Corvus
Flaming Tards Since 2003
Premium,VIP
join:2003-11-26 | Deja vu
It reminds me european 56K modems being selles in brand new PC, they were locked for only one provider. I don't think SIPphone will win this.
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Jesus saves, but only Buddha makes incremental backups. |
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vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD | So you cant sell products in the stores????
I should sue because my xbox controller doesnt work on sony? I dont get it. |
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technick
Premium
join:2000-12-16
Loganville, GA | Monopoly
If you look at the judgements waged against microsoft for being anti-competitive and for monopoly practices, I think they might have a small wood leg to stand on. |
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Corvus
Flaming Tards Since 2003
Premium,VIP
join:2003-11-26
| said by technick  :
If you look at the judgements waged against microsoft for being anti-competitive and for monopoly practices, I think they might have a small wood leg to stand on.
It's a partnership between Linksys and Vonage, to be considered as monopoly, Linksys has to offer their own VoIP service.
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Jesus saves, but only Buddha makes incremental backups. |
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DaSneaky1D
one wall to block them all
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
The Lou
 ·Charter Pipeline
1 edit | Look at the following link:
»www.linksys.com/voice/default.asp
Tell me where it boldly shows these products work with SIPphone...or that they only work exclusively with Vonage.
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] :: my trivial ramblings :: [ |
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Mellow
Premium
join:2001-11-16
Salisbury, MD
 ·HostGator
 ·Cavalier Telephone
| You guys are way off base
"Roberston said Sipphone filed the suit after receiving complaints from Sipphone customers who found they could not use certain Linksys products to access its service. Robertson said these customers were surprised to find they would be charged a monthly fee from Vonage in order to use the device. Furthermore, the device could not be used in conjunction with any other Net phone services."
The main reason they are suing is to get them to LABEL the retail boxes that it only works with vonage so they do not have to waste tech support time.
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Ocean City, MD Surfing Gallery |
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Corvus
Flaming Tards Since 2003
Premium,VIP
join:2003-11-26
| reply to DaSneaky1D
Re: Monopoly
said by DaSneaky1D :
Look at the following link:
»www.linksys.com/voice/default.asp
Tell me where it boldly shows these products work with SIPphone...or that they only work exclusively with Vonage.
Well, it's not clear that Vonage is the only one, but it clearly shows it doesn't work with all VoIP provider.
quote:
* A Voice over IP Service Package from a specific provider is required, and sold separately.
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Jesus saves, but only Buddha makes incremental backups. |
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mchristsen
join:2004-05-10
Los Alamitos, CA | reply to Mellow
Re: You guys are way off base
So why aren't all the VoIP providers filing suit? I bought the Linksys RT31P2 knowing that it was locked to Vonage. And I believe the display at Staples indicated that the RT31P2 and the PAP2 were to be used with Vonage.
Mike |
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calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| reply to Corvus
Re: Monopoly
said by Corvus :
It's a partnership between Linksys and Vonage, to be considered as monopoly, Linksys has to offer their own VoIP service.
Flat out wrong as a general statement. Antitrust law covers a "conspiracy in restraint of trade", which includes two firms acting in concert as well as anticompetitive acts by a single firm.
(However, indications are that this SIPphone/Linksys/Vonage lawsuit seems to be based more on deceptive advertising claims than traditional antitrust/monopoly--so both Corvus's statement and my response to it may not relate directly to the case at hand.)
Calvoiper
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VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! |
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WhyADuck
Premium
join:2003-03-05
| reply to Corvus
Re: Deja vu
The problem may be with the advertising and packaging. No one could object if they were selling "Vonage service (includes Linksys or Netgear router programmed for use with Vonage)" BUT if their ads and packaging prominently feature the router and either do not disclose that it's "locked" to Vonage service, or disclose it only after the consumer arrives at the store and then only in fine print on the box (as an example - I haven't seen the actual packaging) then I think there is a serious problem. Customers have a reasonable expectation that routers are not tied to a single provider (just as when you buy a non-digital camera you don't expect it to be tied to a certain brand of film, to the exclusion of all others). If that is not the case, then it needs to be fully disclosed to the customer, certainly before they put any money down for the product, but also in the printed advertising so the customer doesn't make a wasted trip to the store to discover that the product is locked to a single provider.
Hopefully the stores that sell these intentionally-crippled devices will get a lot of returns, and decide that full disclosure up front is better for their bottom line. |
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krobar
Is this thing on?
join:2002-09-15
Columbus, OH | reply to vic102482
Re: So you cant sell products in the stores????
This'd be more like buying an xbox that only works with XBox Live and not the EA Network. 
