34.95/month for the first 6 months, then $39.95/month after (includes modem).

-24 hour tech support (not an after hours pager or voice mail)
-Connections via MCI & GT/360
-1492 MTU support on PPPoE
-No donwload caps
-No contract - only 30 day notice required to disconnect]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782945 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:39:26 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782889 diskace : Heard a lot of good comments from teksavvy users, seem to be a good place. They have good price and good service because they cap. You can't do miracle :)

However if you are looking for unlimited ADSL, i would consider Electronic Box also (www.electronicbox.net).

Regards, jean-philippe.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782889 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:32:25 EDT ISTOP Alternatives http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782685 zencow : I've been considering what to do now that ISTOP is D-E-A-D and so far I've found the following candidates (not in any particular order):

IGS.net (subsidiary of Cybersurf and heir apparent to IStop)
»igs.net/
PROS: OK pricing, no caps
CONS: Lousy website so it's hard to exactly figure out what they offer

3web (another subsidiary of Cybersurf)
»https://highspeed.3web.com/english/HighS···ast.html
PROS: Good pricing, no caps
CONS: It appears that you need a credit card to subscribe and pay the bills :p, also it appears that some kind of "software kit" may be needed

Start Communications
»start.ca/services/highspeed.php
PROS: OK pricing, no caps
CONS: Again, it appears you need a credit card to pay them :huh:

TekSavvy Solutions
»teksavvy.com/web/prices_DSL.htm
PROS: Good prices
CONS: 20G cap :uhh:

Has anyone comments about these ISPs or perhaps other suggestions? My biggest concern (after prices and caps) is the speed. I don't want to get stuck with ISP that advertises 3M download but only provides 1M in practice.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782685 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:05:45 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782472 Deake : Thank You!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782472 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:34:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782461 anon : The website is still up, mail.istop.com is working too.

This is what I had in my email.

Some customers have reported difficulties accessing the IStop.com web
site to obtain information on the arrangement with Cybersurf.
Cybersuf has setup a hotline to assist IStop.com customers with the
transition: 1-866-833-4164

Ralph Doncaster, IStop.com president]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782461 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:33:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782455 routermonkey : 1-866-833-4164 as seen on »www.istop.com/news.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782455 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:32:10 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782438 Steve :
said by Deake See Profile:

OK.. anyone care to share the special phone number for former istop customers with the rest of us? My sync has been out since last night and today when I was going to go to the "special" web site.. ISTOP.COM is gone.
said by istop.com, from just now:

June 29 2005 - Cybersurf hotline for IStop.com customers
IStop.com customers needing assistance switching to Cybersurf can call 1-866-833-4164. IStop.com customers that transfer their account to Cybersurf will recieve one free month of service. IStop.com will also refund all customers that have pre-paid for service that has not been used. IStop.com customers that have paid a deposit for modem rental can keep the ADSL modem and will no longer be charged a rental fee.

--
Stephen J. Friedl • Unix Wizard • Microsoft Security MVP • Tustin, California USA • my web site]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782438 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:30:39 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782399 Deake : OK.. anyone care to share the special phone number for former istop customers with the rest of us? My sync has been out since last night and today when I was going to go to the "special" web site.. ISTOP.COM is gone.

I love how all this was communicated in an email to their users. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782399 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:26:13 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782220 igsjake : From my understanding of discussions ongoing, all websites and the like are either still reachable or will be moved over to Cybersurf.

There's no reason to move elsewhere. :P

...especially somewhere with $150 setup fees, if the one reply is correct.

Like, wow. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782220 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:03:43 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782082 anon : 150$ activation fees !!! :mad:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13782082 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 13:48:41 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781950 jrhay : From what I've heard iStop are having their problems. If anyone is exploring alternatives for DSL Cronomagic »www.cronomagic.com may be of interest. While I don't know what has happened to hosting clients anyone interested in these services can contact me privately at jrhay@haya.qc.ca and I can help you out as my company does host mail and websites.

