  packetscan Premium join:2004-10-19 Bridgeport, CT clubs: 3 edits | What?
I want to the the MPAA up there a#$ like they were the last pirate. This is Disgusting. This will be interesting to see if they actually get away with it. -- Who do you want to pay off today? |
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 jojodancer
join:2003-07-22 Burlington, VT | Similar to VOIP
This is similar to VOIP providers going ahead using the status qou and avoiding any regulation by labeling themselves as a data service. I don't see how tv via dsl is much different. |
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  vpoko Premium join:2003-07-03 Jamaica Plain, MA
| Where do you draw the line?
Where do you draw the line as to what's considered TV? What if I watch live streaming video with RealPlayer? Is that TV?
I think what we're going to find is with high-speed networks becoming a reality, a lot of these local regulations like franchise agreements are going to be very cumbersome to enforce. I'd love to hate ILEC's on this because they ARE just motivated the profits, but the reality is local laws are poorly suited to regulating a national industry. |
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 DMS1
join:2005-04-06 Carrollton, TX
| Good for them
This can only be a good thing. Franchise agreements exist to line the government's pockets and keep the old-boy network happy. They have no place in the modern age of multiple providers competing for business. Level the playing field and providers will have to compete on quality of service alone which can only benefit the consumer. |
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  DaveNJ No Fear
join:1999-09-01 New Jersey
·Comcast
·Patriot Media
| reply to vpoko Re: Where do you draw the line?
said by vpoko :Where do you draw the line as to what's considered TV? What if I watch live streaming video with RealPlayer? Is that TV? I think what we're going to find is with high-speed networks becoming a reality, a lot of these local regulations like franchise agreements are going to be very cumbersome to enforce. I'd love to hate ILEC's on this because they ARE just motivated the profits, but the reality is local laws are poorly suited to regulating a national industry. Comcast customer might disagree with that statement, i kinda think its funny and wrong, that these large corps are balantly breaking a law, and dont care. When the courts catch up, most people dont give huge corps slack. -- Liberalism weakening The USA everyday... |
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  DaveNJ No Fear
join:1999-09-01 New Jersey
·Comcast
·Patriot Media
| reply to DMS1 Re: Good for them
said by DMS1 :This can only be a good thing. Franchise agreements exist to line the government's pockets and keep the old-boy network happy. They have no place in the modern age of multiple providers competing for business. Level the playing field and providers will have to compete on quality of service alone which can only benefit the consumer. Are you out of your mind? Without agreements, we wouldnt have service in our entire towm, internet access, Channel 8, Answer the phone in 3 mins or less. Plus numerous service standards. It wasnt until we had these in our towns agreements did we get them. DSL IPTV just isnt going to cut it, and will have a hard times competing again regular cable. -- Liberalism weakening The USA everyday... |
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  Cat Food
@cox.net
| Don't Need Franchise Agreements anymore
Franchise agreements were originally established because of physical limitiations. I.e., municipalities couldn't have 100 companies stringing lines through town because they didn't have enough space and/or right-of-way and cable co.s weren't going to invest to do it unless they had exclusivity via a franchise. With satellite, fiber, dsl and cable all capable of delivering TV, infrastructure constraints aren't an issue anymore and so franchise agreements are obsolete. I say let the market run. |
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 VansHSI
join:2005-01-29 America | This could get juicy
You know this is going to end up in the courts... of course pushed by the cable companies and then by local governments who want $$$$$. |
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 Cod
join:2000-07-05 Greensboro, NC
| Way to go SBC
Franchise agreements are obsolete & pointless in todays era. Remember, the Bells aren't against franchise agreements- they just want to have state agreements and not to have to deal with mom & pop municipalities who will basically try to do everything possible (since they are in bed with the cable companies) to prevent and make their lives hard.
Franchise agreements are due for an overhaul, or be eliminated totally. |
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 rahvin112
join:2002-05-24 Sandy, UT
| reply to DaveNJ Re: Good for them
said by DaveNJ :Are you out of your mind? Without agreements, we wouldnt have service in our entire towm, internet access, Channel 8, Answer the phone in 3 mins or less. Plus numerous service standards. It wasnt until we had these in our towns agreements did we get them. DSL IPTV just isnt going to cut it, and will have a hard times competing again regular cable. Governments place isn't to regulate service if there is legitimate competition. Once competition is in place let the people vote with their wallets, not government mandate. |
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  vpoko Premium join:2003-07-03 Jamaica Plain, MA | reply to vpoko Re: Where do you draw the line?
