jjoshua
Premium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ | Don't bother
Don't secure your wireless network. Encrypt all traffic using a VPN. Deny all other wireless traffic.
If you need security, use a wired network. |
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karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
iraq
 ·Fairpoint Communic..
| That's not a realistic solution. Of course, if wireless encryption, WEP is easily cracked by any desktop in a matter of minutes. WAP has always been crackable, given enough processing power and a big enough data set. Of course, if that 1000 hour crack could be done in 6 minutes with an NVIDIA graphics card, that would be a game changer. But what are the options available? Assuming a regular PC would take about 5 months to brute force a 13 character key, using an Nvidia card would take that to about 45 minutes. Heck, I've got 45 minutes to waste outside an office building, do you?
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The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
|  I believe it
Just look at how much faster your GPU is at Folding@Home or encoding a video. A DVD to WMV conversion on my E6750 takes close to 48 hours due to the upconversion to 720p. It takes 1 hour and 45 using my 9600GT.
GPUs are great at tasks that can utilize massively parallel architectures.
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Linux Haters Unite! |
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maartena
Stacked.
Premium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to karlmarx
Re: Don't bother
said by karlmarx  :That's not a realistic solution. Not for homes. But for offices it is. As a matter of fact my employer does not allow ANY wireless connection out of security reasons. We work with sensitive data and have to conform to bank-industry security standards. (We aren't a bank though).
The only wireless option we have considered, and isn't too hard to implement.... is using VPN. It wouldn't be too hard to install the VPN client we already use on our laptops, (which most have installed anyways as they take it home) and have them logon to a VPN before they can access *anything* on the network.
For offices VPN implementation isn't too difficult. And you can actually leave your wireless access points completely open, they only thing people will be able to reach on your network..... is a VPN server.  |
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k1ll3rdr4g0n
join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
| Not again...
You know this stuff is really starting to *bug* me. Left and right I always see "WEP insecure don't use it", blah blah blah.
Anyone with fingers and more than 2 braincells to rub together will realize you can't just crack wireless APs with off the shelf wireless cards (at least the vast majority). That means that your neighbor is probably not going to be a "WEP cracker", so its safe to use WEP in a residential area. I'll bet anyone's neighbor here probably only knows the basics of Word. I would use something more industrial in a apartment area though; as since your signal can encompass more people...but in a urban/rural residential area where there is considerate amount of space between houses WEP is enough to keep the average doodle head from connecting to your wifi and thinking its his.
But again why are we even talking about this when the vast majority of people don't even use any protection at all! (Just walk down your street with your laptop, I'll bet you will find at least one open AP with a internet connection.)
I am NOT saying it isn't hackable, but for the amount of time it takes...I think some "researchers" are stretching the truth. Somehow I doubt someone can crack a 128bit wep key in a matter of minutes on the average laptop. And for the people that say that WEP is really insecure...again in an urban/rural area is there actually people going around *wasting* their time sitting in a car just to see if they can crack your WEP key? If they are I haven't seen any. If anything they would be driving around trying to find an open wifi AP. |
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avd706
insert annoying animated gif here
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Union, NJ
| said by k1ll3rdr4g0n :You know this stuff is really starting to *bug* me. Left and right I always see "WEP insecure don't use it", blah blah blah. Anyone with fingers and more than 2 braincells to rub together will realize you can't just crack wireless APs with off the shelf wireless cards (at least the vast majority). You mean the vast majority of G cards cant go into promiscuous mode, but I'm sure you can get lots of hardware out there on the internet that can. WEP is dead. obsolete. |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
 ·Verizon FIOS
1 edit | said by avd706 :You mean the vast majority of G cards cant go into promiscuous mode, but I'm sure you can get lots of hardware out there on the internet that can. WEP is dead. obsolete. Probably so, but it's perfect for making sure the old retired couple next door doesn't accidentally connect to my wireless network, and it still allows the fastest transfer speeds considering the tiny overhead it creates.