Take care,
Jim.

Hay-Net Networks
»www.hay-net.net]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781950 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 13:34:12 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781159 anon : I'm in Quebec and I finally lost sync a few minutes ago (11:30 AM).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781159 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:50:00 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781104 anon : Yep, wait and see.

I'm still logged in under my istop login, wont switch unless something goes wrong, but good to know things might switch over smoothly.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13781104 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:42:24 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780834 anon : I just got through to the Cybersurf number that Istop gave us to call. The person informed me that all accounts will be automatically switched to Cybersurf (unless you are switching to another ISP). There is nothing to do if you intend on staying on with them.

If you have a sync and are using the igs.net temp fix, just stay put and hope that Bell doesn't pull your card before they make the switchover.

He also informed me that as far as he was told, all of the terms and conditions of your original istop deal should stay the same under Cybersurf.

We shall see.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780834 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:02:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780595 anon : Well I'm still up and running.

Won't disconnect as long as I can prevent it.

Server and modem are on a UPS so if the weather acts up I should be safe.

Any idea on pricing yet, and if we'll retain the static IP one time fee, I hate wasting my money. I mean iStop was costing me $32 a month for what I was getting you can't beat that.

A.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780595 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:20:12 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780557 anon : well it's thursday morning and i still have nothing.
cycled router & modem & pc (couple of times even)...and still nothing.
says connected but i can not hit anything at all.
up until i switched my login info, i could at least still access my server via remote desktop from outside, but today nothing at all.
...this is very frustrating. guess i should've made the switch after the last big outage.
*grumble*...time for another coffee.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780557 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:15:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780410 anon : A little update on Cybersurf. I just called the special number set up for istop. After waiting around 30 minutes for someone to pick up the phone, I just got a simple answer. If your modem doesn't have the ADSL sync, minimum wait is 5 days before you get any service. As of now, Cybersurf has no idea on how to switch istop users over or how they are going to proceed. They don't want istop users to call the regular line and register for new accounts because that may result in double billing and the such. So all in all, you just have to wait if you decide to stay with Cybersurf. If not, you can go with someone else, and perhaps have to wait the 5 business days anyways to get the link set up. So... doesn't look too likely that I will have internet for the weekend.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780410 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:52:04 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780214 Matt_IGS : LOL Nice angolmois..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13780214 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:17:44 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13779701 zencow : Well, since you're a Sympatico user, I guess the joke is really on you, and the final laugh will be ours.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13779701 Thu, 30 Jun 2005 06:50:55 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13775390 anon : DING DONG THE B!TCH IS DEAD

I am REVELING in this. I feel sympathetic to the remaining Istop users, but only slightly. I jumped off that ship a year ago. I think Ralph Doncaster is an arrogant fool and finally seeing his "empire" crumble makes my day. Call in the repo man for that M5, reserve your seats for the liquidation auction, Istop is finally dead and gone.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13775390 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:57:10 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774678 anon : very nice.

the girl i just finished talking with took all my info (incl my prev. assigned IP) and is pushing it thru as well. she was very helpful and extremely professional.

it's 15:32h now and she said i should be good to go by 16:00h. also, tech support is available until 23:00h should i need to call them and straighten out any remaining issues.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774678 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 15:33:16 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774595 anon : The Lady I spoke to in sales asked her manager because I was from Istop customers and he approved]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774595 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 15:22:45 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774540 anon : who (or what dept) did you speak with.

i'm talking to someone at IGS right now who is really pushing to use the available online form for new accounts since "they don't really do it over the phone".]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774540 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 15:15:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774332 anon : just called IGS

You can call right away and do the transfer over the phone.
you will have a static IP if you had one.

for now they say the price is theirs (34,95 + 5$ static) *mention Jake to get the 5$ static IP*.