Would you then care to answer my first question? |
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  winky Turn Left At The Moon
join:2001-02-11 Saint Louis, MO
| reply to jojodancer Re: Similar to Business as Usual
Indeed. This is one instance where SBC and I agree. What reason is there for a franchise, except to allow the parties involved, a method by which to protect their investment. Allowing a cable company a reasonable expectation to recoup their investment in an area and a governing body to make commercial services available to their constituents in such a manner as to protect the consumer. This begs the question: What will SBC receive from the franchising body? The answer of course is, nothing. No access rights, easements, or tax incentives that aren't already in place. Consequently if SBC receives nothing, where is the leverage to force it into a franchise agreement? How does adding a "feature" to an existing service make you a completely different enterprise? It doesn't of course unless you view the situation from the cable industry's perspective. The cable companies have a point of course. Being under their respective franchise agreements, they may face restrictions that SBC would avoid, but that's not SBC's problem because they're not receiving the consequent benefits the cable companies are. SBC may seem like the good guy in all of this, and in this case I feel that they are. Unfortunately SBC has used the same apples to oranges comparisons to battle the cable companies in their quest to offer data and voice services. Both industries would like you to think that their focus is you, the consumer, and that bringing better and more varied services is their goal, which it is, as long as you fall on the plus side of their bottom lines. Suffice to say, neither industry is looking out for the individual consumer, or the advancement of entertainment/communications in the country, and will not hesitate to malign each other at the first opportunity over injustices; be they real, perceived, or fabricated. We can only hope that eventually, in the end, it's the consumer that receives the benefit of better services at a fair price, When?, you may ask, will this happen? Perhaps it will only be after the FTC steps in and clarifies a few things, which is oh so long overdue. For now though, a good start would be for someone to step in and put these fussy toddlers down for a nap or an extended "time out" while mommy and daddy discuss a few parenting guidelines, until then it's pandemonium at the entertainment/communication household. -- If you can break it,I can fix it.Of course, It'll cost ya' |
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  broadbanderdemander
@66.100.x.x
| Local governments and what people seem to miss
I don't understand how people in this forum can treat local governments like their profit-grubbing whores bent on making money. That's what the other side is, the private companies. Local governments simply want enough money to provide for simple town services and escalating costs. Eliminating franchising hurts a local government's pockets, and guess what, everybody, when a local government is hurt, than YOU, the citizen are hurt. Potholes, sewage overages, poor education, lack of resources, these things are what happens when local governments get squeezed out of the money intake picture by too much privitization. SBC aren't going to teach your kids how to read. People in this country are very strange, when asked about taxes, they say they hate taxes and government takes all of their money. Yet when asked about schools and road maintenance, they say they want the best schools with no expense spared and safe, easy to drive on roads. Really, does it take much to understand that franchise agreements are one of a series of ways in which a local government can receive some much needed funding that neither raises taxes on individual members of the community nor forsakes the services of the city? |
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 DMS1
join:2005-04-06 Carrollton, TX | reply to rahvin112 Re: Good for them
That is exactly the point I was trying to make. Once competition is established, there is no better way of forcing providers to continually improve service than customers leaving for competitors. |
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  zoom314 Superman Premium join:2001-04-30 Yermo, CA
| reply to Cat Food Re: Don't Need Franchise Agreements anymore
said by Cat Food:
Franchise agreements were originally established because of physical limitations. I.e., municipalities couldn't have 100 companies stringing lines through town because they didn't have enough space and/or right-of-way and cable co.s weren't going to invest to do it unless they had exclusivity via a franchise. With satellite, fiber, dsl and cable all capable of delivering TV, infrastructure constraints aren't an issue anymore and so franchise agreements are obsolete. I say let the market run. Ditto.:D -- Firefox forever! »zoom314.blogspot.com/ »mysite.verizon.net/zoom314/ |
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 DMS1
join:2005-04-06 Carrollton, TX
| reply to broadbanderdemander Re: Local governments and what people seem to miss
I disagree. I'm sure that most people with even a modicum of sense understand that a certain level of taxation is required. However, make that taxation open and obvious. In other words, call it a 'tax'. We already pay property taxes, sales tax and, in many states, state income tax. Revenue lost from franchise agreements could easily be recovered by tweaking these 'real' taxes. |
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  KoolMoe Aw Man Premium join:2001-02-14 Annapolis, MD clubs:
·Verizon FIOS
·Speakeasy
| reply to rahvin112 Re: Good for them
First, I believe Public Access TV is critical. There would be no PEG if there were no required franchise agreements.
