Voyager2K2
join:2001-10-04
Wayne, PA | Too Big for Their Britches
Hey it happened once, it can happen again.
Break these big boys up into smaller more edible pieces.
These mega-bells are just as bad or worse than Ma Bell ever was. |
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Count Hogula3
John Forged Kerry
Premium
join:2004-07-10
Corona, CA | Boo F-ing hoo
They'll have to live with the money tree they have for the next few months.
My violins are playing for them. |
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odog
Cable Centric Vendor Biased
Premium
join:2001-08-05
Norcross, GA
clubs:
1 edit | price is right? where?
umm.
can't some outside source just agree on nationwide rates. make them reasonable and be done with it.
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disclaimer: my opinions are my own, my employer is not responsible. |
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Alpine
Premium
join:2000-01-11
Atlanta, GA
| reply to Voyager2K2
Re: Too Big for Their Britches
You guys are right... The big telcos are pure evil. I even wish they'd extend the line-sharing laws a little further. CLECs shouldn't have to pay for their lines at all! In fact, I think all employees of the CLECs should be able to sit at home and collect paychecks off of the ILECs. That's the spirit of competition! This is America - we don't need a level playing field. Artificial crutches and subsidies are the way of the future!
I want to break into the software business. Maybe I'll get the government involved and force Microsoft to share their developers and code with me. Of course, they'll need to do it at a considerable discount even though my sole purpose is to take customers away from them, but who cares?! Artificial "competition" - capitalism at its best! Woohoo!!
ATP |
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ronpin
Imagine Reality
join:2002-12-06
Nirvana | Ya'll do realize that Verizon should now cease their FIOS residential overbuilds. If they don't then we know this is all election year posturing. |
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
 ·Qwest.net
1 edit | reply to odog
Re: price is right? where?
said by odog  :
umm.
can't some outside source just agree on nationwide rates. make them reasonable and be done with it.
Nice idea except it would take about 6000 years to come up with an agreement, and at every turn their would be a law suite.
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»www.gobpl.com |
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neftv
join:2000-10-01
Broomall, PA | Awww
The poor bells I'm suppose to feel sorry for them.
Double and triple charging for a phone line, Data line I think not I don't feel sorry for them as long as the customer is left out of the picture in the scheme of savings. |
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micl
Visit Lovely Downtown Port Starboard
Premium
join:2001-10-25
Silver Spring, MD
| reply to Alpine
Re: Too Big for Their Britches
said by Alpine :
CLECs shouldn't have to pay for their lines at all! In fact, I think all employees of the CLECs should be able to sit at home and collect paychecks off of the ILECs. That's the spirit of competition! This is America - we don't need a level playing field. Artificial crutches and subsidies are the way of the future!
One thing that bugs me (among many) is that the Bells were so successful in convincing people they they were actually losing money under the UNE-P rules. Under those rules their compensation was cost + reasonable profit... but because they couldn't charge cost + rape & pillage markup they were loosing money???? LOL.
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If I don't see you in the future, I'll see you in the pasture |
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macmouse
Premium
join:2002-05-30
Saratoga, CA
1 edit | reply to Voyager2K2
This time, they should do it right.
Split all of the telco's into two companies.
A)Company that covers the local phone lines (copper wires,etc) *only* and nothing else. Provides no service directly to the customers. This could then arguably, go back to a national company for simplicity as there is no longer a threat.
B) Pacbell/Verizon/whatever all buy line service from this new company (just like sprint/att/covad). Then, they only have to worry about is competing on service.
As a bonus, the first company would probably provide a more reliable,cheaper service (after adjustment period). That's because, they make money by providing more coverage/reliable service/features and not by selling packages. |
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alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
|  Everybody and Nobody wants that Last Mile!
Telecommunications is going through a big revolution, and the only way progress will happen is if we take that Last Mile. If we band together and pay for our own Networks, then we don't have to wait for the Big Boys. I keep telling you guys, the Big Boys will listen if the numbers are right. |
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lesopp
join:2001-06-27
Land O Lakes, FL
| reply to ronpin
Re: Too Big for Their Britches
They have already admitted it was more of a deregulation ploy than actual concern for winning over more broadband customers.
»Verizon Fiber Bait
What do I think of the FCC's recent action:
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Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
| reply to Alpine
You are just simply sad.
I could give you $1,000,000,000 in startup capital to start a telco / broadband / video company of your own and you would STILL NOT be able to compete or even get a decent amount of coverage in any major city within 5 years if you had to build out your own infrastructure.
What point of that do people like you miss? You think you can just file a business application and start digging up yards and roads to lay that fiber down as if it were a lemonade stand you were starting. Are you really that IQ challenged? (I'm guessing you aren't, but instead are an employee of one of the monopolies)
It is a monopolistic service by nature because of the extreme barriers to entry even when you remove money from the picture. That is compounded by the monopolistic strategies employed by the companies that are already in the service. The entire infrastructure needs to be taken away from all of these companies (cable and telco) and owned and operated by an independent company or 2 (or the government). Then any and every company that wants to fight for our dollar is able to do it on a level playing field throughout the entire country without the extreme political barriers or the extreme market entry obstacles that exist now.