as the deal goes on, IGS and Istop will negociate about the pricing if it stays the same or not

login should be available in about 15-20 minutes

they are making calls to bell to make sure istop customer switching over are not being disconnected.

phil]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774332 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:51:25 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774229 zepperdude : I switched to the IGS login (remotely did it of course).
And lost connectivity. Either my IP changes or I lost sync.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774229 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:38:48 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774227 anon : my connection hasn't dropped yet through this whole ordeal...
just hoping it stays up until the decision has been made on how to proceed]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774227 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:38:25 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774215 anon : I still have sync. I switched to Teksavvy though but they said the line would be switched next week.. Not sure if they did the swap or if I am just lucky..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774215 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:36:25 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774210 anon : I do :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774210 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:35:57 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774173 anon : Has anyone called IGS and asked to be transferred right away yet? Any user in Quebec still having a synch?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774173 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:29:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774163 anon : I'm still up, but wont log out for sure.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774163 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:28:36 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774004 Matt_IGS : Who else of you istop customers have lost sync here? I have spoken to several people with this problem today along with several who were fine?

- Matt]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13774004 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:06:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773996 anon : Ya, let me re-sign up after this debacle. NOT. I've had my fill of Bell's passive resistance to it's DSL resellers, it's terrible customer service to both residents and DSL ISPs, and having THIS situation sprung on hapless Istop users. "Hello Rogers..."

At least the static IP has been retained (for now).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773996 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:05:52 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773967 anon : Some of us already lost the synch this morning. I wonder how much time will it take to get it back... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773967 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:02:45 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773903 anon : that would be nice.

now i know that cybersurf is the parent of igs... and on the istop news page it mentions to istop users to change their pppoe login to use the igs.net domain.

for those of us in the ottawa area, who should we be contacting? cybersurf in calgary, or igs in ottawa? or is it best to just put up with the loss of connection for one more day and wait for the aformentioned "page" to become available?

as an aside...i find it rather humourous (in a very frustrating sort of way) that all of the updates and instructions are posted online, yet if i was sitting in front of my machine at home, i would not be able to read any of them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773903 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 13:54:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773619 anon : Wonder if we can do it right now over the phone with cybersurf to make sure we're active before the long weekend]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773619 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 13:23:18 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773580 anon : from »www.istop.com/news.html

June 29 2005 - Cybersurf account transfer
In order for ADSL customers to maintain line sync, the account must be transferred to Cybersurf. A web page to process an account transfer will be available on June 30. IStop.com customers with a static IP will not loose their IP assignment by transferring the account.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773580 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 13:17:59 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773198 Storm666 : I have not been able to make Cybersurf work over my Istop connection in Montreal... I'm using Teksavvy login account for now and decide which provider I'll choose afterward...

See you tomorrow Menoche! :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13773198 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 12:19:26 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772853 anon : Just called cybersurf

the guy wasn't betting on it, but last he heard, things should remain exactly the same for at least the first few weeks of the transition...

the routes are still looping tho...

wonder how much time it'll take to get fixed]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772853 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:36:54 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772808 anon : now that would be nice, esp considering many of us already paid the 'one-time' fee for ours.

any news (or 'inside info') on what the pricing structure will be otherwise? or better yet, when all of this is expected to be in-place?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772808 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:30:56 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772751 igsjake : Pssst...I've heard that IP's will follow.

But don't hold me to that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772751 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:21:37 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772391 Dave Lewis : more than likely you'll end up with cybersurf ip's, unless ralph transfers his ip's to them, hard to say.. I'd definetly want to check into that before too long, if it was me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772391 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:27:12 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772319 anon : What about the fixed ips? will they remain the same and be rerouted also?

what will happen to the pricing structure?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772319 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:15:29 EDT Re: iStop sells its ADSL service http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772305 anon : June 29 2005 - Cybersurf Agreement

IStop.com has made a preliminary agreement selling the majority of its assets to Cybersurf. Cybersurf will take over the ADSL internet access and web hosting business of IStop.com. Customers will not have to change their email address and Cybersurf will continue to operate the IStop.com domain name and brand.

