[Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax in VOIP Tech Chat

[Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax in VOIP Tech Chat http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r12318025 en Fri, 27 Nov 2009 21:49:23 EDT Fri, 27 Nov 2009 21:49:23 EDT Re: [O/T] Smile, be happy http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12380813 usa2k :

said by vonsen

:

... All right, I've decided that humor doesn't work in this forum. ...

OT: For humor, try »Team Helix

The worst puns are posted there among other interesting things.

Their prime service is to crunch numbers to help cure cancer!

The FAH (Folding at Home) link in my sig, points to my PC contributions. (TEAM HELIX/TEAM 4)
--
Jim -- USA2K
SEE: |DCWU |FAH |PICS |BVX REVIEW |
FWD, Vonage 01/03 to 12/04, & BVX 07/04 to now]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12380813 Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:17:57 EDT Re: [O/T] Another flame war http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379557 tj008 : Vonsen, I didnt take it as a flame. I love humor! Im all about humor! I have the Comedy Channel for goodness sakes! Used to have Comedy East and West when I had a B.U.D. (Big Ugly Dish, that is) :D:D Robin Williams is my best friend...well maybe not. :huh: LOL

Use those smileys on the left to help indicate ones emotion in this one dimensional world (forum) we find ourselves.

All's good, man! :)

Cheers!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379557 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 23:37:28 EDT [O/T] Another flame war http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379325 vonsen :

said by tj008

:

Just because I dont agree with the amount of time you've spent informing us on Lingo's greed, doesnt make me a Lingo employee. Dont go there!

All right, I've decided that humor doesn't work in this forum. My comments were satarical (see earlier in the thread). The comments were not intended to incite a flame war. So, <serious face> Kindly, ignore the offending post & lets move on </serious face>.

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Email these Lingo executives about the misrepresented 18% hike: psingh@primustel.com,nhazard@primustel.com,tkloster@primustel.com,jdepodesta@primustel.com,t book@primustel.com,smcintyre@primustel.com,anayar@primustel.com,tlawson@primustel.com,mguirg is@primustel.com,jmelick@primustel.com,jrosenblatt@primustel.com,ghicks@primustel.com,mmagil l@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379325 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 23:09:13 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379127 tj008 :

said by vonsen

:

So.. do you happen to work for lingo? Oh right, I get into trouble when I ask that. Never mind. Forget that I asked. Actually I needed a hobby, so when lingo misrepresented the reasons for their large hike, I made it my life mission to help them realize the error of their ways. :D Seems like a good way to get rid of that pesky spare time, keeping people up to date with lingo and maybe saving some grief for people who were considering lingo but weren't aware of lingo's shanigans. Does me good. Thanks for your concern, though!

Just because I dont agree with the amount of time you've spent informing us on Lingo's greed, doesnt make me a Lingo employee. Dont go there! Accusations are made for flame wars - not for good discussion.

Aside from this tax/fee issue, Lingo is a great voip provider. The service has been rock solid for me for over 5 months. Of course, if you care to look, I did have my issues with them but all went away when I got a public IP address.

If anyone wants a good voip provider and the feature set works for them, try Lingo. Dont throw the baby out with the bath water! Please! :o

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12379127 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 22:42:45 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12378986 tj008 : I agree with the principle in all this. And further, Im glad there is a forum to vent and to keep informed on various companies' shananigans.

But still the bottom line remains at the end of the day. If you stay, you're gonna pay.

Besides, looking at the many providers discussed in these hallowed halls, they are all starting to charge. Maybe it's a "keep up with the Jones'" thing. Who knows?!

So, where will you go next? AT&T? No. Vonage? No. Packet8? No. VoicePulse? No. BroadVoice? No.

Looks like the last hold outs (and for how long) are Broadvox Direct and SunRocket. Are there any others? Lets find 'em!

Cheers!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12378986 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 22:28:51 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12378438 hkvalet :

said by tj008

:

When we signed up for service we acknowledged and agreed to the Terms and Conditions of our using the Lingo service.

If you dont wish to do so, cancel your service and pay the disconnection fee and be done with Lingo.

All this complaining is not doing you or your heart any good.

So please, come to terms ;) with it or cancel the service.

If I choose to cancel the service, I am not going to pay the cancellation fee. I understand that there are Terms and Conditions that we acknowledged initially, but here is the thing, PRINCIPLE....

$1.5 and 3% will not kill us, but this is the principle. At this time, we all don't know if Lingo, or other service providers, are collecting the taxes and send it to the IRS and other related government departments. If they really do, we will have nothing to say and complain. If they just collect the taxes into their pockets, then there is no reason we need to pay any cancellation fee if we decide to leave.
--
RELAX, God is in Charge!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12378438 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 21:28:07 EDT Re: [Off Topic] http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377783 voiplover :

said by vonsen

:

I usually don't. I do appear to have misread your 'join date' and apologise for misquoting that date. As for the rest, please check your sense of humor. If it helps at all, please feel free to make fun of me! :)

--
OK. Your smiley face is bald and has no body! :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377783 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 20:20:27 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377547 vonsen :

said by tj008

:

No one is happy about paying more money for something they already enjoy using.

I think ycool said that he welcomed the new $1.50 per number fee

said by tj008

:

So please, come to terms ;) with it or cancel the service.

So.. do you happen to work for lingo? Oh right, I get into trouble when I ask that. Never mind. Forget that I asked. Actually I needed a hobby, so when lingo misrepresented the reasons for their large hike, I made it my life mission to help them realize the error of their ways. :D Seems like a good way to get rid of that pesky spare time, keeping people up to date with lingo and maybe saving some grief for people who were considering lingo but weren't aware of lingo's shanigans. Does me good. Thanks for your concern, though!

--
Email these Lingo executives about the misrepresented 18% hike: psingh@primustel.com,nhazard@primustel.com,tkloster@primustel.com,jdepodesta@primustel.com,t book@primustel.com,smcintyre@primustel.com,anayar@primustel.com,tlawson@primustel.com,mguirg is@primustel.com,jmelick@primustel.com,jrosenblatt@primustel.com,ghicks@primustel.com,mmagil l@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377547 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:56:54 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377354 tj008 : No one is happy about paying more money for something they already enjoy using. This includes me.

I wrote the powers that be at Lingo and voiced my opinion about their extra charges and fees. From their perspective, they have explained the company's position on the new fees and taxes.

The bottom line of it all is:

When we signed up for service we acknowledged and agreed to the Terms and Conditions of our using the Lingo service.

Complain as we might, come February 2005, we will be paying the extra fees.

If you dont wish to do so, cancel your service and pay the disconnection fee and be done with Lingo.

All this complaining is not doing you or your heart any good.

So please, come to terms ;) with it or cancel the service.

On the current course, many more voip providers will be charging the fees and taxes. It will soon be a part of the service. The next due diligence many of us will be doing soon is discovering how much and what taxes the voip providers of interest charge.

FWIW

Cheers!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377354 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:38:47 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377192 vonsen :

said by ycool

:

Well apparently you don't even know what you are talking about

I usually don't. I do appear to have misread your 'join date' and apologise for misquoting that date. As for the rest, please check your sense of humor. If it helps at all, please feel free to make fun of me! :)

--
Email these Lingo executives about the misrepresented 18% hike: psingh@primustel.com,nhazard@primustel.com,tkloster@primustel.com,jdepodesta@primustel.com,t book@primustel.com,smcintyre@primustel.com,anayar@primustel.com,tlawson@primustel.com,mguirg is@primustel.com,jmelick@primustel.com,jrosenblatt@primustel.com,ghicks@primustel.com,mmagil l@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377192 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:20:51 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377122 usa2k :

said by ycool

:

... click on my userid at the post and you will see ...

old timer :)

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377122 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:11:25 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377058 laserjobs : If you have no problem paying the extra $1.50/month fee, then PM me for my address and you can send me an extra $1.50/month fee. I love free money.
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377058 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:04:44 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377035 ycool : Well apparently you don't even know what you are talking about, click on my userid at the post and you will see the date i joined dslreports.com is: Joined: 2001-12-04 15:58:36
which is more that I can say for you since yours say: Joined: 2005-01-06 11:15:38
And NO, I do not work for Lingo.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12377035 Thu, 13 Jan 2005 19:01:45 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12369831 laserjobs : On that note I just spoke with a friend who knows the industry very well and he said that VOIP providers grossly underestimated their costs from the get go.
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12369831 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 23:23:12 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12369776 caseydoug : For what it's worth, I am less upset with Lingo than I was before (and no, I don't work for Lingo). Their explanation made some sense to me. I admit, their handling of the increase was incredibly clumsy, but they are doing what every other VoIP provider is doing in collecting the 3% FET and charging $1.50 for the RRF.

