Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots in Wireless Service Providers http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r13350117 en Sat, 28 Nov 2009 23:14:49 EDT Sat, 28 Nov 2009 23:14:49 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13371024 jdmarti1 : I love Radio Mobile. I have used it for all of our predictions so far. I just hope that it works out close to the predicted model. The program is very intuitive, at least I thought. There is also a very basic demo site that will get you started with it. The best thing is the price!!!!
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»magicwisp.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13371024 Mon, 09 May 2005 23:28:33 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13353810 korym : Good point, Michael. :) I'm truly inspired by all your efforts with Tim's new PoP. Very, very impressive.

I was working on a commercial-based application with someone that would allow for pre-subscription and eliminating about 80-90% of pre-qual truckrolls via a simple web-based search interface using street addresses with semi-realtime GPS and demographic data. Unfortunately, I haven't talked with the guy in a couple of months and am not sure where the project stands.

Either way, here's a link that also might prove helpful for something like this:

»www.wirelessmapping.com/

Granted, Radio Mobile may offer an interface like this. Michael would probably know best of course.

HtH!

Thx again!

Regards,
Kory
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WISP Directory : WISP News : Start a WISP : WISP Classifieds]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13353810 Sat, 07 May 2005 16:34:40 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13353597 DaDogs : Naw Dawg, you are Da'Man. I have an ulterior motive anyway. I'd really like to see what this last image looks like in a few months if you print it and stick a white pin in it every where the prediction looks correct, and a black pin in it every where that it looks wrong.

For example, suppose you stick a client radio with a receive sensitivity of -86 dBm at a location in the -90 to -86 dBm RSSI band (yellow area). If you install that customer with a 16 dBi panel on a coax which has ~3 dB loss, you get this:

The client radio has receive sens of -86 that is at most 4 dB less receive sensivity than the predicted signal. That subtracts from the antenna you use. If you use a 16 dBi antenna and you subtract that 4 dB deficit in receive sens it is like using a 12 dBi antenna. Now subtract out the 3 dB for feed line losses and you are down to 9 dB fade margin. If you add the fade margin back into the RSSI for the CPE you get -77 dBm (-86+9). This tells us the prediction is good if the *measured* RSSI is between -77 dBm and -73 dBm and the client is in a YELLOW area. If the prediction is bad the measured RSSI would be above -73 or below -77 for that client system.

Such a chart *might* be useful for determining which antenna type you are going to install in each band.

It would be a good way of marking all your customers locations as well.
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»www.freeantennas.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13353597 Sat, 07 May 2005 15:59:19 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13352879 superdog :
said by DaDogs See Profile:

I've left it actual size. I'll be emailing a PDF with all this infor in it.

-m-
Michael, once again, Thank You very much, I have always been Your #1 fan. You are Da'Man!
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»www.wavecrazy.net Join WISPA today! »www.wispa.org/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13352879 Sat, 07 May 2005 13:43:07 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13352222 DaDogs : One last plot SD;

This one is going to be your best predictor. I tweaked it a bit to more accurately model the system parameters you gave me and color coded the predicted RSSI.

Yellow = -90 to -87 dBm
Green = -87 to -83 dBm
Orange = -83 to -80 dBm
Red = -80 to -76 dBm

I've left it actual size. I'll be emailing a PDF with all this infor in it.

-m-
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»www.freeantennas.com
Click for full size
Best Predictor
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13352222 Sat, 07 May 2005 11:34:50 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13351225 superdog : I just want to thank Michael for taking the time to do this!. I think radio mobile is the best, I just don't have the patience for it.:D. I hope that we all can learn from this one?.:)
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»www.wavecrazy.net Join WISPA today! »www.wispa.org/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13351225 Sat, 07 May 2005 06:20:46 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13351150 Denver Max : Man i wish i could even get a map of the areas i want ot cover... the latest one ive seen is 10 years old and has nothing usefull on it..... its all shoot and hope for me.. 180f tower it is then
:0S]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13351150 Sat, 07 May 2005 05:32:35 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350327 DaDogs : Radio Mobile Deluxe, shuttle radar topography mission data, and topo maps from terraserver-usa.com.

-m-
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»www.freeantennas.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350327 Sat, 07 May 2005 00:43:56 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350203 VariableARK : whatd u use to plot that?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350203 Sat, 07 May 2005 00:25:37 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350117 DaDogs : Nice map. Good resolution.
Click for full size
Here is the actuall size of the plots
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350117 Sat, 07 May 2005 00:13:15 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350044 John Galt : I was trying to figure out why the signal to the north was so diminished. Now I see why...

Those hills sure put the "kibosh" on the signal.

:huh:

Oh well!

;)
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A is A
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350044 Sat, 07 May 2005 00:01:55 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350013 DaDogs :
said by John Galt See Profile:

A very substantial change...going to 900 MHz.

Are these for the new PoP?
Yes they are for his new pop. There are some caveats I am adding. The 2.4 GHz stuff was modeled with an EIRP of only 250 mw, whereas the Canopy model was a high fidelity model and therefore modeled at 36 dB EIRP.

I have removed the 900 MHz plot for the time being. Probably not necessary in this context.

-m-
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»www.freeantennas.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13350013 Fri, 06 May 2005 23:57:11 EDT Re: SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13349980 John Galt : A very substantial change...going to 900 MHz.

Are these for the new PoP?
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A is A]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13349980 Fri, 06 May 2005 23:50:19 EDT SuperDog's PoP Plots http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13349955 DaDogs : First Plot
The Visual Line of Sight plot shows VLOS from the pop to points 20' above the ground. Most roof installs are at about 20'.

Second Plot
The no clutter plot shows coverage for a 2.4 GHz system operating with 17 dBm transmit power into an 8 dBi omni antenna. Feed line losses were modeled at only 1 dB. The receive sensitivity for the system was modeled at -86 dBm. This is a fairly close model of the Alvarion FHSS system when operating at 1 MBit. I am not modeling high gain antennas at either end of the link. The CPE is also modeled with an 8 dBi gain antenna.

Third Plot
The same system is modeled with losses for 33 percent urbanization. The plot presumes the presence of buildings across 33% of the terrain.

Fourth Plot
The same system is modeled with losses for 33 percent forestation. The plot presumes the presence of forest across 33% of the terrain.

Couple of points should be made here. First the 2.4 GHz system that was modeled presumed all units in the system were equipped with 8 dBi omni antennas, normally we would not do that with CPE at 2.4. This means that the 2.4 GHz systems were modeled with an EIRP of only 17dBm + 8 dBi -1 dB = 24 dB EIRP (250 mw). This would be a VERY low powered system.

The map is 12.4 miles wide by 12.4 miles tall. Your tower is modeled at 24' on top of an 83' building which sits on real terrain at 157 meters. That is what the SRTM data said the elevation was at your coordinates. That puts the base of your antenna 622 feet above sea level.

Superdawg, PM me with your E-Mail and I will send you the high res images and the pdf. I'd be interested in seeing you plot your actuals against the predicted so that we can get information regarding the accuracy of these plots.

-m-
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»www.freeantennas.com

Visual Line of Sight

2.4 Ghz, no clutter, no vegetation

2.4 GHz ISM with clutter

2.4 GHz ISM with vegetation.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,13349955 Fri, 06 May 2005 23:46:52 EDT