I as a consumer should not have to have my yard, my neighbor's yard, nor the parking lot of the local grocery store dug up everytime I want to change local or long distance carriers or broadband providers. I shouldn't have to have 8 lines hanging off my house for each time that has occured. I as a citizen shouldn't have to have 10 or 20 companies that want to compete for my business tearing up my local roads every other week to install their lines so they are able to bring me these services I may or may not want. I'm guessing you wouldn't want that either, but what you really want is for companies that want to compete against yours to have to pay you a lot more and charge the consumers a lot more so that in the end your already inflated profits can become more inflated by A) you getting more out of your competitor B) you charging more now because you can raise your prices and yet still under cut your competitors. |
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JakCrow
join:2001-12-06
Palo Alto, CA | reply to Alpine
Nice hyperbole. Got something better? |
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Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
| You want 10 billion? Regardless the point still stands - It is impossible to compete against a monopoly, which is why they are a monopoly. It is also impossible for 99% of the service providers to build out their own infrastructure to even try to begin to compete, which reinforces that monopoly.
You need it "dumbed down" any more? |
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JakCrow
join:2001-12-06
Palo Alto, CA | The bells interfering with competitors trying to build out their own networks also doesn't help the situation. |
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Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
| That is absolutely true.
That is more or less what I meant by ".... because of the extreme barriers to entry even when you remove money from the picture. That is compounded by the monopolistic strategies employed by the companies that are already in the service." Generally areas with the best services and prices are those with the most competition. Areas close to setting up a competitive service get put on some sudden "upgrade plan" or as in the case of muni's the local monopolies simply try to crush them with misleading and false PR information. |
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JakCrow
join:2001-12-06
Palo Alto, CA
| I believe there was a case of a local phone company serving a small area in Texas that had built up its own network, and SBC tried to get a bill pushed thru the state legislature that would have forced this small phone company to give SBC half its profits for interconnect fees. I don't know what came of it. |
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mocycler
Premium
join:2001-01-22
Naperville, IL
 ·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T Midwest
3 edits | reply to Alpine
Hi! You must be new here. A few things you should know to help you understand the madness a little better:
1. If you support the Bells you are a "shill". If you support the CLECs, you are a "consumer advocate".
1(a). If you say anything even remotely nice about the Bells you will be accused of working for them or being a stockholder (they have no right to an opinion, y'know). If you say anything nice about the CLEC's you are most certainly a "consumer advocate". CLEC employees and stockholders never, ever visit here or post comments.
2. The "consumer advocates" will incessantly bring up the fact that the Bells have been around for 100+ years and have a firm leg-up in the industry. This has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that most of the infrastructure everyone is bickering about...namely, broadband and fiber...was installed after the 1996 Telecommunications Act.
3. While I'm on the subject of the TCA, please understand that the Act was intended to give the CLECs complete access to another company's resources, forever, with no expectation that the CLEC will ever do anything for themselves. Yeah, I know that's not what the Act really says, but that's how the "consumer advocates" read it, so humor them and their alternate-reality plane...the dialog will go soooo much smoother.
4. As you have seen in this thread, the "I don't want my yard dug up" is also a popular excuse to bash the Bells. Forgive the "consumer advocates". They have never heard of wireless, cellphones, VOIP, or radio-guided boring equipment that can pull cable hundreds and hundreds of feet and do no more damage than a spade-sized hole at the end of the block.
5. There have been no reported sightings of CLEC technicians climbing utility poles in the rain, or sitting in manholes on Christmas. In fact, no one is certain if there even is such a creature known as a "CLEC tech." But don't worry. The "consumer advocates" have assured us that the Verizon truck you saw rolling along at 2:00 am was really a CLEC attorney/public relations hack hurrying to the aid of a customer in need.
There are other tidbits I could toss out to you, but I guess that'll do for now. Enjoy you visit.
Peace,
mocycler
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The Lord's Prayer is 66 words. The Gettysburg Address is 286 words; there are 1,322 words in the Declaration of Independence. Government regulations on the sale of cabbage is 26,911 words. »www.lp.org |
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calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA | reply to alchav
Re: Everybody and Nobody wants that Last Mile!
Of course, this is after we've already paid for one last mile network, but the Bells own it and want to charge rates for it like they just installed it yesterday using hand labor, instead of having had it paid off for 25 years....
Calvoiper |
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mocycler
Premium
join:2001-01-22
Naperville, IL
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T Midwest
| said by calvoiper :
Of course, this is after we've already paid for one last mile network...instead of having had it paid off for 25 years....
Yeah how dare they make a profit! Why just last week I rented a truck to help my friend move. Since it was an old truck that had been paid for many times over, the rental company said, "Aw shucks! Take it for free. We already got our money's worth out of it."
mocycler
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The Lord's Prayer is 66 words. The Gettysburg Address is 286 words; there are 1,322 words in the Declaration of Independence. Government regulations on the sale of cabbage is 26,911 words. »www.lp.org |
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