Even Sunrocket, which includes taxes and other governmental charges in its "bottom line price," reserves the right to increase rates at any time. If taxes go up, its rates will go up (although probably not for those who pay $200 up front). And Sunrocket starts off charging $5 more than Lingo.

Many of these companies are quite small -- I think I read that VoicePulse had eight employees. All of them operate on incredibly thin margins. If not covered by increasing revenues, a small rise in costs could drive many of them out of business. Sunrocket is smart to distinguish itself by offering an up-front payment plan. But if taxes and fees increase dramatically, the company could easily go under, and subscribers would never receive the service they had already paid for.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12369776 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 23:16:21 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12368806 PortMeOver : ;-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12368806 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 21:40:32 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367752 vonsen :

said by ycool

:

I have no problem paying the extra $1.50/month fee.

Well I'm glad that you're happy.

I see that you just joined today. By the merest coincidence I emailed a link to this thread to the thoughtful people over at lingo about two hours before you joined. I don't suppose you work for lingo? No? Well you're still outnumbered about 2000:1 in your opinion. :-)

--
Email these Lingo executives about the misrepresented 18% rate hike: psingh@primustel.com,nhazard@primustel.com,tkloster@primustel.com,jdepodesta@primustel.com,t book@primustel.com,smcintyre@primustel.com,anayar@primustel.com,tlawson@primustel.com,mguirg is@primustel.com,jmelick@primustel.com,jrosenblatt@primustel.com,ghicks@primustel.com,mmagil l@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367752 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 19:56:51 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367655 ycool : I have no problem paying the extra $1.50/month fee. The TOS support that any taxes may be added. Lingo's service has worked great for me with excellent call quality so I see no problem in paying this extra $1.50 a month fee.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367655 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 19:47:28 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367396 laserjobs : I just edited my review for Lingo and gave them the lowest rating due to dishonesty. I suggest others do the same that are upset over this.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367396 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 19:21:16 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367341 vonsen : Just wanted to bring this thread to the top of the forum, as I just emailed links to this thread and others to the Lingo execs below.

--
Email these Lingo executives about the misrepresented 18% rate hike: psingh@primustel.com,nhazard@primustel.com,tkloster@primustel.com,jdepodesta@primustel.com,t book@primustel.com,smcintyre@primustel.com,anayar@primustel.com,tlawson@primustel.com,mguirg is@primustel.com,jmelick@primustel.com,jrosenblatt@primustel.com,ghicks@primustel.com,mmagil l@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12367341 Wed, 12 Jan 2005 19:16:44 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12349440 claudeo :

said by PortMeOver

:

clueless or hiding, you decide.

Both it seems.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12349440 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 23:40:29 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12348069 PortMeOver : This is great!! I received a RESPONSE from Lingo.

I emailed the sales department and asked them to explain the taxes and new fees. Here is what the dumb [edit] emailed me back.

---

Dear Sir/Ma'am,

We are sales and have limitations with regards to providing you with customer support. We do appreciate your concerns and rather than provide you with a response that would be inadequate or misleading, it is necessary for our customer support staff to respond to you query. To contact our customer care or technical support, please call 1-888-LINGO-99 or e-mail at customercare@lingo.com.

Thank you,
Lingo Sales Support Team

---

Wow. I guess if you call sales and ask about fees, they will have to send you to TECHNICAL support?

clueless or hiding, you decide.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12348069 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 21:27:13 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12348012 Sinclair42 : I just hung up with Lingo Customer support and he said i was the first caller to complain and he has been there since 3pm....I find that hard to believe!!!He had no explanations on why they picked now to raise the price.He said they didn't it was taxes that were being implemented..this is getting sickening..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12348012 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 21:21:25 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12347801 vonsen :

said by Network Guy

:

For instance, did you know that the "Federal Subscriber Line Charge" that shows up on your bill (about $6 per line) is kept by your local phone company, just like the line or feature charges?

Yes, those disguised charges have made me sick for years. And lingo seems to be headed down that same road. I'm now looking at sunrocket, whereas I never would have considered leaving lingo before they started imposing surcharges.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12347801 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 20:58:00 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12343916 Network Guy :

quote:
For instance, did you know that the "Federal Subscriber Line Charge" that shows up on your bill (about $6 per line) is kept by your local phone company, just like the line or feature charges?

$6.50 for me personally, and yep makes me sick.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12343916 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 13:10:46 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12343382 Sinclair42 : Hopefully SunRocket will add on more cities .Here in South Carolina there are only two major VoIP services that have a ton of cities and the rest never add.Example; Vonage has been around the longest has only 5 cities and 4 of those are in the upper state.We have three area codes and P8 covers all three with small to medium to large cities in all three , probably close to 50 cities or better.Next if not about the same number is VoicePulse.There are a few more with a very limited amount of cities.The Carolina's seem to be last on the list to cover the smaller areas but those smaller areas have tons of people that do have broadband.

I hope Lingo comes to their senses and listens to their customers complaints about the charges that they announced.I guess they will need to step up their advertising campaign if people decide to vote with their wallet if no word comes out of the Lingo camp.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12343382 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 11:55:19 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12342419 laserjobs : I think Sunrocket is going to gain a lot of subscribers just due to their 'Bottom-Line Pricing' terms:

Are you sick and tired of all the mysterious taxes, fees and surcharges tacked on by the phone companies? These can add $10 or more to your phone bill every month. Some of these are legitimate taxes assessed by federal, state or local authorities — passed through to pay for government services. However, a surprising number of these fees represent charges kept by the phone company. For instance, did you know that the "Federal Subscriber Line Charge" that shows up on your bill (about $6 per line) is kept by your local phone company, just like the line or feature charges? Your phone bill may be full of confusing charges, and the phone companies go out of their way to hide the real story behind these fees.

With SunRocket, there are never any bogus charges — any tax or fee we charge will be directly passed through to the appropriate authority, and is included in your bottom-line price.
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12342419 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 09:33:34 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12341986 stufried : To the best of my knowledge, they are also charging this fee to foreign subscribers using foreign DIDs. If it was a tax, you'd think they'd be exempt.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12341986 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 07:54:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12341767 usa2k :

said by bbrlogue

:

I don't recall the same heated reactions when Vonage started charging $1.50 Regulatory Recovery Fee last summer (or maybe I missed it). ...

»Vonage lowers rates
»New Info about Vonage new Regulatory Fees
»Vonage bill

You have to remember that there was less of an explosion of users back then. Many of us were in the geek realm, and saving money was one only aspect.
--
Jim -- USA2K
SEE: |DCWU |FAH |PICS |BVX REVIEW |
FWD, Vonage 01/03 to 12/04, & BVX 07/04 to now]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12341767 Mon, 10 Jan 2005 06:15:36 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12340529 claudeo : You don't understand. That fee doesn't go to the government. It just goes to pad the bottom line of the provider. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12340529 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 23:54:35 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12340485 voiplover : 'Nothing stays the same.'
Voip providers are being manipulated to paying the 3% and the $1.50 per did fees by their providers, or have been advised of future charges. The voip provider is going to pass the expense to the subscriber one way or the other.
Lingo has decided to pass it on as stated.
The fact is that you will be paying it in one form or another. Sunrocket has gambled in just including it in their cost, but who knows what will happen next year. The only thing I count on is that once a gov't entity is used to collecting a tax or fee, they will go to great efforts to keep collecting it from someone, and the bottom line ends with the subscriber.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12340485 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 23:49:10 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12339969 bbrlogue : I don't recall the same heated reactions when Vonage started charging $1.50 Regulatory Recovery Fee last summer (or maybe I missed it). I have both Vonage and Lingo and wish they didn't charge that fee. If the total cost became too much for me, I would cancel and switch provider, but for now, Lingo is still a good value for me.

