TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·Comcast
|  Chokepoint is always the local infrastructure ...
.... and allowing ANYONE(including their competitors) to send unthrottled data would adversely affect all users on the local infrastructure. IF THEY HAVE to throttle, they are doing it in the right spot where it affects all providers equally.
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My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
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JSRoman
Premium
join:2005-03-10
Callahan, FL
| Courts he they come.
I would think unless it is specifically written out in contracts they have with Bell Canada, BC would not be able to throttle traffic that comes from wholesale parners.
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»www.seabee.navy.mil |
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Nintendo
join:2007-03-17 | Its funny Teksavvy has never had a problem passing as much bandwidth as they need through their equipment, but the big Bell can't.
This whole think reeks of anti-competitive behavior. |
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mazhurg
Premium
join:2004-05-02
Portage La Prairie, MB
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
·MTS
1 edit | reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Chokepoint is always the local infrastructure ...
However, the local infrastructure was holding quite well before this started. The problem is the Sympatico cloud and this was implemented in a effort to stop bleeding customers as now they can truly say that there is no advantages in leaving.
Bunch of crooks.
SEE: »Bell shareholder report re Bell Throttling (was inter. blog. for proof. |
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Mashiki
Balking The Enemy's Plans
join:2002-02-04
Woodstock, ON
·Bright House
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| reply to TKJunkMail
This is bell's anti-bleed measure since they're hemorrhaging customers to other dsl providers due to their poor tech, throttled service and high prices. Their solution is to make sure all of their competitors stuck in the same spot, this isn't a local infrastructure issue, this is happening everywhere.
This really comes down more to a violation of the crtc regulations and peering agreements more then anything. |
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Done_Posting
Shoot to kill
Premium
join:2003-08-22
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable
| Understandable
I misunderstood this piece at first glance. I initially thought that bell was throttling leased circuits (like DS3, ether, etc.) as a WAN peer to the public Internet. I got it backwards; they're just throttling their local loop which other parties are using to provide broadband services. If they were throttling dedicated circuits I would wholeheartedly agree that this is wrong because having the freedom to do whatever you want with your circuits is part of the reason you pay a premium for them. Since this is just shared access broadband, I don't really see what all the fuss is about.
I agree it's shady of Bell not to inform their ISP clients in advance, but if someone like TekSavvy sells connections via Bell's copper plant, then that third party is subject to whatever rules the local loop provider cares to enforce. The only way around this would be to include very specific language forbidding traffic shaping in their contracts with each other.
Funny, this kind of dispels the age old belief some people have that DSL subscribers are immune from throttling, doesn't it?
- Tate
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Happiness is an OC-768 in your basement... |
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Done_Posting
Shoot to kill
Premium
join:2003-08-22
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable
| reply to Nintendo
Re: Courts he they come.
said by Nintendo  :Its funny Teksavvy has never had a problem passing as much bandwidth as they need through their equipment, but the big Bell can't. I don't think TekSavvy has any of their own copper plant anywhere. If I'm correct, then your theory is flawed. It's far easier to add another Gig-E / DS3 / whatever link on the backend (in this case TekSavvy's part of the system) than it is to add additional plant capacity (in this case Bell's copper loops to the individual subscribers).
- Tate
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Happiness is an OC-768 in your basement... |
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Done_Posting
Shoot to kill
Premium
join:2003-08-22
Toledo, OH | reply to mazhurg
Re: Chokepoint is always the local infrastructure ...
So you work at Bell or have access to their network resource utilization figures?
- Tate
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Happiness is an OC-768 in your basement... |
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HeadSpinning
join:2005-05-29
Windsor, ON
| reply to Done_Posting
Re: Courts he they come.
said by Done_Posting : I don't think TekSavvy has any of their own copper plant anywhere. If I'm correct, then your theory is flawed. It's far easier to add another Gig-E / DS3 / whatever link on the backend (in this case TekSavvy's part of the system) than it is to add additional plant capacity (in this case Bell's copper loops to the individual subscribers). - Tate Unlike in HFC Cable networks, the copper plant is dedicated on a per subscriber basis. The issue Bell is claiming is that the DS3/OC3 capacity in their fiber plant is becoming over saturated - which they haven't offered any proof of. |
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adisor19
join:2004-10-11
·Velcom
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Radioactif
·Videotron
·Look Communications
| reply to Done_Posting
Re: Understandable
People on proper DSL providers like TekSavvy WERE NEVER THROTTLED. This is not an OLD age belief like you say but rather the truth. Bell has just screwed these 21000 users of TekSavvy service and many many more that belong to other companies. It's absolutely revolting !