Checkout »www.cybersurf.ca ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13772305 Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:13:13 EDT Re: Unreachable http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13769890 tenchsan : What do you want for the price?

I don't want to pay for phone tech support that I won't use. I'm not an idiot who will call because I don't know how to type a username and passwd.

I don't want to spend 100$/month to Bell to have a static IP connexion with a *beep*ing crippled modem/router that has trouble with VPN and port forwarding. The changes are so easy to set a static IP on a BAS Server that it doesn't justify the money. Oh, I forgot to mention. It's not static IP, it's called a sticky IP. It's a lease that doesn't end.

If you think Bell is doing better, then I'm going to prove you wrong: when Bell Business (Bullshit) Internet began to offer their static IP service 8 months ago, you haven't heard when all static IP customers couldn't connect. It took them a whopping 2 weeks to resolve the issue...

Oh, and I forgot: Bell outsourced the Bell Business Internet Tech support to Teleperformance (they're also doing tech support for Sympathetic) between 1800 and 0800 on weekdays, plus weekends and holidays.

And concerning the outage, it wouldn't surprise me that Bell is bugging istop again. Istop explain thoroughly their outages, and they are of the very few ISP's who will admit they made a screw up that resulted in an outage. Read their status log, it's interesting. And considering that Istop is constantly a pain in Bell's ass at the CRTC, and they disconnected istop and its customers without any notice whatsoever, it wouldn't surprise me that Bell just want to get Istop out of the picture.

That was my 2 cents.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13769890 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 23:16:42 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13768077 anon : It would make sense for them to sell of their DSL customer base. But they did something like this before at the last blackout...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13768077 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 19:24:46 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13767970 TemporalFlux : Looks like IGS is going to take on the iStop customers. That would indicate that iStop is going to fold..... Cybersurf owns IGS & 3web]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13767970 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 19:12:23 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13767795 anon : "June 28 PPPoE login change
Bell has cut off the DSL service used by IStop.com. They chose to do so even though they received a $300,000 deposit for the service in March 2005. In addition, they have been paid well in excess of their General Tariff Item 5410 rates. Considering the situation and the lack of support by the CRTC, IStop.com has made arrangements with Cybersurf to continue service for our customers. PPPoE logins should be changed to
istop:userid@igs.net
Your password does not change. Staff at IStop.com and Cybersurf expect to have the new login working by 1900 today. We will issue another update on June 29 to further assist our customers with this transition and provide more details on the actions of Bell. "

Ok I am confused...who is cybersurf? Why is there a @igs.net login? Cybersurf.ca website transfers to 3web...

But boy Istop is really gone and the best thing to do is to transfer their customers to another ISP sounds like this is what they have done.

Any thoughts on the @igs.net ? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13767795 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 18:46:49 EDT Unreachable http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765892 anon : What do you want for the price?

Want top notch service? You'll have to pay for it.

Why do you thing sears is almost twice as expensive as wall mart or future shop?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765892 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 14:55:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765825 anon : 15 hours after they go off the air there's finally a recording saying they're experiencing service difficulties (and no additional information)... what a revelation... and last night when I called tech support they were closed for the night while their customers were without service... checked their emrgency "web site" smtp.istop.com too and it still showed the message from their December 2004 outage.

Ralphie sure missed his calling... he should have been teaching courses in customer relations (for all you serious types THIS IS A JOKE).

With an attitude like that, Ralphie should actually be working for the government.

As this is being written and sent on a backup dial link we're in the midst of switching provider. Thank God The Pain Is Finally Over!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765825 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 14:46:28 EDT - http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765766 ThunderGulch :
Umm as an Istop customer that says it all. They won't ever have connectivity again in the ottawa POP (their offices BTW)?