We are talking about your neighbors with a few Dell computers that have very little understanding of networking protocols. WEP is an obsolete security measure, but it can be used to prevent a neighbor from inadvertently hijacking your connection, while still making it simple for your guests to be able to connect without having to delve into the router's advanced feature settings. |
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kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
 ·T-Mobile US
1 edit | reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n
said by k1ll3rdr4g0n :You know this stuff is really starting to *bug* me. Left and right I always see "WEP insecure don't use it", blah blah blah. Anyone with fingers and more than 2 braincells to rub together will realize you can't just crack wireless APs with off the shelf wireless cards (at least the vast majority). That means that your neighbor is probably not going to be a "WEP cracker", so its safe to use WEP in a residential area. I'll bet anyone's neighbor here probably only knows the basics of Word. I would use something more industrial in a apartment area though; as since your signal can encompass more people...but in a urban/rural residential area where there is considerate amount of space between houses WEP is enough to keep the average doodle head from connecting to your wifi and thinking its his. But again why are we even talking about this when the vast majority of people don't even use any protection at all! (Just walk down your street with your laptop, I'll bet you will find at least one open AP with a internet connection.) I am NOT saying it isn't hackable, but for the amount of time it takes...I think some "researchers" are stretching the truth. Somehow I doubt someone can crack a 128bit wep key in a matter of minutes on the average laptop. And for the people that say that WEP is really insecure...again in an urban/rural area is there actually people going around *wasting* their time sitting in a car just to see if they can crack your WEP key? If they are I haven't seen any. If anything they would be driving around trying to find an open wifi AP. Jesus, sweet ignorance. 
I bet you live in some remote place - visit NYC and you'll realize nobody has to go to anywhere, I can see 10+ wifi connection in my home and I live in nice brownstone area, on the corner of the best park in NYC, not in a multi-dwelling apt building area where literally hundreds of wifi APs are within connection range...
WEP is fuckin dead. Use it in any urban area and you get your @ss owned within days.
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said by bicker :Waaaa waaaa waaaa. You just want what you want and don't care to factor in what is right or true. Your perspectives are un-American, and deserve far more ridicule than I'm prepared to pile on them. |
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kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| reply to jmn1207
said by jmn1207 :said by avd706 :You mean the vast majority of G cards cant go into promiscuous mode, but I'm sure you can get lots of hardware out there on the internet that can. WEP is dead. obsolete. Probably so, but it's perfect for making sure the old retired couple next door doesn't accidentally connect to my wireless network, and it still allows the fastest transfer speeds considering the tiny overhead it creates. We are talking about your neighbors with a few Dell computers that have very little understanding of networking protocols. WEP is an obsolete security measure, but it can be used to prevent a neighbor from inadvertently hijacking your connection, while still making it simple for your guests to be able to connect without having to delve into the router's advanced feature settings. This is the type of soft nonsense that gives people some ver false sense of security - it's BS, sorry, people should drop WEP altogether, period.
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[BQUOTE=[user=bicker]]Waaaa waaaa waaaa. You just want what you want and don't care to factor in what is right or true. Your perspectives are un-American, and deserve far more ridicule than I'm prepared to pile on them.
[/BQUOTE] |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| I would drop the wireless security altogether, but it keeps out innocent neighbors. I live in a suburb of DC and only see 1 other wireless network out there. We have big lawns with lots of space around us, it probably is not anything like Brooklyn. The street I live on has no passing traffic and the house is adjacent to a hiking trail and creek. WEP is perfect for me. |
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avd706
insert annoying animated gif here
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Union, NJ
| reply to jmn1207
said by jmn1207 :We are talking about your neighbors with a few Dell computers that have very little understanding of networking protocols. WEP is an obsolete security measure, but it can be used to prevent a neighbor from inadvertently hijacking your connection, while still making it simple for your guests to be able to connect without having to delve into the router's advanced feature settings. AES is faster since encryption is done in hardware.
WEP keys are the most confusing system out the, hex keys in rotation. You can use a text passphrase to generate the WEP keys, but there is no guarantee that these text passphrases generate the same key amoung vendors.