I applaud efforts to get Lingo to repeal that fee. However, I don't see them reverting.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12339969 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 22:44:27 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12339767 Sinclair42 : Thanks Gericurlswrl i couldn't have said it any clearer........... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12339767 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 22:24:02 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12338227 Gericurlswrl :

said by nightwalker

:

Wow. I never realized how many cheap bastards used VOIP. We live in America, taxes are charged on almost everything. Why should VOIP be any different?

If you really want to go on tax debate, check out the amount of taxes charged for gasoline.

The main difference between the gasoline taxes you refer to and the VoIP federal excise tax we are referring to is obvious. Gas tax is required by state and federal government. Each state has different rates.

As far as VoIP goes, the IRS has not made any type of request or law stating that VoIP providers must charge this fee. To volunatrily charge customers this fee is insulting, among other terms that come to mind.

But since we live in America, I suppose we should all be charged taxes on everything and not question it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12338227 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 19:20:30 EDT More Primus (Lingo) V.P.s http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12337958 vonsen :

said by MikeSH:

Sinclair42 -- My emails on Friday and Saturday went okay, but are bouncing today. Keep sending the emails!

I suppose it is wishful thinking to think that the lingo mailboxes might be full with complaints already. If your emails bounce, I would encourage you to try again the next day & here are some more Primus (Lingo) V.P.'s if you want to email your opinion to them instead.

     Stephen McIntyre, V.P. <smcintyre@primustel.com>
     Ambuj Nayar, V.P. <anayar@primustel.com>
     Tracy Lawson, V.P. <tlawson@primustel.com>
     Mark Guirgis, V.P. <mguirgis@primustel.com>
     John Melick, V.P. <jmelick@primustel.com>
     Jay Rosenblatt, V.P. <jrosenblatt@primustel.com>
     Geoffrey K. Hicks, V.P. <ghicks@primustel.com>
     Mike Magill, Senior Director Sales NA <mmagill@primustel.com>]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12337958 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 18:44:33 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336929 anon : Sinclair42 -- My emails on Friday and Saturday went okay, but are bouncing today.

Keep sending the emails!

Idea -- Pick another VOIP provider and port your Lingo number; change to the lowest cost Lingo plan, foward calls from Lingo to the new service until LNP takes effect; deny Lingo the abiltiy to charge your CC; cancel Lingo after LNP and send back the Lingo box in "Lingo Time" (abt 2 months).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336929 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 16:29:22 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336872 Sinclair42 : I wish the Media would pick up on it..well i am sure they have with the amount of posters on the VoIP forum. Could make things worse by the Government getting involved, but when i did sign up i was told the fee would be what i was told, no more , no less..They enjoy changing rules mid stream.
Anyone have an estimate on how many customers Lingo has? I know that Vonage's numbers were posted several months ago. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336872 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 16:21:54 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336276 claudeo : Bottom line is that a "regulatory recovery fee" or "regulatory cost recovery fee" is not a tax. It is just a way to charge the customer directly for part of the cost of doing business. Nothing prevents a business from collecting and keeping any fees it wants from its customers.

This sleazy and deceptive business practice is unfortunately widespread--just about every telephone company and mobile phone carrier does it and, so far, gets away with it because it is a "small bite" and the very vast majority of their customers just go along with it. To the extent that this is used to to enable misleading advertising, where the advertised cost is lower than what you are actually charged, this should be illegal and people should complain to the FTC and state AGs and consumer protectin agencies. However, in most cases they are very careful to bury these fees in the tiny print at the bottom of the ads, and to generally cover their butt by mentioning that additional unspecified fees may be applied. People should complain loudly to the regulatory agencies AND TO THE MEDIA THAT CARRY THE ADS about the misleading ads. After all, it is in effect a bait and switch tactic.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12336276 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 15:01:34 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12335841 Sinclair42 : I am not sure if it's my server or not, but my emails to the executive office are all bouncing back.Does that mean that the server is full??They went through last night without a problem..........]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12335841 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 14:09:53 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12335255 Sinclair42 : Doug

I don't think i would give them another card number.I am afraid they may charge it twice.I do know that taking the card off the customer information page looks like it is deleted , but they have copies on another database.I have changed my contact number and there is no trace of it anywhere on the page , but when i call tech support they always bring the old number back up.I gave up having T2 take it off 3 times and it reappears back in 24 hours.I guess the best way is to call , "as you said", your Credit card Co. and tell them not to accept any more debits from Lingo; that is after your paid up with them.

Lingo you really made a terrible move when you sent that email out!!!Things were looking up and you other VoIP Companies out there, people will now take notice from all the publicity of what they have to pay and what is required.They key word is "GREED"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12335255 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 12:50:01 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334724 caseydoug :

said by hkvalet

:

I think you guys can start doing it like me. Or just report you card stolen to get a new account number.

You really don't need to go to such lengths. Just write your credit card company and withdraw authorization for Lingo to charge your account. It might even work simply to delete the credit card information from your profile on Lingo's site, but they may prevent deleting this information without substituting another valid card.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334724 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 11:30:14 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334706 ceocio : No one is gonna die over a couple of bucks of course. For me,However,it's the wording in the letter rather than the rate increase itself that's really irritating. If the money they collected from end users are REALLY required by law, I believe no one is gonna say anything about it. But lingo may very well be pocketing the money...Charging something that they shouldn't be, and then blaming it on the government. That's disgusting. It's like raping a girl and then blaming Viagra for it! They really think customers are too stuipid to figure out who really want it?!

If that's not illegal, then there's really something wrong with the U.S. legal system. If voip companies can get away with charging such stupid regulatory recovery fees, I don't see why retaliers like wal-mart can't charge RRFs as well, hell, they are subject to more regulations than voip companies currently are.

Believe it or not, I saw this coming when providers like vonage and CV charged this and we consumers chose to do nothing...It'll be really funny one day these unregulated voip companies will charge almost the same taxes and fees as old telcos do, only they are pocketing the money themselves. And believe me, the day may just come real soon, when voip market is more consolidated and only a few providers remain to dominate the market.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334706 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 11:27:26 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334003 nightwalker : Wow. I never realized how many cheap bastards used VOIP. We live in America, taxes are charged on almost everything. Why should VOIP be any different?

If you really want to go on tax debate, check out the amount of taxes charged for gasoline.

--
»www.reverse.net]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12334003 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 08:59:34 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12333608 hkvalet : I use "Virtual Account Number" that provided by my Credit Card Company. Each number can only be used once. I have to update my credit card information every month in Lingo's web site. So if I cancel their service, they won't be able to charge any additional fee from me.

I think you guys can start doing it like me. Or just report you card stolen to get a new account number.
--
RELAX, God is in Charge!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12333608 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 05:20:23 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12333406 caseydoug : I don't have much confidence of success in a legal claim against Lingo on account of these charges. First, the Terms and Conditions allow Lingo to impose "tax-like charges" and "tax-related surcharges" ("Taxes"). We can argue about whether these charges are valid, but Lingo has at least a colorable legal right to collect them in the first instance. If a challenged Tax is found to be invalid, Lingo is required to compensate its subscribers, either by reducing rates for a period of time, refunding the money, or taking other specified actions.

Second, Lingo's service is month-to-month, and it has expressly reserved the right to raise rates at any time. It could have collected the same amount of money simply by calling this a price increase. It is hard to see how subscribers are harmed by calling it "Taxes."

Third, Lingo has the right to change the Terms and Conditions at any time. Thus, if you think you have some rights under your service agreement, wait a month and Lingo can take them away. :)

We may have a claim under the federal or state consumer protection laws on account of "unfair or deceptive acts and practices" -- false advertising, consumer fraud, etc. -- but it would only make sense to bring such a claim as a class action.

As vonsen says, the taxes are really the smaller part of these surcharges, amounting to around 60 cents per month on Lingo's unlimited residential service (As I pointed out in another thread, these taxes have nothing to do with the FCC). The larger charge is the regulatory recovery fee, which adds $1.50 per line. That amounts to a 30% increase in the cost of "universal" numbers. Maybe the best way to protest this is for everyone to cancel their extra phone numbers.