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Power corrupts. Absolute power is kinda neat. |
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calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| Predictions come true, just not how you expect....
For all of you who were so strongly disputing my predictions that ISPs would get sued for favoring their own or affiliated VoIP providers, this lawsuit should be an indication of things to come. (Some two weeks ago, in an exchange with Tikker_los, highjinx, and odog, I mentioned false advertising claims as one of the possible legal pitfalls those favoring particular VoIP services might face.)
Yes, this involves a router vendor favoring a VoIP provider, but the issues involve substantial similarities. (Indeed, the favoritism claims may be even weaker here--because while individual customers may be, to a greater or lesser degree, limited in their ISP choices, it's harder to say they are limited in their router choices.)
Nevertheless, a lawsuit has been brought alleging someone else in the supply chain is improperly favoring a VoIP partner. This suit may in fact go nowhere, or it may have legs. Regardless, it is a pain inflicted on those who attempt to favor particular VoIP providers that will have to be dealt with.
We'll see more of these types of suits as other entrenched providers (both of goods and services) attempt to leverage their market positions into the VoIP field.
Calvoiper
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VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! |
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hskrfan23
join:2004-03-18
West Sacramento, CA | reply to Mellow
Re: You guys are way off base
*Broadband phone service from Vonage required. See product box for more details .....from Staples website who is selling this...so apparently it looks like it is on the box |
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TUSA
@swbell.ne | SIPphone v. Vonage » False Advertising Lawsuit
More info from SIPphone forum website '»forum.sipphone.com/viewforum.php?f=38' |
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cgw123
join:2002-09-13
Moraga, CA
| Outpost makes it clear ....
This may be a response to the lawsuit, the the Fry's/Outpost website makes it clear that it is for use with Vontage. See
»shop4.outpost.com/product/417575···_RSLT_PG |
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IanR
join:2001-03-22
Madison, NJ
| I agree with SIPphone
Clearly the Linksys ads are "economic in the truth" and give a consumer a missleading impression. Certainly they don't indicate it only works with Vonage.
IF Cisco/Linksys want to put their bet on Vonage, with this hardware, why not come out and say it guys.
Right now therse router manufacturers are getting away with a lot of bad stuff. I have a new BEFSR81 V3 rounter and it is halving my internet speed compared to the model "41" I used prior. Do Linksys admit they are selling duff hardware...Nope. Do they say they are working on a "fix"|. Nope. They just charge full price, admit nothing and take the cash. It's time for a lot more honesty. And I am not picking just on Linksys. Netgear have long had disconnect problems with their 614 router range and where is the fix? |
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lazarus_
join:2002-08-31
Resolute, NU
1 edit | reply to vic102482
Re: So you cant sell products in the stores????
said by vic102482 :
I should sue because my xbox controller doesnt work on sony? I dont get it.
Umm actually its like selling you a generic DSL or Cable modem that is loaded with a firmware that only works with the crappiest ISP in your area. And later on when you decide to change ISP you cant use your generic locked modem because its only usable on your original ISP's network. Sounds like Vonage is trying to act like a cell phone network and try and stop people from wandering to competitors.. If thats the case, I'm sure smart people wont want to have anything to do w/ this company since they will probably be bad news in the near future..
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Facts are meaningless; you can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! Facts, schmacks |
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swsamurai
Premium
join:2002-04-17
Bakersfield, CA
clubs:
·Bright House
|  reply to Corvus
Re: Deja vu
They may not have to win it. We have all seen how companies will do this sorta thing for the noteriety. It may just be a play for advertising. Grant... a lawsuit is not a CHEAP way to advertise, but it does get your name out there, and makes the other company spend money to defend itself, or settle. |
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sipphone blows ass
@vonage.net
| reply to IanR
Re: I agree with SIPphone
This is seriously the most baseless and retarded thing I have ever heard, and is not the right way to gain publicity, even for a lowlife company such as sipphone. If this case makes it anywhere but the garbage can, I will sure enough hang myself as it will become clear that the the end of the world has begun. |
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BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
| reply to vic102482
Re: So you cant sell products in the stores????
said by vic102482 :
I should sue because my xbox controller doesnt work on sony? I dont get it.
This is the repercussions of what happens when every company goes after microsoft. Now every company thinks it has the right to sue over anti competitive practices.
This is asinine. This is real world business to bind with people who will give you the best chance to get rich. Why is it these dumb bastards do this.
If it is a router with a built in Vonage jack as long as it works for it's intended purpose it is a fully sell able unit. Since it will work without the VoIP section used.
To reiterate this is what happens in the USA when stupid claims are able to be brought to court. My god and I thought real vs MS was bad. This one is even stupider.
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"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" |
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