No. Downtown is for coloc and big pipes. Office is on Queensview in the west end.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765766 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 14:37:30 EDT I see it coming up again a bit at a time. http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765722 ThunderGulch : I could connect this morning, not my mail just started working. Still can't see my site though.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765722 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 14:32:17 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765407 anon : from »www.istop.com/status.html

"The few colocation customers in the Ottawa POP should retrieve their servers as we do not expect to re-establish connectivity"

Umm as an Istop customer that says it all. They won't ever have connectivity again in the ottawa POP (their offices BTW)? Come pick up your equipment.

There is still no DSL access... They really are done guys. I will be and should have switched after the last time, but thought I would give them another chance.

And usually if you owe one creditor hundreds of thousands you owe three, four, five...

TIME TO MOVE ON...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765407 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:50:31 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765342 Storm666 : Well, they are accepting sign up again now: »https://istop.com/news.html

This was mainly due because of the Entourage strike I do believe... And they are back up now, which probably mean that Bell didn't cut them off... I do believe they are Network issues, but then again, it took them what, 16 hours to get it back on?... :huh:

Anyway, I'll still probably change...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765342 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:43:40 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765278 pg94au : "IStop.com has stopped accepting new ADSL signups"

This hardly needs to be said.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765278 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:35:40 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765276 ThunderGulch : Now if the email wasn't lost, I might still be in business.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765276 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:35:20 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765229 Dave Lewis : The interesting thing is that there used to be 2 colo's in ottawa... the canceled the one after the last disconnect and this one that they're saying is not being restored is actually at the head office site.

You'd think that eventually even Ralph would have enough sense to throw in the towel. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765229 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:29:19 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765199 MacGyver : »https://istop.com/access.html

This certainly doesn't bode well for existing customers.
--
There is no limit to what one can do, so long as they don't mind who takes the credit.
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765199 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:26:27 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765198 anon : Additionally, the Colocation page indicates that "istop is no longer accepting colocation customers", and the DSL page indicates that "istop has stopped accepting new ADSL signups".

Is this the end? Can't wait for the update later today...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765198 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:26:19 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765132 anon : Update on istop can be found at »https://istop.com/status.html. Strangely they're not serving http. The message mentions that Ottawa colos are being discontinued. Hmm.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13765132 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:17:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764740 anon : Try start.ca]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764740 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:28:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764643 anon : Ok, nevermind. I eventually noticed the tiny "site map" link at the bottom of the front page, and felt my way through until I found »www.igs.net/services/hs_res.shtml. You might wish to improve the site design.

It indicates static IP for $10. So, $5 if we mention your name? iStop gave us the option of paying some one-time fee which then eliminated any ongoing monthly surcharge. Can you provide that option?

-ben]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764643 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:11:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764631 igsjake : Static IP is usually $10/month...

If ye mention me we'll knock it down to $5, though...

-j]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764631 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:08:29 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764627 pg94au : >We don't block any ports.

Excellent. I'm away from home right now (thus I have internet access now), but I'm leaning in your direction. :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764627 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:08:24 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764612 anon : Jake, what are the rates? I can't find ANY description of services on www.igs.net, other than the signup links. Once I navigate through to the form, it implies that residential 3 Mbps service is 34.95. However, it does not describe the cost for static IP address.

-ben]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764612 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:06:35 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764600 preacher860 :
said by pg94au See Profile:

>IGS has unlimited DSL and static IP's.

Does IGS block any ports?

No ports locked, no caps either. I've been with them since the last istop outage and up to now, they've been rock solid, no downtime at all!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764600 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:05:13 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764596 igsjake : We don't block any ports.

Customers can run any service(s) they want...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764596 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:04:55 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764573 pg94au : >IGS has unlimited DSL and static IP's.

Does IGS block any ports?

I'm in the market for an ISP. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764573 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:00:48 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764433 igsjake : IGS has unlimited DSL and static IP's.