Hihiken asked about the cancellation fee. I suspect Lingo will charge you $40 if you cancel. Whether they are entitled to do so is another matter. However, since you pay by credit card, you control whether Lingo can actually collect this fee. And even if you do pay the cancellation fee, you get to keep your adapter. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12333406 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 03:27:32 EDT Re: [Lingo] going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332839 usa2k : You can't cancel, then port.

I ported a Vonage issued number to BroadvoxDirect :)
(It took a month that I had to hang onto Vonage.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332839 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 00:55:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332796 hihiken : I just have few question.

1) If I cancel the service. Do I have to pay cancellation fees? I had service for 5month. If yes how much?

2) Can I port my number to someone else? (It is originally from SBC)

3) Or SHould I wait until I finish 1 year contract?

This is really bad.. Lock up the people with contract and rise the fee..

I guess If they rise $50 I still have to pay because of contract... Any Lawyer?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332796 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 00:47:01 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332503 bjohn : I'm curious about something. As of now FCC doesn't mandate VOIP services to be taxed.

Even if the FCC does mandate taxes to be collected at a later date, will the voip providers be asked to pay FCC taxes from the previous periods?

If not, how can they charge taxes now?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332503 Sun, 09 Jan 2005 00:03:47 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332181 tj008 : Glad I cancelled my second (virtual) phone line last month. Guess I'll next downgrade my service plan.

Maybe that could be the drum sound needed. Everyone downgrade their plan to the 14.95 level.

Would 5 bucks mean much?

A buck fifty seems to.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332181 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 23:15:34 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332019 vonsen :
said by Gericurlswrl :

Curious, but how is collecting taxes on something that is not taxable legal?

At my business, we can't charge a fictitious tax on our products, or we would surely be investiated by state authorities.

You can get away with a lot of dubious activities if you are a large corporation with a sizable legal staff. It's hard to be certain. Any attorney's here, familiar with the relevent case law care to chime in? I was thinking that they might escape on a technicality and the presumption that a billion dollar enterprise had probably sought a legal opinion in advance.

They shouldn't be collecting an unlevied tax. But their terms + conditions are written to supposedly allow them to collect anticipated taxes. I think that they would eventually have to issue some type of credit if the tax wasn't eventually levied. Perhaps they want to start collecting tax now on the vanishing small possibility that it could be a retroactive tax. More likely they want the profit (interest) on collected taxes in escrow. Or my best guess: collecting tax at this point is just a smoke screen to deflect attention from the much larger 7.5% RRF they are slapping on each number or 15% for a lingo subscriber that has a second virtual number.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12332019 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 22:55:05 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331861 Gericurlswrl :
said by vonsen :

It might not be illegal, but don't let that stop you from complaining.
Curious, but how is collecting taxes on something that is not taxable legal?

At my business, we can't charge a fictitious tax on our products, or we would surely be investiated by state authorities.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331861 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 22:32:56 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331758 tj008 : My...I never thought this discussion would go 4 pages! We all have something to say, for sure.

What worries me is the greater picture of voip.

The many voip providers discussed in this forum that charge taxes and fees are now ACTING like a legacy telecom - telephone company. This is very scary. Remember the old adage....fake it until you make it. It seems like it's coming true in this case.

To me, using the internet for purchasing products and services has always been a type of rogue activity. The internet has been a free zone. But it seems like this freedom is slowly being eroded. It is truly sad.

The entrepreneurs - the cavaliers - the rogues are now becoming like the very people they didnt want to become. Why have the googles, the yahoos, etc. grown up and taken their toys home?

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331758 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 22:19:30 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331462 vonsen :
said by eperos :

How many Voip customers are out there? If indeed they are not supposed to be collecting these taxes, then we should be writing letters to law enforcement.

I think that they can wiggle out because the fine print in their terms + conditions say that they might collect anticipated taxes. They were probably planning on doing this all along. So definitely unreasonable, unethical and dishonestly portrayed. But probably not illegal. In fact the only reason that they are collecting a 3% tax before they have to, might be to obscure the 15% "regulatory recovery fee". Sounds like another tax, right? But it isn't! This is 100% profit to lingo & no one requires them to impose it. But by implying that they have to collect the 3% tax (plausible, but not true), they hope that the 15% RRF slides in under the radar.

It might not be illegal, but don't let that stop you from complaining. If enough people complain they will back off. If they do proceed with imposing the 18% surcharge, I will drop lingo like a hot potato.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331462 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 21:41:46 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331338 eperos : How many Voip customers are out there? There is gotta be something else we can do than complain to the companies involved. If indeed they are not supposed to be collecting these taxes, then we should be writing letters to law enforcement. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331338 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 21:24:04 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331274 Gericurlswrl :
said by Network Guy :

I said you folks are fools, or foolish if you can understand my point better, for complaining about a $1.50 tax when your local telcos more than likely double, if not triple that
The excessive taxation of POTS service is exactly why most of us left it for VoIP in the first place. We are outraged at these new fees because

1. The 3% federal excise tax they are collecting is most likely illegal. The IRS administers the collection of the excise tax, and they have never ordered VoIP operators to collect such taxes. Period.

2. The $1.50 regulatory charge is pure profit, plain and simple. They don't want to raise the $19.95/mo rate just for the mere fact that they want to continue to be one of the cheapest VoIP operators out there. If they said their rates were now $21.45 versus a competitors that was only $19.95, I'd most likely pick the cheaper price, and so would most others.

Please don't compare the heavily regulated and taxed POTS service that you have to VoIP. You are smart enough to know the difference and the reason VoIP is becoming so popular.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12331274 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 21:15:31 EDT A complaint template http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12330615 vonsen : Here is a complaint template for anyone who is outraged by Lingo's intention to surcharge us an average 18%.

Feel free to change it in any way to voice your opinion. It is important that we actually complain. If lingo doesn't hear a lot of complaints, they will just go ahead with these outrageous surcharges. If you have the time, a totally original letter is even better, but the template can still be effective. The time when your opinion can change this is now!

The best addresses to complain to are:

To: "Paul Singh, CEO" <psingh@primustel.com>
CC: "Neil Hazard, COO" <nhazard@primustel.com>
      "Thomas Kloster, CFO" <tkloster@primustel.com>
      "John DePodesta, Exec. V.P." <jdepodesta@primustel.com>
      "Tracy Book, V.P." <tbook@primustel.com>]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12330615 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 19:36:57 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12329926 vonsen :
said by caseydoug :

said by robbob90210:

Ummm, The only sense I can see in collecting this charge is for there bottom line. Really, perfect sense would be if they become regulated they should start to collect it, at that point.
Seeing this charge is a bit like having the winning bid on EBay and then getting an invoice that adds surcharges for a state sales tax that you know the seller does not intend to remit

Well put. Lingo is just padding their bottom line, IMO. They are not obligated to collect any taxes now and it is exceptionally unlikely that any future taxes imposed would be retroactive. Ergo, they are gratutiously taking more money out of your wallet, just because they believe that they can get away with it. And the "regulatory recovery fee" at 7.5% per phone number (so, 15% for many of us) is a more blatant money grab. No telco is obligated to collect this. It is a slush fund charged at lingo's discretion. I phoned and emailed to voice my displeasure. And I am willing to dump lingo if they don't back down. Anyone who feels the same should stongly consider calling or email lingo ASAP to object. They will only back down if there are a lot of complaints and/or cancellations.

Neil Hazard, COO: nhazard@primustel.com
Paul Singh, CEO: psingh@primustel.com

Executive offices (Maclean, VA): (703) 902-2800

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12329926 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 17:56:24 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12329330 caseydoug :
said by robbob90210:

Ummm, The only sense I can see in collecting this charge is for there bottom line. Really, perfect sense would be if they become regulated they should start to collect it, at that point.
Seeing this charge is a bit like having the winning bid on EBay and then getting an invoice that adds surcharges for a state sales tax that you know the seller does not intend to remit to your state, and for the seller's business license, which the seller has always had and which is simply his cost of doing business. It's not that these extra charges make the service unaffordable, but their justification is inherently misleading.