Setting up WEP or WPA otherwise requires the same configuration effort in terms of configuring the router. |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Well, WPA was significantly slower in my experience with the equipment we mostly used. And of these two, if anyone really was interested in hacking into my network, neither would be worth a crap. So I went with the fastest performer of the 2 I had available. |
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jhegfwsa56
| reply to kamm
The correct word is minutes not days  WEP can be cracked in way less than an hour with REGULAR hardware available at ANY store just pick the right model and that's it. Every store probably have at least two models ready to crack you POS WEP encryption. |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| reply to kamm
said by kamm :This is the type of soft nonsense that gives people some ver false sense of security - it's BS, sorry, people should drop WEP altogether, period. WEP isn't security, its avoidance. If someone has the time they will get in easily, but it will keep the vast majority of problems away. |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| reply to kamm
said by kamm :Jesus, sweet ignorance. I bet you live in some fuckin remote place - visit NYC and you'll realize nobody has to go to anywhere, I can see 10+ wifi connection in my home and I live in nice brownstone area, on the corner of the best park in NYC, not in a multi-dwelling apt building area where literally hundreds of wifi APs are within connection range... ...outside of your shack WEP is fuckin dead, try to understand it. Use it in any urban area and you get your @ss owned within days. Union Square (NYC), each corner of the park has 250 APs visible, chance of connecting to any of them, zero b/c of noise levels. |
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Secure
@rr.com
| A secure wireless connection
All I hear about is people cracking what is being done to prevent or create a more secure wireless experience?
What about Quantum cryptography why can't that be implemented in wireless devices?
»www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/···lly-safe
At least make it a waste of time for users trying to freeload or conduct illegal activity, make it more difficult for them to crack it say 3 hours and then have your key or pass phrase rotated every hour and make you log in each session or something like that.
Would it be worth a hackers trouble to hack into a system when they will loose the lease in less than an hour?
With a better defense 2 or 3 hours would make it useless for a hacker to try and pick on your network nothing to see here move on approach.
I would like to learn how to break the encryption so I can learn how to try and come up with a solution or at least see what steps I could take to make it take longer to crack. Eventually enough people will be aware of the security holes and may decide to go wired as the safe way until the community of Genius figures out a way to make it a little more safe give us more time to track these intrusive bugs tools ect.. |
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blueeyesm
join:2003-09-05
Waterloo, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| If a GPU can be used to decrypt..
..why hasn't someone come with a method for a GPU to ENcrypt as well?
Sounds like it may be time to have a box acting as an AP that, once (honest) clients have successfully connected, be able to auto-generate and update the new encryption every xx minutes?
Or, maybe its time the average Joe stops being so damned lazy about their access security... |
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avd706
insert annoying animated gif here
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Union, NJ
| reply to patcat88
Re: Not again...
said by patcat88 :said by kamm :Jesus, sweet ignorance. I bet you live in some fuckin remote place - visit NYC and you'll realize nobody has to go to anywhere, I can see 10+ wifi connection in my home and I live in nice brownstone area, on the corner of the best park in NYC, not in a multi-dwelling apt building area where literally hundreds of wifi APs are within connection range... ...outside of your shack WEP is fuckin dead, try to understand it. Use it in any urban area and you get your @ss owned within days. Union Square (NYC), each corner of the park has 250 APs visible, chance of connecting to any of them, zero b/c of noise levels. A directional antenna cuts through all of that. |
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jjoshua
Premium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ | reply to Secure
Re: A secure wireless connection
said by Secure :
What about Quantum cryptography why can't that be implemented in wireless devices?
I believe that quantum cryptography uses photons, not electromagnetism. |
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BIGMIKE
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Westminster, CA
| reply to jjoshua
Re: Don't bother
Insecure.org Top 100 Network Security Tools
In 2000, Fyodor, creator of the NMap Scanner, conducted a survey of the readers of the nmap-hackers mailing list and compiled the Top 50 Security Tools.
»netsecurity.about.com/od/hackert···htm?rd=1
»sectools.org/index.html |
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