Adi |
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Bellsucks
@aliant.net | reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Chokepoint is always the local infrastructure ...
They are not allowed to affect the competition when it comes to throttling. I expect the CRTC to have a hearing on this issue. |
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RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
1 edit | reply to Done_Posting
Re: Understandable
said by Done_Posting :Funny, this kind of dispels the age old belief some people have that DSL subscribers are immune from throttling, doesn't it? No, it doesn't. What you have here is a large monopoly vendor using government-mandated access provisions to screw it's wholesale customers like most US cable companies screw their retail customers. If anything it should wake up the CRTC.
Unlike your typical cable connection, the DSL is not being throttled. It's the connection between the indie ISP's customers and the ISP, and that's happening much farther upstream than the DSL equipment. The local loop and even the DSLAMs are not part of this fiasco.
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Toolmaster of La Grange. |
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Bell_LIES
@teksavvy.com
| pathetic
"...majority of your end users will experience an increased level of satisfaction."
What a pathetic statement. May I state for the record I am NOT one of this so-called "majority".  |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Chokepoint is always the local infrastructure ...
said by TKJunkMail :.... and allowing ANYONE(including their competitors) to send unthrottled data would adversely affect all users on the local infrastructure. IF THEY HAVE to throttle, they are doing it in the right spot where it affects all providers equally. Monthly usage limits are already in place. Now they are throttling from 4:30PM-2AM down to a few kbps all P2P traffic.
This is once again a Bell attempt to undermine their competition who, using the infrastructure Bell owns, has figured out a way to offer a better product. How can Teksavvy and others do it? They don't have shareholders to please. They can offer a better product for less because their costs and profit margins are slimmer.
As the former Bell's (ergo Verizon) have demonstrated here in the US as well, the days of innovation are gone. AT&T used to be widely respected for their innovation technological prowess, at some point they lost focus on that and instead started focusing on how to nickle and dime their customers, while offering a substandard product that was largely subsidized by taxpayers in the first place.
I am not normally for regulation, but if U-Verse is what we get in a deregulated market, bring on the Feds. |
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adisor19
join:2004-10-11
·Velcom
·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Radioactif
·Videotron
·Look Communications
| reply to Done_Posting
Re: Courts he they come.
You're misunderstanding the issue. The copper loops are already in place. What bell is claiming to be the problem, is their internal ATM network, which is complete BS. This has nothing to do with capacity and everything to do with POWER and control. They want to limit and stop the migration of their own sympatico customers towards third party DSL providers.
Adi |
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Keep him busy
@paisleymanor.com
1 edit |  "Feel Free to call me on my cell phone"
Let John Sweeney, Senior Vice President of Carrier Services, know what you think about his throttling of P2P services, and inspection of our data packets.
Bell Canada
Floor 6N
483 Bay Street
Toronto, Ontario M5G 2C9
Telephone: 416-353-7225
Fax: 416-977-3557
john.sweeney@bell.ca |
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Thane_Bitter
join:2005-01-20
London, ON
·Bell Sympatico
| reply to Nintendo
Re: Courts he they come.
 Very true, Bell has done this to kill of the massive exodus of its customers to other providers. Bell's form letter response to the wholesalers is a farce "We understand the difficulty this action has caused for you and your customers who are P2P users, but the majority of your end users will experience an increased level of satisfaction." - Reminds me of the novel "1984". 
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...A bitter ray of sunshine |
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sbrook
Premium,Mod
join:2001-12-14
H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host:
Rogers
Bell Canada
| This kind of spin control soon gets outed.
Rogers tried this "everyone will see improved response" when they cut our speeds in half a few years ago and denied it for weeks. Funny how that wasn't the case ... everyone felt the slow speeds, and many worse off than others because of the Terayon hardware designs! It was soon recanted. |
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The Wave
join:2004-03-27
Canada
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| This is nothing more than a cash grab
After seeing that memo posted by ottawa gal it is clear that the whole purpose of this move was to increase bell's bottom line by strategically and methodically curtailing competition. The tactics employed are to create this fake belief that capacity is running out and that caps have to be put in place in addition to charging more for over usage. this is probably the work of some VP who has to improve the numbers in his dept. and is just a scheme to artificially create a new avenue to charge people. This is highly devious form Bell, and I cannot believe that this could be allowed to go on in a western economy where the rules of fairness and competition are of the utmost importance. Give it some time and the competition bureau will put them back in their place. |
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Raptor
Not a Dumptruck
join:2001-10-21
London, ON | The worst part is our tax dollars went out to help build their infrastructure. |
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