I think you should assume that, as this industry shakes out, providers will charge whatever the market will bear. Subscribers will switch to whichever providers offer the services they want at the lowest price.

There are hassles in switching, however. Porting your telephone number is one. Dealing with the termination fee is another. I don't believe Lingo would be entitled to charge a termination fee to someone who cancels on account of Lingo's unilateral price increase. One could also simply keep the adapter and use it for another provider (most adapters can be unlocked with a little effort).

I plan to wait a bit before deciding what to do. I want to see whether Lingo has a response to the many customer complaints.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12329330 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 16:31:48 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328688 laserjobs : VOIP is supposed to be free of "a regulatory environment" but the VOIP companies are well on their way to creating regulation.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328688 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 15:07:00 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328659 lobster11 : "Regulatory Recovery" fees can include all sorts of costs, like property taxes in some cases. All companies that operate in the communications area operate in a regulatory environment so this fee is essentially a price increase.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328659 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 15:02:55 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328285 Sinclair42 : I agree and 1143 hits or people are very interested in this issue tells me that there is trouble in the VoIP world.........]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328285 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 14:05:22 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328159 anon : Down4U said

"Bvox explained the reasoning behind the $1.50 should they ever become regulated and hence begin collecting it, and it makes perfect sense why they would."

Ummm, The only sense I can see in collecting this charge is for there bottom line. Really, perfect sense would be if they become regulated they should start to collect it, at that point.

Its like saying in my business Im going to charge my customers another 3% from today, just in case a Govt depart introduce another charge. Its bulls..t.

I really dont care about the extra charge, What I care about is misleading information why they are introducing it. I also dont understand why I have to pay $1.50 for my international numbers as well.

Look at the big picture here. If all VoIP companies introduce 1 or 2 fee's at a time. It wont be long until were back at the POTS system level of charges. Especially when they all charge the 'Federal Excise Tax', its not hard for legislation to be introduced, (Its not going to hurt the industry, because its already implemented), the Govt take this charge then the VoIP are looking at another one to keep their profits at the same level.

Robert.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12328159 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 13:43:47 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327846 Network Guy :
quote:
P.S. Why bother posting a POTS phone bill,it has nothing to do with VOIP

It does have something to do with VoIP, the same tax(es), except a lot less than the telco.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327846 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 13:00:49 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327835 laserjobs : I am ready to run right over to Broadvox or preferably Sunrocket. We are trying to keep regulation out of VOIP and the VOIP companies really want FCC regulation for some reason by acting like a regular Telco with their taxes and fees. I just don't get it.

P.S. Why bother posting a POTS phone bill,it has nothing to do with VOIP
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327835 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:58:59 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327819 Network Guy : No, I said you folks are fools, or foolish if you can understand my point better, for complaining about a $1.50 tax when your local telcos more than likely double, if not triple that, for their benefit, not because Uncle Sam makes them.

Bvox explained the reasoning behind the $1.50 should they ever become regulated and hence begin collecting it, and it makes perfect sense why they would.

Do you work at Lingo or are involved in their legal dealings to know why they chose to go down that route? No, and I'm pretty sure everyone else paying Lingo for VoIP doesn't know either.

I'm not defending Lingo, in fact I don't like the fact that they did that, and if I were a customer of theirs I'd likely complain, if not ditch them as well for that. But at this point you are all speculating, and unless you can all get an official word from the CFO or COO, you'll never know for sure other than believing your purported assertions.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327819 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:56:56 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327763 Sinclair42 : I am not interested in looking at your bill first of all, but to come into this forum and insinuate and flame posters by calling us all "fools" shows your maturity level is less than my 6 year old.What kind of response did you think you would get by calling people "fools". a big welcome to the forum party? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327763 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:48:37 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327667 Sinclair42 : Correct Doug!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327667 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:36:16 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327647 caseydoug :
said by Sinclair42 :

You maybe could do some checking to see if they have a leg to stand on when you get back to your office.

I'll try to look later today, but unless people are really prepared to walk over this, it's not going to be much of a threat just to tell Lingo we don't believe its reason for a rate hike. What would make a difference is if people called and canceled.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327647 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:33:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327604 Network Guy : Ehhmmm.. I realize this is an ethical issue. Wanna get into ethics? I suggest you read through that bill of mine again.

If you don't feel that I'm outright getting robbed, perhaps you're the ignorant one.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327604 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:25:52 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327572 Sinclair42 : Yawn..I new there would be a poster such as this.The only fools i know are the ones that follow the crowds that don't care about whether an issue is ethical or not........
Everyone has their right to express their opinion whether it shows their ignorance or intelligence...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327572 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:21:01 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327515 Network Guy : Ok, you wanna see what you whiny bishes aren't contending with doing VoIP even with this controversial $1.50 fee? Please take a look at my telco bill below..

As you'll realize, my actual monthly plan and usage fees are nearly doubled with all fees and taxes.

And you fools are complaining about $1.50?

Me

NY

Account Summary

Account Number
Invoice Number 52675969
Billing Period Ending 1/3/2005
Total Amount $37.83

Invoice Summary

Previous Bill $38.17
Payments and Credits $38.17 CR
Balance $0.00
Current New Charges $37.83

Current Balance Due By 1/29/2005 $37.83
Pay My Bill

Summary Of Services Total

Trinsic
NY Trinsic Basic $0.00

Local Primary Line
NY Trinsic Basic Line without Features $19.99
Directory Listing Pricing Plan - Free $0.00
Regulatory and Other Fees $10.72

Member to Member $0.00

Long Distance
Long Distance $0.00
Long Distance Intl $0.00
Long Distance Int - Cell $0.00

Voice Mail $0.00

Travel Card
Trinsic Access Card $0.00
Trinsic Access Card Intl $0.00

Conferencing $0.00

TeleMail Messaging $0.00

Directory Assistance and Call Completion $0.00

PVA Direct. Assist. & Call Comp. $0.00

Other Charges Summary $0.00

Special Billed Calls $0.00

InfoStream - Information Services $0.00

Account Charges $0.57

Government Fees and Taxes $6.55

Current New Charges $37.83

Special Notes
Answers and Information
Billing Inquiries (800) 511-4572
Customer Service (800) 511-4572

Payments and Credits Amount

Payment by Direct - 1/3/2005 $38.17 CR

Total Payments and Credits $38.17 CR

New Charges Detail

Local Monthly Service Quantity Amount

Trinsic 1
(718) xxx-xxxx NY Trinsic Basic Line without Features 1/4/2005 - 2/3/2005 $19.99
(718) xxx-xxxx Service Number Portability 1/4/2005 - 2/3/2005 $0.23
(718) xxx-xxxx Subscriber Line Charge (Res) 1/4/2005 - 2/3/2005 $6.50
(718) xxx-xxxx Interstate Recovery Fee 1/4/2005 - 2/3/2005 $1.24
(718) xxx-xxxx Federal Regulatory Compliance Fee 1/4/2005 - 2/3/2005 $1.94
Fed Universal Service Fund $0.81

$30.71

Total Monthly Service $30.71

Account Charges Quantity Amount

Finance Charge - 1/4/2005 1 $0.57

Total Charges $0.57

Government Fees and Taxes

Sales Tax $2.74
Excise Tax $0.77
Federal Excise Tax $0.98
E911 Tax $1.00
NY MCTD 186c $0.18
NY MCTD 184a $0.04
Franchise Tax $0.72
NY Franchise 184 $0.12

Total Government Fees and Taxes $6.55

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327515 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:13:37 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327481 Sinclair42 : Doug

You are correct about individual letters having more merit, but there are those that probable would feel more comfortable using a template type of letter stating that the tax that is being implemented into the pricing structure is in no way a Government regulation as of yet.You maybe could do some checking to see if they have a leg to stand on when you get back to your office.Even though i have already written to the above email address there are those that would feel better sending a letter with accurate statements.I guess the more letters to the designated addressees would be a plus to all that are concerned in trying to get Lingo's attention.If a thousand people threatened to unsubscribe because of the letter that was sent out, which is very possible as i see almost that many according to the hits that this post has been read, then i think they would surely have to do something to keep their service going forward because they are one of the best if not the best VoIP contenders out there.Would be a shame to lose a big chunk of their base over the issue that will pick up speed as word of mouth gets the word out.I guess they think no one would care??????? I think they better think twice............. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327481 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 12:08:49 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327282 caseydoug : A template is fine for those who don't care to compose their own letter. Generally, however, individual unique communications are considered more effective. So if you feel up to writing it in your own words, that is what you should do.