If you (generic) do not believe the public should have access to the 'airwaves' (so to speak) then maybe you don't have a problem with it's impending death. I, however, believe Public Access is one small way for the average American to at least have their voice heard. Such access should NOT be for-profit only.
Second, as other posters have stated, franchise fees bring in money to the local governments - no doubt. Is that bad? Well, if you aren't going to complain about your local goverment either cutting services or increasing taxes if that franchise money is removed from the pot - cool. But I bet most of all you 'free marketers' will. KM |
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 UofMiamiGrad Premium join:2001-02-03 Great Neck, NY
| reply to broadbanderdemander Re: Local governments and what people seem to miss
said by broadbanderdemander:
I don't understand how people in this forum can treat local governments like their profit-grubbing whores bent on making money. That's what the other side is, the private companies. Local governments simply want enough money to provide for simple town services and escalating costs. Eliminating franchising hurts a local government's pockets, and guess what, everybody, when a local government is hurt, than YOU, the citizen are hurt. Potholes, sewage overages, poor education, lack of resources, these things are what happens when local governments get squeezed out of the money intake picture by too much privitization. SBC aren't going to teach your kids how to read. People in this country are very strange, when asked about taxes, they say they hate taxes and government takes all of their money. Yet when asked about schools and road maintenance, they say they want the best schools with no expense spared and safe, easy to drive on roads. Really, does it take much to understand that franchise agreements are one of a series of ways in which a local government can receive some much needed funding that neither raises taxes on individual members of the community nor forsakes the services of the city? We get squeezed regardless. Come on, our freakin cable bills, etc go up anyway, so we get hit on that end. And you are saying that if we eliminate franchise agreements we'll get hit, when we already are by the companies providing services to us. I'd rather give money to my local gov't then some big business if it's to benefit my town. At least the local gov't won't spend the money elsewhere, namely another state or town, like a big company can and will do. |
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  ropeguru Premium join:2001-01-25 Bridgeport, WV clubs:
·VOIPo
| Off the topic of..
whether franchise agreements are right or wrong, the telcos again are ignoring the laws that are on the books and using strong arm tactics as they always do. This will go to court and the local governments will win. The laws are on the books and have been for years.
So if the precident is set that it is ok for the telcos to just up and break the laws and get away with it, where does it stop. I may feels that a spped limit of 25 MPH is too slow in a residential neighborhood. Does this give me the right to speed and break the law before it gets changed?? I think not..
What if I feel that I think I should be able to setup a new business in a neighborhood that is zoned for residential whithout having to go through a zoning review process and get it changed? Will I be shut down?? Damn right I will be because it is against the laws and regulations of where I am conducting business and until someone get s the law changed, I will be found guilty.
Telcos are getting worse than judges these days. They think they are above everyone else and can do whatever the hell they want. It is about time somone put them in their place.. -- FWD#: 223611 |
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  ropeguru Premium join:2001-01-25 Bridgeport, WV clubs:
·VOIPo
| reply to UofMiamiGrad Re: Local governments and what people seem to miss
said by UofMiamiGrad :said by broadbanderdemander:
I don't understand how people in this forum can treat local governments like their profit-grubbing whores bent on making money. That's what the other side is, the private companies. Local governments simply want enough money to provide for simple town services and escalating costs. Eliminating franchising hurts a local government's pockets, and guess what, everybody, when a local government is hurt, than YOU, the citizen are hurt. Potholes, sewage overages, poor education, lack of resources, these things are what happens when local governments get squeezed out of the money intake picture by too much privitization. SBC aren't going to teach your kids how to read. People in this country are very strange, when asked about taxes, they say they hate taxes and government takes all of their money. Yet when asked about schools and road maintenance, they say they want the best schools with no expense spared and safe, easy to drive on roads. Really, does it take much to understand that franchise agreements are one of a series of ways in which a local government can receive some much needed funding that neither raises taxes on individual members of the community nor forsakes the services of the city? We get squeezed regardless. Come on, our freakin cable bills, etc go up anyway, so we get hit on that end. And you are saying that if we eliminate franchise agreements we'll get hit, when we already are by the companies providing services to us. I'd rather give money to my local gov't then some big business if it's to benefit my town. At least the local gov't won't spend the money elsewhere, namely another state or town, like a big company can and will do. I have to agree. What most people do not realize is that the agreements also require cable companies to put in cahnnels and allow bandwidth for governmental uses in order to have the rights to provide service. If all of this is taken away, you will not only see your cable bill going up, but probably your taxes too because of what the local governments are going to have to start paying for. -- FWD#: 223611 |
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