Mention me (Jake) and they'll give you $5/month off on the static IP...

1800-268-3715

You can try us free for a few hours as a test, if you like. Simply see our "free trial" thread in canbroadband.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764433 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 11:41:12 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764228 anon : Ok, istop down again... I left them a chance the first time but that becoming too much...

You guys know any other ISP with unlimited DSL with static IP address?

Thanks,]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13764228 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 11:16:28 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763885 Dave Lewis : Define something real great? like paying their bills ?. In order to become a really great isp, you need several things.

1) connections to your customers
2) a peering point or more (ralph still has)
3) a good attitude and customer service

well. he's got 1 of the three... ya.. this should be real great :)

I'm waiting to see what story comes out of this disruption of service. Should be good for a laugh]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763885 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 10:20:50 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763714 gnoorod : Maybe it's a ironic person :)

Anyway, their web site seems to be down...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763714 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:49:54 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763652 HiVolt :
said by Doci See Profile:

Wasn't it NBN?
O yeah, my bad. kevmetric See Profile is the self-proclaimed Magma spokesman. ;)
--
}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763652 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:37:03 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763614 Doci : Wasn't it NBN?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763614 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:29:39 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763599 HiVolt :
said by HiVolt See Profile:

Bell unreliable, or Ralphie not paying the bills again. I'd bet my left nut on the latter. ;)
--
Seems I get to keep my left nut after all. muahahah. :D
--
}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763599 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:27:09 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763595 HiVolt :
said by vif user:

ISTOP is alive and kicking. Don't listen to the rumours. My sources tell me they are in the process of something real great. I don't know what it is but judging from Mr. Ralph's past history and reputation, it can only be the very best for their clients. The small guy once again teaches the behemoths a thing or two about customer service.
Seems you've jumped off Magma's bandwagon to iStop, eh? Your sources must get their info from septic tanks.
--
}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763595 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:26:15 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763545 dementor :
said by vif user:

ISTOP is alive and kicking. Don't listen to the rumours. My sources tell me they are in the process of something real great. I don't know what it is but judging from Mr. Ralph's past history and reputation, it can only be the very best for their clients. The small guy once again teaches the behemoths a thing or two about customer service.
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I've told myself I would stay out of istop related discussions... but godamn!!!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763545 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:19:17 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763525 anon : ISTOP is alive and kicking. Don't listen to the rumours. My sources tell me they are in the process of something real great. I don't know what it is but judging from Mr. Ralph's past history and reputation, it can only be the very best for their clients. The small guy once again teaches the behemoths a thing or two about customer service.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763525 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:14:55 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763278 gnoorod : I already asked electronicbox to swith the provider. I hope I wll be able to relog in the next hours]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763278 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 08:20:55 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763261 Dave Lewis : yup.. looks like ralphy's disconnected again....

as for time... if you still have sync and are on PPPOE then it should be rather painless, because it's just a login. however there is always a chance that with ralph being shut down that your pppoe connection that is paid to bell canada through ralph could be cut too, that would take more time to re-install.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763261 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 08:16:33 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763253 gnoorod : Hi All,

anybody have news about this downtime? How much time take the transfert to another ISP?

Thx]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13763253 Tue, 28 Jun 2005 08:11:20 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13761269 anon : I have it under good resources (i.e Bell Canada) that this is another full istop disconnect executed from an executive directive (VP), due to non payment. Apparently ralphs "arrangement" has run out. All of his dedicated circuits have been disconnected so those of you who still have a connection, feel lucky.. it's not going to last.

Amazing what happens when you don't pay your bills and piss off your piping provider.

I saw this coming months ago, that's why I jumped ship long before the first disconnect. and the second one was only a matter of time.

Good riddance Ralph.. go get a real job and do something your good at, perhaps politics..
After all that's a place where people can lie and get away with it..