Regarding the comment of WilliamK23, the FCC fees referred to are only around 0.2%, and have been around since before Lingo got started. Lingo should not be imposing a surcharge at this time, any more than it should impose a surcharge because it pays property tax on its headquarters building.

The tax cited in Lingo's letter to its subscribers is a 3% Federal Telecommunications Excise Tax which certain telecommunications providers are required to COLLECT from subscribers. It is governed by the Internal Revenue Code and administered by the IRS. Last July, the IRS published a notice asking for comment as to whether this tax should be extended to subscribers of non-traditional telecommunications service (69 Fed. Reg. 40345). No decision has been made yet, but Lingo told its subscribers it is required to collect this tax.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327282 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 11:39:05 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327150 anon : I vote for VONSEN to be the template writer. Based on his concise use of English and explaining the feeling of Lingo customers.

Robert]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327150 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 11:20:29 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327110 laserjobs : I agree bjohn. If someone is good at writing letters could they post a template. It would make it much easier for all Lingo users to send a complaint.
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12327110 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 11:14:11 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326824 tj008 : ditto]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326824 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 10:23:40 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326813 bjohn : I emailed all these people.

primuscare@primustel.com;
customercare@lingo.com;
nhazard@primustel.com;
psingh@primustel.com;
sales@lingo.com

It would be nice if someone who's good with "creative writing" make a template (letter) that we can all follow when emailing.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326813 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 10:22:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326783 laserjobs : Thanks vonsen for the emails, I just sent another one off to them
Neil Hazard, COO: nhazard@primustel.com
Paul Singh, CEO: psingh@primustel.com
--
Email Lingo about the misrepresented rate hike: customercare@lingo.com primuscare@primustel.com nhazard@primustel.com psingh@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326783 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 10:17:11 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326652 anon : »hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/a···04A5.pdf

Long Distance Carriers owe taxes on the revenue that they collect and have to turn that over to the FCC (the FCC collects a regulatory tax to support the FCC).

The problem isn't native VoIP (Internet PC to Internet PC) but when it goes off the internet to a remote PSTN gateway that is owned by the same carrier in another state (That's when it becomes a long distance call); and rightfully so the FCC wants their share of the pie.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12326652 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 09:55:25 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325842 hkvalet : Either VoIP Companies or Mobile Carriers.......

These companies just want to make more and more money from consumers.

Government taxes and fees are just some other ways and different names for them to take money out from your wallets.
--
RELAX, God is in Charge!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325842 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 04:10:52 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325712 caseydoug : For the POTS line, these charges either represent real government taxes and fees, or they have been accepted by a state regulatory commission as a real cost of service.

In the case of the Federal Telecommunications Excise Tax (under section 4252 of the Internal Revenue Code), the Internal Revenue Service last July asked for public comment on whether these taxes should be extended to non-traditional telephone services. Comments were due this past fall. This was not even a notice of proposed rulemaking, and to my knowledge, proposed rules have not yet even been published.

I have not researched this thoroughly, so I could be wrong. But I would like to see some evidence for Lingo's statement that it is "required by Federal law" to collect this tax.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325712 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 03:19:44 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325605 usa2k :
said by Gericurlswrl :

How can they charge a "tax" that is not mandated by the government . . .
just look at a POTS bill, or cell phone bill. Much of those add-on fees above the advertised rate are not government fees. The just have official sounding names.

»Good Article on those extra "fees"

»Taxes will be the death of us
--
Jim -- USA2K
SEE: |DCWU |FAH |PICS |BVX REVIEW |
FWD, Vonage 01/03 to 12/04, & BVX 07/04 to now]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325605 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 02:44:09 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325567 vonsen : Emailing customer service won't get you very far at lingo. If you are outraged by the gratutious 18% surcharge that lingo is imposing, try these email addresses instead:

Neil Hazard, COO: nhazard@primustel.com
Paul Singh, CEO: psingh@primustel.com

I am certain that these gentlemen would be interested in their customer's opinions. Happy customers usually mean rising share prices. The CEO, Paul Singh pulled down $3 Million last year, so he is well paid to listen to your concerns. Oh, the $3M is based on the current share price. Should Primus shares goes back up to $12, then his personal income would be closer to $15 million. If you prefer to call rather than email, the switchboard for the executive offices in MaClean, VA is (703) 902-2800. You might try asking for Neil or Paul's executive assistant.

edit: for typo
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325567 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 02:32:58 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325496 Gericurlswrl : How can they charge a "tax" that is not mandated by the government for VoIP, if indeed that is the case? Does anyone have proof that VoIP is completely unregulated in regards to taxation? Perhaps state attorney generals need to be notified?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325496 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 02:15:15 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325262 Sinclair42 : customercare@lingo.com
primuscare@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325262 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 01:21:15 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325136 Sinclair42 : We have all heard this from the Politician's and i see this as the same type of lies. "I will not raise taxes".Anything to get your business or vote.With the small amount of customers that Lingo or any other VoIP provider has compared to Landline,if the voices of the consumer's is heard loud enough, they may just listen and drop the $1.50 fee...
People don't like being lied to and VoIP is more of a hobby to me.I would just assume get rid of VoIP and not have to worry about rebooting, Rev.upgrades, etc. and go strictly landline.The last time this happened it was about charging us for calls to Hawaii.They quickly fixed that problem.If this is not mandated tax from the Government as of now then they have no right to lay the burden on the consumer and make up for some lost revenue.Hope they get the message.I like the service but not the lies.
Lets get those emails filling their boxes....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325136 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 01:00:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325087 laserjobs : Don't forget Sunrocket and their policy of including all taxes and fee in their pricing. Please take the time to email Lingo about this issue before we start paying the taxes and fees of POTS.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325087 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 00:50:13 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325018 tj008 :
said by bjohn :

bastards.
I think I'll quit Lingo.

I urge everyone to email them and tell them this is BS.

It is always good to voice ones opinion. Email them and let them know.

But before anyone jumps ship, lets look at what is waiting for you in the water....

By the looks of things (from this thread »ALL Providers - Monthly Bill including taxes, etc ), there is one frequently discussed provider NOT charging taxes or fees. That is Broadvox Direct. Is it only a matter of time?

Be happy where you are.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325018 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 00:39:14 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325002 laserjobs : I have already sent them two emails with no response. Please everyone who subscribes to Lingo send an email to let them know you are dissatisfied with this misrepresented rate hike.

Here are the emails I have for Lingo:
customercare@lingo.com
primuscare@primustel.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12325002 Sat, 08 Jan 2005 00:36:28 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12324615 bjohn : bastards.
I think I'll quit Lingo.

I urge everyone to email them and tell them this is BS.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12324615 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 23:40:56 EDT Re: [Lingo] to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12323376 usa2k : Two years ago I was happy to pay $40 a month with Vonage. I was saving $80 a month verses SBC and ATT LD back then. With the more competitive pricing we have now, we still have a good deal.

Still, you can vote with your wallet, and go anywhere you wish. I did not leave Vonage because of fees. I just found a better deal from a solid service provider.
--
Jim -- USA2K
SEE: |DCWU |FAH |PICS |BVX REVIEW |
FWD, Vonage 01/03 to 12/04, & BVX 07/04 to now]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12323376 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 21:13:03 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322834 the_glassman : Time for me to drop my service package or switch providers or drop VOIP all together. I wish more people used Skype including business. I can't express how pissed off I am regarding this. I dropped my landline to avoid this crap.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322834 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 20:10:58 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322780 laserjobs : Nicely said vonsen. I am thinking of dumping Lingo over this as well.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322780 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 20:06:09 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322618 vonsen : Lingo is being very dishonest in their stated reasons for imposing these fees. The government is not forcing them to collect any tax at this time. The FCC has issued several recent decisions, none of which mandate that taxes have to be collected at this time. Lingo is simply imposing them in anticipation that they will be required to collect taxes at some future time. To label it as something that the government has compelled them to do is untrue and deceptive.

Moreover, the "regulatory recovery fee" is nothing more than a slush fund for lingo. There is no requirement to collect any such fee. It is entirely descretanary on lingo's part. Having sorted out many of their launch problems, they are feeling comfortable enough to slap a 15% surcharge on everyone who is locked into a one year committment. 15% is a large step toward the only reason that I signed up (lower costs). Lingo thinks that few will jump ship over 15% PLUS tax. If broadvox stays the course and does not follow suit, I for one, will get rid of lingo.

Nice.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12322618 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 19:49:31 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321952 sheik28 : Just as an FYI. This is taken straight from my P8 bill...

Freedom Unlimited Monthly Fee For 2/1/2005 - 2/28/2005

Account Balance $19.95

Federal Excise Tax (3% FET) $0.60

Total Bill $20.55
--
There is no such thing as a stupid question, and yes, the camel types. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321952 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 18:33:26 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321264 ceocio : I got the silly email too.
Lingo wants to raise price? Fine, just come right out and say it!..Lingo wants a better bottom line to please its investoers? I'm all for that.
But don't tell me they are suddenly "required" by the federal governemnt to collect taxes and "regulatory recorvery fee", which they are mostly likely gonna pocket for themselves. Since when voip legislation changed? I thought vonage just won another legal battle few days ago....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321264 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 17:12:45 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321249 ejrobinson : My main complaint is the imposition of that $1.50 on virtual numbers, especially the offshore ones. I can't imagine the state of virginia, where lingo is domiciled, taxing a virtual number in london or paris.

-er]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12321249 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 17:10:31 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12320906 anon : Guys, Guys.
Unless I havent been in the US long enough, but in AUS, if you collect a tax, then you pay this to the Government. If you call something a Tax and keep it yourself, well this is fraud.
If your not imposed by the Govt to collect a Tax, then you are legally not allowed to.

I dont understand the in's and out's of the POTS system and charges here, but to me it like USPS trying to charge me for my email.

Robert]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12320906 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 16:30:58 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12320156 caseydoug : There is a big difference between the regulatory recovery fee charged by your local phone company and that charged by Lingo. As a regulated monopoly, the phone company uses "cost of service" pricing, in which it must justify all of its expected costs to a regulatory agency and then is allowed to charge a rate anticipated to recover those costs, plus an approved return on its investment. While this formula does not guarantee it a profit (since all ratemaking is prospective), it does reduce the risk to investors. In exchange, the consumer gets some protection against the phone company's exercise of monopoly power in its pricing decisions.

By contrast, Lingo is allowed simply to charge what the market will bear. If we don't like it, we can take our business elsewhere.

While Lingo's terms of service do allow them to impose Taxes, we should distinguish between taxes they are required to collect (i.e., where the subscriber is the taxpayer), and taxes imposed upon them, or which might be imposed upon them. I feel no obligation to pay more simply because Lingo's costs go up.

The question is, what to do about it? The fact is, Lingo's service agreement does not prevent them from raising their prices whenever they see fit -- and I see this as nothing more than a price increase. Similarly, there is nothing in the service agreement that requires us to continue as subscribers.

The ONLY question is whether Lingo has a right to charge a termination fee if we quit. I believe that is something of an open question. However, we certainly have a good argument that we are not obligated to pay the termination fee if Lingo raises its prices on account of taxes it is not required to collect. Unless this is litigated as a class action, there is simply not enough money involved for any subscriber to test this theory in court. Similarly, it would not be worth it for Lingo to take someone to court for a $40 termination fee.

Therefore, if you want to drop your subscription on account of this price increase, simply tell your credit card company that you no longer authorize Lingo to charge the monthly service fee, pay what you legitimately owe, and cancel your service.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12320156 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 15:15:39 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319422 Trimline : Well at least Bellsouth is honest about the "fee". And your right, it is a "pocket" profit for Lingo.

BellSouth imposes a Regulatory Cost Recovery Fee of $2.97 per month to offset costs incurred in complying with regulatory obligations and includes offsetting BellSouth's Universal Service Fund payments for the DSL used in our FastAccess DSL Service and recovery of other expenses incurred to support specific regulatory requirements unique to BellSouth as a DSL provider. This fee is not a tax or charge imposed by a government entity.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319422 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:46:29 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319356 Network Guy : Better hope that the FCC continues to plunk down your local pol's efforts to tax you up the arse any further. It's gonna happen sooner or later, might as well start accepting it.

And yes I agree.. I'd rather give Broadvox those tax dollars than to give them to Verizon.

Verizon can experience another 9/11 for all I care.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319356 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:36:57 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319334 csbadboyz : I will still pay Lingo, before I pay the local scum phone company.

Thanks for being there Lingo
--
VoIP on FWD & Lingo ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319334 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:34:30 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319315 artisticcheese : So what you are saying is.
I pay more taxes on POTS line then on VOIP or so taxing VOIP is ok.
Secondly since they collect tax for good reason it's ok as well.
The problem with this is that if I want to help my local agencies or disabled organisation I can donate directly. I don't need my phone company make that decision for me.
The only explanation which I'll accept is that they are required to do it by law which does not seems to be a case right now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319315 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:33:02 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319277 Network Guy : Dude, you wanna pay the taxes I pay on my residential POTS line? There's at least five different local government entities collecting, FIVE!!! It all adds up close to $20 per month, and the plan I subscribe to is $20!!

I still say the $3 they're collecting isn't bad, if they're really collecting it for what they say they're collecting it for.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319277 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:29:27 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319248 artisticcheese : From Sunrocket TOS

SunRocket Bottom-Line Pricing. If your service plan qualifies for SunRocket Bottom-Line Pricing, all applicable federal, state, local or other governmental taxes and charges will be included in the Bottom-Line Price specified for your service plan. The specified Bottom-Line Price represents the sum of SunRocket effective charges and all applicable governmental charges.

My understanding since they are already including taxes and did not raise price recently (to offset changed regulation to tax service) it means that there were no changes on tax front recently (which appears to be the case with Lingo which claims that there were changes).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319248 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:25:57 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319224 Network Guy :
said by priller :

said by Network Guy :

Anyone know Broadvox's stance on this?

»Re: I am against regulation of VoIP - no Broadvox

Well see, I like his explanation on why they'd collect that, and do agree. Not like it's astronomical fees that nearly double your bill like it happens with my POTS account, and it actually goes toward supporting the service, not supporting your local congressman's pockets.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319224 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:22:41 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319198 lobster11 : That $1.50 per month they are collecting for "regulatory recovery" is certainly a rip-off. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319198 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:20:14 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319145 bbrlogue : To be fair, beside AT&T CV mentioned above, Vonage already does this too:

Charges Detail:
International Calls for 1-(703)-xxx-xxxx (02/Dec-01/Jan) $0.95
Overage Calls for 1-(703)-xxx-xxxx (02/Dec-01/Jan) $0.08
Residential Basic 500 for 1-(703)-xxx-xxxx (02/Jan-01/Feb) $14.99
FET Tax $0.48
Regulatory Recovery Fee $1.50
Total Amount $18.00
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319145 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:13:31 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319090 priller :
said by Network Guy :

Anyone know Broadvox's stance on this?

»Re: I am against regulation of VoIP - no Broadvox]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319090 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:06:34 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319057 EGeezer :
quote:
What is the Regulatory Recovery Fee?

The Lingo service regulatory recovery fee is $1.50 per phone number. This fee is charged to our Lingo customers to recover the costs of certain regulatory and compliance requirements imposed, or expected to be imposed, on us by the federal government or various states and localities. These costs can include charges associated with supporting services such as state or local universal service, emergency calling, law enforcement, disability compliance and certain tax requirements. Your Regulatory Recovery Fee reflects a $1.50 charge for each domestic or international phone number, including primary voice, secondary voice, and fax numbers.

This reads more like "slush fund" , or the ADP surcharge car dealers put on a hot selling model's sticker.