Or wait.. that would involve him actually working for a living.. never mind. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13761269 Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:57:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760634 anon : From this thread:

»groups.google.ca/group/can.inter···87e6f44c

it appears that their Ottawa-Toronto link is down.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760634 Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:36:08 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN)... The Weekly Outage http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760632 anon : Unable to contact any of the ISTOP web or mail servers for last several hours AGAIN... they managed 11 (eleven) days without an outage this time - unless I missed some additional outages when I was away from the computer... now if we could work this up to 2 weeks without another outage we'd be making progress.

I think Ralphie's middle name must be Doncaster and his last name must be Gates from the frequency of his system/network crashes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760632 Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:35:43 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760197 mlerner : Ironically I used to work in the same building as iStop and i've never seen Ralph there, EVER and I walked by the iStop office many times.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760197 Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:35:41 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760008 anon : Did they forget to pay their Bell bills again? :( ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13760008 Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:12:22 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13686016 TLS2000 :
said by HiVolt See Profile:

said by Sean See Profile:

You tend to put your left nut on the line a lot, HiVolt. :p
Haven't lost it yet. :D
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}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´
Watch what you say buddy. I had a buddy that bet his left nut that he could get the side of his house painted by then end of daylight one day. He fell off the ladder. The house wasn't painted, and he lost his left nut. :p
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Tom Murdoch »www.tomscomputers.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13686016 Sat, 18 Jun 2005 01:12:13 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679285 MacGyver : You know, I might be wrong, but it sounds like the only link that Istop has between their Toronto and Ottawa POP is through that infamous Bell Canada link ( »www.istop.com/network.html ) that has failed at least one other time in the past. Wouldn't it be prudent for a ISP/webhost to have at least one other backup link to a completely different network in case that one fails? Or is this just a convenient arrangement so that he can point the finger at "Big Bad Bell, it's not our fault" whenever something goes awry?
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There is no limit to what one can do, so long as they don't mind who takes the credit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679285 Fri, 17 Jun 2005 07:20:02 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679256 DKS : From can.internet.highspeed

quote:
June 16 network outage

At 1530 Bell Canada experienced a failure in their network in Toronto. This affected the link between Toronto and our Ottawa POP, and about half our ADSL customers in the
Ottawa area. Bell fixed the issue at around 2045.

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Need-based health care not greed-based health care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679256 Fri, 17 Jun 2005 07:10:52 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679242 MacGyver : It's not necessarily Istop customers that are upset, but also those who are trying to contact those customers. I know of one website that used to be hosted on Istop, but during the last "outage" nobody could reach the site, or email the webmaster to let them know there was a problem!

They are no longer hosted by Istop.
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There is no limit to what one can do, so long as they don't mind who takes the credit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13679242 Fri, 17 Jun 2005 07:06:05 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13678147 andyb : seems to be the same people complain about thier service but never switch providers. seems strange to me.if ya won't switch dont bitch]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13678147 Fri, 17 Jun 2005 00:42:14 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677629 HiVolt :
said by Sean See Profile:

You tend to put your left nut on the line a lot, HiVolt. :p
Haven't lost it yet. :D
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}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677629 Thu, 16 Jun 2005 23:25:20 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677389 Leathal : Raphie should just sell IStop to someone else, or let someone else hold the ranes while Raphie is pushed out of their reach. :)

Leathal ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677389 Thu, 16 Jun 2005 22:53:50 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677137 Sean : You tend to put your left nut on the line a lot, HiVolt. :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13677137 Thu, 16 Jun 2005 22:21:56 EDT Re: ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13676255 HiVolt : Bell unreliable, or Ralphie not paying the bills again. I'd bet my left nut on the latter. ;)
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}·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´ ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13676255 Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:29:57 EDT ISTOP Unreachable (AGAIN) http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13676121 anon : Couldn't reach reach ISTOPs mail or web servers (AGAIN). Was told by the tech it was Bell's problem... boy, Bell is unreliable!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13676121 Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:11:53 EDT