ADP = Added Dealer Profit
--
N-X-211 ====== N-328KF]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12319057 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 13:02:30 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318896 Network Guy : I wonder how much longer before the rest of the VoIP carriers start charging tax and fees. That's one big reason why I just switched over from POTS in the first place. :(

Anyone know Broadvox's stance on this?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318896 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:41:51 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318774 amateur100 : Simple just switch to a non US provider. And fingers up to their taxes. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318774 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:28:55 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318736 laserjobs : Exactly what changes have happened?

Until now, we have been fortunate to take advantage of current federal regulations and a regulatory environment that has allowed us not to charge Federal taxes and other cost recovery fees on your service. However, changes in both areas have caused us to modify our current policy. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318736 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:25:09 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318712 techRW :
said by Hooper :

Verizon and Comcast raise their taxes all the time. Unfortunately in the future we will see more posts like this... but hopefully not too soon. Look at ATT CV, they are already collecting fees for taxes they don't have to pay.

Are you suggesting that Lingo keeps the taxes they collect?

Also, Lingo says that "changes" have caused them to alter their policy. What changes are they referring to?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318712 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:22:56 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318678 artisticcheese : PLease note that SunRocket charges some taxes required but they are just included in monthly price.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318678 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:18:58 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318677 mike823461 : There is no way to put lipstick on this pig....the $1.50 is just a surcharge that, as long as VoIP is unregulated, comes out of our pocket and right to Primus's bottom line.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318677 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:18:47 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318663 laserjobs :
said by artisticcheese :

Why would not just Lingo customer call customer service and ask them why exactly Lingo collecting this tax and other providers don't. This looks like one question which still has not got answered anywhere in this group.

I sent them an email asking why companies like SunRocket do not charge these taxes but Lingo does.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318663 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:17:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318642 artisticcheese : Why would not just Lingo customer call customer service and ask them why exactly Lingo collecting this tax and other providers don't. This looks like one question which still has not got answered anywhere in this group.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318642 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 12:13:49 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318497 Hooper : Verizon and Comcast raise their taxes all the time. Unfortunately in the future we will see more posts like this... but hopefully not too soon. Look at ATT CV, they are already collecting fees for taxes they don't have to pay.
--
Bonnaroo 2004 : June 11-13 Manchester, TN ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318497 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:55:42 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318454 laserjobs :
said by GrepTar :

I am almost certain that wasn't in the agreement when I signed up on June 9, 2004. I didn't print it out at the time, though. I guess I will remember to do that from now on.

Would anyone here have an agreement from then?

I just looked at the T&C from when I signed up in June. Unfortunatley here is the Taxes part:

S. Taxes
1. All taxes, tax-like charges, and tax-related surcharges are referred to collectively as “Tax(es).” Primus may elect to impose
and collect such Taxes, unless otherwise constrained by
court order or direction.

2. You agree to pay all Taxes imposed. If Primus has collected Taxes and a challenged Tax is found to have been invalid and
unenforceable, Primus, in its sole discretion, will either reduce service rates for a fixed
period of time in the future in order to flow-through to customers an amount equivalent to the amounts collected, or it will credit
or refund such amounts to affected customers (less its reasonable administrative costs),
if the amounts collected were retained by Primus or if they were delivered to the jurisdiction and returned to Primus, or it will
negotiate an arrangement with the jurisdiction to provide a future benefit for customers in
that
jurisdiction.

3. If you provide Primus with a duly authorized tax exemption certificate, Primus will exempt you in accordance with law,

effective on the date Primus receives the certificate.

& Taxes on Primus's net income will be Primus's responsibility.

5. If you are required by the laws of any foreign tax jurisdiction to withhold income or profit taxes from a payment, within 90
days of the withholding, you will provide Primus with official tax certificates documenting
remittance of the taxes. The tax certificates will be in a form sufficient to document qualification of the taxes for the foreign
tax credit allowable against Primus’s U.S. corporate income tax, and will be accompanied by
an English translation. Upon receipt of the tax certificate, Primus will issue you a credit for the amounts represented thereby.
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318454 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:50:53 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318389 tj008 :
said by GrepTar :

I am almost certain that wasn't in the agreement when I signed up on June 9, 2004. I didn't print it out at the time, though. I guess I will remember to do that from now on.

Would anyone here have an agreement from then?

Im sure somewhere in the T&C there is a line saying if this T&C is changed you are bound by them by continuing to pay for the service.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318389 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:42:51 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318262 mwf : This is my favorite part:

or expected to be imposed,]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318262 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:29:07 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318252 GrepTar : I am almost certain that wasn't in the agreement when I signed up on June 9, 2004. I didn't print it out at the time, though. I guess I will remember to do that from now on.

Would anyone here have an agreement from then?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318252 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:27:05 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318183 tj008 : "U. Taxes

1. All taxes, tax-like charges, and tax-related surcharges are referred to collectively as "Tax(es)." Primus may elect to impose and collect such Taxes, unless otherwise constrained by court order or direction.
2. You agree to pay all Taxes imposed. If Primus has collected Taxes and a challenged Tax is found to have been invalid and unenforceable, Primus, in its sole discretion, will either reduce service rates for a fixed period of time in the future in order to flow-through to customers an amount equivalent to the amounts collected, or it will credit or refund such amounts to affected customers (less its reasonable administrative costs), if the amounts collected were retained by Primus or if they were delivered to the jurisdiction and returned to Primus, or it will negotiate an arrangement with the jurisdiction to provide a future benefit for customers in that jurisdiction."

-From the current Terms and Conditions dated in October 2004

Was just a hope and prayer on our parts that they wouldnt succumb to charging taxes.

Would still like to see where the FCC requires these taxes and fees to be collected on voip services.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318183 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:18:30 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318108 anon : Im a bit confused about this whole thing.
»australianit.news.com.au/article···,00.html

Im sure there are heaps of other articles around about this.

Robert]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318108 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:08:39 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318069 artisticcheese : Why did not they put following question in FAQ.

Question: Why other providers don't charge those or charge those and don't increase prices and Lingo does?

Answer: Becouse we can]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318069 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:04:57 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318059 GrepTar : So, if I cancel because of this, I wonder if I will still have to pay the $40 cancelation fee, since this is not what I originally agreed to.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318059 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:03:39 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318052 laserjobs : Thank you other VOIP carriers, now everyone is following suit with fees and taxes. The party is over:(]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318052 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:03:06 EDT Re: [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318038 PCInTech : Uh oh.... smells like the beginning of something disgusting... :(]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318038 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:01:20 EDT [Lingo] is going to charge Excise and Reg Tax http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318025 anon : Just got this through.
Excise I can understand, but why the hell do I have to pay the $1.50 each for my International phone numbers. ??

Dear Lingo Customer,

As a valued Lingo broadband phone service customer, we strive to provide you with the best service possible at the most affordable costs. Until now, we have been fortunate to take advantage of current federal regulations and a regulatory environment that has allowed us not to charge Federal taxes and other cost recovery fees on your service. However, changes in both areas have caused us to modify our current policy.

Effective with your billing cycle in February 2005, your Lingo service will be subject a 3% Federal Telecommunications Excise Tax on your monthly subscription fees and additional usages charges from the previous month. Additionally, your Lingo phone numbers are now subject to a Lingo service regulatory recovery fee of a $1.50 per phone number on your service. This includes your primary voice, secondary voice, and fax numbers.

In anticipation that you may have some basic questions regarding these changes, below are some questions and answers for your reference.

What is the Federal Excise Tax?

Lingo is required by Federal law to collect a 3% federal excise tax on the amount which it charges its customers for all communication services. This tax applies to monthly subscription fees as well as to any additional usage charges.

What is the Regulatory Recovery Fee?

The Lingo service regulatory recovery fee is $1.50 per phone number. This fee is charged to our Lingo customers to recover the costs of certain regulatory and compliance requirements imposed, or expected to be imposed, on us by the federal government or various states and localities. These costs can include charges associated with supporting services such as state or local universal service, emergency calling, law enforcement, disability compliance and certain tax requirements. Your Regulatory Recovery Fee reflects a $1.50 charge for each domestic or international phone number, including primary voice, secondary voice, and fax numbers.

We thank you for your understanding and your continued use of Lingo service.

Regards,

Lingo Customer Service

Lingo is a registered trademark of Primus Telecommunications, Inc.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12318025 Fri, 07 Jan 2005 11:00:16 EDT